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Official - Canucks Agree in Principle on Deal with Sergei Shirokov

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Old
06-11-2009, 02:09 AM
  #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SelKesler View Post
Edler/Bieksa, Raymond, Schneider and a 1st

I know they have Elliot but him and Schneider sharing the full NHL load would be a really good thing for them.

GENIUS
LeClaire says hi.

Genius.

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06-11-2009, 02:14 AM
  #102
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Originally Posted by DreamCatcher View Post
LeClaire says hi.

Genius.
Awww FML I keep completely forgetting about that trade. Oh well a deal can still be done surrounding Edler/Bieksa, 1st and Raymond

PS - Leclaire doesn't have a capital C

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06-11-2009, 02:15 AM
  #103
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****UPDATE****

Quote:
*Update* I have been told that a official announcment has not been made yet because there is a problem over in Russia to send him over. But don't get me wrong, this deal is 100% done. I will try and find out more about the situation, stay tuned...
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1...ergei-shirokov

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06-11-2009, 02:18 AM
  #104
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Shirokov says "Shhhh" to all the speculation.

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06-11-2009, 02:45 AM
  #105
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There is another implicaton to this. It seems like Gillis is looking at filling alot of the roster spots from within. Even if Sundin is resigned, it won't be for more than 4 mil a year. After he re-signs the Sedins, its looking like it's probable that he'll have the money to go after Niedermayer or Bouwmeester.

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06-11-2009, 03:02 AM
  #106
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how credible is this site?

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06-11-2009, 03:10 AM
  #107
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Originally Posted by Aeon View Post
Kesler as the 1st Line C? I love Kes too man, but there's no way in hell he's going to carry a line by himself. It took Sundin AND Demitra, two playmakers, for Kesler to start putting up points. He's a finisher, not a set-up man.
Who says the 1st line center has to carry the line by himself? Morrison certainly didn't. I agree that Kesler is not what you would consider a first line center but are you really giving Sundin and Demitra credit for making that line work? Kesler put both those guys on his back, especially in the defensive zone. He was putting up some pretty decent numbers with Burrows too, he just was used in a more defensive role.

If he wasn't going, that line wasn't going. I'm also not sure I agree with the idea that Kesler is a finisher and not a playmaker.

I think people should stop worrying about categorizing lines like they are playing NHL 09. I would rather have 4 balanced lines than 1 superstar "scoring" line and a bunch of supporting lines. We tried that once here already, it doesn't work.

Ideally we have 3 really great centers and not worry about who is 1st, 2nd or 3rd. Who ever is going that particular night will get the ice time.

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06-11-2009, 03:57 AM
  #108
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Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Apparently our team sucks in any lineup that doesn't include the Sedins
Nah, man. A team that loses it's top scorers who are consistent, durable, and hard-working sucks.

That would be SelKesler's line-up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrmyheadhurts View Post
Who says the 1st line center has to carry the line by himself? Morrison certainly didn't. I agree that Kesler is not what you would consider a first line center but are you really giving Sundin and Demitra credit for making that line work?
Yes, I'm giving them full credit for making Kesler better than he was initially. The trio of Kesler-Sundin-Demitra is an odd one, because all of them collaborated with each other to make everyone on that line better. Without Sundin opening up vast amounts of ice, Kesler would never have any room to pull of the stuff he did. Without Kesler's terrific defensive play, that line becomes a liability in their own zone. Without Demitra's uncanny ability to act as a playermaker AND finisher when necessary, most of those points that line put up don't happen.

Quote:
Kesler put both those guys on his back, especially in the defensive zone. He was putting up some pretty decent numbers with Burrows too, he just was used in a more defensive role.
I'm going to have to politely disagree with you here. Kesler has had one marginally good season- and that's because he was playing with two people who could A) Open up the ice for him and B) Give him the puck when he was open/crashing the net. Kesler is the energy on that line... he has nowhere the hands of Pavol or Sundin, even at their age. If Kesler was put on the ice with, say, Raymond and Wellwood, could you realistically expect him to put up the same amount of points while making him play a more 'offensive-minded game'?

Quote:
If he wasn't going, that line wasn't going. I'm also not sure I agree with the idea that Kesler is a finisher and not a playmaker.

I think people should stop worrying about categorizing lines like they are playing NHL 09. I would rather have 4 balanced lines than 1 superstar "scoring" line and a bunch of supporting lines. We tried that once here already, it doesn't work.
Playmaker is quite a generally used term in sports- off the top of my head, the NHL, NBA, and NFL all have players categorized as playmakers. NHL 09 wasn't the originator of the term.

