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09-28-2009, 02:49 PM
  #51
DontStepanMe
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
i dont agree with your assessment of his play the past few years. The grass is always greener on the other side, until you actually get there and realize no grass is perfect.

I think hes been fine. Not amazing, but certainly a player worth keeping on your roster for a cap hit of only 1.55 Mil.
I don't know inferno. It certainly seems as though whoever he is put with starts to struggle (or his game diminishes) once paired with him. Redden look horrible with him early in the year, Staal is much better paired with Rosy than him, Tyutin is looking fantastic now that he isn't paird with Girardi (and struggled the most here when paired with Girardi). There is a reason that Girardi is always towards the bottom of the team in +/-. It's because, truthfully he isn't that good, and he is being played way too much.

I hope we cut cords with him after this season.

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09-28-2009, 02:51 PM
  #52
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Originally Posted by 94now View Post
In a few years may be. This season we have to patch holes on defence, not to have fantazies about rookies making huge impact out of the blue. We can't afford two rookie Ds, let alone three.
I'm saying today. I don't think it's a fantasy. I think Sauer is better defensively than Dan Girardi RIGHT NOW. I'm not suggesting we bench Girardi in favor of Sauer, just telling you how I see it.

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09-28-2009, 02:51 PM
  #53
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Larry Brooks is only confirming what some of us have known for awhile.

In 2007, I was pleasantly surprised by Girardi, he was steady, poised, and rarely made mistakes. Now he is a shell of his former self and I think that his solid play when he first came up may have been an aberration.

I've never questioned Girardi's work ethic, though, and now even that is being questioned by Brooks. I see words like "indifferent" and "floating" to describe Girardi and that is very disappointing to hear. Granted, Brooks is probably being a bit sensationalistic, but Torts also sounds discouraged with Girardi's effort as well.
Yeah, right. It's about time to dress Dan in Zherdev's scary costume.
Is Halloween coming soon enough?

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09-28-2009, 02:54 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
I'd wager money that a full season of Mike Sauer would give us better defensive play than a full season of Dan Girardi. Unfortunately, with Tortorella running the show, we'll probably never know!
Interesting... could be... although I'm not the highest believer in Sauer either. But you very may well be on to something.

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09-28-2009, 02:56 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
Interesting... could be... although I'm not the highest believer in Sauer either. But you very may well be on to something.
From all I saw of Sauer last season in Hartford and his couple of games with the Rags, I have zero doubt that he could be a good defensive defenseman right now. He'll need to learn to join the rush and make quick passes out of his zone if he wants to play on a Tortorella team though.

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09-28-2009, 02:58 PM
  #56
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Redden may look better this year but he's not capable of playing to the level he's being paid for. By his own admission--he wants to forget about last season (it's been on the telecasts)--just going back one year--26 pts. from a $6.5 mil player who admits he played like crap--and whether he got better at the end or not (or by how much) there's no disputing that he **** the bed a good part of the year. He's showing much better signs for this year but is there anybody out there who thinks for the money he's making that he should be getting at least 45 pts? and thinks he's capable of doing it?--which is why Gilroy and MDZ more than someone like Sauer is still in the mix. The kind of same argument can be used to lesser extent against Rozsival. If we're really looking at the defense those two are the guys who are really hurting us--because their stats and their play on the ice don't add up to what they're making--no way and no how.

I think it's a valid argument that Girardi is best suited as a 5-6 stay at home guy and that he's somewhat misplaced as a top 4--however at that 5-6 he is a real one capable of being a very good NHL'er. His pricetag does not hurt the team.

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09-28-2009, 02:58 PM
  #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
I'm saying today. I don't think it's a fantasy. I think Sauer is better defensively than Dan Girardi RIGHT NOW. I'm not suggesting we bench Girardi in favor of Sauer, just telling you how I see it.
Sanguinetti is better than Sauer at this point. If Torts palns to chase Girardi away, Sangs is his guy. I hope it will not come to it. We can't afford so many rookies.

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09-28-2009, 03:07 PM
  #58
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Originally Posted by Rags225 View Post
I don't know inferno. It certainly seems as though whoever he is put with starts to struggle (or his game diminishes) once paired with him. Redden look horrible with him early in the year, Staal is much better paired with Rosy than him, Tyutin is looking fantastic now that he isn't paird with Girardi (and struggled the most here when paired with Girardi). There is a reason that Girardi is always towards the bottom of the team in +/-. It's because, truthfully he isn't that good, and he is being played way too much.

