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[UPD] Marleau-Heatley speculation, etc.; 3-way trade debunked 9/10

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Old
08-05-2009, 12:18 AM
  #26
Winky
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Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slu...yhoo&type=lgns

McKeon asks "will Heatley make the team better?"
I think, if its unclear whether or not a player will make the team better, it might be best to not risk it.

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08-05-2009, 01:02 AM
  #27
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08-05-2009, 04:00 AM
  #28
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Originally Posted by Murderin Murphy View Post
You know, the part about Wilson sympathizing with Tambellini because of all these leaks... Does murray not run a tight ship over there? ALL of these rumors are no doubt leaking from ottawa, if i were a GM i would absolutely hate dealing with a guy that lets the press know every time an offer is made.

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08-05-2009, 05:17 AM
  #29
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"I also have it on good authority that Sharks GM Doug Wilson isn’t at all happy with the efforts in some parts of the media to portray him as a hockey exec who promised there would be major changes and has yet to deliver on that promise"

Well, when you say, "Do we have to change the mix? Absolutely.”...you kinda set yourself up there, Doug.

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08-05-2009, 05:56 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Wild GM View Post
"I also have it on good authority that Sharks GM Doug Wilson isn’t at all happy with the efforts in some parts of the media to portray him as a hockey exec who promised there would be major changes and has yet to deliver on that promise"

Well, when you say, "Do we have to change the mix? Absolutely.”...you kinda set yourself up there, Doug.
Deja vu ...

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08-05-2009, 08:32 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by endy View Post
You know, the part about Wilson sympathizing with Tambellini because of all these leaks... Does murray not run a tight ship over there? ALL of these rumors are no doubt leaking from ottawa, if i were a GM i would absolutely hate dealing with a guy that lets the press know every time an offer is made.
It doesn't have to be Murray. I don't think Tambellini would have stuck with it as long as he did if he knew Murray leaked the offer.

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08-05-2009, 09:00 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slu...yhoo&type=lgns

McKeon asks "will Heatley make the team better?"
The guy doesn't know anything about the Sharks:

Quote:
The Sharks definitely have a need at left wing. If the season were to start today, that spot would go to Milan Michalek(notes), Ryane Clowe(notes) or Jonathan Cheechoo
Uhm... Marleau?

Quote:
Right now, the power play is basically built around the hard shot of Rob Blake
What?

Rest of it is just rehash.

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Old
08-05-2009, 09:55 AM
  #33
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But this isn’t one of those things that gets taken care of with a conference call. No, JR will be back at HP Pavilion for the 11 a.m. event and the live TV cameras will be rolling.

...

*****I do have it on good authority that there won’t be any big-time distractions between now and 11 a.m. Thursday, so don’t hold your breath on those Dany-Heatley-to-San-Jose rumors leading anywhere just yet.
Quotes from Pollak. I wonder if a deal might be done to land Heatley, but out of respect for JR, Wilson (and Murray) have agreed to hold off on finalizing the trade until JR's retirement is out of the way. You know, as to not take the wind out of his sails for his final hurrah.

Just the way Pollak wrote that, I wonder...

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08-05-2009, 10:09 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by RammsteinGT View Post
Quotes from Pollak. I wonder if a deal might be done to land Heatley, but out of respect for JR, Wilson (and Murray) have agreed to hold off on finalizing the trade until JR's retirement is out of the way. You know, as to not take the wind out of his sails for his final hurrah.

Just the way Pollak wrote that, I wonder...
Theres no way that stays a secret regardless, he was probably just told not to dig around to much during the press conference for things other than JR

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08-05-2009, 10:22 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LadyStanley View Post
http://sports.yahoo.com/nhl/news?slu...yhoo&type=lgns

McKeon asks "will Heatley make the team better?"
It's funny, he says the Sharks need a top line LW, but completely ignores that Marleau has played there for most of the last 2 seasons. And that Marleau put up only one goal less than Heatley last year.

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08-05-2009, 10:42 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Vaasa View Post
It's funny, he says the Sharks need a top line LW, but completely ignores that Marleau has played there for most of the last 2 seasons. And that Marleau put up only one goal less than Heatley last year.
Why do you compare the two players based on one season as if it holds any weight?

One season does not reflect on a player's overall ability, we should know that by now given Marleau's horrible season 2 years ago and Cheechoo's amazing one in 06. At least throw out a different reason why Marleau would be a potentially better LW. Just sayin'.

