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Heatley to Colorado

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Old
05-31-2009, 12:02 PM
  #76
Ruiner058
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A trade for Heatley to the Avs would mean that Ryan Smyth is going the other way - b/c of their cap situation. It's not like the Avs aren't going to be spending to the limit... adding an legit number 1 goalie is almost unaffordable as it stands right now - prior to Heatley's salary. So the trade then turns into Smyth + 3rd pick overall for Heatley. That's a fair value trade (the Avs would likely have to add more) and I would consider it, but I think from a rebuilding standpoint (knowing the Avs won't compete for at least 3 years), I say no and try and get as many other key pieces in place w/ the salary Heatley would take up. If the Avs were just one super star forward away, by all means make this trade. Unfortunately, we need to get rid of a few defenseman and the pylon that is Arnason, replace Sakic, and find a goalie... Since the Avs will likely have another good draft pick next year, this type of trade should be revisited then by which time a number of awful defensive contracts for the avs will come off the books and they will hopefully have solidified their goal tending.

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Old
05-31-2009, 06:13 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by singabba kowatix View Post
Would Colorado be interested in Heatley for Wolski, Kevin Shattenkirk, and the 3rd overall?
One of the worst trade proposals i have ever seen. Period.

A good young player with untapped potential, the teams top prospect and a potential franchise player in the 3rd overall pick for Heatley? Brutal.

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Old
05-31-2009, 06:46 PM
  #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcphllp View Post
ya you can do all of this. but its a gamble right? .
and respectfully, so is trading for heatley with what colorado can ice right now...

it's a gamble either way you go, however in colorado's situation, i'd side with patience and keep my assets

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Old
05-31-2009, 07:32 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcphllp View Post
I just dont get why so many people on this site put such an emphasis on a guys age. Kaberle is 31 and hes old, Heatly is 28 and he'll be old in a few years.

Not having a #1 centre is a big problem, but Heatley can probably score 40 goals playing with AHL players. He didnt do it this year, but the Sens had a real problem scoring goals until the Head Coach was changed, then they were one of the top scoring teams in the league. Saying Heatley would only get 30-35 goals on the Leafs is wrong. The Leafs are a good offensive team already without having big name players. Heatley would do great in Toronto.

So many people on here always talk about you gotta rebuild, and I understand that, but adding a guy like Heatley would advance that rebuild so much faster than hoping that your draft picks pan out.

Schenn for Heatley is a no brainer.
The obsession with age is weird. Detroit is by far he oldest team in the league.

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Old
05-31-2009, 09:34 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcphllp View Post
This is ridiculous. Not trading a prospect for a young winger that is one of the top players in the league? Come on man. You hope your 3rd overall pick will be as good as Heatley.

From a strictly hockey player deal, of course heatley> the 3rd, but the deal doesnt work for the avs for the following reasons:

a) the avs are no good right now, a stud like heatley at best gets them in the playoffs, not make them a contender, thus sacrficing the future for the now doesnt make sense.

b) the avs have cap issuses which a heatley sized contract would not fit in easily.

c) duchene will be an av till he is atleast 26 and most likely longer at a reasonable price. heatley could just leave as soon as he is a ufa again.

LA is a more logical trade destination with all their young players ready to make an impact and the team having stockpilled lots of valuable trade assets.

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Old
05-31-2009, 09:48 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trentmccleary View Post

The NHL entry draft has been going on for just over 40 years now, leaving you with 40+ examples of 3rd overall drafted players to choose from.

Name 5 that are/were better than Heatley.

You might want to recalculate your odds of getting a player "as good or better than Heatley".
Denis Savard, Pat LaFontaine, Scott Niedermeyer, Reggie Leach, Marian Gaborik.

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Old
05-31-2009, 09:52 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laoghaire View Post
The obsession with age is weird. Detroit is by far he oldest team in the league.
If they're lucky, maybe they can deal guys like Lidstrom, Zetterberg and Datsyuk for first round picks.

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Old
05-31-2009, 09:55 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex28 View Post
I guess every top 5 draft pick is worth as much as any above average-NHLer.

Duchene, like all draft picks, is a gamble. He could pan out to be better than Heatley, he could pan out to be as good, or he could not pan out at all (though from his scouting report that's less likely for Duchene than for other players).


Oh man.

First you refer to Heatley as an "above average-NHLer," and then you make it seem like if Duchene doesn't pan out as good as the back-to-back, 50 goal, 100+ point player, he won't have panned out at all.

If Duchene approaches Heatley's production, the team that picks him would be ecstatic.

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:00 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laoghaire View Post
The obsession with age is weird. Detroit is by far he oldest team in the league.
and Pittsburgh is a young team?

