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Expressen: Sedins ask for $63 million over 12 years each - Sedin Contract Talks Here

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Old
06-12-2009, 03:08 PM
  #276
pitseleh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
Except it's tough to compare either Sedin to either of those players as Buffalo didn't have to sign Pominville's brother to get Pominville. In each of those situations it was 1 player signing for the $5M figure. With the Sedins it's 2 players in a package deal.
Yeah, but the Sedins had shown a lot more to that point in their careers than any of those three players too.

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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
There is however an external factor now to consider - the anticipated dropping of the salary cap for 2010-11. That may have a dampening effect on their demands as GM's have to take that into account.

In terms of Luongo it may well be positive because he can get a greater maximum salary if he signs before 01 July 2010.
And if anything that would have a dampering effect on their salary demands now that wasn't there last summer because a potentially dropping cap would have significant implications on the teams that would be bidding for their services.

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06-12-2009, 03:23 PM
  #277
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Originally Posted by LeftCoast View Post
The Sedins would have almost certainly been cheaper to extend last year than this year. They were coming off a season where they were much criticized for fading down the stretch and into the playoffs. Their offensive production had plateaued and even dropped off (they both went from the low 80's to mid 70's in points). There were even some (still) questioning if they were legitimate first line players. I think even they would have admitted they had something to prove. They would not have been facing competitive offers a full year away from free agency.
I disagree. There's no way a guy like Michael Ryder would've got the same contract this off-season than last year given the change in the economic environment. And he had a WORSE off-year than either Sedin.

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06-12-2009, 03:27 PM
  #278
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Old
06-12-2009, 03:36 PM
  #279
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Originally Posted by pitseleh View Post
And if anything that would have a dampering effect on their salary demands now that wasn't there last summer because a potentially dropping cap would have significant implications on the teams that would be bidding for their services.
Yes that was my point.

The generally accepted wisdom is that the closer a player gets to his UFA date, the higher the asking price. And once the playing season is over then there is usually little incentive to not test the Free Agent market.

The big reason for a player to get locked up early (i.e. the off-season prior to contract termination) is the protection the extension affords in case of serious or career-ending injury during that final season of the contract.

As a general rule "extended" contracts (in reality a new contract) have no effect until they actually go into effect on the following 01 July - with one major exception:
Quote:
(f) Contract Extensions.
(i) An "extension" of an SPC, as such term is used in this Agreement, shall mean a new SPC entered into between a Club and a Player, which SPC is to be effective immediately upon the expiration of the Club and Player's existing SPC. To the extent a Club and Player enter into a valid contract extension during the final year of the Player's SPC, the contract extension will be fully enforceable pursuant to its terms even in the event the Player is injured prior to the commencement date of the contract extension.
In terms of the Sedins this impetus no longer exists since the Canucks were knocked out of the play-offs.

However this may have been off-set by the looming drop in the salary cap for 2010-11 as GM's will have to take this into account for any multi-year deals when looking to sign both Sedins as I do not see much chance they will go anywhere except as package.

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06-12-2009, 05:34 PM
  #280
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I have this big thing growing out of my head. What should I do?
Are you sure it's not your nose?

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06-13-2009, 03:57 AM
  #281
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Yeah, let's get this back on track. Brocket 99 is reporting that the Sedins are each asking for $9m a year for 11 years. Gillis needs to let them walk. They have big heads, red hair and they are from overseas. 3 strikes and you're out.

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06-13-2009, 05:00 AM
  #282
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$9 million?! Do you actually believe that they would ask that much? From the years they've been here, they've never come across as money-grabbing selfish players. They're smart and they know that if they ask that much the team they'll be playing for would most likely not be contenders. I think they'll each sign for $5 to 6 million per year cap hit. I'm hoping for the lower end of that range, obviously.

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06-13-2009, 12:31 PM
  #283
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$9 million?! Do you actually believe that they would ask that much? From the years they've been here, they've never come across as money-grabbing selfish players. They're smart and they know that if they ask that much the team they'll be playing for would most likely not be contenders. I think they'll each sign for $5 to 6 million per year cap hit. I'm hoping for the lower end of that range, obviously.
Do I believe they would ask that much? Definitely. And I sure hope you aren't questioning the credibility of a fictitious native radio station.

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06-13-2009, 12:32 PM
  #284
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Just heard on TSN they're asking for 10m and paid vacation of 20 games a season. Let them walk.

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06-14-2009, 01:34 AM
  #285
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Originally Posted by pitseleh View Post
After Shawn Horcoff signed his $5.5 million/year extension last July, Barry brought it up as a comparable for a player that was less productive than either of the Sedins.
Using horrible contracts on the fringe of any curve is a good sign of desperation. "Hey Mike, I just found the worst deal signed in a decade, I'd like to use that as a starting point".

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Both Gillis and Barry have said that the Sedins performance in the playoffs would have no bearing on their contract value.
Bridge for sale.

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06-14-2009, 01:40 AM
  #286
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I hope they do ask for 9 million dollar contracts because if they did I might literally die of laughter.

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06-14-2009, 10:56 AM
  #287
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I hope they do ask for 9 million dollar contracts because if they did I might literally die of laughter.
you want to die?

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06-14-2009, 11:45 AM
  #288
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Originally Posted by dhabums View Post
Using horrible contracts on the fringe of any curve is a good sign of desperation. "Hey Mike, I just found the worst deal signed in a decade, I'd like to use that as a starting point".

That is precisely how salaries escalated so rapidly, ultimately ending in a lockout. One idiotic GM would overpay for a journeyman second-liner, and that contract would become the new benchmark.

The NHLPA kept (keeps) a database on all salaries and appropriate comparables for the agents' use in negotiations. "Fringe" contracts became the standard by which all pending FA's were measured, as dictated by their agents.

