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Ott - SJ - Chicago

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Old
08-02-2009, 07:57 PM
  #1
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Ott - SJ - Chicago

To Chicago: 1st Round Pick, Logan Coutoure, Ilya Zubov

To San Jose: Dany Heatley

To Ottawa: Mihan Mihalek, Christian Erhoff, Patrick Sharp



Why San Jose does it: They shape up their roster by adding Dany Heatley, like they wanted to do. It costs them only 2 roster players, important since Marleau is UFA in a year.

Why Chicago does it: Cap flexibility, and the fact that Patrick Sharp is likely the odd man out next season. The pick and blue chips help re-stock the cupboard to allow them to be competitive now and going forward.

Why Ottawa does it: They trade Heatley, get the two top six they wanted and get a reasonable return. I'm not convinced Patrick Sharp is truly a top line player, but he is a solid 2nd liner, and Mihalek might be as well. Both are young enough to fit in the Sens plans.

Ottawa dumps Jason Smith in the minors. Thoughts?

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08-02-2009, 08:11 PM
  #2
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San Jose gets hosed. WAAAAAAAAY too much for Heatley...even if that 1st isn't the Sharks.

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08-02-2009, 08:15 PM
  #3
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Another 3-way deal where Sharks get hosed and Ottawa fleeces everybody. Nice.

If anything the 1st rounder should go to SJ from Ottawa for the Sharks to even consider this.

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Old
08-02-2009, 08:25 PM
  #4
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To Chicago:Christian Erhoff,

To San Jose: Dany Heatley,

To Ottawa: Milan Michalek, , Patrick Sharp ,1st '10 CHI



Do I have anyone to agree with me?

The first going to Ottawa would be from Chicago if you all agree that Erhoff is better than Sharp, and from SJ, if you all think that Sharp is better. I think it's Erhoff

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08-02-2009, 08:36 PM
  #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSenators11 View Post
To Chicago:Christian Erhoff,

To San Jose: Dany Heatley,

To Ottawa: Milan Michalek, , Patrick Sharp ,1st '10 CHI



Do I have anyone to agree with me?

The first going to Ottawa would be from Chicago if you all agree that Erhoff is better than Sharp, and from SJ, if you all think that Sharp is better. I think it's Erhoff
Now Chicagos giving up Sharp and a first for Erhoff, how is that going to work?

Howabout

To SJ:
Heatley (7.5)

To OTT:
Sharp (3.9)
Erhoff (3.1)

To CHI:
Cheechoo (3)
Sharks 1rst round pick

Then Sharks make a follow up trade to send Marleau for prospects and picks.

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Old
08-02-2009, 08:41 PM
  #6
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Originally Posted by sweHockeypunk21 View Post
Now Chicagos giving up Sharp and a first for Erhoff, how is that going to work?

Howabout

To SJ:
Heatley (7.5)

To OTT:
Sharp (3.9)
Erhoff (3.1)

To CHI:
Cheechoo (3)
Sharks 1rst round pick

Then Sharks make a follow up trade to send Marleau for prospects and picks.
I think the Hawks would have to clear up more cap than that to take on Chechoo, but If they accept it good deal

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08-02-2009, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSenators11 View Post
To Chicago:Christian Erhoff,

To San Jose: Dany Heatley,

To Ottawa: Milan Michalek, , Patrick Sharp ,1st '10 CHI



Do I have anyone to agree with me?

The first going to Ottawa would be from Chicago if you all agree that Erhoff is better than Sharp, and from SJ, if you all think that Sharp is better. I think it's Erhoff
Chicago doesn't want Erhoff for Sharp and would laugh at Erhoff for Sharp AND a 1st..
Everyone has the Hawks moving Sharp. I still don't see it. Want chicago in your deal? Make it something like. (without changing much)


To Chicago: 2nd (Ott) Logan Coutoure, Ilya Zubov

To San Jose: Dany Heatley

To Ottawa: Mihan Mihalek, Christian Erhoff, Kris Versteeg, 1st (SJ)

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08-02-2009, 08:46 PM
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Originally Posted by GoSenators11 View Post
I think the Hawks would have to clear up more cap than that to take on Chechoo, but If they accept it good deal

Good for the Sens and Sharks. Doesn't do a thing but weaken the Hawks. Losing 900k off the cap doesn't justify the drop in over play from Sharp to Cheechoo. The 1st doesn't get it done.

Change Sharp's name to Versteeg and change Cheechoo to a 2nd.

