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This Leblanc Obsession

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Old
06-09-2009, 01:25 PM
  #76
vokiel
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Originally Posted by Freaky Habs Fan View Post
It's not an excuse...it's a fact...at least for them. There is no such thing as a clear cut BPA. Each teams has their own list of BPA so if they pick the guy they felt was the BPA, so be it. They are not lying...are they always right? Of course not, but on draft day, they feel like they are right.

And you can't judge as a fan if they took the BPA. Bottom line is the term best player available is different for everyone...but you still can use it because it's not a wrong term.
Well what I meant is that usually there's a lot more involved than simply selecting the best player available and that in the end people always come back to this like it's a pair of crutches. For example, it's not just for the fun of it that some teams have silly questions in interviews with certain players and that some players drop on their list based on those interviews. BPA? well.. whatever. More like we'd like this guy to fit with us or someone convinced us that he'd be a good or bad fit.

So in the end it's not entirely impossible that the org picks Leblanc and not because he's BPA on ice, but because, as so many ppl hate to say, the draft is in Montreal, the team needs to satisfy their fan base at the draft sometimes, etc.. etc...

Best Player Available isn't just a on ice concept IMHO.


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06-09-2009, 01:54 PM
  #77
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I see it to be quite the opposite, actually. Leblanc seems like a future 2nd-3rd line player. His coach did not hesitate to point out that teammate and MTL draft pick Danny Kristo is the more talented player between the two, with Leblanc getting the edge in the work ethic category. Yes Kristo was picked in 2008 and Leblanc is 2009 eligible, but there's only 6 months separating the two in age. Anyways I think it's time to go for talent over work ethic and determination. Even with his supposed great work ethic, he posted average numbers at the combine and I find his skating to be a bit iffy.

I also don't like that he's heading to Harvard next year. As ridiculous as that statement may sound, we're looking for hockey players here, not Rhodes Scholars. Higgins tore that division up and the level of competition is definitely a notch below many of the other NCAA divisions.
Don't really disagree with you on any of those points, especially the whole Harvard thing. I think this kid would be best off playing in the CHL, but I've read a few scouts comments that sound like some teams look at him as a diamond in the rough. Of course many diamonds in the rough never get out of the rough, so.......

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06-09-2009, 02:10 PM
  #78
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So is Leblanc the guy who, if we pass over him at 18, the media will whine about for months? Like, on 110% they'll cry about it over and over like they did with Esposito?

You know, they'll have a little montage of Leblanc and then show Gainey saying "the Habs draft..." and get some super terrible english-accent voiceover saying "RY-UNNN MUC-DUNNN AAAAAA??????????"

Like that?

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06-09-2009, 02:19 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by vokiel View Post
Well what I meant is that usually there's a lot more involved than simply selecting the best player available and that in the end people always come back to this like it's a pair of crutches. For example, it's not just for the fun of it that some teams have silly questions in interviews with certain players and that some players drop on their list based on those interviews. BPA? well.. whatever. More like we'd like this guy to fit with us or someone convinced us that he'd be a good or bad fit.

So in the end it's not entirely impossible that the org picks Leblanc and not because he's BPA on ice, but because, as so many ppl hate to say, the draft is in Montreal, the team needs to satisfy their fan base at the draft sometimes, etc.. etc...

Best Player Available isn't just a on ice concept IMHO.
Oh I see now and I agree with that. When I say BPA, I also think about those things. That's why the drafting list of every team is so different...I know the Habs put effort in meanting the players they like. They even go in their family to meet everyone...

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Originally Posted by Waffledave
So is Leblanc the guy who, if we pass over him at 18, the media will whine about for months? Like, on 110% they'll cry about it over and over like they did with Esposito?

You know, they'll have a little montage of Leblanc and then show Gainey saying "the Habs draft..." and get some super terrible english-accent voiceover saying "RY-UNNN MUC-DUNNN AAAAAA??????????"

Like that?
Yup...just like that. Even if he's taken before our pick, people will whine that we did not moved up to snatch him...

And then, they will say we should have went with Caron who is a big player...but isn't ranked anywhere near the top 20 by ANYONE (but media will quickly forget that).

Then, we'll draft one or two quebecois, but they will be in the shadow of the non selection of Leblanc.

Add to the fire the fact the Habs passed over many Quebecois in the first round of the last few draft and you are ready to have a big explosion...

I'm telling you, it won't be nice...

At least, 110% is out for summer...but man, I always enjoy hearing those clown talk about something they don't even know a bit...

