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Graf 705 and Graf 703

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Old
05-31-2009, 03:40 PM
  #1
luciousharris
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Graf 705 and Graf 703

I am having a problem with my skates. I had a pair of Graf 705's for over two years and they were too big. So I got a new pair of skates a half size smaller. But this time I got the 703's. They are definatly much more comfortable than the 705's, but my heel is still popping up. Does that mean I need a smaller size?

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06-01-2009, 12:38 AM
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BrianNYR
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Not necessarily the wrong size. Like me you may just have narrow heels. You can wearing socks if you don't, or a thicker one if you already do. Maybe a different pair of insoles?
I had 705's too and they fit perfectly, but had heel lift as well.

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06-01-2009, 01:28 AM
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The Grafs have different fits. You may have a model that has a heel that's too wide.

http://www.grafcanada.com/science/every_foot.pdf

However, that's not the case according to that. The boot you're in is built for a narrow heel.

My next thought would be a depth issue. If the boot is too shallow, which yours could be, the boot you have has less depth then your old one, you may be easing off on tightening the laces around the heel because it hurts to tie them tighter and getting inadequate heel lock as a result.

The best advice I can give is to find somebody experienced in skate fitting and have them look at you. You should be able to find someone on long island, there are a lot of people there.

But I'm going to guess that you need a similar size in a different boot.

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06-01-2009, 11:35 AM
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Having owned the 703's for years. It's really hard to believe you can move in that heel. The heel lock on the 703's is insanely good. Makes me wonder if you are kicking your foot back far enough into the boot.

You could try a heel shim (in the boot, under the innersole) to help bring your heel up a little for a better lock. I had to do this, it worked great.

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06-01-2009, 01:00 PM
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CptKirk
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Actually, here's a thought. His heel could be too big, and it's not fitting back into the heel enough, creating a gap and causing slippage.

The advice is still the same. Get yourself to an experienced skate fitter.

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06-01-2009, 04:07 PM
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luciousharris
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cptjeff View Post
Actually, here's a thought. His heel could be too big, and it's not fitting back into the heel enough, creating a gap and causing slippage.

The advice is still the same. Get yourself to an experienced skate fitter.
That is what I was thinking. I wore the skates in the begining with the insoles and I had no room at all. So i took them out. I broke them in after a couple of skates So I figured I would put the insoles back in, once I did that it is very hard for me to get my heel to settle in. When I do get to heel back in there (to a certain degree) I like the skates. I can skate better in them better than I did in the 705's. I just tried skating in them today and there was no way I could get my heel to settle in. It's like I have to go through a whole process. I have to unlase them, put my foot in, wiggle around. Then after a miniute take my foot out then put them back in. Then they feel better. But Sometimes I have to repeat the step. I think I am going to but the 703's in a size 11.
I spoke to a guy at a proshop and he said the 703's had a narrower heel than the 705's. I have no idea where he got that info.

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06-01-2009, 06:17 PM
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stick9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by major league View Post
That is what I was thinking. I wore the skates in the begining with the insoles and I had no room at all. So i took them out. I broke them in after a couple of skates So I figured I would put the insoles back in, once I did that it is very hard for me to get my heel to settle in. When I do get to heel back in there (to a certain degree) I like the skates. I can skate better in them better than I did in the 705's. I just tried skating in them today and there was no way I could get my heel to settle in. It's like I have to go through a whole process. I have to unlase them, put my foot in, wiggle around. Then after a miniute take my foot out then put them back in. Then they feel better. But Sometimes I have to repeat the step. I think I am going to but the 703's in a size 11.
I spoke to a guy at a proshop and he said the 703's had a narrower heel than the 705's. I have no idea where he got that info.
So, with the innersoles you can't get your foot to seat into the heel cup, but with them you have some movement. That leads means you need something between the two. Something that lifts your heel into the heel cup, but doesn't take up any room in the boot.

Seriously, try a small heel shim before buying a whole new pair of skates.

Also, I'm not a big believer in using innersoles unless they are needed. I see quite a few people buy them because the sales guy recommends them, but aren't actually necessary.

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06-01-2009, 07:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stick9 View Post
So, with the innersoles you can't get your foot to seat into the heel cup, but with them you have some movement. That leads means you need something between the two. Something that lifts your heel into the heel cup, but doesn't take up any room in the boot.

Seriously, try a small heel shim before buying a whole new pair of skates.

Also, I'm not a big believer in using innersoles unless they are needed. I see quite a few people buy them because the sales guy recommends them, but aren't actually necessary.
It's wierd. Without them (insole) my heel is all over the place. With them, for some reason I am having trouble getting the heel in the back of the boot on a consistant basis. On Saturday with the insole they felt good. But early this morning with the insole my heel wouldn't sit back in the heel cup for nothing. Very strange.