I hope we cut cords with him after this season.
see that last part I have a problem with. I think if gilroy/DZ really step up, maybe girardi can be where he belongs; on the bottom pair. I believe Girardi on the bottom pair would be better than most 5th-6th D, no?

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09-28-2009, 03:14 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by allstar3970 View Post
see that last part I have a problem with. I think if gilroy/DZ really step up, maybe girardi can be where he belongs; on the bottom pair. I believe Girardi on the bottom pair would be better than most 5th-6th D, no?

I agree.

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09-28-2009, 03:15 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post
Redden may look better this year but he's not capable of playing to the level he's being paid for. By his own admission--he wants to forget about last season (it's been on the telecasts)--just going back one year--26 pts. from a $6.5 mil player who admits he played like crap--and whether he got better at the end or not (or by how much) there's no disputing that he **** the bed a good part of the year. He's showing much better signs for this year but is there anybody out there who thinks for the money he's making that he should be getting at least 45 pts? and thinks he's capable of doing it?--which is why Gilroy and MDZ more than someone like Sauer is still in the mix. The kind of same argument can be used to lesser extent against Rozsival. If we're really looking at the defense those two are the guys who are really hurting us--because their stats and their play on the ice don't add up to what they're making--no way and no how.

I think it's a valid argument that Girardi is best suited as a 5-6 stay at home guy and that he's somewhat misplaced as a top 4--however at that 5-6 he is a real one capable of being a very good NHL'er. His pricetag does not hurt the team.
If Redden can continue to play the way he has played the las 4 or so preseason games I honestly believe he may be able to put up 35 points. It also depends on how the PP does this season as I could foresee him getting anywhere from 10-20 PP points alone if the PP is much better than last season.

I went on record pretty much all season that Redden looked out of place on such a defensively-oriented team. Renney all summer was clamoring about how the team would be much more up-tempo and score more goals which fits Redden much better than a defensively oriented team(which I would imagine is part of the reason Redden signed in NY). I honestly believe Torts style that he wants to play will allow him to be more comfortable and play much better than last season.

Now, do I think he will ever be a 6.5 million dollar player? Highly unlikely, but if he could be solid defensively and put up 35+ points playing 20+ minutes on average per game, I would take that considering he brings some experience and leadership to a very young defense.

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09-28-2009, 03:17 PM
  #61
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I know he's been disappointing, however, I don't really notice him out there negatively either. Maybe I'm not looking hard enough, but overall as a defense core, I don't think he's been too bad as the others. Regressed, for sure. But I guess seeing poor defensive play all over makes you drown out certain players.

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09-28-2009, 03:17 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by allstar3970 View Post
see that last part I have a problem with. I think if gilroy/DZ really step up, maybe girardi can be where he belongs; on the bottom pair. I believe Girardi on the bottom pair would be better than most 5th-6th D, no?
See the reason I say this is because he is already making $1.5 million this season. So he will need a raise, and will probably be getting somewhere in the neighborhood of $2mil per season, which I think is too much for a #6 dman.

Also we have alot of prospects who next year should be able to step in and take a spot from him such as Sangs, Sauer, Heikinnen (if he resigns) and Williams (if he gets better), not to mention other prospects such as Kundratek who could really surprise.

Also I am not sure if we will be able to get rid of Rosy (especially if he has a bad season) nor am I sure we should get rid of Rosy as we do need to have some veterans on the blueline besides Redden (who lets face it is going nowhere).

Therefore hopefully Gilroy/MDZ play well enough this year to either A) make Girardi expendable at the TD (would really like this) or B) Gilroy/MDZ play well enough after the TD to make Girardi expendable again in the offseason, becuase if we sign Girardi to a 3 year 8 mil contract or something like that I have a good feeling we will regret it.

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09-28-2009, 03:22 PM
  #63
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Yes, Girardi is better suited to being a bottom pairing D-man, and, yes, his salary is not a problem...right now. He's an RFA and is expecting a raise. Should the Rangers spend $2 million plus on a bottom pairing D-man, when more talented and less expensive are ready to join the club?

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09-28-2009, 03:23 PM
  #64
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I would think Sather would really try to move Rozsival before not resigning Girardi. It also depends on if MDZ and Gilroy play well this season. If they do they will most likely be locks come next season. I could see something like:

Staal-Gilroy
Girardi-Redden
MDZ-Mcdonagh/Sauer/Sanguinetti

Obviously the pairings would change but looking at the players it makes sense. If Sanguinetti and Mcdonagh and Sauer all have very good seasons respectively then possibly Sather moves Girardi next offseason but there are too many scenarios to think about.

