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Old
10-23-2009, 11:19 PM
  #76
Ziggy Stardust
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I've seen brutal. Its name was Jason LaBarbera. Jon Quick is a capable NHL netminder. How many of the teams losses can be faulted on Quick's performance? He won 50% of the games he started last season with his 20+ wins in 40+ games.

Put him in net from the start of last season and the Kings could very well have ended up in the playoffs. Might I remind you of all the shootout losses from last season courtesy of LaBarbera's horrid performance?

Quick will earn his paycheck and the Kings will have an excellent tandem in net with Quick and Bernier next year. With those two in net, they should push each other to play their best. I would like to see them do a 55-27 split in net next season.

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10-23-2009, 11:26 PM
  #77
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You are nuts! If quick was playing half as good as Dean Lombardi thought he would be.... Bernier would be traded by now....
Don't you see the writing on the wall? Lombardi inserting Simmonds into the firt line the other night.. What coach with a set would ever even ask that of their GM? No wonder why Terry Murray coaches like he is afraid... because he is...
What experience do you have with hockey besides watching it?
Yes, I will admit my suggestion may be off the wall so to speak...but you watch and see... Johnathan quick as a tradeable commodity will never ever be worth as much to us as he was last year and that is my pt.
and your suggestion he and Bernier shoudl be our tandem is even more ridiculous

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10-23-2009, 11:34 PM
  #78
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Haha, I'd like to hear exactly why having a tandem of Quick and Bernier is ridiculous. And yes, I have a lot of experience in hockey. Have you worked with any players, former players and agents in the past?

Ever heard of this thing called depth? It is a nice thing for a team to have at every position. Nothing is guaranteed yet with Quick or Bernier. Quick is 23, turns 24 in January and Bernier turned 21 a few months ago. Why rush Bernier in? You do realize there are only two starters in the NHL younger than Quick; one is Steve Mason in Columbus and the other is Carey Price in Montreal.

Like I said, no logic applied to your suggestion. Like most fickle fans North of the border, they want immediate results and have no patience to see players develop.

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10-23-2009, 11:36 PM
  #79
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Putting 1 person in a 2 person argument on ignore makes for some interesting reading

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10-23-2009, 11:48 PM
  #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
Hey Ziggy
U just watch and see what happens... Quick is going nowhere...if we didn't have the first line we have now we would be 2-8.
U just watch!!!! Quick is brutal. END OF STORY.
Man your posts get funnier and funnier, can you imagine any team without there first line?!?!?!?!?!? The sharks without Thornton/Heatly, the ducks without getslaugh/perry, Washington without Ovie/backs/semin....... no what we finally have is a first line doing what is suppose to do, score goals(lots) and carry a team.

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10-24-2009, 12:06 AM
  #81
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First of all I will address why Bernier and Quick are not a good tandem. I will explain but I will also first answer with a Question? Why are they not a tandem now? Are you telling me Quick outplayed Bernier during the preseason? He absolutely did not. Are you telling me Quick outplayed Ersberg during the preseason? He absolutely did not. The fact of the matter is, this was decided prior to the season... Look at Terry Murray's Quotes!!!!!!!!!! ALSO, do you think ersberg outplayed Bernier???????
The fact of the matter is you cannot have two players under 25 as your two starting goaltenders as they have no experience. YOUNG TEAMS LIKE OURS(LA) ARE DANGEROUS
On a team as young as ours you end up with half the team(BECAUSE THEY ARE SO INEXPERIENCED) wanting one goaltender, and the other half of the team wanting the other goaltender... (ESPECIALLY If things are not going so well like a .500 team come APRIL time when deep divisions can seriously affect team morale and cohesiveness)
Unlike you, I am unwilling to put down your nationality or where you coach or play now.
I will tell you this.... I played Highschool Hockey south of the Border at a school in New England that won all New Englands. Yes we were better than Avon Od Farms(What a hole that place is)
In actual fact, just last week I spoke with Cheechoo's old linemate in Belleville(of 3 or 4 years) and he was laughing at the fact that Terry Murray was consistently having a forward at the pt on the PP.(Another story but I was one of the only ones that was against it since day 1 even when it was working and now look at it)
Further, I have been a multi award winner including Rookie of the Year in the same league Theoren Fleury and other NHLers played just last year and many other years.....Countless NHLers. Ever hear of the Allan Cup?
I am also a certified coach in multiple sports hockey included.
I understand you have a view point but so do I..... My pt is and remains, Johnathan Quick as a tradable Commodity will never be as high as it was last year I completely stand by that and it is a fact. Quick will show his weaknesses more so as the season progresses I just wnt you to watch and see.
Unlike you, I witnessed this one full year ago.....

