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Cam Ward Signs 6 Year Extension

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Old
09-30-2009, 02:40 PM
  #76
RandV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elriz View Post
I have no idea how you know that all/a large majority of NHL GM's would sign Ward for 6.3 million. Please share your thinking.
Just convert Ward into young franchise player X and 6.3 million into large star salary Y. When teams have a player X they overwhelmingly give them contracts for salary Y. Rick Nash was the original player X, and a lot of fuss was made about his contract at the time, but since then that's how pretty much all teams operate now. To 'play it safe' like some people are suggesting the GM would basically be hedging his bet that the young player will fail. Why else would you pay Ward $4M? "We're really not sure if you're definitely that good yet, so we're withholding salary until you prove yourself to us some more". Is that really the way you want to treat your young star players when they reach UFA status at age 25-27?

You'd think people would learn, but every time a contract like this is signed there's a couple people that jump in that it's not a good idea because the player hasn't really proven himself yet. Not just kids too, it can happen with vets like Datsyuk or Luongo. Yet NHL GM's continue to do these deals, and they do them for a very good reason.

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Old
09-30-2009, 02:41 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Crash the Net View Post
Wow I don't think I've seen someone be so wrong in one post.

And this is coming from someone who doesn't think highly of either goaltender. I don't know if you can say "not even close". Fleury has a cup just as well as Ward, though he hasn't gotten a chance to prove much of it. Both goalies are inconsistent throughout the regular season and not superb, but have shown to step up their games in the playoffs for sure. Fleury and Ward are both top 10. Ward in the top 5 is arguable. Just as well as Fleury would be if you'd call him in the top 5.

But there's no question that Fleury at $5 mill > Ward at $6.3.
Ward >>> Fleury.

Not even close.


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Old
09-30-2009, 03:01 PM
  #78
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the issue is, all teams need a no 1 goalie. the price for a number one goalie long term is approx 5-7 these days right? if you want cheaper, you have to give one of these 10+ years contracts that everyone finds even more ludicrous than these contracts, for good reason. if rick dipietro had signed for six years instead of the rest of his life, it wouldve been for 6 million. its fair to say cam is in the same range as miller, and this is the deal miller got. there is no argument against this. whether you like one guy more than the other is irrevelant. ward has one a conn smythe and led an overacheiving team to the conference finals, asterisk it all you want but no agent will give you an inch when cam has put up the goods.

fluerys deal is better than cams? ok, so if the canes wont give it to cam what do they do? cam wont sign for less so they have to get rid of him and get a no 1 goalie long term for how much? who's available? is it better to let cam go and trade for huet or someone in that range? isnt it better just to keep the guy you raised yourself and who has fulfilled expectations? i dont see how people look at the big picture and think this is "too much". this is the going rate for tying up a guy for 6 years, when he is 25 and just hitting his prime in an already accolade filled career. some guys go whole careers without doing what cam has done, how can anyone say he has to prove more to get paid? if this is too much, whats the solution? dont say give him less money cuz he was getting this much from somebody.

rutherford paid more for both staal and ward, but he didnt cave in to the ridiculous 10 year contracts. the price to be paid for NOT signing one of those deals was to give more cash per year. the canes have their two top players tied up long term during their prime - and at similar prices to what everyone else pays for theirs. will it work? who knows, but the canes have nothing remotely close for replacements for either guy if they chose to "walk away" from paying such prices. no gm would let these guys go.

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Old
09-30-2009, 03:06 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RandV View Post
Just convert Ward into young franchise player X and 6.3 million into large star salary Y. When teams have a player X they overwhelmingly give them contracts for salary Y. Rick Nash was the original player X, and a lot of fuss was made about his contract at the time, but since then that's how pretty much all teams operate now.
I'm not in favour of overpaying young players based on potential, for every Rick Nash there is a Shawn Horcoff or a Scott Gomez or worse. To say you should overpay for potential hoping people turn out is how you get a team that's salary-screwed. It's not the norm and just because there may be a trend going around doesn't mean its a good idea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RandV View Post
To 'play it safe' like some people are suggesting the GM would basically be hedging his bet that the young player will fail. Why else would you pay Ward $4M? "We're really not sure if you're definitely that good yet, so we're withholding salary until you prove yourself to us some more". Is that really the way you want to treat your young star players when they reach UFA status at age 25-27?
Oh man, heaven forbid you require a player to live up to a contract before you give it to them. What could possibly go wrong by giving a non top-3 goalie top-3 money for 6 years?

Inflated contracts to unproven players is what will absolutely cripple teams as time goes on and people are starting to learn that lesson now.

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Old
09-30-2009, 03:16 PM
  #80
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The way Ward has played he deserves this contract.