Then I put the skates on about an hour ago and I was able to get my foot back there. I spoke to someone at the proshop and they said I should have them baked. And if that did not work they could heel stretch the boot. I do not understand why I am getting the incosistency with these skates. One day they are fine the next day it is a headache.

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06-01-2009, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by major league View Post
It's wierd. Without them (insole) my heel is all over the place. With them, for some reason I am having trouble getting the heel in the back of the boot on a consistant basis. On Saturday with the insole they felt good. But early this morning with the insole my heel wouldn't sit back in the heel cup for nothing. Very strange.

Then I put the skates on about an hour ago and I was able to get my foot back there. I spoke to someone at the proshop and they said I should have them baked. And if that did not work they could heel stretch the boot. I do not understand why I am getting the incosistency with these skates. One day they are fine the next day it is a headache.
That boot can be tough to break in, but once you do they will feel like they were made for your foot. I'd take the proshop workers advice and have them baked. It will do wonders for the fit. I'd suggest having them baked without the innersoles first. If that still doesn't feel right then have them done again with the innersoles.

If they continue to be a problem. Maybe it's time to switch brands.

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06-01-2009, 11:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by major league View Post
It's wierd. Without them (insole) my heel is all over the place. With them, for some reason I am having trouble getting the heel in the back of the boot on a consistant basis. On Saturday with the insole they felt good. But early this morning with the insole my heel wouldn't sit back in the heel cup for nothing. Very strange.

Then I put the skates on about an hour ago and I was able to get my foot back there. I spoke to someone at the proshop and they said I should have them baked. And if that did not work they could heel stretch the boot. I do not understand why I am getting the incosistency with these skates. One day they are fine the next day it is a headache.
Oh yeah, you need to have them baked. I presumed you had. Pretty much all modern skates need to be baked for a proper fit, some more then others though.

And use the friggin insoles. They make it a lot more comfortable, and are an important part of the fit and support of the skate.

What will happen with that is the foams have a memory, and in order to set that memory, they have to be at a high temperature. When they cool back down, they will stay in that form, giving you a custom fit. When you do that, your heel will settle back in, and you'll get your heel in, and the padding will form to that area, giving you a heel that will fit your foot perfectly every time you put your foot in that boot.

They should have been baked the day you bought them if you got them at a store. Many skates these days will not break in unless you do.

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06-02-2009, 12:04 PM
  #11
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Quote:
And use the friggin insoles. They make it a lot more comfortable, and are an important part of the fit and support of the skate.
I get the impression he's refering to aftermarket innersoles, which aren't always needed and can turn a prefect fitting skate into one that doesn't fit.

I've been skating for over 30 years and I have never used anything more than a factory innersole. I think they are pushed at the shops because it's an additional purchase and people sometimes feel like they need to buy them.

Plus, you can't bake a boot smaller.

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06-02-2009, 01:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cptjeff View Post
Oh yeah, you need to have them baked. I presumed you had. Pretty much all modern skates need to be baked for a proper fit, some more then others though.

And use the friggin insoles. They make it a lot more comfortable, and are an important part of the fit and support of the skate.

What will happen with that is the foams have a memory, and in order to set that memory, they have to be at a high temperature. When they cool back down, they will stay in that form, giving you a custom fit. When you do that, your heel will settle back in, and you'll get your heel in, and the padding will form to that area, giving you a heel that will fit your foot perfectly every time you put your foot in that boot.

They should have been baked the day you bought them if you got them at a store. Many skates these days will not break in unless you do.

That is the one thing I forgot to mention. I didn't buy the skates in a store. I bought them off if Ebay from someone. $200.00. Not a bad deal. The other thing is the guy said that they were a regular width, but looking at the spread of the laces they look more like a wide. I am thinking maybe that is why the guy got rid of them for so cheap. Either way, I am going to get them baked and then heel stretched if needed by the end of the week. Thanks guys for you help. Lets go Wings!

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06-03-2009, 07:56 AM
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Nbr-17
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Actually you don't need to bake Graf 700 series skates.

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07-05-2009, 04:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by major league View Post
That is the one thing I forgot to mention. I didn't buy the skates in a store. I bought them off if Ebay from someone. $200.00. Not a bad deal. The other thing is the guy said that they were a regular width, but looking at the spread of the laces they look more like a wide. I am thinking maybe that is why the guy got rid of them for so cheap. Either way, I am going to get them baked and then heel stretched if needed by the end of the week. Thanks guys for you help. Lets go Wings!
footbed of the boot should tell you the width of the boot. The 703's that I have have the size of the boot stamped in black and the width stamped in red.

The heel lift might be caused by the person who you bought the skates from, since he broke the boots in to his feet.

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07-05-2009, 01:31 PM
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Unlace the skates and pull the tongue all the way out. Now kick you're foot to the toe. How much space is between your heel and the heel of the boot?

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