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Red Sox Thread: The Stretch Drive

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Old
08-22-2009, 07:40 AM
  #1
GKJ
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Red Sox Thread: The Stretch Drive

Old thread was over the limit.


Anyways, I'd take Wagner for the rest of the year. Take the chance on him, if it works great, if not, sure it won't cost the Sox much.

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08-22-2009, 08:05 AM
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I definitely would. He could only cost the Sox 2.5 mil the rest of the way, and I doubt the Mets would be asking for much, if anything in return.

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08-22-2009, 08:08 AM
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Anybody want to wager on how long ago Theo Epstein would have been fired if he worked for a company that had any kind of budget?

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08-22-2009, 08:57 AM
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5 playoff appearances, 4 ALCS appearances and 2 World Series Championships in Theo's 6.5 seasons. Let's fire this guy.

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08-22-2009, 09:00 AM
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5 playoff appearances, 4 ALCS appearances and 2 World Series Championships in Theo's 6.5 seasons. Let's fire this guy.
Never said they should fire Theo because they don't really have a budget and make money over fist, and he works well within those lack of constraints.

But there is over $100 million in empty money in those years....and most of us have to explain to someone if we charge McDonald's to the company card.

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08-22-2009, 09:17 AM
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Can you guys please stop bending over for the Yankees? It's unbearable to even live in this area anymore....

PS Mets won't give Wagner away....The Giants claimed Sheffield last week and wouldn't pony up much at all so they pulled him back....Billy would help the Sox IMO, especially against the Yankee lefties IMO...

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08-22-2009, 09:18 AM
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Great game last night. I guess the only good thing that came out of it was that a couple got married.

http://mlb.mlb.com/media/video.jsp?content_id=6222067

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08-22-2009, 10:19 AM
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Can you guys please stop bending over for the Yankees? It's unbearable to even live in this area anymore....

PS Mets won't give Wagner away....The Giants claimed Sheffield last week and wouldn't pony up much at all so they pulled him back....Billy would help the Sox IMO, especially against the Yankee lefties IMO...
Lou, no offense to your Mets or anything, but how much longer does that dolt Minaya have? I mean why wouldnt he take anything for Wagner at this point? They shuold be happy just to save money.

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08-22-2009, 10:22 AM
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Originally Posted by WhamBamCam8 View Post
Can you guys please stop bending over for the Yankees? It's unbearable to even live in this area anymore....

PS Mets won't give Wagner away....The Giants claimed Sheffield last week and wouldn't pony up much at all so they pulled him back....Billy would help the Sox IMO, especially against the Yankee lefties IMO...
it didn't help that sheffield has said that if he's dealt to a team he doesn't like, he's not going to show up.

Quote:
"I do not think I will be here," Sheffield said. "But if I am sent to a team that I don't want to play for, I would go home."
not going to get much for the mets.

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08-22-2009, 10:36 AM
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Lou, no offense to your Mets or anything, but how much longer does that dolt Minaya have? I mean why wouldnt he take anything for Wagner at this point? They shuold be happy just to save money.
Minaya is a dolt, but Wagner is supposedly on his way to being a Type A free agent. If that is so AND the Mets have the budget to risk offering him arbitration (which he may very well take, in addition to his $1M buyout), they'd be asking for the equivalent of a 1st round pick and a supplemental pick. Whatever that means.

My sense is Minaya would ask for quite a bit. Maybe ownership pulls Minaya's strings on this one.

As for Wagner himself, I don't really care much one way or the other. The pen has been a bit erratic lately and we're heading into September 40-man roster territory so it may be worth a shot if the cost is another Negron/Argenis Diaz type of prospect.

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08-22-2009, 10:39 AM
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I would think that if the Mets (or Red Sox) offered Wagner arb, he'd just accept. I don't think the Type A status will be too big of a concern. He's 38 and fresh off TJ surgery. There aren't going to be a lot of multi-year contracts from teams, particularly if he's offered arb and the compensation picks come into play.

As always, this is Omar Minaya we are talking about. Nobody knows what he's capable of doing, or any of the logic behind his moves. See Church, Ryan and Francoeur, Jeff.

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08-22-2009, 10:44 AM
  #12
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Originally Posted by nycbruins View Post
Anybody want to wager on how long ago Theo Epstein would have been fired if he worked for a company that had any kind of budget?
And how would Theo have operated if he had a 100M budget? Can you say? Or do you, for some ill-conceived reason, think he's some kind of idiot that doesn't realize what sort of budget he has and how to prioritize his decisions?

$ 121,745,999 (4th)
$ 133,390,035 (4th)
$ 143,026,214 (2nd)
$ 120,099,824 (2nd)
$ 123,505,125 (2nd)
$ 127,298,500 (2nd)

The Sox definitely have a budget. It's a high one, but if you look at the total payroll numbers since 2004, you see a general limit. In the past couple of seasons, the Sox have actually been cutting the MLB payroll instead of spending for the fun of it to finish as the runner up to the NYY payroll spigot.

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08-22-2009, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by cshea View Post
5 playoff appearances, 4 ALCS appearances and 2 World Series Championships in Theo's 6.5 seasons. Let's fire this guy.

Not to mention the development of players like;

Pedoria
Paplepon
Buchholz
Ellsbury
Baird

and trading away Manny to get Jason Bay.

Theo stinks! Fire Him!

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Old
08-22-2009, 12:04 PM
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I would think that if the Mets (or Red Sox) offered Wagner arb, he'd just accept. I don't think the Type A status will be too big of a concern. He's 38 and fresh off TJ surgery. There aren't going to be a lot of multi-year contracts from teams, particularly if he's offered arb and the compensation picks come into play.

