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Zherdev signs with Atlant of KHL (post 233)

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Old
09-13-2009, 12:24 PM
  #76
D713B
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mti79 View Post
You forgot Higgins.



Is Higgins able to play center? I thought he was a wing.... Similar to your lines:
Kotalik-Drury-Gaborik
Higgins-Dubinsky-Zherdev
Avery-Prospal-Callahan
Brashear-Anisimov-Lisin

I'm not going to lie to anyone... I don't hate that top 12. AA's line could get 7-9 mins a night as he acclimates to the NHL.
Higgin's cap hit was in there. He fell in at the 5th highest.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ImmortalRanger View Post
With Donald Brashear on the 3rd line and porspal on the 4th you are just ASKING for trouble.

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Originally Posted by amendandrevise View Post
I might be wrong, but I'm almost sure that's just the auto-generated lines capgeek throws out.
Yeah, Capgeek.com automatically generates the lines according to the cap hit starting with the greatest and working it's way down. It's not a representation of what I believe the lines should/would be.


Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
We drooled at the prospect of Gomez setting up Jagr.
So we should never "drool" over potential linemates ever again? You're one of the more pessimistic posters on this board when you want to be.

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Old
09-13-2009, 12:25 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by BrooklynRangersFan View Post
What is with all this glee in his having to eat crow? I've never seen such nasty schadenfreude. Last time I checked, they didn't hand out the Stanley Cup for the team that did a best job of "sticking it" to players in August...

Look, he (or rather Hedges) misplayed his hand badly. He should have fired his agent the moment that the Rangers walked away from his arbitration award. But that's not the point. As a fan (and especially if you're putting yourself in mgmt's shoes), you should be looking at one thing: making the team better.

If we can't fit him under our cap (which I can buy) or we no longer need him on the roster (which I can't - I mean, really? He's worse than 12 other forwards on our team?), then you let him walk. If you can get Z for cheap and he fits on the team, then great.

But all this "nyah, nyah" nonsense is just that - nonsense.
Nice post. Some fans just turn their backs on players at a drop of a hat. It's quite pathetic and immature. Yesterday I saw multiple posters change their opinion about Dubinsky and Gaborik in the matter of minutes. I think some are so easily influenced by what other people write that they can no longer think for themselves.

Are people going to be pat themselves on the back if Dubinsky doesn't sign? It's sad, really.

And your totally right about people finding glee and happiness in events that may not even make the team better, solely because they were "right." Personal biases take priority over the good of the team, I guess...

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Old
09-13-2009, 12:30 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by D713B View Post
So we should never "drool" over potential linemates ever again? You're one of the more pessimistic posters on this board when you want to be.
Call it what you want. If you want to choose to not see the flaws in this team, that's certainly your right.

I'll drool over a line combination when they they prove to be drool-worthy.

BTW, was I pessimistic when I took all kinds of heat in January for saying I would wait to give Zherdev a long-term contract extension? Or was I realistic?

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Old
09-13-2009, 12:45 PM
  #79
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HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA




EPIC FAIL for Zherdev.

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Old
09-13-2009, 12:53 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Call it what you want. If you want to choose to not see the flaws in this team, that's certainly your right.

I'll drool over a line combination when they they prove to be drool-worthy.

BTW, was I pessimistic when I took all kinds of heat in January for saying I would wait to give Zherdev a long-term contract extension? Or was I realistic?
You're missing my point. If you want to discuss the pitfalls of having Zherdev on the roster then by all means feel free. Both sides of the argument have been debated ad nauseum to begin with. But raining on someone's parade because they like the sound of Gaborik and Zherdev together simply because Jagr and Gomez couldn't find chemistry is anything but having a realistic discussion.

BTW, what does not wanting Zherdev signed to a long term contract in January have to do with wanting to sign him for less than his QO and for one year? Aside from that are you implying that having a 24 year old perennial 60 point player signed long term would be detrimental? That's a matter of opinion and judging by the split of those who wanted him re-signed this off-season and those who didn't you won't find any definitive answer to that, simply opinions.

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09-13-2009, 12:59 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D713B View Post
You're missing my point. If you want to discuss the pitfalls of having Zherdev on the roster then by all means feel free. Both sides of the argument have been debated ad nauseum to begin with. But raining on someone's parade because they like the sound of Gaborik and Zherdev together simply because Jagr and Gomez couldn't find chemistry is anything but having a realistic discussion.
Raining on someone's parade is saying wait and see? And I'm not saying wait and see because Jagr and Gomez didn't click. I'm saying it because this team has looked good on paper for years (going back the end of the Smith era and the start of the Sather era) and the results on the ice aren't always the same. We should know that by now.