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08-02-2009, 09:07 PM
  #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brevard View Post
Chicago doesn't want Erhoff for Sharp and would laugh at Erhoff for Sharp AND a 1st..
Everyone has the Hawks moving Sharp. I still don't see it. Want chicago in your deal? Make it something like. (without changing much)


To Chicago: 2nd (Ott) Logan Coutoure, Ilya Zubov

To San Jose: Dany Heatley

To Ottawa: Mihan Mihalek, Christian Erhoff, Kris Versteeg, 1st (SJ)
I'd rather keep our 2nd than have San Jose's first, so we could sign an RFA if we wanted. Depending on how the year goes, our 2nd may well be near the Sharks 1st.

That said, the deal seems pretty good I guess. Versteeg isn't bad. Born 4 days before me.

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08-02-2009, 09:10 PM
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brevard View Post
Chicago doesn't want Erhoff for Sharp and would laugh at Erhoff for Sharp AND a 1st..
Everyone has the Hawks moving Sharp. I still don't see it. Want chicago in your deal? Make it something like. (without changing much)


To Chicago: 2nd (Ott) Logan Coutoure, Ilya Zubov

To San Jose: Dany Heatley

To Ottawa: Mihan Mihalek, Christian Erhoff, Kris Versteeg, 1st (SJ)
So San Jose gives up their top prospect, their 1st round pick, their #2 dman (Ehrhoff), and their 2nd-line LW who is good for at least 25 goals and still improving. All of that for Dany Heatley?? How much harder can you try to bend the Sharks over??

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08-02-2009, 09:12 PM
  #11
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Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
So San Jose gives up their top prospect, their 1st round pick, their #2 dman (Ehrhoff), and their 2nd-line LW who is good for at least 25 goals and still improving. All of that for Dany Heatley?? How much harder can you try to bend the Sharks over??
Dude, the Sharks currently are offering Erhoff + 1st + Cheechoo already, and it's accepted that it's not currently enough. Mihalek is better than Cheechoo, but I don't think Mihalek + Coutoure amounts to being ridiculously more than the current offer.

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08-02-2009, 09:15 PM
  #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
So San Jose gives up their top prospect, their 1st round pick, their #2 dman (Ehrhoff), and their 2nd-line LW who is good for at least 25 goals and still improving. All of that for Dany Heatley?? How much harder can you try to bend the Sharks over??
Actually as a Hawk fan ... I have to agree with you and it is the Hawks getting overpaid.

From the post above I see Ottawa may not want to give up a 2nd for a 1st (crazy but ...) So SJ keeps their 1st Ott keeps their 2nd and the Hawks don't get a pick but instead send a 2nd to Ottawa.

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08-02-2009, 09:22 PM
  #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pyke View Post
Dude, the Sharks currently are offering Erhoff + 1st + Cheechoo already, and it's accepted that it's not currently enough. Mihalek is better than Cheechoo, but I don't think Mihalek + Coutoure amounts to being ridiculously more than the current offer.
It's "accepted" in the rumor reports. San Jose hasn't had a 1st round pick in something like 3 years now, and they are going to give up another one for cry-baby Heately? Doug Wilson has already ruined this teams prospect pool and depth. If he trades Ehrhoff, Michalek, and Couture for a cancer like Heatley, I would do my best to follow him around all season kicking him in the nads every time he turns around.

Cheechoo is included because he's a salary dump the Sharks can afford to lose. I don't see the logic of trading Ehrhoff at all, who was the Sharks best player in this last playoffs. Adding a first is just plain bad. Replacing Cheechoo with Michalek is incredibly stupid. Adding Couture goes beyond comprehension.

Dany Heatley is not that valuable. Let Ottawa keep him. If he wants to come to the Sharks he can come for Lukowich and Cheechoo, and the Sharks can make cap space elsewhere. Hopefully he doesn't come at all. Screw him and screw Ottawa too. If they really want to get rid of him put him on waivers.

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08-02-2009, 09:39 PM
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two of these three teams are over cap to start with
Chicago is 2.5 mill under
Ottawa is 2 mill over
and san jose has no cap left
San Jose 600thousand to cap

this doesn't work


Last edited by OrangeBlue10: 08-05-2009 at 11:18 AM.
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08-02-2009, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by SheldonSouray44 View Post
two of these three teams are over cap to start with
Chicago is 4.5 mill over
Ottawa is 2 mill over
and san jose has no cap left
San Jose 600thousand to cap

this doesn't work
You're making numbers up

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Old
08-02-2009, 09:53 PM
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What I don't understand about this whole thread is this, For Ottawa and San Jose to work out a deal with a third team, said team needs cap space, look at the team the OP picked...Chicago?! Dosent add up. 3 way trades where all the teams need to shed salary don't happen.

I think the basis of the deal should be Heatley for Mihalek and Erhoff. Let the third team fill out the details or find a way for Ottawa to take on Cheech.