And there was usually somebody willing to pay...

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06-14-2009, 12:44 PM
  #289
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That is precisely how salaries escalated so rapidly, ultimately ending in a lockout. One idiotic GM would overpay for a journeyman second-liner, and that contract would become the new benchmark.

The NHLPA kept (keeps) a database on all salaries and appropriate comparables for the agents' use in negotiations. "Fringe" contracts became the standard by which all pending FA's were measured, as dictated by their agents.

And there was usually somebody willing to pay...
But this was all solved by the salary cap as revenues are tied to salaries. - I know this to be true because Bettman told us so continually since the lockout.

Also remember as Bettman has stated on a number of occasions there is no way in his system that teams can go over the salary cap as set in the CBA.

So there should no longer be a need for the players to keep bailing out the idiot GM's.

Trust in Gary.

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06-14-2009, 12:57 PM
  #290
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
But this was all solved by the salary cap as revenues are tied to salaries. - I know this to be true because Bettman told us so continually since the lockout.

Also remember as Bettman has stated on a number of occasions there is no way in his system that teams can go over the salary cap as set in the CBA.

So there should no longer be a need for the players to keep bailing out the idiot GM's.

Trust in Gary.
Under the cap system, if a player is overpaid now, it simply means the team has less flexibility to sign another player, who may sign with another team. As a collective, the players' salaries are tied to league revenues, but it doesn't prevent individual players from being signed above "market" value. It just means that either another player has to may have to sign for under market value, or that the players as a whole have to repay the league by the amount over the prescribed percentage of HRR they're collectively to recieve.

This doesn't help bailout individual GM's who've made idiotic signings, or prevent agents from using said idiotic signings in negotiations. All it means is that players salaries as a whole can't go over a certain pecentage of HRR, no matter how stupid teams are.

Whether you like Bettman and cap system or not, it is not designed to make managing a hockey team idiot proof - it simply prevents other managers from making it impossible for other teams to compete.

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06-14-2009, 01:10 PM
  #291
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Originally Posted by Timmy View Post
Under the cap system, if a player is overpaid now, it simply means the team has less flexibility to sign another player, who may sign with another team. As a collective, the players' salaries are tied to league revenues, but it doesn't prevent individual players from being signed above "market" value. It just means that either another player has to may have to sign for under market value, or that the players as a whole have to repay the league by the amount over the prescribed percentage of HRR they're collectively to recieve.

This doesn't help bailout individual GM's who've made idiotic signings, or prevent agents from using said idiotic signings in negotiations. All it means is that players salaries as a whole can't go over a certain pecentage of HRR, no matter how stupid teams are.

Whether you like Bettman and cap system or not, it is not designed to make managing a hockey team idiot proof - it simply prevents other managers from making it impossible for other teams to compete.
I can swear that it was claimed that the whole point of the exercise was to make the system "idiot proof". And given there are so many idiots running things that clearly is necessary.

Mind you the problem is


Mind you Gary also claimed that it would result in lower ticket prices (which thanks to the recession/depression) seems to be working in a number of markets albeit several years down the road.

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06-14-2009, 01:14 PM
  #292
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
I can swear that it was claimed that the whole point of the exercise was to make the system "idiot proof". And given there are so many idiots running things that clearly is necessary.

Mind you the problem is


Mind you Gary also claimed that it would result in lower ticket prices (which thanks to the recession/depression) seems to be working in a number of markets albeit several years down the road.
You rang?

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06-14-2009, 03:24 PM
  #293
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Originally Posted by Wetcoaster View Post
Mind you Gary also claimed that it would result in lower ticket prices (which thanks to the recession/depression) seems to be working in a number of markets albeit several years down the road.
Gary knew the CBA would cause a global recession. He is that good.

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06-14-2009, 03:30 PM
  #294
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Gary knew the CBA would cause a global recession. He is that good.
Hmmmm... Maybe we should add this one to the nickname thread running in the History of Hockey Forum:

Gary "Nostradamus" Bettman

or

Gary "Miss Cleo" Bettman


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06-14-2009, 03:38 PM
  #295
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you want to die?
Of laughter? **** yeah.

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06-14-2009, 04:47 PM
  #296
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So how about those Sedins. How many more days till they become UFA's? I must admit I am getting a tad nervous here.

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06-14-2009, 04:59 PM
  #297
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So how about those Sedins. How many more days till they become UFA's? I must admit I am getting a tad nervous here.
I'm not, in fact the longer this goes on (them remaining unsigned) the better the chances of them ending up on a different team.

Teams have lost players to unrestricted free agency before, and will in the future. It is not the end of the world, or the demise of this franchise.

We'll be just fine.

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06-14-2009, 05:04 PM
  #298
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Centre depth would be weak but it's possible depending on what moves Gillis would make. That said, I'd still rather have the Sedins next year for 5.5 or under, even if it's a 12 year deal.

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06-14-2009, 05:12 PM
  #299
Barney Gumble
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I'm not, in fact the longer this goes on (them remaining unsigned) the better the chances of them ending up on a different team.

Teams have lost players to unrestricted free agency before, and will in the future. It is not the end of the world, or the demise of this franchise.

We'll be just fine.
It might be to the team that might sign them for $13+ million.

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06-14-2009, 05:14 PM
  #300
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Originally Posted by Respect Your Edler View Post
Centre depth would be weak but it's possible depending on what moves Gillis would make. That said, I'd still rather have the Sedins next year for 5.5 or under, even if it's a 12 year deal.
Good gravy, now you people are talking about 12 year deals for these guys! How desperate are you?

I know it may be hard to believe, but the Sedins can be replaced. There's no need to lock into 12 years of mediocrity just because you can't see who might be available this summer (or next).

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