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Latendresse traded to Wild for Benoit Pouliot, Part 3

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Old
11-27-2009, 12:54 PM
  #76
saints96
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who is latendresse?

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11-27-2009, 01:00 PM
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
I guess you didn't understand the moral of the story

It was more about Pouliots stats than Lats'. You see, I clearly recall in this very same hockey forum, a lot of people not overly excited about Getzlaf back at the draft, due to his clearly not world-beating numbers in junior. The consensus was, if he barely clings to ppg in junior, what's he going to do in the NHL? But I guess that's what happens when people go by stats and stats alone....the scouts that actually WATCHED Getzlaf play, saw past the numbers and picked up on the entire picture.

Pouliot, from the scouting reports I read, was clearly in the same boat. And Lats, judging from his junior numbers -> NHL efforts, would so far backup the scouts' assessment of him. Not to say that is always the way it works out, we've seen 7th rounders become stars, and top-5 picks become busts.....but I don't think it has much to do with their stats prior to being pro's.
Getzlaf is a playmaker who relies on having fitting teammates. Getzlaf's assists increased when he played with scoring linemates. Pouliot never showed to be much of a playmaker. His points total never increased much in his career unlike Getzlaf.

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11-27-2009, 01:02 PM
  #78
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I'll add to the Lats debate.

I've always been a staunch supporter of GL. This was based on a combination of glimpses of on-ice potential, and his ostensible good attitude and willingness to work on his weaknesses (powerskating lessons etc.). Now based on the reality of the situation (IMO, poor attitude based on his post-Habs comments), and if the rumours are true (not taking his powerskating lessons seriously, not listening to the coaches), then I change my opinion of him 360 degrees.

For GL to be a factor in this league, IMO he MUST work harder than most players (due to his skating deficiencies), and he MUST step it up in the hockey sense and awareness areas (to offset his skating deficiencies) and he MUST step it up in the physical side by avoiding the perimeter like the plague (so he can fully utilize his god-given size and strength).

If the reported attitude is true, all of the above are going to come slowly, if at all....because it appears to me his ego is bigger than his heart.

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11-27-2009, 01:03 PM
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
I change my opinion of him 360 degrees.
so your opinion remains the same?

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11-27-2009, 01:11 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
I don't want your 5 bucks
My 5bucks are worth more than your life.

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Old
11-27-2009, 01:11 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathletic View Post
Getzlaf is a playmaker who relies on having fitting teammates. Getzlaf's assists increased when he played with scoring linemates. Pouliot never showed to be much of a playmaker. His points total never increased much in his career unlike Getzlaf.
I don't understand your post. It appears he had the same key guy with him with the Hitmen from 2003-2004 to 2004-2005, yet his numbers when from 1.53ppg to 1.05ppg...and this in his final season, when he's playing against more and more 16 year olds as a grown man.

Stats don't mean everything and sometimes they really mean nothing...the only way to get the real story, is to watch the players play on a regular basis. That's all I'm saying.

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11-27-2009, 01:12 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Mathletic View Post
so your opinion remains the same?
LOL....good catch

My grade 8 math teacher is shaking his head....

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11-27-2009, 01:13 PM
  #83
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Latendresse is playing with Brodziack and Clutterbuck

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11-27-2009, 01:14 PM
  #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pam19 View Post
Agreed.
Stats only give you a limited idea.
I would think that work ethics and the ability to transpose to the next level skills showed at one level.

Daigle is one example.

Applying this to Leblanc who seems intelligent and is recognized for his work ethics everywhere he went makes me hopefull.

Still you can't ignore stats.
Of course not...but I'd take watching over reading any day when it comes to assessing a player .

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11-27-2009, 01:16 PM
  #85
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My 5bucks are worth more than your life.
Wth does that mean?

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11-27-2009, 01:17 PM
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
I don't understand your post. It appears he had the same key guy with him with the Hitmen from 2003-2004 to 2004-2005, yet his numbers when from 1.53ppg to 1.05ppg...and this in his final season, when he's playing against more and more 16 year olds as a grown man.

Stats don't mean everything and sometimes they really mean nothing...the only way to get the real story, is to watch the players play on a regular basis. That's all I'm saying.
even though I think there can be quite a bit to argue in favor of Getzlaf's favor, I'll give you that one for that season alone, but Ryan came back producing at full force from the get go in the NHL. Pouliot has had quite a few years to get himself going both in the AHL and NHL and hasn't done much yet, so I mean, yeah sure we could argue about junior stats and all but Pouliot is a pro now and he hasn't done much at the pro level.