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06-09-2009, 02:20 PM
  #80
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So is Leblanc the guy who, if we pass over him at 18, the media will whine about for months? Like, on 110% they'll cry about it over and over like they did with Esposito?

You know, they'll have a little montage of Leblanc and then show Gainey saying "the Habs draft..." and get some super terrible english-accent voiceover saying "RY-UNNN MUC-DUNNN AAAAAA??????????"

Like that?
Doubtful. Esposito caused such a stir because he was at one point considered a top-3/5 pick. He also had a fair amount of success in the Q with the Remparts who won the memorial cup, and made the press before even playing a game by holding the US College route over potential drafters, making it clear he would only play for a team he approved of. Leblanc shunned the Q to go play in the USHL, has sort of come out of nowhere, and is headed to Harvard next year. Even the RDS clips had nothing special of him, just some shoddy skating and some ambiguous interview with Timmins.

This is too solid a draft for the Quebec "issue" to come into play. Hopefully all media outlets see it that way.

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06-09-2009, 02:22 PM
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Doubtful. Esposito caused such a stir because he was at one point considered a top-3/5 pick. He also had a fair amount of success in the Q with the Remparts who won the memorial cup, and made the press before even playing a game by holding the US College route over potential drafters, making it clear he would only play for a team he approved of. Leblanc shunned the Q to go play in the USHL, has sort of come out of nowhere, and is headed to Harvard next year. Even the RDS clips had nothing special of him, just some shoddy skating and some ambiguous interview with Timmins.

This is too solid a draft for the Quebec "issue" to come into play. Hopefully all media outlets see it that way.

So, it's all right if any other teams draft Leblanc before the Habs' pick, but it is forbidden for the Habs to draft him at number 18 because he is a local boy ?

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06-09-2009, 02:24 PM
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So, it's all right if any other teams draft Leblanc before the Habs' pick, but it is forbidden for the Habs to draft him at number 18 because he is a local boy ?
The local boy thing has nothing to do with it.

Different teams have different needs. I think we have enough 2nd-3rd line wingers, doesn't matter whether they're from Azerbaijan or Uzbekistan.

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06-09-2009, 07:00 PM
  #83
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The local boy thing has nothing to do with it.

Different teams have different needs. I think we have enough 2nd-3rd line wingers, doesn't matter whether they're from Azerbaijan or Uzbekistan.

who said Leblanc couldnt be a 1st line players? it wont be the 1st time scout think x-prospects will be a 3rd liner and end up being top line forward and vice versa

for those who have not seen the leblanc,chiasson and Gelinas interview on radio-canada

http://www.radio-canada.ca/audio-vid...2300.asx&pos=1

edit: its the 2/3 video button at the bottom of the video

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06-09-2009, 07:25 PM
  #84
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who said Leblanc couldnt be a 1st line players? it wont be the 1st time scout think x-prospects will be a 3rd liner and end up being top line forward and vice versa

for those who have not seen the leblanc,chiasson and Gelinas interview on radio-canada

http://www.radio-canada.ca/audio-vid...2300.asx&pos=1

edit: its the 2/3 video button at the bottom of the video
He could. But right now he doesn't seem to have as high a ceiling as other players available in this draft. This is a very good draft and I would be thoroughly disappointed if we went with Leblanc in the 1st round.

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06-09-2009, 07:45 PM
  #85
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He could. But right now he doesn't seem to have as high a ceiling as other players available in this draft. This is a very good draft and I would be thoroughly disappointed if we went with Leblanc in the 1st round.
just out of curiousity, who do you see having more ceiling than Leblanc at the Center position??? (players who we actually would have a chance to pick at 18th)

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06-09-2009, 07:57 PM
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just out of curiousity, who do you see having more ceiling than Leblanc at the Center position??? (players who we actually would have a chance to pick at 18th)
I don't care about position, especially since Leblanc may very well convert to wing.

Schroeder, Kassian, Josefson, Holland, Glennie if he falls, Kreider, and I'd rather even go with Shore since he's going to a real hockey program.

Leblanc's decision to go to Harvard turns me off of him completely. You need to play with the best to be the best. His skating is very average and so is his conditioning. For a guy with less talent than our late second rounder from last year, it's enough for me to say no thanks.

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06-09-2009, 08:08 PM
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I don't care about position, especially since Leblanc may very well convert to wing.

Schroeder, Kassian, Josefson, Holland, Glennie if he falls, Kreider, and I'd rather even go with Shore since he's going to a real hockey program.