Last edited by The Nemesis: 08-02-2009 at 11:20 PM. Reason: please don't jab other fanbases, it just starts fights.
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Old
08-02-2009, 09:54 PM
  #17
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I actually like Ottawa. I just don't like Heatley as a solution to the Sharks problems, because it doesn't fix their problems, it makes them worse. The Sharks biggest problems in the playoffs have been a lack of depth and maturity. People forget just how young the Sharks teams have been for the last several years. JT and Marleau have played good, but not great. And both players are just now getting to the 30 age range. But all opposing teams have had to do is shut down those 2 players to shut down the Sharks.

But this year the Sharks finally started to see some of the young players starting to step up. Murray and Ehrhoff were the best defensive pairing. Ehrhoff was the best defenseman overall. He played great on both sides of the puck and really stepped up his game offensively, defensively, and physically. Michalek played much grittier, much better defensively, and got a lot of shots on goal. The problem was that because of Clowe's injury he had to change his style of play and move in front of the net. This meant he couldn't use his shot from where he is best.

The Sharks saw Setoguchi start to emerge this year into the player we hoped he could be. Clowe played pretty well until he injured (although I think he was overpayed with the new contract). Pavelski had a solid season (although his playoffs could be better). And McGinn seems to have solidified his spot at the NHL level. With Mitchell returning, this team should be better.

If the Sharks could move Cheechoo and Lukowich for cap space, and pick up a decent 3rd-line RW (maybe Kobasew if Boston is looking to clear cap space for Kessel?), and if they can managed to go into the playoffs in better health, they should be fine as they are. I would tweak the current line-up to be more like this:

Clowe-JT-Seto
Marleau-Pavs-Michalek
McGinn-Mitchell-Kobasew
Ortmeyer-Nichol-Staubitz
Shelley

Boyle-Ehrhoff
Vlasic-Blake
Murray-Huksins
Joslin

Nabby
Griess


Now if the Sharks have to give up Ehrhoff, Michalek, and a 1st for Heatley, they then still need to get rid of Cheechoo and Lukowich for cap space. But now they take a major hit on defense and they lose one of their best 2-way forwards. And next year when the cap drops, they are sure to lose Marleau at a minimum and probably at least one more good player. And of course, now their prospect pool is even worse (with no 1st), their cap situations is worse, and the team is worse.

So again. Acquiring Heatley make no sense for the Sharks. That doesn't mean Doug Wilson won't continue to wreck the team by trading for him. But if he does it's going to be a disaster.


Last edited by The Nemesis: 08-02-2009 at 11:17 PM. Reason: qdp
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Old
08-02-2009, 10:20 PM
  #18
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REDO:

To CHI: Nick Petrecki, Chris Kelly

To OTT: Milan Michalek, Versteeg/Sharp, Jonathan Chechoo

To SJ: Dany Heatley

I thought that Chicago fans valued Versteeg more than Sharp... Am I wrong?

To the Hawks, It think Pertrecki, Kelly and Cleared cap is worth Versteeg/Sharp

Sharks Get : Dany Heatley (7.5)

Give: Chechoo, Michalek, Petrecki (8.5)

Sharks should do this deal. They are dumping Cheechoo, and giving Michalek and Petrecki for Heater... Done deal in my opinion

Sens Get: Sharp/Versteeg, Michalek, Chechoo (10.3/11.2)

Sens Give: Chris Kelly, Dany Heatley ( 9.6)

Done deal easy, Get rid of Kelly, who is a good player, but have been looking for a way to get Regin some minutes, and can put him on the 2nd line.

Chicago Gets : Petrecki,Kelly ( 3.3)

Chicago Gives Versteeg/Sharp (3.1/3.9)

They only question I think is whether Chicago gives up Versteeg or Sharp

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08-02-2009, 10:22 PM
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^^ Possible but unlikely. Petrecki is the second coming for Sharks fans.

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08-02-2009, 10:23 PM
  #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
Because if you looked at Sharks organization you would see that beyond what is on the NHL roster right now, they have virtually no assets.

They have 2 good prospects in Couture and Petrecki. The rest of their good prospects are probably at least 4-5 years out. ALL of their organizational depth is basically at the NHL level right now, which means that any trade that moves assets for Heatley (beyond their only 2 expendable parts Cheechoo and Lukowich) is moving assets the Sharks simply can't afford to replace with anywhere near the same skill level.

Their depth is so bad that they had to go out and get Scott freakin Nichol to center the 4th line because they don't have even the marginal talent at the AHL level take that role. They have 2 defenseman at the AHL level (Joslin and Moore) who could probably step into the 6-7 role, but neither is anywhere near able to replace a player like Ehrhoff. That's why Sharks fans are so tight with the assets.

This is not a team that has players fighting for roster spots. This is team that is struggling just to find players to fill out a roster. Those are 2 entirely different situations. In the first you can afford to trade assets for a guy like Heatley. In the second, you can't afford to trade anybody without more good, cheap, highly skilled bodies coming in than you are shipping out.
Fair enough, I'll admit I dont know much about the Sharks organization, I just thought they might be looking to make a splash. But think about it out of the 3 players I mentioned, Heatley upgrades MM, and as far as Ive seen you guys have been trying to get rid of Cheech. If you cant replace Erhoff, which is understandable, then yeah, It wont work.

