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Eklund - Sharks and Toronto - Couture

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Old
10-12-2009, 12:55 PM
  #26
one2gamble
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at this point id rather move clowe, he better wake the **** up

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Old
10-12-2009, 01:12 PM
  #27
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Schenn for Couture. BAM!

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Old
10-12-2009, 01:34 PM
  #28
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First off, i'm sure DW is talking to many GMs about *possible* deals, remember he is known as a terrible tire kicker. This does not mean any deals are forth coming.

Second, i think it's a little soon to make a deal for a D, i'm wanting to wait to see if players can get it together and tighten up in this area. I'll add that we've made some changes in the off season and are breaking in 2 new D so far, lets stop making changes and try for some stabilization.

Third, not sure Van Ryn or White would be players i'd want. Van Ryan is *always* getting hurt and has offensive talents which i'm not sure we need. We could have kept Ehrhoff for about the same cap hit and he's a better more durable player.
I don't know enough about White. I'll say that the leafs are not know for their outstanding team D at this point so i'd be cautious about taking players with bad habits, etc. on our team.

Forth, we can get serviceable D for little to know cost via waivers, etc. Luko and Davison come to mind as former Sharks playing in the AHL that would be cheap.

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Old
10-12-2009, 01:50 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by matt trick View Post
I think the plan has always been to let Marleau go, but if he has a good year and wants to sign a Hossa-like contract, I can't see the team turning him down. You can't just find 1st line two-way forwards of Marleau's quality of the FA market. Getting him for 4-4.5 mill would be an absolute steal. Doug must know this.

Also, I have been encouraged by the comments from Todd (and maybe Doug as well) regarding Patty having the opportunity to whine or complain, and he didn't do so.

On Couture, I agree that he is a very good insurance policy, but I think Thornton and Pavs, along with Heatley and Boyle, are the safest on the team. I would bet Joe will be signed and sealed come next July 1st. I agree that converting to wing is something the org is almost certainly considering, but Couture's game is very much a center's game, of course players change.

If they manage to keep Heatley, Thornton, Marleau, Pavelski, and Setoguchi, the major hole that is our prospect forward depth (and wingers in particular) is not nearly as bad as it is if we lose one. It shouldn't be noted that keep those five, will almost certainly mean the end of Nabby's time in San Jose.
It seems as if it's the plan but it can change and the way things are starting, it should. I think it will depend heavily on next season's cap and forecasts. If the cap takes a significant dive, (54 would be the worst, I believe) then I think they'd ask Marleau to take a 8 or 9 year deal at 32-36 mil, backload it, and give him a conditional NTC for the first four or five years. That way, he's protected while he remains a great player, gives himself a damn good chance to retire a lifelong Shark, and in case things fall apart, the Sharks can buy him out in the latter stages for a cap-friendlier hit.

I think if it comes down to choosing a top six to lose, I would go with Ryane Clowe at this stage. I don't know how he could get the contract he did for his play last season and he certainly hasn't lived up to it yet in the few games we've seen thus far. Dumping Clowe and Huskins at the draft to make room for Marleau, if necessary, should be considered if Clowe keeps this up...and even if he doesn't Marleau in the next five years will probably outproduce Clowe the rest of his career.

I also agree that the two Joes are pretty safe bets to sign another contract but they still need some insurance in case things blow up on either front. In reality, a good portion of Marleau's game is a center's game...especially at this point. He's generally the fastest guy on the ice and is probably the most conservative defensively. Of course, this wasn't true when they originally tried the switch a couple years ago. I think Pavelski could make the switch as well simply because he is a very smart player and shouldn't have a problem making an adjustment if necessary. And it might be necessary if he keeps getting killed in the faceoff circle in the playoffs.

As for Nabby, it again will heavily depend on the cap. There's no way even if he plays out of his mind that he can command the same or more from the Sharks. His age and inconsistency from year to year will become a factor. However, there are a couple of options for him. He's going to be 35 late in July so they could, I guess, wait for him to hit that point and sign him to one year deals with bonuses for him so they can go over the cap. I think that's really the only way that Nabby can get a really good pay from the Sharks w/o too large of an actual cap hit salary. He'd have to take a 2.5-3 mil salary to stay and if he waits he can get bonuses to pump it up at the expense of term.

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Old
10-12-2009, 02:24 PM
  #30
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even if one of the joes does not re-sign (god forbid), Marleau could play center again.

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Old
10-12-2009, 02:36 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by stanley cup pleeease View Post
even if one of the joes does not re-sign (god forbid), Marleau could play center again.
He could but I think they'd rather use Couture and keep Marleau at the wing. A new player that you need to succeed needs to be put in the best position for him to succeed and for Couture that would be center at this point.

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Old
10-12-2009, 02:42 PM
  #32
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Ian White is atrocious defensively. He is the perfect example of a player who made and and has stayed in the NHL based purely on one skill, his shot. This is typical Eklund BS, trading a top prospect for well, other teams' junk.

Van Ryn is decent. But other than Beauchemin, Kaberle, Schenn, and Kessel, there's no player on that team worth Couture. I could see DW getting someone like Van Ryn at the deadline for a 3rd rounder or something. I think Burke has learned his lesson about over-valuing his players after last season's deadline disaster.

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Old
10-12-2009, 02:47 PM
  #33
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After reading the Toronto board, there seems to be speculation that Van Ryn's career could be over due his current knee injury.