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Old
09-30-2009, 03:23 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by TR3V0R View Post
The way Ward has played he deserves this contract.
I agree. He is a pivotal part of the Canes future.

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Old
09-30-2009, 04:16 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elriz View Post
Cam Ward is a playoff goaltender, he's not getting paid because of his regular season numbers, which until last year were bad for even a backup.

When Cam Ward doesn't show up for an entire playoff series, I would say that brings a little off his value. He's an average at best regular season goaltender already, when he starts to show chinks in his armor in the playoffs (where most of his value lies) by dropping a series himself then I don't think he's worth the 6.3 million cap hit.

Is he a bad goaltender? No, he's won a ****ing cup and a conn smythe. But at sometime you have to realize that was 4 seasons ago and look at what he has done since then. Yes, he is still improving and could turn out to be a beast and make this number a steal, but i think 6.3 on Cam Ward is a gamble.
Ward's regular season stats are skewed by playing in a Laviolette system. I would be surprised if his numbers are not easily career highs in a full season under Maurice.

As others have said, there is no hometown discount in this deal, but it is still a good deal for the organization.

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Old
09-30-2009, 06:04 PM
  #83
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Good for Ward and the Hurricanes. Always been a fan of his since watching him play midget in the Park. A lot of money for sure, but I think he is well worth it.

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Old
09-30-2009, 06:58 PM
  #84
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Average - regular season goalie
Elite - Playoff goalie

Good for ward

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Old
09-30-2009, 08:09 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucbourdon View Post
Average - regular season goalie
Elite - Playoff goalie

Good for ward
I would rather it be that way than the other way around, but again I must protest this designation. Ward is a developing goaltender that just happens to pick it up on a massive scale in the postseason, but that does not negate his status as a developing goaltender.

I would hate to harp on the point, but it bears repeating, that Ward has had a vast improvement from season to season in terms of his measurable statistics and wins. The improvement has been steady and without major derailment and his play since Tom Barrasso took over as his goaltending coach has been tremendous.

I think Ward has generally battled a bit of malaise in net in terms of the importance of regular season games, and that isn't atypical of a player that has played as many games as he has from a young age. I think that has an impact on his mental focus in games, which it seems has been the major change from night to night that Barrasso has instilled into him. In other words, I wouldn't be shocked if he follows last year's performance with another one just as strong.... which should cement his status as one of the Top 10 goaltenders in the game. I am still not quite ready to anoint him with that title until he does put together back to back regular seasons of very strong play. The Team Canada roster spot would also confirm some of that sentiment as it's historically the toughest position to crack internationally considering the talent pool Canada has and the fact that they only carry a limited number.

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Old
09-30-2009, 08:42 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elriz View Post
Oh man, heaven forbid you require a player to live up to a contract before you give it to them. What could possibly go wrong by giving a non top-3 goalie top-3 money for 6 years?

Inflated contracts to unproven players is what will absolutely cripple teams as time goes on and people are starting to learn that lesson now.
You need to look at the whole picture, not just half of it.

Staal and Ward are this teams cornerstone. You have to pay for "your guys". Staal and Ward is this franchise.

Not to mention, Ward has 1 Conn Smythe, 1 Cup, has gone 4-0 in Game 7s and have won 7 of 8 playoff series and he's ONLY 25.

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Old
09-30-2009, 09:04 PM
  #87
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A little much, but the guy is clutch in the playoffs. No denying that.

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Old
09-30-2009, 09:18 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Declan View Post
Posted this in the Hurricanes Forum, but this is probably something that all hockey fans would like to hear about


According to CapGeek Cam Ward has signed a 6 yr extension w/ the Hurricanes worth $37.8M - a cap hit of $6.3M/yr
And now I don't feel so bad about Fleury's contract. 6.3m/yr? lol

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Old
09-30-2009, 09:54 PM
  #89
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I'm surprised nobody has brought this up yet...but this contract makes us all feel pretty good about Fleury's contract.

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Old
09-30-2009, 10:02 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by ncpuckhog View Post
I'm surprised nobody has brought this up yet...but this contract makes us all feel pretty good about Fleury's contract.
What else do you expect from THE model franchise?

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Old
09-30-2009, 10:23 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Buck Naked View Post
Ward >> Fleury, not even close. This is the same Fleury that has been wildly inconsistent throughout his entire pro career right? Ward is a top 5 Goalie, Fleury might be top 10.
Ward too has been incredibly inconsistent as well over his career...

This is a market value signing, and an important piece for the Canes

i would probably take Fleury at his contract over Ward though

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Old
09-30-2009, 11:19 PM
  #92
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Great signing. I'm a Sabres fan but have been going to Canes game for awhile now since its only an hour or two away and Ward is the real deal. He had a defense that was awful in 07-08 and it only came together in the stretch run during this past season. Anytime you can get a goalie with those nerves of steel for his prime locked up, you have to do it. Staal and Ward are the franchise now, and as a secondary fan, thats pretty exciting.

