HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

Rozsival MUST GO

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
11-19-2009, 05:25 PM
  #101
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
for comparison sake:

Rozsival is making the same as Gonchar, Carter, Fleury, Savard, Havlat, Gionta, Kovalev, Ribeiro, Thomas and Kubina.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 05:30 PM
  #102
Bluenote13
Believe In Henke
 
Bluenote13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: BKLYN, NYC
Posts: 23,632
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
for comparison sake:

Rozsival is making the same as Gonchar, Carter, Fleury, Savard, Havlat, Gionta, Kovalev, Ribeiro, Thomas and Kubina.
Ya don't say? I've never ever ever seen that posted around here

Bluenote13 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 05:36 PM
  #103
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Ya don't say? I've never ever ever seen that posted around here

I havent.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 05:43 PM
  #104
Fataldogg
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 6,884
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
If I were to grade the defenseman itd go as follows:

Redden- B - been the most consistent and steady defenseman, he will never live up to his contract but contract aside, hes playing just fine

Del Zotto - A - hes been a pleasant surprise, hes got poise and great vision and has contributed more than we could ask for in points and on the PP, hes only going to get stronger and mature as time goes on but so far so good

Gilroy - B - he can really skate and has been steady defensively although he hasnt produced as much offense as id thought. he tries but comes up short but still playing pretty sound defense for the most part

Staal - C - hes been pushed to play offensively and join the rush which has proven to be a disaster and has cost us games at key times. he needs to work on his offense but not at the expense of his shutdown game. we really need him to be playing his strong defensive game. too many people are viewing him with a "what have you done for me lately" lens. i think theyre all off their rocker. hes one of the best up and coming shutdown defensemen in the league, stick to that.

Girardi - C - he hasnt been consistent at all, blows coverage at key times, very slow but decent shot. probably our biggest defensive asset to trade since hes not getting a $5 million paycheck. has upside but this years been pretty poor for him.

Rozsival - D - he just ****ing sucks. period. and on top of that hes taking up $5 million of our cap.

the day Rozsival is off the Rangers, i am seriously going to throw a party
Because of this, Staal has been one of our worst defense men in terms of actually playing defense. He doesn't have the offensive instinct that Gilroy or Del Zotto have. He may NEVER be that. And that is fine. He is one of the best shut down defense men in the Eastern Conference though. I strongly believe that. Utilizing Staal the way he is now makes his time on the ice less effective, he cannot contribute offensively nor on the PP and it makes him a defensive liability every time he is on the ice. He has had a poor season. It's as much his fault as it is Torts. He clearly is not ready for this offensive game. Don't pressure him. He is a defensive defense man. We already have two offense minded defense men (Gilroy and Del Zotto). We don't need three or four.

Fataldogg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 05:58 PM
  #105
MisterUnspoken
Vintage
 
MisterUnspoken's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Orlando, FL
Country: United States
Posts: 10,073
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to MisterUnspoken
Quote:
Originally Posted by Melrose_Jr. View Post
So put Sanguinetti in! Obviously, Torts isn't bashful about benching a guy or using 'Pack players, so what's stopping him from making the assessment? Tell me!

Trust me MU, I'm all for seeing who's capable of what. What I'm not for is making a bold declaration of instant success for an AHL'er who was literally blown away in camp 8 weeks ago by almost all of his competition.
Right he should but he can't. Points were made above that Rozsival is taking a spot on the roster because, even if we believe Sather is trying to move him, the Rangers want teams to see him play. If you demote him to the minors teams are definitely not going to want to take a flyer on someone who can't even beat out a rookie. It's not a great situation for anyone.

And further to your point, Sangs was not blown out of the water. He was quite good in the pre-season, but then again Gilroy & MDZ looked a bit better. However, a fact remains that we can't overlook. These rookies are now playing in a system they understand and will grow to be a major part of. I don't think this team can afford to let these 'pluggers' stick around much longer and should actively seek to unload them.