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Old
08-05-2009, 10:49 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
Why do you compare the two players based on one season as if it holds any weight?

One season does not reflect on a player's overall ability, we should know that by now given Marleau's horrible season 2 years ago and Cheechoo's amazing one in 06. At least throw out a different reason why Marleau would be a potentially better LW. Just sayin'.
You could argue hes a more rounded player, better in his own end, better on the pk and therefor a better option when playing with JT and Gooch/Clowe who arent much for playing D.

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:00 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by one2gamble View Post
You could argue hes a more rounded player, better in his own end, better on the pk and therefor a better option when playing with JT and Gooch/Clowe who arent much for playing D.
Those are valid points. But is there a need to be sound defensively if you are scoring more than you are scored on? Just playing devil's advocate. For what it's worth, Heatley's plus-minus on the Sens is pretty good, but that stat is always interpreted differently.

Also, McKeon is obviously not the biggest sharks expert but he raises an interesting point about the franchise's lack of LWs over the years. Marleau had a good year playing LW but I wouldn't say that's his most comfortable position given that he's played C most of his career.

Also - just throwing ideas around - is being a defensive stalwart as a winger an essential part of the position? I thought traditionally that's the center's responsibility. Impact wingers like Ovechkin, Selanne and Kovalchuk aren't known for their defensive aura and I assumed Heatley followed a similar style.

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:06 AM
  #39
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
Those are valid points. But is there a need to be sound defensively if you are scoring more than you are scored on? Just playing devil's advocate. For what it's worth, Heatley's plus-minus on the Sens is pretty good, but that stat is always interpreted differently.
Well, the idea is to outscore the other team.

Quote:
Also - just throwing ideas around - is being a defensive stalwart as a winger an essential part of the position? I thought traditionally that's the center's responsibility. Impact wingers like Ovechkin, Selanne and Kovalchuk aren't known for their defensive aura and I assumed Heatley followed a similar style.
In general and patty should probably attack the net more and shoot more and he probably will next year. The players you listed are very agressive at shooting and attacking the net, patty isnt like that it somewhat hinders his ability to score. I would say Milan somewhat suffers from this in his own right also. Gooch on the other hand will try to beat you every time.

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:08 AM
  #40
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Originally Posted by sharkohol View Post
Those are valid points. But is there a need to be sound defensively if you are scoring more than you are scored on? Just playing devil's advocate. For what it's worth, Heatley's plus-minus on the Sens is pretty good, but that stat is always interpreted differently.

Also, McKeon is obviously not the biggest sharks expert but he raises an interesting point about the franchise's lack of LWs over the years. Marleau had a good year playing LW but I wouldn't say that's his most comfortable position given that he's played C most of his career.

Also - just throwing ideas around - is being a defensive stalwart as a winger an essential part of the position? I thought traditionally that's the center's responsibility. Impact wingers like Ovechkin, Selanne and Kovalchuk aren't known for their defensive aura and I assumed Heatley followed a similar style.
If you score a career-high in goals, I'd say you are pretty comfortable.

There have been plenty wingers with excellent defensive skill, just take Heatley's linemate Alfredsson. He is the defense on the Heatley-Spezza-Alfredsson line.

Simply put, what counts are the individual skills, not some artificial stuff like "centers are supposed to be the defensive minded ones".

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:14 AM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Sanderson View Post
If you score a career-high in goals, I'd say you are pretty comfortable.

There have been plenty wingers with excellent defensive skill, just take Heatley's linemate Alfredsson. He is the defense on the Heatley-Spezza-Alfredsson line.

Simply put, what counts are the individual skills, not some artificial stuff like "centers are supposed to be the defensive minded ones".
Individual skill counts. I'm just going by my own experience playing the game and what's expected of someone playing C compared to someone playing LW or RW.

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:23 AM
  #42
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If the Sharks had to deal one of Valsic or Erhoff, which one would you prefer they keep and why?



Oh, and as far as Heatley and goals scored, I do beleive that he is only behind Ovechkin and Kovalchuk in terms of the most amount of goals scored since the lockout...