In fact, this offseason was very similar to moves made in the past — and to me that is reason enough for concern.

Quote:
Originally Posted by D713B View Post
BTW, what does not wanting Zherdev signed to a long term contract in January have to do with wanting to sign him for less than his QO and for one year? Aside from that are you implying that having a 24 year old perennial 60 point player signed long term would be detrimental? That's a matter of opinion and judging by the split of those who wanted him re-signed this off-season and those who didn't you won't find any definitive answer to that, simply opinions.
What I'm saying is I was killed for saying wait and see. He then, true to form, had a lesser second half, invisible playoffs and asked for insane money. Was I being pessimistic or realistic?

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09-13-2009, 01:02 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Raining on someone's parade is saying wait and see? And I'm not saying wait and see because Jagr and Gomez didn't click. I'm saying it because this team has looked good on paper for years (going back the end of the Smith era and the start of the Sather era) and the results on the ice aren't always the same. We should know that by now.



What I'm saying is I was killed for saying wait and see. He then, true to form, had a lesser second half, invisible playoffs and asked for insane money. Was I being pessimistic or realistic?
You weren't wrong, but the problem is that the team avoided making the mistake of overpaying him for on year and went out and overpaid a lesser player and committed themselves to him for three years. Certainly not unexpected with this team, but still stupid.

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Old
09-13-2009, 01:09 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Raining on someone's parade is saying wait and see? And I'm not saying wait and see because Jagr and Gomez didn't click. I'm saying it because this team has looked good on paper for years (going back the end of the Smith era and the start of the Sather era) and the results on the ice aren't always the same. We should know that by now.



What I'm saying is I was killed for saying wait and see. He then, true to form, had a lesser second half, invisible playoffs and asked for insane money. Was I being pessimistic or realistic?
If everyone waited to see the outcome there would be no one on this board. News flash, fans enjoy speculating.

4 Million for a sixty point player isn't necessarily insane. Look around the league at some other contracts. If you're referring to the 4.5 he asked for that's a part of negotiating. The Rangers offer 3.25 he asks for 4.5 hoping to meet in the 3.9 range which was then awarded. As for you being pessimistic or realistic, again it's difficult to say because there are about equally sized parties on both sides of that fence. IMO before watching what happens the next three years I'd take Z at 3 years 4 mill per as opposed to Kotalik 3 years 3 mill per and I actually like the Ales signing.

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Old
09-13-2009, 01:24 PM
  #84
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id take him back in a heartbeat, but at least 2 "top 9" wingers are going to get screwed then...

so far we have gaborik, kotalik, higgins, prospal, callahan, avery and lisin....already 1 of those is going to have to play on the 4th line, or as a reserve forward, or in hartford....add in Z and 2 will be gone.

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Old
09-13-2009, 01:26 PM
  #85
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unbelievable

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Old
09-13-2009, 01:32 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
id take him back in a heartbeat, but at least 2 "top 9" wingers are going to get screwed then...

so far we have gaborik, kotalik, higgins, prospal, callahan, avery and lisin....already 1 of those is going to have to play on the 4th line, or as a reserve forward, or in hartford....add in Z and 2 will be gone.
Higgins-Dubinsky-Gaborik
Callahan-Dury-Zherdev
Kotalik-Anisimov-Prospal
Avery-Boyle-Lisin

Brashear for games which need an enforcer. Four lines that can score with some grit on each line however you shake em up. I'm really not sure how the lines would hash out in the end, the above is just a guess of the starting 12 on most nights.

Please spare me the Avery on the 4th line non-sense...(not directed at you Inferno, I know some people take offense to that notion.)

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Old
09-13-2009, 01:47 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt4776 View Post
http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/more_...wwoELvW8ClVkdN

Would you want Zherdev back for 3.25?

Yes, I definitely would want him back for QO. He's a young top-6 winger who has been brought down to Earth by his experience this summer. Just like Avery has been on his best behavior since coming back, so will Z.