As always, this is Omar Minaya we are talking about. Nobody knows what he's capable of doing, or any of the logic behind his moves. See Church, Ryan and Francoeur, Jeff.
Of course he's a closer and if he's in a situation where he won't be closing, he might not want to stay there. He's made money in his career already and his role and situation MAY be his deciding factors.

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Old
08-22-2009, 12:40 PM
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Enrique Gonzalez up for Bowden to be the emergency sacrificial lamb.
http://www.boston.com/sports/basebal...s/extra_bases/

Wakefield to start Wednesday with Penny to...do...something else. Maybe to be the permanent Enrique Gonzalez / long guy / whatever.
http://twitter.com/amaliebenjamin

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08-22-2009, 12:47 PM
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I think we should ease up on the Sox. They only lost by a touchdown and a field goal last night. Maybe they'll find some pitching tonight. Love the genius that is Tito who started Brad (let's get pounded) Penney last night. He's 7-8 now ? Every time he pitches, I want to have a 7 and 7.

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08-22-2009, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by erfus View Post
Minaya is a dolt, but Wagner is supposedly on his way to being a Type A free agent. If that is so AND the Mets have the budget to risk offering him arbitration (which he may very well take, in addition to his $1M buyout), they'd be asking for the equivalent of a 1st round pick and a supplemental pick. Whatever that means.

My sense is Minaya would ask for quite a bit. Maybe ownership pulls Minaya's strings on this one.

As for Wagner himself, I don't really care much one way or the other. The pen has been a bit erratic lately and we're heading into September 40-man roster territory so it may be worth a shot if the cost is another Negron/Argenis Diaz type of prospect.
Wow...did not realize he would be a type A....actually never considered it. Now both Minaya and myself are dolts.

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08-22-2009, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by mikeybuddha View Post
Of course he's a closer and if he's in a situation where he won't be closing, he might not want to stay there. He's made money in his career already and his role and situation MAY be his deciding factors.
Yes, but what team would offer a 38-year old guy coming off TJ surgery a contract when they'd have to pony up the draft picks? This is what happened with Varitek last year. Sox offered arb, then he declined thinking he had value, but there was nobody out there ready to pay humans give up the picks.

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Old
08-22-2009, 02:06 PM
  #19
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I hate to say this but Boston has no realistic chance of catching New York in the AL East. Even if they end up winning 2 out of 3 in this series they would only get to within 5.5 games of 1st place and although Boston has a more favourable schedule the rest of the way I don't think they could make up that big of a difference.


Remaining New York Schedule ( 40 games left - 22 at home and 18 road games )
at Boston ( 2 games )
Texas ( 3 games )
White Sox ( 3 games )
at Baltimore ( 3 games )
at Toronto ( 4 games )
Tampa Bay ( 4 games )
Baltimore ( 3 games )
LA Angels ( 1 game )
Toronto ( 2 games )
at Seattle ( 3 games )
at LA Angels ( 3 games )
Boston ( 3 games )
Kansas City ( 3 games )
at Tampa Bay ( 3 games )


Remaining Boston Schedule ( 41 games left - 24 at home and 17 road games )
NY Yankees ( 2 games )
White Sox ( 4 games )
Toronto ( 3 games )
at Tampa Bay ( 3 games )
at White Sox ( 4 games )
Baltimore ( 2 games )
Tampa Bay ( 3 games )
LA Angels ( 3 games )
at Baltimore ( 3 games )
at Kansas City ( 4 games )
at New York ( 3 games )
Toronto ( 3 games )
Cleveland ( 4 games )

A big advantage for Boston is that 14 of their last 17 games are against crappy teams. By that point it probably won't mean much as far as the AL East goes but it should certainly help in their chase for the AL Wild Card spot


Last edited by BostonBob: 08-22-2009 at 02:51 PM.
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Old
08-22-2009, 03:22 PM
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Yes, but what team would offer a 38-year old guy coming off TJ surgery a contract when they'd have to pony up the draft picks? This is what happened with Varitek last year. Sox offered arb, then he declined thinking he had value, but there was nobody out there ready to pay humans give up the picks.
I think it's early to say that because teams are always gung-ho for closers. If Wagner keeps throwing 96 and has success in a setup role from now to season's end, I think it's possible a team that finishes in the bottom 15 (and therefore has 1st round pick protection) would give up a 2nd to sign him. The sandwich round pick doesn't hurt the signing team. Sure, if he has a Varitek-like finish, he won't be attractive at that price.

I'm not sure if he'd accept arbitration or not. I think he probably would rather close for KC or Washington than setup for Boston. If the Sox do trade for him, I'd be disappointed if they didn't go that route (assuming he throws well).

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08-22-2009, 03:30 PM
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Old
08-22-2009, 03:31 PM
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3-0 Sox so far. I am loving the agressive baserunning by the Sox, with Martinez and Ortiz. Good job Hale.

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Old
08-22-2009, 04:14 PM
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Tazawa looking good so far. He just made ARod look like a fool with the breaking ball in his last AB. Tazawa has potential to be a reliable guy, doesn't throw hard enough to be a #1 or 2 in my eyes though.

7-0 Sox, btm 3

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Old
08-22-2009, 04:22 PM
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Varitek pisses me off so much.

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Old
08-22-2009, 05:15 PM
  #25
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Tazawa looking good so far. He just made ARod look like a fool with the breaking ball in his last AB. Tazawa has potential to be a reliable guy, doesn't throw hard enough to be a #1 or 2 in my eyes though.
He seems to be a lot of smoke and mirrors, but he's getting results. 1 thing we do know about him is that nothing phases him. He's been put in some tough situations, and has passed each test. He's got a good head above his shoulders, now it's just a matter of working on the pitches, particularly location. He also seems to fall behind a lot of batters, but that's generally the MO of most young pitchers, and should correct itself with time.

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