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10-24-2009, 12:13 AM
  #82
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You answered your own question.

Look at the quotes.

Lombardi has said he wants Bernier in Manchester for two years. Period.

So yeah, it kind of was decided earlier than camp. Bernier played well enough, but he was not lights out. He didn't play in camp the way he is playing now.

I also always find it funny when people rail against the coach non stop for apparently making decisions that aren't his to make, but rather are up to the GM.

And don't give me "Murray has overarching input" or something, since you just made the point AGAINST Murray that he let Lombardi decide who should replace Williams on the first line. You can't say that Murray is a wimp for letting his GM make a coaching decision, but then accuse Murray of making a GM decision.

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10-24-2009, 12:21 AM
  #83
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Do you think Mike Babcock would let Ken Holland make his lines in Detroit? Ask yourself that....

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10-24-2009, 12:34 AM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
Do you think Mike Babcock would let Ken Holland make his lines in Detroit? Ask yourself that....
If Ken Holland has a strong opinion about something I'm sure he wouldn't hesitate to tell Babcock. Likewise I'm sure Babcock isn't stupid enough to oppose Holland if he tells him to do something.

You conspiracy theorists crack me up.

Lombardi says "Hey, what about SImmonds?"

And you interpret that as

-"Put Simmonds in because I think I'm great and know better than everybody"

-"Oh ok, I'm a big wuss, and I have no brain so I will do as you say because I've never made a line before"

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Old
10-24-2009, 12:52 AM
  #85
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The way Murray said it, it looked to me like he was asking for opinion. He had several options on his mind and he asked DL what he thought.

I mean WTF is wrong with you people? You think that TM would go around telling people how Dean runs the lines? Be serious. And it is nothing less than laughable, that head coach shouldn't be asking GM or coaching staff about certain dilemma he has.

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10-24-2009, 12:55 AM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ziggy Stardust View Post
I've seen brutal. Its name was Jason LaBarbera. Jon Quick is a capable NHL netminder. How many of the teams losses can be faulted on Quick's performance? He won 50% of the games he started last season with his 20+ wins in 40+ games.

Put him in net from the start of last season and the Kings could very well have ended up in the playoffs. Might I remind you of all the shootout losses from last season courtesy of LaBarbera's horrid performance?

Quick will earn his paycheck and the Kings will have an excellent tandem in net with Quick and Bernier next year. With those two in net, they should push each other to play their best. I would like to see them do a 55-27 split in net next season.
You are spot on, sir.

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10-24-2009, 01:11 AM
  #87
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Im not 100% sure but,,.... considering that these are extensions...then does that mean that there cap hit involves there previous contract......

example: http://www.nhlnumbers.com/overview.p...=0910&expand=n

this shows that nash's cap hit is 5.4m....... and in his extension contract that runs from 2010 till 2017 is anywhere between 7.5m and 8.2m......... wich should be a cap hit of 7.8ish.......... so do the previous years get attached is what im basicly asking.....????

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10-24-2009, 01:18 AM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingLB View Post
Are you sure on this, I am almost positive DD was on the ice for a few pk goals earlier in the season when we couldn't stop anyone..... maybe the stat is just even strength goals so he doesn't have any minus'
Doh, you're right. Looks like it's just even strength.

http://www.behindthenet.ca/2009/new_...team=ALL&pos=D

Also, looks like Jim Vandermeer has also not been on the ice for any even-strength goals against the Coyotes.

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10-24-2009, 01:21 AM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoughtyJovi View Post
Im not 100% sure but,,.... considering that these are extensions...then does that mean that there cap hit involves there previous contract......

example: http://www.nhlnumbers.com/overview.p...=0910&expand=n

this shows that nash's cap hit is 5.4m....... and in his extension contract that runs from 2010 till 2017 is anywhere between 7.5m and 8.2m......... wich should be a cap hit of 7.8ish.......... so do the previous years get attached is what im basicly asking.....????
What?

No?

Cap hit is per contract. A contract extension is a new contract that starts when the current contract expires. The cap hit then changes to that of the new contract.

What?

