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The Official "Danny Boy" Thread

View Poll Results: What do you wish?
I hope he remains a Flyer, despite his contract. 59 55.66%
I hope Holmgren trades him ASAP. 47 44.34%
Voters: 106. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-29-2009, 07:18 PM
  #51
BobbyClarkeFan16
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Originally Posted by Mo0sE View Post
I hope to see him back. (Yeah I said it). I think hes a great player. Yeah he lacks on defense but he was not brought here for that, He was brought here to put up points which he has. In his first, year he got 72 points with 79 games played. He also led the team in powerplay points that year. This year he put up I believe 26 points in 29 GP. Plus if you put him on a line with Giroux next season I think both would benefit off of each other's play. It's not like Briere isn't putting up points. I would much rather see some of the other players moved who have been mentioned on the board (Carle,Lupul,Jones,ect). I like the guy. I figured I would get in my thoughts before this thread turns into the " Bash Briere" thread.
I'm with you on that. Briere came here when this team was the worst team in the league and he wanted to help. The guy's been thrown under a bus by people on here. Fact is, the guy 13 different linemates his first year here and he was injured in his second. Now that he and Giroux have found chemistry, I'd love to see what someone like Hartnell or anyone with a physical presence can do on that line.

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05-29-2009, 10:22 PM
  #52
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This wont come as a surprise but I voted to keep him....Carter came up really small in the playoffs and Briere/Giroux were probably our best forwards out there. If we move Lupul, Jones and Carle (replacing him with a better #3) we should have enough cap space assuming it doesnt drop.


With that said, if there is something that makes absolute sense to move him than fine....but I dont see many of those in the rumors.

This team as it currently plays wins on its scoring depth. If you remove Briere and Lupul and most likely Knuble from that and JVR/Grioux dont compensate, this team will have problems.....Unless of course we get a defensive system all of as sudden

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05-29-2009, 10:27 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
I'm with you on that. Briere came here when this team was the worst team in the league and he wanted to help. The guy's been thrown under a bus by people on here. Fact is, the guy 13 different linemates his first year here and he was injured in his second. Now that he and Giroux have found chemistry, I'd love to see what someone like Hartnell or anyone with a physical presence can do on that line.
I would love to see Hartnell Briere Giroux (either or at center)!!!

Assuming Lupul is moved you can try JVR (if he makes the team) on the wing with Gagne and Richards...you would think anyone could play with them to. If not, maybe Knuble is re-signed cheap or someone else gets a shot.

I dont think it matter who plays with Carter, he is pretty much a puck hog anyway.

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05-29-2009, 11:30 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by PhillyFan4Ever View Post
name me 3 incontrovertible reasons why Briere would NOT ever waive his NMC.
Zing!

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05-29-2009, 11:44 PM
  #55
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Then comes the question of return. Could the Flyers get what is deemed "fair value" [for Briere]? I am not so sure. For that reason, I will be shocked if he is traded. Lupul, Carle, Jones get moved before Briere.
Fair value: Daniel Briere + the cap room it would give us = a bag of pucks

The Flyers don't need to get ANYTHING for Briere. I said it before, I'm more worried we're going to have to throw in our 1st pick to get someone to agree to TAKE him off our hands, regardless of whether he would then agree.

The front end loading makes Briere more affordable for cash strapped teams. He's got 6 years left and $34 million = $5.67 million/yr but a cap hit of $6.5 million.

That would be attactive for many teams, so assuming there is one he would go to, they can HAVE him for nothing.

Then Homer can deal, for example, Lupul and a prospect for a goalie and have a lot of extra cap room to go after JBo or Komisarek or whoever.

The Flyers need cap flexibility and goalie more than anything else. The best way to accomplish that is by trading Briere to free up some room - for what amounts to a spare part.

If Briere won't waive, then Homer has to figure something out and Lupul, Carle, Jones, or even Gagne are vulnerable - or we end up going cheap on a goalie like Emery.

Pick your poison.

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05-30-2009, 01:42 AM
  #56
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Yeah, but we haven't. And Briere did take a cut, I think it's pretty common knowledge that the Habs offered him 7 mill a year and he would have been a hero in Quebec if he had signed.
Habs offered him $49M, we offered him $52M with a ******** up front. We had the more attractive offer. This nonsense that he took less money to play here needs to go away.