I don't necessarily think it will be 'instant' success. This isn't oatmeal we're talking about here. But I do believe in the not too distant future these kinds of moves pay off. My fear is that if Rozsival is kept, these younger talents will get fed up and leave the team for opportunities.

And I hope you aren't getting irritated, it's just conversation after all.

MisterUnspoken is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:11 PM
  #106
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
The main gripe about Sanguinetti's game is his speed/conditioning. He is an offensive dman who needs to work on defense but its his speed and conditioning level that really keeps him from making the team.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:32 PM
  #107
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,773
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
for comparison sake:

Rozsival is making the same as Gonchar, Carter, Fleury, Savard, Havlat, Gionta, Kovalev, Ribeiro, Thomas and Kubina.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
Why do so many people focus attention on what isnt there over what is?

You tell me.

__________________
SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:37 PM
  #108
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 22,666
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
The main gripe about Sanguinetti's game is his speed/conditioning. He is an offensive dman who needs to work on defense but its his speed and conditioning level that really keeps him from making the team.
Conditioning? Maybe. Speed? No. He's a strong skater and gets around just fine out there.

And it wasn't his defense that kept him off the team, it was his lack of offense during camp. I've been saying for a year now that his defensive issues are overblown and camp certainly backed that up.

__________________

It's just pain.
nyr2k2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:38 PM
  #109
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,773
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
The main gripe about Sanguinetti's game is his speed/conditioning. He is an offensive dman who needs to work on defense but its his speed and conditioning level that really keeps him from making the team.
Surely you have a link to a news source that says as much.

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:42 PM
  #110
Emptyvoid
Registered User
 
Emptyvoid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 3,349
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Surely you have a link to a news source that says as much.
Evidence from HF posters? You've been much here much too long to expect such a thing from us

Emptyvoid is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:46 PM
  #111
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Surely you have a link to a news source that says as much.

Well, since you asked....

Quote:
The Rangers, at 23, are close to opening-night ready. As for Bobby Sanguinetti, 21, being sent down to Hartford (AHL) today, here are some thoughts from John Tortorella.

"We wanted to get down in numbers," Tortorella said. "He had a really good camp. He, to me, is a guy that needs to keep playing. The difference in him going down versus the others (read: Michael Del Zotto, Matt Gilroy) is the speed of his game, the speed of his decision making, the speed he moves the puck. Everything about his game just needs to be quicker.

"He'll improve. (The AHL) is a great league. Will he be back? I don't have a crystal ball. He had a great attitude. He still has some work to do."

The Rangers don't seem sold on Sanguinetti and the whispers are they've shopped him already.
http://njmg.typepad.com/rangersblog/...itals-924.html

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:50 PM
  #112
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
You tell me.

Youd have a point if I was suggesting getting one of those players.


What is? Rozsival sucks, thats what is.

A for effort though, dude.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:54 PM
  #113
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 22,666
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
That's not saying he doesn't have speed. That's saying he needs to adjust to the speed of the game. Two completely different things.

nyr2k2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:56 PM
  #114
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
That's not saying he doesn't have speed. That's saying he needs to adjust to the speed of the game. Two completely different things.

Can you quote me on when exactly I said that?


Ill be around.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 06:58 PM
  #115
SingnBluesOnBroadway
Retired
 
SingnBluesOnBroadway's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: NYC
Country: United States
Posts: 29,773
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
Youd have a point if I was suggesting getting one of those players.


What is? Rozsival sucks, thats what is.

A for effort though, dude.
What are you suggesting then by posting that

SingnBluesOnBroadway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:00 PM
  #116
Gardner McKay
Hey Hey...
 
Gardner McKay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Abingdon, VA
Country: United States
Posts: 9,555
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by CHGoalie27 View Post
Perhaps you have never heard of Michael Del Zotto. He even plays for the same team as the above mentioned.

If Redden has been our best defenseman, we're in severe trouble.
Have you not watched this team for the past 10 games?

Yes Redden has been our best DEFENSIVE defenseman and yes that does mean were in severe trouble.