I understand what your saying, but if you stand pat with your team now, and dont make it deep into the playoffs, at what point do you make a move?

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08-02-2009, 10:28 PM
  #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSenators11 View Post
REDO:

To CHI: Nick Petrecki, Chris Kelly

To OTT: Milan Michalek, Versteeg/Sharp, Jonathan Chechoo

To SJ: Dany Heatley

I thought that Chicago fans valued Versteeg more than Sharp... Am I wrong?

To the Hawks, It think Pertrecki, Kelly and Cleared cap is worth Versteeg/Sharp

Sharks Get : Dany Heatley (7.5)

Give: Chechoo, Michalek, Petrecki (8.5)

Sharks should do this deal. They are dumping Cheechoo, and giving Michalek and Petrecki for Heater... Done deal in my opinion

Sens Get: Sharp/Versteeg, Michalek, Chechoo (10.3/11.2)

Sens Give: Chris Kelly, Dany Heatley ( 9.6)

Done deal easy, Get rid of Kelly, who is a good player, but have been looking for a way to get Regin some minutes, and can put him on the 2nd line.

Chicago Gets : Petrecki,Kelly ( 3.3)

Chicago Gives Versteeg/Sharp (3.1/3.9)

They only question I think is whether Chicago gives up Versteeg or Sharp
I cant speak for the other teams, but this doesn't work for the Senators. I like the value, but they already have too many forwards. Also, they are over the cap as it is, cant take on money.

Switch one to a defenseman, and dump Smith/Shubert or Donovan or somebody else and it works for the Sens alone. Tall Task.

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Old
08-02-2009, 10:33 PM
  #22
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Originally Posted by AllNightmareLong View Post
I cant speak for the other teams, but this doesn't work for the Senators. I like the value, but they already have too many forwards. Also, they are over the cap as it is, cant take on money.

Switch one to a defenseman, and dump Smith/Shubert or Donovan or somebody else and it works for the Sens alone. Tall Task.
Hmm

To CHI: Petrecki, Chris Kelly, Cristoph Schubert

To SJ: Ott 2nd'10, Dany Heatley

To OTT: Michalek,Erhoff, Sharp/Versteeg

Last one...

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08-02-2009, 10:36 PM
  #23
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Originally Posted by GoSenators11 View Post
Hmm

To CHI: Petrecki, Chris Kelly, Cristoph Schubert

To SJ: Ott 2nd'10, Dany Heatley

To OTT: Michalek,Erhoff, Sharp/Versteeg

Last one...
Sharks will not be giving up Nick Petrecki in any deal.

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08-02-2009, 10:45 PM
  #24
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Sharks will not be giving up Nick Petrecki in any deal.
Who do you think he is??

You wouldn't give up a PROSPECT for Heatley... He would be the one person they wouldn't give up?

I thought I would be flamed for including Erhoff.

Quick Comparison...

Patrick Wiercioch

36 Games 12 goals, 23 Assists (Last year in College hockey)

42 Games 5 goals, 7 assists ( 07-08 College Hockey)

I'm not really sure if he's more of A stay at home defenseman, but still I would throw him in If I were a Shark

Nick Petrecki is not the second coming of Jesus my friend

BTW Wiercioch is our 4th-5th best prospect

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08-02-2009, 11:41 PM
  #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoSenators11 View Post
Who do you think he is??

You wouldn't give up a PROSPECT for Heatley... He would be the one person they wouldn't give up?

I thought I would be flamed for including Erhoff.

Quick Comparison...

Patrick Wiercioch

36 Games 12 goals, 23 Assists (Last year in College hockey)

42 Games 5 goals, 7 assists ( 07-08 College Hockey)

I'm not really sure if he's more of A stay at home defenseman, but still I would throw him in If I were a Shark

Nick Petrecki is not the second coming of Jesus my friend

BTW Wiercioch is our 4th-5th best prospect
Petrecki is not valued for his offense. He has virtually none at this point (although he has showed some glimmers). But what he does provide is overwhelming physical play and he can skate extremely well (especially for a guy his size). This is a player who as a freshman was so dominating at the college level that he was still taking penalties simply because he was that much stronger than all the other players.

Out of every hockey prospect out there, Petrecki is the closest thing I have seen to a player who might have a reasonable chance to be the new Scott Stevens in the NHL. Just an absolutely dominating physical player who would make other players choke off the puck just because they don't want to be hammered by him. Petrecki is the single most untouchable prospect in the Sharks org as far as I'm concerned. Even more so than Couture.

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