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Mathias Brunet on Danny Kristo

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Old
10-12-2009, 03:33 PM
  #26
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Don't know why I'm answering to your post seeing as I've never read one positive thing out of you. Guess I must be bored.

A.Kost is definitely first line material. Any rookie that scores 26G and 23 in what many consider a horrible sophomore year, is first line material. Whether he finds enough consistency to become a solid 1st liner is another story.

But he has all the tools to be a top liner.

As for Kristo, he's got more potential than just a 3rd liner. No question about it.
Sorry, AKost is not first line material right now.

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10-12-2009, 04:19 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
Sorry, AKost is not first line material right now.
Yes he is. No need to apologize.
He might not be playing like it according to you, but he's certainly is 1st line material.
He has all the tools required to be a first liner, all he lacks is consistency.

He'd be a first liner on many teams throughout the league.

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10-12-2009, 04:28 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by StephenYoung View Post
From what I read, this kid is the real deal. Leadership skills, speed, scoring ability, these are all things the team lacks right now. Maybe not speed, but the future habs are going to need a good scoring leader. Sounds like he'll be a 1st-2nd liner, but then again we won't be able to tell until AT LEAST next year, if not the year after when he actually cracks the organization.
Kristo ===========>>>>>> SPEEEEEEED MEEP MEEP CU LIKE COPPER

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10-12-2009, 04:34 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Yes he is. No need to apologize.
He might not be playing like it according to you, but he's certainly is 1st line material.
He has all the tools required to be a first liner, all he lacks is consistency.
I understand that with our big 2007-2008 season we gained a lot of new fans, but it seems like many of them lack perspective.

For starters, having the tools required means jack squat in the NHL if you don't use them. Right now, he isn't using them... so that argument is not worth much (if anything).

Second of all, this is a case where "according to me" doesn't come into play. Why? Because A-Kost has been so horrendously poor that if "according to you" he has been playing like a first liner, then I can't take you seriously.

He'll slot in somewhere in your top-6... but to annoint A-Kost as a first liner is pure lunacy at this point. He was something like 140th among scorers in points last year.. let's get real.

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10-12-2009, 04:36 PM
  #30
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Great another 3rd liner, maybe we should just trade all our 1st round picks for more late 2nd and 3rd rounders and then gather all those prospects together and trade them for a god damn 1st liner player!

Do your ****ing job Timmins, really sick of you being overhyped for picking mediocre talent.

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10-12-2009, 04:40 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
I understand that with our big 2007-2008 season we gained a lot of new fans, but it seems like many of them lack perspective.

For starters, having the tools required means jack squat in the NHL if you don't use them. Right now, he isn't using them... so that argument is not worth much (if anything).

Second of all, this is a case where "according to me" doesn't come into play. Why? Because A-Kost has been so horrendously poor that if "according to you" he has been playing like a first liner, then I can't take you seriously.

He'll slot in somewhere in your top-6... but to annoint A-Kost as a first liner is pure lunacy at this point. He was something like 140th among scorers in points last year.. let's get real.
I guess it comes down to how you analyze the potential of a player. Kriss's point is that he believes he has in him to be a 1st liner. You are saying that he's not playing like one. Which actually, to me, both of you are right.

I believe that AKost has the adequate speed, strenght and one of the greatest wrist shot in the NHL. With confidence, we still have no idea how this guy could develop into. Sure, work ethic, consistency seems lacking. But if he finally understand it....Kriss's evaluation of a 1st liner might not be so far fetched.

What is my biggest problem with him being a 1st liner is how he ready the play. His hockey sense. I'm far from being sold. It was said as a question mark in his draft year, while we might have seen some little improvement over the years, it's not there yet or will it ever be.....Still, he has all the other intangibles as far as pure talent is concerned to score 40.....it's all the other stuff he needs to put together that will soon tell if he'll ever be able to do it.

But something is sure. Anybody who just throws away the notion that confidence isn't a big part of the equation just have never played the game. A great management though needs to know if it's confidence or just a ceiling that has been already reached....

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10-12-2009, 04:44 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by OneSharpMarble View Post
Great another 3rd liner, maybe we should just trade all our 1st round picks for more late 2nd and 3rd rounders and then gather all those prospects together and trade them for a god damn 1st liner player!

Do your ****ing job Timmins, really sick of you being overhyped for picking mediocre talent.
Calm down now.... You know that I don't entirely disagree with you on the subject, but Timmins has been wrong before and I hope he is but to our advantage this time. He does point out that he might be a 2nd liner or a 3rd liner. 2nd line productive player at this rank wouldn't be too bad to say the least. He might not be Grachev, but I have a lot of confidence in him now. He turned his attitude around which is a great sign. Seems that he went from a loner, selfish player to a team guy and possible captain material. I'll tell you, that despite what Timmins says, we can be excited about that player.