No knocks to Wade, because he has played great, not 6.5 mil worth, but he never will and Rangers fans need to let that go. Hes been above solid. Redden has been reliable, very reliable. Staal, Blowitzall and Girardi have been P U D R I D.

So we have a 6.5 million dollar defensive defenseman and two rookies leading our defense corps... Yes that spells trouble.

Gardner McKay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:02 PM
  #117
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
The main gripe about Sanguinetti's game is his speed/conditioning. He is an offensive dman who needs to work on defense but its his speed and conditioning level that really keeps him from making the team.

At what point does this become mistaken for, "hes slow"?


Its the exact same thing Tortorella said.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:05 PM
  #118
Gardner McKay
Hey Hey...
 
Gardner McKay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Abingdon, VA
Country: United States
Posts: 9,555
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
for comparison sake:

Rozsival is making the same as Gonchar, Carter, Fleury, Savard, Havlat, Gionta, Kovalev, Ribeiro, Thomas and Kubina.
And Gomez, (Brad)Richards, Campbell, Spezza, Smyth, Vanek, all make within 500k or more of Gabborik and who would you rather have?

We win in some places, we lose in some places, nothing is perfect.

Gardner McKay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:06 PM
  #119
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Tortorella has actually voiced this. His MAIN concern for every single AHL player, no matter who it is, is the speed of the game. He most recently said that about Parenteau.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:08 PM
  #120
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 22,666
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
The main gripe about Sanguinetti's game is his speed/conditioning. He is an offensive dman who needs to work on defense but its his speed and conditioning level that really keeps him from making the team.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
Can you quote me on when exactly I said that?


Ill be around.
Yeah... So when you said speed in your first post, you meant "ability to read the speed of the game and make faster decisions"? Right...

nyr2k2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:08 PM
  #121
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabborik View Post
And Gomez, (Brad)Richards, Campbell, Spezza, Smyth, Vanek, all make within 500k or more of Gabborik and who would you rather have?

We win in some places, we lose in some places, nothing is perfect.


I think the group that Rozsival is with theres a bigger gap of talent. Alot bigger.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:10 PM
  #122
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 22,666
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyMotto View Post
At what point does this become mistaken for, "hes slow"?


Its the exact same thing Tortorella said.
When you lump it with conditioning, it's pretty easy to come to the conclusion that you were talking about foot speed. Because ability to process the speed of the game has zero to do with conditioning.

nyr2k2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:10 PM
  #123
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Yeah... So when you said speed in your first post, you meant "ability to read the speed of the game and make faster decisions"? Right...

Its a re-wording of what Tortorella said.


There is a reason I put conditioning in there.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:12 PM
  #124
RS085*
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Brooklyn/Utica, NY
Posts: 653
vCash: 500
Conditioning doesnt equate to speed as much as it does endurance, stamina, etc.

He fell during training camp doing laps. That has nothing to do with speed. Some players just have it and some dont for the most part, I wouldnt say its entirely exclusive but thats neither here nor there.

RS085* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
11-19-2009, 07:13 PM
  #125
ThirdEye
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: New York
Country: Ukraine
Posts: 11,666
vCash: 500
I think Staal will eventually find out the extent of his offensive abilities and settle down. He's basically been going all out this season and getting burned.

I think he has some offense in him, just not as much as some would have hoped (including me). He's good through the neutral zone and has a very long reach so he can protect the puck. The problem is his puck handling is pretty much awful. If he can somehow improve on that even a little bit it will help a ton with those turnovers that we've been seeing. He can still be one of those defenseman that maybe won't put up many points but will still be a threat to pinch in and score on you occasionally.

That said, Del Zotto has the tools to surpass Staal very quickly. I think now that I've seen him for at least 20 games I think he could potentially be a #1 defenseman on this team in the future. His defense is not that bad, and he's shown willingness to learn. Every year his defense has gotten better. His offfensive instincts are already stellar. Even though he's cooled down a little bit, he's still VERY noticeable in every game. If the forwards weren't so damn snakebitten he could have 20+ points easily right now the way he's played.

ThirdEye is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:22 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.