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10-24-2009, 01:25 AM
  #90
Hollywood
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sane Voice View Post
The way Murray said it, it looked to me like he was asking for opinion. He had several options on his mind and he asked DL what he thought.

I mean WTF is wrong with you people? You think that TM would go around telling people how Dean runs the lines? Be serious. And it is nothing less than laughable, that head coach shouldn't be asking GM or coaching staff about certain dilemma he has.
Where did I ever say about TM go around telling people how Dean runs the lines? Where was that ever said? I did say TM is coaching like he is afraid.
My original pt was and remains this... Drewiske good signing for a ~5th defenceman...
Quick is not needed. He was a 4th rnd pick when the teams focus was on Bernier. Now SUDDENLY it is on Quick when he is NOT even any good...
Quick last year was at a higher value than he is now (We have plenty of young goaltenders) with plenty of holes in our team.... (Go back to my riginal post on this thread) I was stating IN MY OPINION Quick's value will never reach what it was last year. When we trade him which we will at some point his value will be nil. That is a fact....watch and see if line 1 had a slump we would be below .500 by atleast 3 games now.
You so called fans who are up and down on the team like rides at Busch Gardens are a joke.... I have been with this team since 1987 and as a Canadian that is incredibly hard. I love this team but I am a realist. We win 4 games and to you all it is all good, we lose three and the sky is falling. You guys(for the most part) are a joke....
We need 4 things... 1) A Coach 2) a second line centre 3) an experienced third offensive defenceman 4) a goalie with a back up (In my opinion bernier and someone experienced)

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10-24-2009, 01:25 AM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DoughtyJovi View Post
Im not 100% sure but,,.... considering that these are extensions...then does that mean that there cap hit involves there previous contract......

example: http://www.nhlnumbers.com/overview.p...=0910&expand=n

this shows that nash's cap hit is 5.4m....... and in his extension contract that runs from 2010 till 2017 is anywhere between 7.5m and 8.2m......... wich should be a cap hit of 7.8ish.......... so do the previous years get attached is what im basicly asking.....????
The answer to your question is no. The answer to nhlnumbers is the far better http://www.nhlscap.com

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10-24-2009, 01:30 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
Where did I ever say about TM go around telling people how Dean runs the lines? Where was that ever said? I did say TM is coaching like he is afraid.
My original pt was and remains this... Drewiske good signing for a ~5th defenceman...
Quick is not needed. He was a 4th rnd pick when the teams focus was on Bernier. Now SUDDENLY it is on Quick when he is NOT even any good...
Quick last year was at a higher value than he is now (We have plenty of young goaltenders) with plenty of holes in our team.... (Go back to my riginal post on this thread) I was stating IN MY OPINION Quick's value will never reach what it was last year. When we trade him which we will at some point his value will be nil. That is a fact....watch and see if line 1 had a slump we would be below .500 by atleast 3 games now.
You so called fans who are up and down on the team like rides at Busch Gardens are a joke.... I have been with this team since 1987 and as a Canadian that is incredibly hard. I love this team but I am a realist. We win 4 games and to you all it is all good, we lose three and the sky is falling. You guys(for the most part) are a joke....
We need 4 things... 1) A Coach 2) a second line centre 3) an experienced third offensive defenceman 4) a goalie with a back up (In my opinion bernier and someone experienced)
I never knew things that haven't happened yet could be fact.

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10-24-2009, 01:42 AM
  #93
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Oh my.... I love the fact that hockey sells in the US I really do love it.... It does however absolutely kill me that hardly any of you know what it is like to get a cross check in the face, get an elbow in the face and wake up in hospital, lose teeth like trees lose leaves. My nose breaks so easily now it almost goes on a strong noreaster. You armchairs have no clue.
I take solace in the fact that at the end of the day we all cheer for the same jersey....
Now based on Sane Voices comments being nationalistic i do understand why you guys feel this strongly for Quick. It is unfortunate he will play himself out of the position...

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10-24-2009, 01:45 AM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
Oh my.... I love the fact that hockey sells in the US I really do love it.... It does however absolutely kill me that hardly any of you know what it is like to get a cross check in the face, get an elbow in the face and wake up in hospital, lose teeth like trees lose leaves. My nose breaks so easily now it almost goes on a strong noreaster. You armchairs have no clue.
I take solace in the fact that at the end of the day we all cheer for the same jersey....
Now based on Sane Voices comments being nationalistic i do understand why you guys feel this strongly for Quick. It is unfortunate he will play himself out of the position...
You armchairs. Sure you used the right pronoun there?