Leblanc's decision to go to Harvard turns me off of him completely. You need to play with the best to be the best. His skating is very average and so is his conditioning. For a guy with less talent than our late second rounder from last year, it's enough for me to say no thanks.
i guess we will see, i dont think his skating "is very average" i dont know where you saw/read that....also his conditionning is a question mark (his vo2 bike test was not so good) but i see this in a good way since he has chance to improved in this area and that will make him a better hockey players (more endurance, more strenght ect) as he's still a raw prospects since he hasnt hit his peak physically yet.

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06-09-2009, 08:37 PM
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Leblanc's decision to go to Harvard turns me off of him completely. You need to play with the best to be the best. His skating is very average and so is his conditioning. For a guy with less talent than our late second rounder from last year, it's enough for me to say no thanks.
http://www.sportsjuniors.com/?p=6332

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« L’entretien s’est bien passé, mais nos chances de le voir avec les Saguenéens avant les fêtes sont plutôt faibles. S’il joue avec nous l’an prochain, ce sera à la deuxième moitié de saison. Il veut absolument faire au moins une première session à l’Université Harvard, à l’automne », a expliqué le pilote des Sags à Sports Juniors.
Seems that Harvard could only be for the first session if everything goes well.....as far as the Sags are concerned.

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06-09-2009, 08:37 PM
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Leblanc's decision to go to Harvard turns me off of him completely. You need to play with the best to be the best.
Talent is still talent. The guy went straight from playing Midget (playing against comparatively low competition) hockey to being one of the top guys on Canada's "A" U18 team (playing with the best Canada had to offer). Gretzky only played one year of junior hockey before moving on to the bigger challenge of the WHA, but Lemieux and Crosby were unarguably over and beyond QMJHL hockey before their draft years (especially Lemieux in his third year in the league), but they turned out okay. Theoretically, maybe both would have developed better playing pro hockey in their draft years, but, as I said, talent is talent and they turned out okay. I don't think high school hockey is what made Tom Barrasso a Calder and Vezina winner a year later either.

Sure, Leblanc would be better refined playing in the CCHA or WCHA, but if he doesn't have natural finish, for example, playing in either of those Conferences isn't going to magically give it to him, just like a Chris Higgins wouldn't magically have a better finishing touch if he played for the University of Michigan instead of Yale. It would have developed his game better, playing against better competition, but wouldn't have given him anything he doesn't have.

And I think the competition he'll be playing with and against with Harvard is still a step above what he faced this past year in the USHL, so while he won't be playing with and against the best he could be playing with and against, it will still be a step up. It's not like he's going to be playing rec hockey or is going to be taking a step down in competition.

In sum, yes I think he'd be better served playing in a tougher Conference with a more proven program, but I hardly think playing in Harvard is career suicide or the be all and end all. His future is in his hands; it's not dependent on the league in which he plays.

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06-09-2009, 08:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
http://www.sportsjuniors.com/?p=6332



Seems that Harvard could only be for the first session if everything goes well.....as far as the Sags are concerned.
i dont believe a word of it, i think the sags are dreaming if they think Leblanc is going to quit harvard for them after one session

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06-09-2009, 08:47 PM
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Guys, stop talking about Chris Higgins. The guy is a 3rd line player with some offensive abilites. In such a deep draft, we cannot waste a 1st round pick on a guy who could become the next Chris Higgins. I like Higgins, but I will never spend a 1st round pick in 09 for a guy like him. I prefer players who are committed to strong hockey program and I really think their development is highly influenced by the competition level. Maybe Higgins did well in that division but look what he became...

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06-09-2009, 08:52 PM
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Guys, stop talking about Chris Higgins. The guy is a 3rd line player with some offensive abilites. In such a deep draft, we cannot waste a 1st round pick on a guy who could become the next Chris Higgins. I like Higgins, but I will never spend a 1st round pick in 09 for a guy like him. I prefer players who are committed to strong hockey program and I really think their development is highly influenced by the competition level. Maybe Higgins did well in that division but look what he became...
Leblanc is going to be (imo) much better than Higgins and hell Higgins has not been bad since he join the habs (had one bad season and now he's an awful players....he scored 23,22 and 27 goal its not what i call third liner typical stats) i expect him to have huge rebound year next year under new head coach Jacques Martin who is really high on hard working two-way forward like higgins)

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06-09-2009, 08:54 PM
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I don't care about position, especially since Leblanc may very well convert to wing.

Schroeder, Kassian, Josefson, Holland, Glennie if he falls, Kreider, and I'd rather even go with Shore since he's going to a real hockey program.