If you don't want to call Kesler a finisher, then there are only so many other options. Just some that pop into my head:

Energy player
Defensive-specialist
Playmaker
Power-forward
Goon

I'm sure I didn't cover everything, but defensive-specialist and energy player cover Kesler quite nicely already.. so what would you call him?

------------------

Regardless of semantics, a hockey line compiled of one sort player, e.g., a bunch of finishers/snipers on the same line would be entirely useless because none of them can get the puck to one another. A line full of playmakers will not flourish because nobody is going to shoot.

Quote:
Ideally we have 3 really great centers and not worry about who is 1st, 2nd or 3rd. Who ever is going that particular night will get the ice time.
Ok. (I'm sorry, I'm really tired so I don't think I'll reply to this one just now.)

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06-11-2009, 06:43 AM
  #109
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Kesler is none of those things. He is a sniper

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06-11-2009, 07:48 AM
  #110
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I think this might be a very good signing for the Nucks, but let's wait a more reliable source. It's true that he's trying hard to rule himself out of CSKA after Bykov left the team, and the first court action said CSKA owns the player (he's RFA). This is why it's hard to get him signed, but I think if both parts wanna dance the music will start soon.

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06-11-2009, 09:44 AM
  #111
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FYI

http://fdevji.blogspot.com/2009/06/s...situation.html

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06-11-2009, 10:11 AM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Respect Your Edler View Post
There is another implicaton to this. It seems like Gillis is looking at filling alot of the roster spots from within.
Or he's trying to have some competition for available spots (either on the Canucks or on the Moose) which is always a good thing.

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Old
06-11-2009, 10:16 AM
  #113
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Thankyou Bykov

Anyways i hope this comes true.

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06-11-2009, 10:18 AM
  #114
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Originally Posted by BleedCanucks View Post
Thanks... that's quite interesting.
Maybe he can pull a Malkin and sneak his way out of the country

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Old
06-11-2009, 10:26 AM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alessandro Seren Rosso View Post
I think this might be a very good signing for the Nucks, but let's wait a more reliable source. It's true that he's trying hard to rule himself out of CSKA after Bykov left the team, and the first court action said CSKA owns the player (he's RFA). This is why it's hard to get him signed, but I think if both parts wanna dance the music will start soon.
So Alessandro, what would prevent him from signing a deal with CSKA and then pulling out the "two weeks notice" card like Malkin did?

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Old
06-11-2009, 10:36 AM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alessandro Seren Rosso View Post
I think this might be a very good signing for the Nucks, but let's wait a more reliable source. It's true that he's trying hard to rule himself out of CSKA after Bykov left the team, and the first court action said CSKA owns the player (he's RFA). This is why it's hard to get him signed, but I think if both parts wanna dance the music will start soon.
Could you expand on the KHL's restricted free agency? The blog piece mentioned something about rules that come into place in an economic crisis (which for the KHL is every year).

I don't see how there is any way that KHL rules could prevent him from signing with the Canucks once his contract has expired.

In the NHL restricted free agency means that the team still owns his NHL rights and is due compensation (draft picks) if another NHL team signs him. But RFA status does not prevent a player from going to Europe.

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06-11-2009, 10:43 AM
  #117
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Those who are expecting Shirokov to step into the Canucks lineup had better temper their enthusiasm a bit.
Last year he had almost identical stats in the KHL as teammate Oleg Saprykin. Granted, Sergei is 5 years younger and may yet develop more...but keep in mind that Saprykin is also 3 inches taller and 10 pounds heavier than Shirokov, and Oleg struggled to make it in the NHL.
Shirokov will play in Manitoba at first and try to work on his speed and upper-body strength.
It is nice to be regenerating some depth of prospects, who could make a big step forward, though. I look forward to seeing Shirokov at training camp to see how he looks versus North American competition.

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06-11-2009, 10:44 AM
  #118
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Sounds good, I just hope he is willing to stick it out in the AHL if need be and doesn't pull a Kaigorodov and go back to Russia if he gets sent to the Moose after training camp. Thats my only issue with Russian Prospects, there aren't very many who are willing to come over and play in the AHL, even though they may need half a season to a season down there to get used to the North American style of play.

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Old
06-11-2009, 10:46 AM
  #119
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^

He is strong with the puck... If you see his goals..
You do realise he's been playing with Men that are bigger then him right?