I don't care one way or another where you or Quick were born.

What your nose breaking easily or getting cross-checked into the hospital have to do with anything, I'm unsure.

Getting your legs blown off in Korea doesn't mean you are fit to command an army in Iraq.

You do realize, you only get the flak for being a canuck because you claim your opinion as fact, sometimes in the same sentence. 'I think therefore I am' is one thing. 'I think therefore I'm right' is another.

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10-24-2009, 01:51 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by Hollywood View Post
Oh my.... I love the fact that hockey sells in the US I really do love it.... It does however absolutely kill me that hardly any of you know what it is like to get a cross check in the face, get an elbow in the face and wake up in hospital, lose teeth like trees lose leaves. My nose breaks so easily now it almost goes on a strong noreaster. You armchairs have no clue.
I take solace in the fact that at the end of the day we all cheer for the same jersey....
Now based on Sane Voices comments being nationalistic i do understand why you guys feel this strongly for Quick. It is unfortunate he will play himself out of the position...
It looks like you might got a hit or two too many, mate. I have nothing against Canadians, but the way you guys start talking about hockey is really funny. You are too fanboyish with Bernier. I understand you two are Canadians and every Kings fan loves the fact that he is part of the team. But to talk BS about Quick paints you in a completely different picture. Quick is not perfect but if Bernier outplays him, we have a great goalie pair. And yes - Bernier WILL have to outplay Quick, he will get no gifts. Getting rid of Quick now would be probably most stupid thing Dean has ever done in his career.

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Old
10-24-2009, 02:05 AM
  #96
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He is not! When you realize this, you may think back to this day.... When you do you will realize there was one guy(and I love being that one guy) who said we should have traded him last year..
I hope that Quick is not our SC contender goalie as it will mean that Bernier outplayed him.

Even if that happens, you are still wrong now. Why don't we just trade Kopitar for second round pick today while he still has value? In 15 years his value will be zero.

We need Quick now. We need Quick next season WHATEVER Bernier shows. Doesn't matter if they share minutes or Bernier will play more than Quick. It will be best for us, for team, for Bernier, if he doesn't have all pressure on his shoulders first season in NHL.

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10-24-2009, 02:10 AM
  #97
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Toronto in 05/06 should have been gearing up for a rebuild, but they didn't.

The Kings in 08/09 were just starting to come out of one.

Different scenarios.

Trading Quick last year would have forced Bernier to play this year, and/or an overpayment for a UFA goalie. It's competition.

I think Bernier will end up being our #1 in 3 years. I do.

I think Quick will end up as a great starter somewhere else eventually.

I could care less about the value or return of either. I only care that there is competition in the pipeline (which goes away if Quick is traded) and that we have someone in net at all times that we trust, and for the time being, I trust Quick to win 30-35 games this year.

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Old
10-24-2009, 09:11 AM
  #98
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Great signings. DD's deal is a pure steal $ wise at his age, if he keeps it up he could be signing a scuderi-esque deal on his next contract. He's also the clear replacement for OD's role when he retires. Good stuff.

Quick is awesome, haters can eat it. Like I said all last year, JQ is a kid with a punk rock razor sharp chip on his shoulder. Not sure if anyone listened to me, but we're seeing the proof that he just needs to get that arrogance back (TM's own words) and his game will return. He's fine and it's a great signing.

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10-24-2009, 10:00 AM
  #99
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Funny how some people think nobody in Cali plays hockey.

Quick is a solid goalie, "The future of USA goaltending" remember He has let in a lot of soft goals this season but has yet to really cost us a game ala Labarbera. He's young but he'll come into true form eventually. He's signed cheap and we still have Bernier who is finally starting to live up to his billing. I don't care which one of these goalies helps us to win as long as one of them actually does it.

Hollywood, what did you expect Quick to net us in a trade anyway? A draft pick or two.

Fro is probably the guy we should have moved last year to maximize return.


Last edited by Knight of the Realm: 10-24-2009 at 12:07 PM.
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10-24-2009, 10:13 AM
  #100
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The answer to your question is no. The answer to nhlnumbers is the far better http://www.nhlscap.com
theres something missing in this website..... bonus's are not supposed to effect the cap.... they havn't been deducted from the total salary of the team

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