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09-28-2009, 03:49 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
I would think Sather would really try to move Rozsival before not resigning Girardi. It also depends on if MDZ and Gilroy play well this season. If they do they will most likely be locks come next season. I could see something like:

Staal-Gilroy
Girardi-Redden
MDZ-Mcdonagh/Sauer/Sanguinetti

Obviously the pairings would change but looking at the players it makes sense. If Sanguinetti and Mcdonagh and Sauer all have very good seasons respectively then possibly Sather moves Girardi next offseason but there are too many scenarios to think about.
Agreed. It's one of either Rozsival's or Girardi's last season in NY. With the surplus of talent on the farm defensively, along with several RH defensemen (Sauer, Sangs, Potter, though I think he'll get moved to an organization who will give him a chance to play), one of the two is expendable at season's end.

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09-28-2009, 03:59 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by jas View Post
Yes, Girardi is better suited to being a bottom pairing D-man, and, yes, his salary is not a problem...right now. He's an RFA and is expecting a raise. Should the Rangers spend $2 million plus on a bottom pairing D-man, when more talented and less expensive are ready to join the club?
i agree with this...but that is for next season, not this season. This season im not prepared to go into the regular season with 3 rookie defenseman. As great as Sauer looked, I just think it would be suicidal to do that. Maybe on the forward line you can put in more than 2 or 3 rookies, but not on the blueline. I feel we can trade Girardi at the draft to move up, which is what we probably should do.

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09-28-2009, 04:07 PM
  #67
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He wasn't even drafted, so calling him a bust is a bit much
yea right.

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09-28-2009, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by 94now View Post
Sanguinetti is better than Sauer at this point. If Torts palns to chase Girardi away, Sangs is his guy. I hope it will not come to it. We can't afford so many rookies.
Sanguinetti is not better than Sauer. And you will not find many people higher on Sanguinetti than I.

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09-28-2009, 04:24 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Sanguinetti is not better than Sauer. And you will not find many people higher on Sanguinetti than I.
Agreed. but only at this point. IMHO Sangs upside is MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH higher than Sauers.

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09-28-2009, 04:32 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Agreed. but only at this point. IMHO Sangs upside is MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH higher than Sauers.
So sangs will barely be better than Sauer right?

I whole heartedly agree, his upside is much higher however at this very moment Sauer would be better for this club than Sangs (defensively speaking).

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09-28-2009, 04:32 PM
  #71
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Agreed. but only at this point. IMHO Sangs upside is MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH MUCH higher than Sauers.
Oh, absolutely. Still, I think Sauer is a safe bet to be a big, physical #3/#4 defenseman in this league.

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09-28-2009, 06:03 PM
  #72
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Girardi-Tyutin was a miserable pairing and were destroyed in the playoffs.

Girardi was MIA for 75 percent of last season.

Girardi has been terrible this preseason.


Girardi must go.

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09-28-2009, 06:07 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Scipio Africanus View Post
Girardi-Tyutin was a miserable pairing and were destroyed in the playoffs.

Girardi was MIA for 75 percent of last season.

Girardi has been terrible this preseason.


Girardi must go.
I don't think the guy needs to go. He's fine if he's on the third pairing. We're just going to run into problems if he's getting 21:00 TOI each night again.

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09-28-2009, 06:15 PM
  #74
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I think it is a total BS from start to finish.

I said that before and will say it again: the wichhunt on Renney's players continues. Torts says no bad about new aquisitions. No word about Kotalik being dismal, no mentioning of Higgins being not ready or Boyle being MIA.

Leave Girardi alone. We do not have any one better IN WHAT HE DOES besides Staal.
I think this is a bit over the top. I really don't think Tortorella is systematically crucifiying Renney's players. He's not attacking Staal, Drury, or Roszival. There is definitely holes in your theory. And didn't he rip into Higgins at one of the first practices, basically embarassed the hell out of him.

Remember how you felt people were just ripping Renney because he was Renney, well you're starting to do that to Tortorella.

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09-28-2009, 06:44 PM
  #75
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I don't get it. What kind of expectations are we putting on Girardi exactly? I don't think it is crazy to say he can be a pretty good #4/5 guy.

The guy has only been in the league for 2 1/2 years. Maybe we shouldn't be so quick to determine that he should just go.

Also, I find it funny that Brooks brings up Kessel, as if to try to attack Sather. Without mentioning that we likely would of had to give up at least 2 high end picks in addition to Girardi and try to dump salary to accommodate a guy who is out until December. And then go with a defense of 3 rookies.

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