Note that it may also be about lowering our expectations. We'll see soon.

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10-12-2009, 04:48 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by Djee#9 View Post
But but...Burke is an awesome GM and he'll turn his team around in no time.
Yeah with guys like Jeff Finger, Mikael Grabosvki, Jamal Mayers, Jason Blake, Garnet Exelby, Wayne Primeau, Colton Orr and Jay Rosehill... Burke just build a team that could match up the Habs 2000-2001 roster.

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10-12-2009, 05:05 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Whitesnake View Post
I guess it comes down to how you analyze the potential of a player. Kriss's point is that he believes he has in him to be a 1st liner. You are saying that he's not playing like one. Which actually, to me, both of you are right.

I believe that AKost has the adequate speed, strenght and one of the greatest wrist shot in the NHL. With confidence, we still have no idea how this guy could develop into. Sure, work ethic, consistency seems lacking. But if he finally understand it....Kriss's evaluation of a 1st liner might not be so far fetched.

What is my biggest problem with him being a 1st liner is how he ready the play. His hockey sense. I'm far from being sold. It was said as a question mark in his draft year, while we might have seen some little improvement over the years, it's not there yet or will it ever be.....Still, he has all the other intangibles as far as pure talent is concerned to score 40.....it's all the other stuff he needs to put together that will soon tell if he'll ever be able to do it.

But something is sure. Anybody who just throws away the notion that confidence isn't a big part of the equation just have never played the game. A great management though needs to know if it's confidence or just a ceiling that has been already reached....
It's ridiculous to throw around expectations like "1st liner" and "40 goals" when it's clear to anyone watching the games that this guy is "fighting" (I'll use that loosely since I haven't seen much fight out of Andrei in ages) just to stay on an NHL scoring line. Andrei's in a bit of trouble here, and the focus should be on establishing him as a sound 50 point player before any mention is made of him scoring 40 goals on our 1st line. Let's be realistic here.

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10-12-2009, 05:16 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Viau View Post
Yeah with guys like Jeff Finger, Mikael Grabosvki, Jamal Mayers, Jason Blake, Garnet Exelby, Wayne Primeau, Colton Orr and Jay Rosehill... Burke just build a team that could match up the Habs 2000-2001 roster.

To be fair, Finger, Grabovski, Mayers and Blake were all brought to Toronto before Burke became GM of the Leafs.

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10-12-2009, 05:24 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
I understand that with our big 2007-2008 season we gained a lot of new fans, but it seems like many of them lack perspective.
Are you actually trying to say that I'm a new fan??..Seriously??..
This because I feel a player that scores 26G in his ''rookie'' year and 23G in a horrible sophomore year has the tools of a 1st liner??..

11 posts here and already you're trying to throw weak ridiculous disses??..

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
For starters, having the tools required means jack squat in the NHL if you don't use them. Right now, he isn't using them... so that argument is not worth much (if anything).
Whether he uses them or not doesn't change the fact that he's got the tools.
Kovalev plays like a 4th liner at times, does that mean he isn't 1st line material??..no it doesn't.

A.Kost might not be consistent yet, but he's still first line material.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
Second of all, this is a case where "according to me" doesn't come into play. Why? Because A-Kost has been so horrendously poor that if "according to you" he has been playing like a first liner, then I can't take you seriously.
I never said A.Kost is playing like a 1st liner. The argument was that he is 1st line material.
Although he didn't play great in the first two games, he's been playing much better. Saying he's ''horrendously poor'' is just a classic case of a poster exaggerating only to prove a point.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
He'll slot in somewhere in your top-6... but to annoint A-Kost as a first liner is pure lunacy at this point. He was something like 140th among scorers in points last year.. let's get real.
So, if I got this right, he's a top 6 player but calling him a first liner is ''pure lunacy''??..Didn't know there was such a huge difference between first and second lines. That must be because I've only followed hockey and the habs since 07-08.

I must admit, I love the selective stats. Let's only look at his horrible season right..
What about his 1st year??..he finished tied at 82nd among forwards in terms of pts with others like Carter and Gionta. Goal wise, he was tied at 52nd. There's 90 first liners in the NHL right??..3x30=90.
Yea, he finished around 140th last year, who cares??..Nobody will argue that he didn't play like crap last year, like 90% of our team btw.