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:36 AM
  #43
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If the Sharks had to deal one of Valsic or Erhoff, which one would you prefer they keep and why?
Between Vlasic and Ehrhoff, I believe the fanbase would trade Ehrhoff in a landslide. The general consensus is that Vlasic has a much higher ceiling even though Ehrhoff outscored Vlasic 42 to 36 last year. Regardless of the opinions, Ehrhoff is still an excellent D-man, albeit a little pricey for what was usually a third pairing in our system.

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:44 AM
  #44
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I guarantee you had you actually seen Zherdev play in the playoffs you would not even be spending a minute of your time on him forget counting on him playoff time. For Glen Sather who throws money around like nothing whether is paying marginal players like Rozivalt 5+ mill a year or throwing the most injury prone forward in the NHL 5 year 7.5 mill per (Gaborik who’s averaged about 30 games missed per since the lockout)…you’d have to be terribly not worth it for NYR to walk away from 3.9 million award. And he is. Laziest player ever and a no show come playoff time. This guy doesn’t even bother trying and avoids all contact.

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08-05-2009, 11:45 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by RammsteinGT View Post
Between Vlasic and Ehrhoff, I believe the fanbase would trade Ehrhoff in a landslide. The general consensus is that Vlasic has a much higher ceiling even though Ehrhoff outscored Vlasic 42 to 36 last year. Regardless of the opinions, Ehrhoff is still an excellent D-man, albeit a little pricey for what was usually a third pairing in our system.
I would be one of those people to dump Ehrhoff in a heartbeat. Sure he outscored Vlasic last year, but only by 6 points. Vlasic is FAR better on defense (and will only get better) than Ehrhoff will ever dream to be.

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:47 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by DrFeelgood View Post
I would be one of those people to dump Ehrhoff in a heartbeat. Sure he outscored Vlasic last year, but only by 6 points. Vlasic is FAR better on defense (and will only get better) than Ehrhoff will ever dream to be.
Thanks. I was under that impression as well, but I prefer the opinion of a fan who sees them 82 games a rather then someone like myself who may see 10 games...

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:48 AM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFeelgood View Post
I would be one of those people to dump Ehrhoff in a heartbeat. Sure he outscored Vlasic last year, but only by 6 points. Vlasic is FAR better on defense (and will only get better) than Ehrhoff will ever dream to be.
Unless it's the playoffs, then Vlasic is about as useful as Semenov, and Ehrhoff is the best defensman (except Boyle, although Todd, and before him RW, play Ehrhoff the most minutes by quite a margin).

Aren't there like 4 threads from earlier this summer already? Ehrhoff is more important to this team if they want to win sooner rather than later. And I'll let Easy get into how much better the powerplay was with Christian on it than Vlasic...

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:50 AM
  #48
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Originally Posted by endy View Post
You know, the part about Wilson sympathizing with Tambellini because of all these leaks... Does murray not run a tight ship over there? ALL of these rumors are no doubt leaking from ottawa, if i were a GM i would absolutely hate dealing with a guy that lets the press know every time an offer is made.
You know that there are player agents too involved here don't you?

I don't know why any GM would leak stuff out, they should get black listed and Bryan Murray's been a long time GM in the NHL on a number of teams.

In an organizational level I think it is hard to keep on the hush on any potential deal especially for a player of Heatley's stature in a hockey market. There are about dozen scouting staff members involved and team officials and for a major or local paper to get to one of them for the right price to leak out some info for print is almost impossible to stop. You have to admit it creates some intrigue if not excitement when potential names in discussions come out. Even though deals that get done and those that don't come out and are quick and sudden.


Last edited by 4thliner*: 08-05-2009 at 11:56 AM.
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Old
08-05-2009, 11:55 AM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrFeelgood View Post
Vlasic is FAR better on defense (and will only get better) than Ehrhoff will ever dream to be.
Not to mention that Pickles was +15 and Error was -12 (and saw much more time on the PP)...

However, you can't deny that CE was far better than MEV in the playoffs. That said, no one was really great in the post-season.

Edit: Fun fact, Ehrhoff had 2 more points last season than Ottawa's highest scoring D-man, Kuba. Obviously, this isn't totally indicative of their skills due to the Senators' disappointing season, but interesting nonetheless.

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Old
08-05-2009, 11:57 AM
  #50
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Originally Posted by RammsteinGT View Post
Not to mention that Pickles was +15 and Error was -12 (and saw much more time on the PP)...

However, you can't deny that CE was far better than MEV in the playoffs. That said, no one was really great in the post-season.
PP points don't count for +/-

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