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Old
10-13-2009, 09:51 AM
  #34
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Haven't seen enough from Couture to make me believe he can make it in the nhl......anyway

Clowe and Couture to Toronto for Hagman and 2nd round pick (if Tornoto has a 2nd rounder)

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Old
10-13-2009, 10:26 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by DarrylshutzSydor View Post
Haven't seen enough from Couture to make me believe he can make it in the nhl......anyway

Clowe and Couture to Toronto for Hagman and 2nd round pick (if Tornoto has a 2nd rounder)
Why would DW do this ?
there is not that much overall value difference between Clowe and Hagman to make this deal even without Couture. Both are capable of producing the same points 40-50
Hagman is not the physical presense Clowe is --either in size, hitting or fighting, and Clowe fits the need SJ has ..

Clowe is also 2 yrs younger than Hagman

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Old
10-13-2009, 11:00 AM
  #36
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Clowe, Mitchell, Couture, 1st for Duncan Keith and something


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Old
10-13-2009, 02:03 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SJfortheCUP View Post
Clowe, Mitchell, Couture, 1st for Duncan Keith and something
They're not going to trade Duncan Keith. All they have to do is waive Brent Sopel and trade one of what will end up being seven forwards that will make over 3 million once Kane and Toews sign. I assume one of Versteeg or Byfuglien will be moved out and that's it.

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Old
10-13-2009, 02:16 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by fr4ed2384 View Post
Why would DW do this ?
there is not that much overall value difference between Clowe and Hagman to make this deal even without Couture. Both are capable of producing the same points 40-50
Hagman is not the physical presense Clowe is --either in size, hitting or fighting, and Clowe fits the need SJ has ..

Clowe is also 2 yrs younger than Hagman
IMO, Hagman is just as hard to play against, as I witnessed while watching him play against us while he played for Dallas, and as you point out he is two years older and as a result he has PROVEN he can put up points consistently, and Hagman is waaaay more mobile. As someone pointed out in the other thread, how many points does Ryane have? whats his plus minus? and you get a 2nd rounder.

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Old
10-13-2009, 03:45 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by DarrylshutzSydor View Post
IMO, Hagman is just as hard to play against, as I witnessed while watching him play against us while he played for Dallas, and as you point out he is two years older and as a result he has PROVEN he can put up points consistently, and Hagman is waaaay more mobile. As someone pointed out in the other thread, how many points does Ryane have? whats his plus minus? and you get a 2nd rounder.
We'd need a 7th rounder for it to be worth it.

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Old
10-13-2009, 05:02 PM
  #40
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If couture gets traded to leafs, his hockey career is finished. you might as well thrown him under the bus.

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Old
10-13-2009, 07:45 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
They're not going to trade Duncan Keith. All they have to do is waive Brent Sopel and trade one of what will end up being seven forwards that will make over 3 million once Kane and Toews sign. I assume one of Versteeg or Byfuglien will be moved out and that's it.
When they waive Sopel...we should snap him up. Sopel is way better than half our defence. Plus at the deadline we should consider Couture or whoever for Sharp, especially if Clowe keeps stinking it up. Sharp is very good and can do everything. Plus this would knock the Hawks off the "favorites" block and definitely make the Sharkies very tough to beat.

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Old
10-13-2009, 09:24 PM
  #42
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When they waive Sopel...we should snap him up. Sopel is way better than half our defence. Plus at the deadline we should consider Couture or whoever for Sharp, especially if Clowe keeps stinking it up. Sharp is very good and can do everything. Plus this would knock the Hawks off the "favorites" block and definitely make the Sharkies very tough to beat.
No. Absolutely not. I've seen Sopel since he got his exposure starting in Vancouver. He shouldn't be anywhere near this team. Even on re-entry he's still counting over $1m against the cap

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Old
10-13-2009, 09:47 PM
  #43
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When they waive Sopel...we should snap him up. Sopel is way better than half our defence. Plus at the deadline we should consider Couture or whoever for Sharp, especially if Clowe keeps stinking it up. Sharp is very good and can do everything. Plus this would knock the Hawks off the "favorites" block and definitely make the Sharkies very tough to beat.
Sharp isn't going anywhere unless Chi is crazy.

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Old
10-14-2009, 01:18 AM
  #44
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When they waive Sopel...we should snap him up. Sopel is way better than half our defence. Plus at the deadline we should consider Couture or whoever for Sharp, especially if Clowe keeps stinking it up. Sharp is very good and can do everything. Plus this would knock the Hawks off the "favorites" block and definitely make the Sharkies very tough to beat.
They're not going to make any of these moves until the off-season. Picking up Sopel would be detrimental to the Sharks as it is when they will have everyone on defense under contract next year except for Rob Blake. 2.3 for Sopel is a worse contract than the 1.7 for Huskins. He may be better than Huskins but past that he's not much to look at.

As for Sharp, he's not going to get moved I don't think. They will have seven forwards making 3 million or more once Toews and Kane re-sign. Of those, the least productive guys would be Versteeg, Byfuglien, and Bolland. Versteeg and Bolland just started their new contracts this year so I think the odd-man out right now is Dustin Byfuglien. He's going to have to have a major breakout season while the other two don't produce at a similar level to justify keeping him over anyone else.

To me, Dustin Byfuglien will be the one shopped if they can't find takers and replacements for Campbell and Huet. Honestly, I don't think they can move either because of their salary and their importance to the Hawks. Byfuglien would be the next likeliest candidate after that.

And for the Sharks in that scenario, I really wouldn't mind Byfuglien at 3 mil if they can move Clowe to the east in a 3-way trade. It would be a long shot mostly because there really wouldn't be a need for Chicago to involve the Sharks in such a deal.

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