And for any of the critics, have you seen Cam's backups play in the past?? Grahame and Weekes looked horrid in their stints and I am pretty sure they have Leighton as their backup now, one of the worst in the league.

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Old
09-30-2009, 11:45 PM
  #93
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I think this move makes Fleury's contract look good.

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09-30-2009, 11:47 PM
  #94
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To be honest, I really like Cam Ward as a goalie, but he is more of a 5 mil goalie than a 6 mil goalie to be honest

I'm sure that someone will criticize this post due to not considering playoff achievements, but if Cam Ward was being paid for that, he would be getting at least 7 million and not what he got.

The point being is that he has only been elite for a single season.

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Old
10-01-2009, 12:17 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Vagrant View Post
I think this move makes Fleury's contract look good.
Ward's a better goalie than Fleury, dont let one great save and a cup change your mind. Im not faulting you as a lot of goalies get overweighted by that criteria, but if im looking for a goalie for a full season, I'm taking Ward. I've seen them both play every game (fleury on tv granted) and M.A. has more talent but he doesent back up the net consistently like Ward.

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Old
10-01-2009, 06:44 AM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by elriz View Post
Cam Ward is a playoff goaltender, he's not getting paid because of his regular season numbers, which until last year were bad for even a backup.

When Cam Ward doesn't show up for an entire playoff series, I would say that brings a little off his value. He's an average at best regular season goaltender already, when he starts to show chinks in his armor in the playoffs (where most of his value lies) by dropping a series himself then I don't think he's worth the 6.3 million cap hit.

Is he a bad goaltender? No, he's won a ****ing cup and a conn smythe. But at sometime you have to realize that was 4 seasons ago and look at what he has done since then. Yes, he is still improving and could turn out to be a beast and make this number a steal, but i think 6.3 on Cam Ward is a gamble.

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Old
10-01-2009, 06:51 AM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Adama0905 View Post
This contract is a lot like Stastny's (and a few others (Kopitar to a larger extent)) in that I don't think he's quite worth it yet, but I think he will be worth it in a while.

It just seems to me that teams are so afraid of the cap that they're signing their guys to these grossly inflated deals. It's really sad.
Some people don't understand...

How much money do you think he made this franchise in the two playoff runs? How much did his play build us from a struggling small market team to a community mainstay with a great fan base.. JR said this contract is more about what he has done for the franchise already than what he is going to do... You can't argue he's worth less than $5 mil, so consider the other $1 mil a year as a thank you for the cup and for building our fanbase...

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Old
10-01-2009, 10:24 AM
  #98
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Good deal, solid contract... nothing too surprising. Smart of the Canes to lock him up.

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10-01-2009, 10:27 AM
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buffalowing88 View Post
Great signing. I'm a Sabres fan but have been going to Canes game for awhile now since its only an hour or two away and Ward is the real deal. He had a defense that was awful in 07-08 and it only came together in the stretch run during this past season. Anytime you can get a goalie with those nerves of steel for his prime locked up, you have to do it. Staal and Ward are the franchise now, and as a secondary fan, thats pretty exciting.

And for any of the critics, have you seen Cam's backups play in the past?? Grahame and Weekes looked horrid in their stints and I am pretty sure they have Leighton as their backup now, one of the worst in the league.
Small correction here, but Weekes never backed up Wardo - by the time Ward got the call to Carolina, Weekes was long gone. Ward backed up Gerber in '05-'06 and as the starter in '06-'07 and '07-'08, Grahame was his backup, with Leighton backing him up last season.

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Old
10-01-2009, 10:47 AM
  #100
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Originally Posted by elriz View Post
Cam Ward is a playoff goaltender, he's not getting paid because of his regular season numbers, which until last year were bad for even a backup.

When Cam Ward doesn't show up for an entire playoff series, I would say that brings a little off his value. He's an average at best regular season goaltender already, when he starts to show chinks in his armor in the playoffs (where most of his value lies) by dropping a series himself then I don't think he's worth the 6.3 million cap hit.

Is he a bad goaltender? No, he's won a ****ing cup and a conn smythe. But at sometime you have to realize that was 4 seasons ago and look at what he has done since then. Yes, he is still improving and could turn out to be a beast and make this number a steal, but i think 6.3 on Cam Ward is a gamble.
Every contract you give out, especially when its a large amount, is essentially a gamble. However, when a player has played well and had success like Ward then your gamble is more likely to pay off then say giving a big raise to a young kid because he may one day earn the money. Ward has done more to justify getting paid this much than other goalies such as Luongo, Lundqvist, Fleury, etc.

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