It can be said that all of Detroits players are in their prime or like Lidstrom seem to never get old.

Age is a big thing though, Zetterberg/Datz wont be this good forever, and Datz is getting up there in age as well, and Lidstrom should be retiring soon

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:11 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alex28 View Post
Lol... way to be completely clueless about what has been going on in Colorado for like half a decade.

Wow
I was talking about Ottawa...Seems your completly clueless too

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:21 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crucifux View Post
Counter Proposal:

Sens:
Elliot
Volchenkov
9th Overall

Col:
Hejduk

C'mon, Hejduk has scored 50 goals before...
no thanks, key word "before" not anymore.

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:22 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laoghaire View Post
The obsession with age is weird. Detroit is by far he oldest team in the league.
People think that they can build their teams like Pittsburgh; getting a ton of young players locked in place to fill roles. That doesn't work unless your team pathetically bottoms out 5 years in a row, like Pittsburgh did.

That said, there's no overlooking the fact that this is a godawful trade that would put Ottawa over the top and Colorado in the dark ages. And in this case, Heatley's age is a valid complaint seeing as Colorado is rebuilding, and Shattenkirk and the 3 players expected to go top three are all under age 21.

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:52 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Evil Sather View Post
Denis Savard, Pat LaFontaine, Scott Niedermeyer, Reggie Leach, Marian Gaborik.


Heatley is way better than those guys.......

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Old
05-31-2009, 10:59 PM
  #89
mcphllp
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HSF View Post
and Pittsburgh is a young team?

It can be said that all of Detroits players are in their prime or like Lidstrom seem to never get old.

Age is a big thing though, Zetterberg/Datz wont be this good forever, and Datz is getting up there in age as well, and Lidstrom should be retiring soon
And yet they will probably win another Stanley Cup. Im not completely sure what your point is here.

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Old
05-31-2009, 11:00 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shadow1 View Post
People think that they can build their teams like Pittsburgh; getting a ton of young players locked in place to fill roles. That doesn't work unless your team pathetically bottoms out 5 years in a row, like Pittsburgh did.

That said, there's no overlooking the fact that this is a godawful trade that would put Ottawa over the top and Colorado in the dark ages. And in this case, Heatley's age is a valid complaint seeing as Colorado is rebuilding, and Shattenkirk and the 3 players expected to go top three are all under age 21.
Heatley is 28. How is that a concern?

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Old
05-31-2009, 11:10 PM
  #91
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yeah people need to give the age a rest, and concentrate on heatley's salary/cap hit.. that's the true issue here...

28 is still golden in terms of age, in terms of acquiring great players, you get them whenever you can really, no matter what their age is imo (well, 35 is pushing it )

it's the money, not the age

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Old
05-31-2009, 11:14 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Avs_19 View Post


Heatley is way better than those guys.......
Heatley is not better than Marian Gaborik. Injury concerns aside, Gaborik is a fair bit better than him. Heatley regularily plays with 2 franchise players on an offensive oriented team and Gaborik plays with significant worse line mates in the most defensive of hockey teams.

If Gaborik had better line mates and wasn't made of glass, he'd have a real shot at being a top 5 forward.

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Old
06-01-2009, 01:27 AM
  #93
shadow1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcphllp View Post
Heatley is 28. How is that a concern?
It's a concern because:

a. The Avalanche suck. It's time to build around 18-23 year olds, not trade three of them away for one 28 year old.

b. His numbers have declined heavily (33 points) the last two seasons. Not saying he's on the decline, but it's noteworthy.

c. He's played the last four seasons with a world class play making center. I'm not saying Stastny can't, or won't, eventually start scoring 90 point seasons, but I have a hard time envisioning him ever scoring more assists than games (a feat Spezza accomplished).

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Old
06-01-2009, 02:56 AM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laoghaire View Post
The obsession with age is weird. Detroit is by far he oldest team in the league.
Pretty sure Chelios, Draper, Maltby, Lidstrom and Osgood have something to do with that.

Oh, and how many 36-39 year old defensemen out there are there as good as Nick Lidstrom?

Exactly.

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Old
06-01-2009, 02:59 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Asquaredx2 View Post


Oh man.

First you refer to Heatley as an "above average-NHLer," and then you make it seem like if Duchene doesn't pan out as good as the back-to-back, 50 goal, 100+ point player, he won't have panned out at all.

If Duchene approaches Heatley's production, the team that picks him would be ecstatic.
Not what I was saying at all.

There's a lot more to it than just production. Age (often correlating the length for which production can be sustained), cap hit, two way play and other intangibles. Heatley's numbers have been declining despite him playing with a much better center than anyone Avalanche have to offer and he's a pretty one-dimensional player.

But you can interpret it any way you want, of course.

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