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05-30-2009, 10:36 AM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul View Post
Habs offered him $49M, we offered him $52M with a ******** up front. We had the more attractive offer. This nonsense that he took less money to play here needs to go away.
Habs offered him a higher amount per year and how do you know they didn't stack it up front?

It's not like he took a massive discount, but if you go back to the 2007 summer, not many were predicting that he'd only make 6.5 especially considering what Drury got.

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05-30-2009, 11:33 AM
  #58
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Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post

3. No evidence of this yet outside of 15 fans on HFboards.
There was another 17,000 people who were booing him last year.

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05-30-2009, 12:44 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
Habs offered him a higher amount per year and how do you know they didn't stack it up front?

It's not like he took a massive discount, but if you go back to the 2007 summer, not many were predicting that he'd only make 6.5 especially considering what Drury got.
The rumour was it was $7M every season, they weren't front-loading it like the Flyers did. Seems like a pretty good reason to sign here - if his tiny elf body sustains an injury he can't come back from, he's set for life after a couple seasons. And I don't know about you, but I'd rather have $52M than $49M.

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05-30-2009, 12:48 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul View Post
The rumour was it was $7M every season, they weren't front-loading it like the Flyers did. Seems like a pretty good reason to sign here - if his tiny elf body sustains an injury he can't come back from, he's set for life after a couple seasons. And I don't know about you, but I'd rather have $52M than $49M.
Meh w/e, this is the anti-Danny thread after all.

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05-30-2009, 12:51 PM
  #61
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I'd like for him to stay. He's a damn good player and we can't be sure what we would be getting is an improvement. He puts up points and offensive threats like him aren't exactly available on demand.

I'm not totally against the idea of moving Briere, but if we do trade him the deal has to make us better. If we move laterally or backwards by trading the guy I think we're making a big mistake.

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05-30-2009, 01:03 PM
  #62
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the fact that he has some chemistry with giroux is reason enough for me to keep briere. throw gagne in the mix and you have the potential for a very good offensive attack.

i'd even consider putting hartnell and lupul back on a line with richards, though i realize that leaves carter with no talent to play with.

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05-30-2009, 01:45 PM
  #63
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Meh w/e, this is the anti-Danny thread after all.
Am I saying anything anti-Danny? He took more money to play in Philly, good for him, I'd do the same. I'd just like to see the end of the "he took less money" notion that's been out there for some time. 52 is more than 49.

I can see why that would hurt your argument, because maybe he doesn't have this burning desire to play in Philly the way you think. But I really wasn't trying to make that point (although I guess I just did, haha).

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05-30-2009, 02:00 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul View Post
Am I saying anything anti-Danny? He took more money to play in Philly, good for him, I'd do the same. I'd just like to see the end of the "he took less money" notion that's been out there for some time. 52 is more than 49.

I can see why that would hurt your argument, because maybe he doesn't have this burning desire to play in Philly the way you think. But I really wasn't trying to make that point (although I guess I just did, haha).
I also believe taxes are significantly better in Philly.

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05-30-2009, 02:08 PM
  #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul View Post
Am I saying anything anti-Danny? He took more money to play in Philly, good for him, I'd do the same. I'd just like to see the end of the "he took less money" notion that's been out there for some time. 52 is more than 49.

I can see why that would hurt your argument, because maybe he doesn't have this burning desire to play in Philly the way you think. But I really wasn't trying to make that point (although I guess I just did, haha).
Give me a ****ing break. 49 million over 7 years is more per year than 52 mill over 8 years, the math isn't hard. If he makes 3.1 million the year after the deal is over (quite possible), than he makes more money on the 7 year deal than he does on the 8 year deal.

Would you prefer a 7 year 49 million contract? I'd rather have the lower cap hit personally. And I don't think he has a "burning desire" to play in Philly, he's a professional.

I never said he had a "burning desire." My original point is there and still stands although Jester apparently thinks I'm censoring people by making them think.