The ahl woudln't be a problem, since the KHL is a much harder league to play in.

I think he will just do find, maybe not the first year but i think he can make it

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Old
06-11-2009, 10:51 AM
  #120
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Saprykin was a legit 30-35 point/82 game 3rd liner for about 5 years in the NHL. For a 22 year old kid to put up the same point totals as a player in the prime of his career with 5 seasons of experience in the NHL is pretty damn impressive.

I don't think he'll be able to step right in but outscoring Saprykin while playing on the same team isn't a bad thing.

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Old
06-11-2009, 11:22 AM
  #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steveorama View Post
Those who are expecting Shirokov to step into the Canucks lineup had better temper their enthusiasm a bit.
Last year he had almost identical stats in the KHL as teammate Oleg Saprykin. Granted, Sergei is 5 years younger and may yet develop more...but keep in mind that Saprykin is also 3 inches taller and 10 pounds heavier than Shirokov, and Oleg struggled to make it in the NHL.
Shirokov will play in Manitoba at first and try to work on his speed and upper-body strength.
It is nice to be regenerating some depth of prospects, who could make a big step forward, though. I look forward to seeing Shirokov at training camp to see how he looks versus North American competition.
Oleg was a regular NHLer... he was a young player with upside that was already good enough to be a 3rd liner in the NHL at Shirokov's age.

I don't think that's it's that much of a stretch to think that Shirokov is NHL ready now... doesn't mean he'll step in and be an impact player, but he's certainly proven enough already to think that he's got NHL ability right now at his age, and still more upside to develop into that impact player down the road.

He's now 23 years old... and anyone that has accomplished what he has at that age should be considered NHL ready... he led his team in scoring as one of the youngest players on the team.

If we're talking about a 20 YO here, I'd agree with you... but at 23, he's at an age where most prospects as accomplished should be expected to be NHLers now.

I think for Shirokov, if he is really coming over, it will come down to winning a job against Grabner... I think both players are likely to see time in both the NHL and AHL next year though, and may split the season between the two, but I can't see both of them making the lineup fulltime next season.... I think we're still a year away from seeing them both as fulltime NHLers.

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06-11-2009, 12:03 PM
  #122
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...Uhhhh

Un-confirmed eh?


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Old
06-11-2009, 12:18 PM
  #123
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If Shirokov does make the team next year, and Grabner is looking damn close to challenging for a spot as well, what does that show about Nonis' drafting in Vancouver?

I know people will complain about White (and the 07 draft in general) forever, but Nonis was around for only 4 drafts - 04 to 07, and it's still way too early to conclude anything substantial with the 07 draft.

from 04 to 06, we currently have Raymond, Hansen and Edler in the lineup... Grabner and Schneider are both looking close... Shirokov is turning into an actual prospect if he's really coming over... and Bourdon (RIP) could have been a big factor here as well...

and we still got Bliznak who's developing well in Manitoba, while Simek and Brown both late round picks were good enough to return some asset value for this team.

Not a bad pull from just 3 drafts.... overall, could be as good, if not better, than any 3 year cycle in the past?

in a couple years, we could have 1/3 of our forwards drafted by Nonis (Raymond, Grabner, Hansen, Shirokov), a key dman (Edler), and an upcoming quality goalie (Schneider)... and you can't really blame him for Bourdon's loss either, who looked well on his way to developing into a quality dman for this club as well.

All things considered, was Nonis' draft history really all that bad?

and that Luongo trade just keeps on giving as well - Shirokov being that 6th round pick acquired in that trade!

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Old
06-11-2009, 12:25 PM
  #124
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I've been thinking about the conundrum of Nonis's drafting lately as well and his recent drafts does somewhat repair his legacy I'm still glad we got rid of him as he was mediocre to horrid in a lot of other key GM aspects. I'm still not going to let go of the Kopitar **** up. But does this also mean Ron Delmore isn't a horrible scout?

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06-11-2009, 12:27 PM
  #125
Barney Gumble
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
Not a bad pull from just 3 drafts.... overall, could be as good, if not better, than any 3 year cycle in the past?
Considering the Canucks draft history since 1970, is that really that much of an accomplishment?

Actually here is a better "three year period":

1978..............Bill Derlago, Curt Fraser, Stan Smyl
1979..............Rick Vaive, Brent Ashton, Dirk Graham
1980..............Rick Lanz, Doug Lidster, Patrick Sundstrom

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