Considering there's 30 first line left wingers throughout the league, let's see where he stands amongst them.
Last year, he ranked 39th in Pts, which is quite decent if we look at how poorly he played. In terms of Goals, he tied at 26th so he cracks the top 30.
For quite the crappy year, his ranking among Left Wingers is pretty decent.
If we look at his rookie year, he ranked 22nd for Pts and 15th for Goals. So he's well into the first line left wingers throughout the league.

Hate him all you want, say that he's not there yet, it's all good. But he definitely has first line material. His skillset is more than good enough to become a top liner. His inconsistency is what has limited him to the 2nd line.


Last edited by Kriss E: 10-12-2009 at 05:39 PM.
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10-12-2009, 05:34 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by parachutist View Post
To be fair, Finger, Grabovski, Mayers and Blake were all brought to Toronto before Burke became GM of the Leafs.
Yup, but Burke kept them.

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10-12-2009, 05:35 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by BeastScottThornton View Post
It's ridiculous to throw around expectations like "1st liner" and "40 goals" when it's clear to anyone watching the games that this guy is "fighting" (I'll use that loosely since I haven't seen much fight out of Andrei in ages) just to stay on an NHL scoring line. Andrei's in a bit of trouble here, and the focus should be on establishing him as a sound 50 point player before any mention is made of him scoring 40 goals on our 1st line. Let's be realistic here.
Last year, there were 8players (out of 90 right, considering 3players consist of the first line and there's 30NHL Teams) to crack the 40G mark.
In 07-08 and 06-07, 10players.
In 05-06, 11players.

As you can see, very few first liners actually score 40G buddy. Maybe your idea of a first liner is a bit too high. Not every 1st liner is a superstar.

A.Kost is 1st line material. Whether he's been playing like it after 5Games is irrelevant.
Jonathan Toews has 1pt in 4GP and he hasn't been great so far. Doesn't change the fact that he's 1st line material.

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10-12-2009, 05:40 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
His skillset is more than good enough to become a top liner. His inconsistency is what has limited him to the 2nd line.
I'd say his inconsistency is a direct result from a lack of hockey sense, much more than work ethic, even if that too needs improvement. I don't see Andrei ever putting it all together even though he has all the tools. There were many players throughout NHL history who had all the tools and never amounted to anything, some much more talented than Andrei. The tools are only one small part of the equation. Confidence, hockey IQ, character, work ethic, capability to learn and adapt and the ability to deal with the pressure are others. I think Andrei lacks in too many of those latter attributes to become all that he could be, or rather that management thought he could have been. Hope I'm wrong though, because he can be fun to watch and has a skillset that complements well the rest of our offensive core.

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10-12-2009, 05:46 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Munchausen View Post
I'd say his inconsistency is a direct result from a lack of hockey sense, much more than work ethic, even if that too needs improvement. I don't see Andrei ever putting it all together even though he has all the tools. There were many players throughout NHL history who had all the tools and never amounted to anything, some much more talented than Andrei. The tools are only one small part of the equation. Confidence, hockey IQ, character, work ethic and the ability to deal with the pressure are others. I think Andrei lacks in too many of those latter attributes to become all that he could be, or rather that management thought he could have been. Hope I'm wrong though, because he can be fun to watch and has a skillset that complements well the rest of our offensive core.
Yes, there were many cases of good prospects flopping. There's also many cases of late round picks blossoming into superstars.
There's also cases of good players needing 3-4-5years to come into their own, some even take up to 7years.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend to know Andrei. I don't know if his confidence is there. I don't know if he lacks character, work ethic or the ability to deal with pressure.

We'll need to wait and see how this player develops over time.
After coming from Russia, he's had very little direction here. A bit of time in AHL and then 3years of not learning anything under Carbo.
He finally has a coach that can improve his overall game and vision. We'll be able to draw better conclusions in a couple of years.

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10-12-2009, 05:55 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Yes, there were many cases of good prospects flopping. There's also many cases of late round picks blossoming into superstars.
There's also cases of good players needing 3-4-5years to come into their own, some even take up to 7years.

I'm not going to sit here and pretend to know Andrei. I don't know if his confidence is there. I don't know if he lacks character, work ethic or the ability to deal with pressure.

We'll need to wait and see how this player develops over time.
After coming from Russia, he's had very little direction here. A bit of time in AHL and then 3years of not learning anything under Carbo.
He finally has a coach that can improve his overall game and vision. We'll be able to draw better conclusions in a couple of years.
True, and I'm not pretending to know the guy inside out either. It's a guess based on what we've seen from him thus far. Sometimes skills can compensate for a lack of hockey smarts, look at Kovalev, but I'm not sure it'll be enough for Andrei. I'll agree that JM is the guy you want taking him under his wing though.

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