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05-30-2009, 02:20 PM
  #66
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I also believe taxes are significantly better in Philly.
I'll take your word for it.

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Give me a ****ing break. 49 million over 7 years is more per year than 52 mill over 8 years, the math isn't hard. If he makes 3.1 million the year after the deal is over (quite possible), than he makes more money on the 7 year deal than he does on the 8 year deal.

Would you prefer a 7 year 49 million contract? I'd rather have the lower cap hit personally. And I don't think he has a "burning desire" to play in Philly, he's a professional.

I never said he had a "burning desire." My original point is there and still stands although Jester apparently thinks I'm censoring people by making them think.
As a fan, obviously I appreciate the lower cap-hit. But let's not make it seem like he's going to war and his life is on the line for the extra 8 months he's being paid to play for us compared to Montreal. He's playing a game for $52M. He took more money. But like I said, there's nothing wrong with that.

Your point is "why would he waive?". Well why wouldn't he? There isn't some great attachment to Philly. He's only been there for 22 months, half of that he's been injured, his role has significantly decreased, and his best friend may be moving on. He's going to make $52M anywhere he goes, and with his NMC, he can control where he plays. There are reasons why he would waive.

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05-30-2009, 02:23 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
My original point is there and still stands although Jester apparently thinks I'm censoring people by making them think.
From the other thread:

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Can we please just have a "I want Danny Briere to Leave" thread so I don't have to read "maybe he'll waive his NMC" in every ********* thread?
Pretty straightforward if you ask me. You don't want to read it, which means you don't want people to talk about it. Of course, we can dwell on the humor of demanding a thread to discuss the topic so that you don't have to read it elsewhere...and then you become one of the primary posters in that thread, thus forcing you to read about it.

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It's not happening. Get used to it.
And then this, which led directly to your ridiculous "3 reasons" rhetoric.

As to the larger point...who knows if Briere will ever sign another contract. He's going to be 38 when that deal is done. Moreover, the lopsided nature of the contract is nothing to scoff at. He can retire with two years left on the deal and have gotten 47M of the 52M out of the deal...and that's before addressing any tax difference between living in Montreal and Philly, which, as said, is pretty significant based on my understanding.

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05-30-2009, 02:29 PM
  #68
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Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul View Post
I'll take your word for it.
Based on quick google searches, I believe it's close to 5% -- yay socialized medicine!

So, for this year when he's making 8M per year, that's 400K in his pocket that would not be in his pocket if he were living in Quebec. In three years (of a 7 or 8 year contract), Briere gets an extra million out of being in Philly as opposed to Montreal.

All this being said, athletes pay is really complicated because they get taxed based on where they're playing and whatnot...so this is a very, very gross estimate.

Of course, this could be entirely incorrect...in which case I blame the internet for false information.


Last edited by Jester: 05-30-2009 at 02:48 PM.
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05-30-2009, 03:32 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by FlyHigh View Post
Give me a ****ing break. 49 million over 7 years is more per year than 52 mill over 8 years, the math isn't hard. If he makes 3.1 million the year after the deal is over (quite possible), than he makes more money on the 7 year deal than he does on the 8 year deal.

Would you prefer a 7 year 49 million contract? I'd rather have the lower cap hit personally. And I don't think he has a "burning desire" to play in Philly, he's a professional.

I never said he had a "burning desire." My original point is there and still stands although Jester apparently thinks I'm censoring people by making them think.
Actually if you consider the time value of money and interest/inflation rates a frontloaded 8 year 52 million dollar deal is probably much more appealing than an evenly disbursed 49 over 7.

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05-30-2009, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Dig Out Your Soul View Post
As a fan, obviously I appreciate the lower cap-hit. But let's not make it seem like he's going to war and his life is on the line for the extra 8 months he's being paid to play for us compared to Montreal. He's playing a game for $52M. He took more money. But like I said, there's nothing wrong with that.

Your point is "why would he waive?". Well why wouldn't he? There isn't some great attachment to Philly. He's only been there for 22 months, half of that he's been injured, his role has significantly decreased, and his best friend may be moving on. He's going to make $52M anywhere he goes, and with his NMC, he can control where he plays. There are reasons why he would waive.
Either one he's doing great, but it was his decision to come to a last-place team in an American city as opposed to going to MTL where he would have been a hero for approximately the same amount of money.