Leblanc's decision to go to Harvard turns me off of him completely. You need to play with the best to be the best. His skating is very average and so is his conditioning. For a guy with less talent than our late second rounder from last year, it's enough for me to say no thanks.
As weird as it sounds, the Harvard thing turns me off a bit as well. That's just selfishness, as I wanna see top prospects in the NHL as soon as possible (given that they're ready). I don't mind if lower draft picks go the school route and develop slowly, but this team needs some star-calibre, impact players ASAP.

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i guess we will see, i dont think his skating "is very average" i dont know where you saw/read that....also his conditionning is a question mark (his vo2 bike test was not so good) but i see this in a good way since he has chance to improved in this area and that will make him a better hockey players (more endurance, more strenght ect) as he's still a raw prospects since he hasnt hit his peak physically yet.
I've read that in younger days his speed was never in question (in fact, it got him noticed), but I'm just about to go through some of the combine results in detail just to see if there are any hints about other facets of skating. For example:

""I like the Wingate," Kekalainen said. "That tells you about the explosiveness, the peak power. The first eight seconds of it gives you a good measure of a guy's quickness and explosiveness and power. The VO2 test is a good place to see a guy's effort. It's painful, just like a hockey game is sometimes."

Very important metrics for the NHL, as players aren't racing ovals around the rink. Heck, I'm sure Latendresse eventually gets up to a pretty high top speed... (did I miss post 14?) And as far as endurance, if he's as lean (low % body fat) as hard a worker as rumoured to be yet still doesn't post even AVERAGE numbers in the VO2, how much more endurance can he really develop?

In the end, his coaches all rave about him. But all coaches do that to hype their boy before the draft. I will say again, though, that I'm hoping for a more skilled (versus "hard worker") guy who projects to top-6 and will be playing in the NHL sooner than later. Those are the guys that should be taken with 1st round picks. Save those safer, longer term projects, for the later rounds. Just my opinion.

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06-09-2009, 08:59 PM
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Leblanc is going to be (imo) much better than Higgins and hell Higgins has not been bad since he join the habs (had one bad season and now he's an awful players....he scored 23,22 and 27 goal its not what i call third liner typical stats) i expect him to have huge rebound year next year under new head coach Jacques Martin who is really high on hard working two-way forward like higgins)
Top 20 players of this years are supposed to be stars players, not franchise but very important players. So, even if I think Leblanc is better than Higgins, stop using Higgins as a reference of important player coming from that weak division. The guy has 38/38/52/23 pts since he's in the NHL. What an impact player! If we take Leblanc this year, I really hope he'll put up much better numbers than that because I have the feeling that at least 15-18 players will be top 3 d-man or near 65+pts players.

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06-09-2009, 09:01 PM
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As weird as it sounds, the Harvard thing turns me off a bit as well. That's just selfishness, as I wanna see top prospects in the NHL as soon as possible (given that they're ready). I don't mind if lower draft picks go the school route and develop slowly, but this team needs some star-calibre, impact players ASAP.



I've read that in younger days his speed was never in question (in fact, it got him noticed), but I'm just about to go through some of the combine results in detail just to see if there are any hints about other facets of skating. For example:

""I like the Wingate," Kekalainen said. "That tells you about the explosiveness, the peak power. The first eight seconds of it gives you a good measure of a guy's quickness and explosiveness and power. The VO2 test is a good place to see a guy's effort. It's painful, just like a hockey game is sometimes."

Very important metrics for the NHL, as players aren't racing ovals around the rink. Heck, I'm sure Latendresse eventually gets up to a pretty high top speed... (did I miss post 14?) And as far as endurance, if he's as lean (low % body fat) as hard a worker as rumoured to be yet still doesn't post even AVERAGE numbers in the VO2, how much more endurance can he really develop?

In the end, his coaches all rave about him. But all coaches do that to hype their boy before the draft. I will say again, though, that I'm hoping for a more skilled (versus "hard worker") guy who projects to top-6 and will be playing in the NHL sooner than later. Those are the guys that should be taken with 1st round picks. Save those safer, longer term projects, for the later rounds. Just my opinion.
Very good post.

I find myself growing increasingly annoyed by McDonagh's reluctance to turn pro. Fischer I understand, as it's a bit of a physical issue for him.. But McD has the frame to play a pro-game right now and he isn't exactly progressing at the rate I'd like from such a high draft pick. With the news of Emelin staying put, and Weber likely starting the year off in Montreal, I would of liked to see both McD and Subban break into the Bulldogs lineup.

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06-09-2009, 09:12 PM
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I don't care about position, especially since Leblanc may very well convert to wing.