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Old
09-13-2009, 01:51 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by BrooklynHockey99 View Post
Yes, I definitely would want him back for QO. He's a young top-6 winger who has been brought down to Earth by his experience this summer. Just like Avery has been on his best behavior since coming back, so will Z.
Yeah... I don't know about that.

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Old
09-13-2009, 02:12 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by BrooklynHockey99 View Post
Yes, I definitely would want him back for QO. He's a young top-6 winger who has been brought down to Earth by his experience this summer. Just like Avery has been on his best behavior since coming back, so will Z.
He clearly cant get 3.25 million anywhere else. So we should reward him by handing him the figure he rejected earlier this summer? Yea right. The word is out on Zherdev...hes a dog, plain and simple. If he wasn't, he'd have an NHL contract by now.

As for Avery, his 'performance' in game 3 and the end of game 4 in the playoffs was downright embarassing. The crap with Tim Thomas towards the end of the season was bush-league, and thats putting it nicely. Best behavior? Again, yea right.

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09-13-2009, 02:16 PM
  #90
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1 year, $1.4M Tell him he can play for his real pay day contract this season and he will score 80 points.

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09-13-2009, 02:19 PM
  #91
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If we took Zherdev back, he'd come back with more drive then ever. He'll realize what you have to do to play like a $4 million dollar player, and he'll be that guy.

He's backed into a corner now and vicious, we should take a shot.

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Old
09-13-2009, 02:26 PM
  #92
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People really think Zherdev would fit into this style of play? Really? He is soft both physically and mentally and has already shown he is only out for the money more so than winning anything. He is a good player but I dont see a spot for him on this team.

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Old
09-13-2009, 02:29 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by t3hg00se View Post
If we took Zherdev back, he'd come back with more drive then ever. He'll realize what you have to do to play like a $4 million dollar player, and he'll be that guy.

He's backed into a corner now and vicious, we should take a shot.
You think so? I certainly dont.

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09-13-2009, 02:42 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
People really think Zherdev would fit into this style of play? Really? He is soft both physically and mentally and has already shown he is only out for the money more so than winning anything. He is a good player but I dont see a spot for him on this team.
He had 12 points in Tortorella's first 15 games. That's also before Tortorella pulled back on the reigns a bit before he realized the team as constructed wasn't capable of being very successful fully employing his game plan. So yes, I do think he can succeed under Tortorella's system.

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09-13-2009, 02:46 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by D713B View Post
He had 12 points in Tortorella's first 15 games. That's also before Tortorella pulled back on the reigns a bit before he realized the team as constructed wasn't capable of being very successful fully employing his game plan. So yes, I do think he can succeed under Tortorella's system.
Well then I guess we will agree to disagree because I dont think there is any way that he fits into the team toughness that Torts wants and the aggressive style of play that needs to be employed in order for it to work.

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09-13-2009, 02:47 PM
  #96
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Counter offer, 1 year, 2M.

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Old
09-13-2009, 02:48 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
Well then I guess we will agree to disagree because I dont think there is any way that he fits into the team toughness that Torts wants and the aggressive style of play that needs to be employed in order for it to work.
Sather and Torts obviously feel the same way. If they didn't, he'd be on the team right now.

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09-13-2009, 02:50 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Sather and Torts obviously feel the same way. If they didn't, he'd be on the team right now.
So Sather didn't offer him $3.25 million previously?

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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
Well then I guess we will agree to disagree because I dont think there is any way that he fits into the team toughness that Torts wants and the aggressive style of play that needs to be employed in order for it to work.
You honestly don't believe he improves the team if he signs for 1 year $1.75-2Mill? I'll give you that he floats but Zherdev is tougher than he gets credit for around here. He's not necessarily soft.

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Old
09-13-2009, 02:53 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by D713B View Post
So Sather didn't offer him $3.25 million previously?
And your point? It was a qualifying offer...one that they wouldnt budge from I might add. If they really felt strongly about Zherdev, dont you think they'd shell out an extra 700K for him?

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09-13-2009, 02:56 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
And your point? It was a qualifying offer...one that they wouldnt budge from I might add. If they really felt strongly about Zherdev, dont you think they'd shell out an extra 700K for him?
No, there has to be a tipping point. With our cap situation $4M wasn't beneficial. By that logic why don't we offer Dubinsky $3M instead of something in the range of the $2-2.3 we gave to Callahan? I'm sure that doesn't mean Sather doesn't feel very strongly about Dubinsky.

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