As for your reasons, what do his injuries have anything to do with want to leave? How many athletes say, "I'm injured, I want to leave this city."? His role won't be decreased next year seeing as barring a minor miracle, he'll be in the top-6.

His best friend moving on, certainly an interesting one, but the odds that he would get traded to the same city where Biron signs are pretty low.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester
Pretty straightforward if you ask me. You don't want to read it, which means you don't want people to talk about it. Of course, we can dwell on the humor of demanding a thread to discuss the topic so that you don't have to read it elsewhere...and then you become one of the primary posters in that thread, thus forcing you to read about it.
Sigh, you completely missed the point of the post. The point is that I'm tired of reading about it in every thread. I mean, within 2 weeks, it'd probably be dominating the Phillies thread too. I think it's an interesting topic and one worthy of debate, but I don't want to see it debated in every thread I read.

Thus, my request for the Danny thread which Opus kindly decided to create which has allowed us to debate the topic in one place and hopefully not hijack other threads.

Not too complicated.

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05-30-2009, 04:21 PM
  #71
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Sigh, you completely missed the point of the post. The point is that I'm tired of reading about it in every thread. I mean, within 2 weeks, it'd probably be dominating the Phillies thread too.
So...the point is that you're tired of people discussing something and you want it to be contained within a space where you won't have to necessarily read it?

...that's suppressing/censoring discussion.

Quote:
I think it's an interesting topic and one worthy of debate, but I don't want to see it debated in every thread I read.
That why the majority of your argument is bent on quashing the very logic of the discussion? You don't think it's ever going to happen...you're not debating it, you're holding an absolutely rigid position.

Quote:
Thus, my request for the Danny thread which Opus kindly decided to create which has allowed us to debate the topic in one place and hopefully not hijack other threads.
Don't bank on it, his contract is a primary impediment to the Flyers having much cap flexibility, something that will only be exacerbated going forward.

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Not too complicated.
When your primary position is that this is never going to happen and it's pretty much stupid to discuss...you can dress it up with whatever drapes you want, it remains what it is.

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05-30-2009, 04:22 PM
  #72
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Actually if you consider the time value of money and interest/inflation rates a frontloaded 8 year 52 million dollar deal is probably much more appealing than an evenly disbursed 49 over 7.
It's actually not even close. It's money in hand which you can put in some interest bearing account.

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05-30-2009, 04:26 PM
  #73
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So...the point is that you're tired of people discussing something and you want it to be contained within a space where you won't have to necessarily read it?

...that's suppressing/censoring discussion.
The point is that I am reading it which is why I'm posting in this thread. Congratulations, your point has no validity, if I refused to read this thread, then I wouldn't.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester
That why the majority of your argument is bent on quashing the very logic of the discussion? You don't think it's ever going to happen...you're not debating it, you're holding an absolutely rigid position.
Sigh, again, no it isn't, I encourage discussion. The problem is that we have a lot of posters who automatically formulate our salary cap plans based on the fact that Briere will waive his NMC. Guess what, that's not a certainty. In fact, it's pretty far from a certainty.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Jester
When your primary position is that this is never going to happen and it's pretty much stupid to discuss...you can dress it up with whatever drapes you want, it remains what it is.
As of right now, the reasons for him not to waive it far outweigh the reasons to waive it unless he's having some kind of personal disaster that we don't know about. It'd be nice if people would accept that, but some continue to have trouble and assume he'll waive it at the drop of a hat.

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05-30-2009, 04:53 PM
  #74
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Actually, I believe the taxes in Quebec are significantly worse than in other parts of Canada, hence why the Canadiens have so much trouble having all these star players who have always wanted to play for the Canadiens...to play for the Canadiens....

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05-30-2009, 05:46 PM
  #75
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Actually, I believe the taxes in Quebec are significantly worse than in other parts of Canada, hence why the Canadiens have so much trouble having all these star players who have always wanted to play for the Canadiens...to play for the Canadiens....
Correct, the players that play for the Canadiens get taxed up the wazoo.

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