Schroeder, Kassian, Josefson, Holland, Glennie if he falls, Kreider, and I'd rather even go with Shore since he's going to a real hockey program.

Leblanc's decision to go to Harvard turns me off of him completely. You need to play with the best to be the best. His skating is very average and so is his conditioning. For a guy with less talent than our late second rounder from last year, it's enough for me to say no thanks.
That scares me too. If a 2nd round pick in a weaker draft(Kristo) is more talented that him, I'm not that high to pick him. Like you said, we really need a talented player with that 18th pick. Sure we wont have Tavares but very good players will be available at 18th and a lot of them, IMO, are more talented than Leblanc. We cant go in the safe way and select a player who'll be a very good 3rd line player with great ethic if he don't reach his ceiling. We need a guy who can become a real offensive threat ex: Morin ( probably the best sniper of the draft after Tavares). Maybe he wont reach his potential but if he does, he'll be a hell of a player.

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06-09-2009, 09:24 PM
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not that hockey canada is 100% right all the time, but for the summer u-20 camp none of Peter Holland, Landon Ferraro and Carter AShton got invited. Leblanc did get an invitation....

just saying

anyway can't wait for the draft 17 days and counting

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06-09-2009, 09:27 PM
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not that hockey canada is 100% right all the time, but for the summer u-20 camp none of Peter Holland, Landon Ferraro and Carter AShton got invited. Leblanc did get an invitation....

just saying

anyway can't wait for the draft 17 days and counting
To play with Cormier on thr 4th line or to be the defensive center
Just a joke but I'll be very surprised to see him on top 2 lines.

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06-09-2009, 11:33 PM
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Leblanc would be doing himself a favor by attending Harvard. If he has a successful hockey career, fine, but if not a Harvard experience could be a lifelong asset.

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06-10-2009, 10:06 AM
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You guys act like he’s going to play in some backwater, no-hockey hick-town. He’s going to a Division I program and school, where he will play against other top schools. There are at least four other NHL-drafted players on his team. He’ll be coached by:

* Ted Donato: Long time NHL player, currently setting coaching records for Harvard.

* Sean McCann: Former Hobey Baker finalist, first overall pick in the NHL supplemental draft (1994, Florida), played over 500 games in the IHL (where he was rookie of the year) and AHL.

* Patrick Foley: Former assistant coach for the USNTD (where he coached, amongst many others, Pat Kane and James Van Riemsdyke) and assistant coach of the U-18 team that won gold for Team USA in 2006.

It’s a solid coaching staff.

I also don’t get this “he needs to be turning pro much quicker” philosophy. By that logic all 14 year olds should be playing in the AHL, “so they can develop quicker.” It makes no sense. You play them at the level they are able to play at, there is ZERO point in putting them in over their head. They’ll develop at their own pace. Look at the Detroit Red Wings – do they do a lousy job of developing? Do they rush everyone into the AHL or NHL as quick as they can??

As for the Chris Higgins comparisons, as usual HF’s has such a bloated evaluation of draft picks that it’s incredible. We’re picking 18th!! Check out the 18th-30th pick in any draft and most teams would be thrilled with a Chris Higgins at that spot. Sure, there are ALWAYS the one or two players that everbody missed that become instant stars, but everybody misses them for a reason. Heck, Louis Leblanc could be that guy for all we know. Even if you compare this draft to 2003, one of the greatest drafts of all time, a Chris Higgins would have fit in pretty well amongst the 18th-30th picks:

18) Eric Fehr
19) Ryan Getzlaf
20) Brent Burns
21) Mark Stuart
22) Marc-Antoine Pouliot
23) Ryan Kessler
24) Mike Richards
25) Anthony Stewart
26) Brian Boyle
27) Jeff Tambellini
28) Corey Perry
29) Patrick Eaves
30) Shawn Belle

Of the 13 players taken in one of the greatest first rounds of all time, only THREE players who would have been available at pick 18 (Getzlaf, Richards, Perry) are better than Chris Higgins. THREE!! Sure, I’d take Getzlaf over Higgins, but I’d take Higgins over Pouiliot, Stewart, Boyle Eaves and Belle, and so would any GM in their right mind. You guys act like getting a Getzlaf or Richards at 18 is a sure thing. It wasn’t in 2003, and it certainly isn’t now.

If we can get a 25 goal, 55-65 point, defensively reliable center at pick 18, who by all accounts has a tremendous work ethic and outstanding character, and who oh yeah happens to be very smart, bilingual, and a life-long Habs fan, I for one would be ecstatic. That's captain material, if you ask me.

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