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11-27-2009, 01:18 PM
  #87
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Latendresse is playing as we speak....

I hope he scores a goal just to see all his lovers spaz and foam at the mouth.

Or, maybe an injury after a "lats hit" (ie: hitting the boards at full speed - late check that never got its target) just to see all his bashers pee in their pants.

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11-27-2009, 01:19 PM
  #88
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Too bad they didn't give him 84.

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11-27-2009, 01:20 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pam19 View Post
Lets say top 10%.
There is 90 players on third line in the league.

Let's not extrapolate that Lats would have done 19 goals in 82 games.

Just give me 9 of those 90 third line players (10%) who has scored 15 goals or more last year.
Among those, how many can throw good hits?
And how many are 22 years old and less?

You want to prove your point.
But this is unfair.

For a third line player, Latendresse was among the best. This is why so many were seeing him on second line.
He would never have been content being on the third line and probably was the reason he regressed in the first place. He would have continued to regress because the reality of simply being a good third liner would have been more and more apparent, and he would have continued to pout that he's not getting chances in the top 6.

He scores in close quarters, excellent style with grinding linemates. When he's lined up with skillfull players, he tries to be a perimeter player but his lack of speed, puck control and decision making just can't keep up. The only hope he had in the top 6 was to drive the net, which he absolutely refuses to do. He hasn't accepted that its is the only way for him to be effective and to hide his defficiencies and unless he does, he'll never play up to his potential.

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Old
11-27-2009, 01:21 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
Latendresse is playing as we speak....

I hope he scores a goal just to see all his lovers spaz and foam at the mouth.

Or, maybe an injury after a "lats hit" (ie: hitting the boards at full speed - late check that never got its target) just to see all his bashers pee in their pants.
What if both happen at the same time?!

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Old
11-27-2009, 01:22 PM
  #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
Latendresse is playing as we speak....

I hope he scores a goal just to see all his lovers spaz and foam at the mouth.

Or, maybe an injury after a "lats hit" (ie: hitting the boards at full speed - late check that never got its target) just to see all his bashers pee in their pants.
I'll leave that small sample theater up to you

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Old
11-27-2009, 01:26 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathletic View Post
even though I think there can be quite a bit to argue in favor of Getzlaf's favor, I'll give you that one for that season alone, but Ryan came back producing at full force from the get go in the NHL. Pouliot has had quite a few years to get hiself going both in the AHL and NHL and hasn't done much yet, so I mean, yeah sure we could argue about junior stats and all but Pouliot is a pro now and he hasn't done much at the pro level.
Yessir...totally agree with that. At the risk of stating the obvious...he continues the same path, and therefore becomes a total bust....or who knows? Some guys do take time to realize their potential in the NHL, same goes for Lats...at least with Pouliot, skating is not an issue and that could be the biggest factor in how this turns out.

I'll be dead honest, I was really thrilled we picked AK over the likes of Getzlaf and Carter (neither tore it up stats-wise in Junior), because the consensus was AK had the makings of being a true offensive superstar, which we desperately needed...but hey, I learned my lesson in that regard.

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Old
11-27-2009, 01:27 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by David_99 View Post
What if both happen at the same time?!
Better chance of him scoring a goal while taking a nap

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Old
11-27-2009, 01:29 PM
  #94
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Sigh, are we going to follow him every game he plays?

What is this?

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11-27-2009, 01:30 PM
  #95
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Sigh, are we going to follow him every game he plays?

What is this?
Sigh...how is HIS 1ST GAME, be EVERY GAME?

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Old
11-27-2009, 01:32 PM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pam19 View Post
I don't about the truth and it is heresay.
I would like to see Latendresse answer.
For sure, he had a young baby and a separation.

For skating, it is not a matter of speed. It is first few steps, turning.

For getting to the net, there was so many time I saw him on the boards getting the puck that he could not be at two place at the same time...
I don't think he does not want to listen to the coaches.
He tends to go to the boards because he is good and it is very tough to get the puck from him (more this year I think).
So he probably goes there to help his confidence.

Two years ago, I was saying that the biggest problem of Latendressse is in the head, his confidence, maturity, who knows.
It will get there and when it does he will rise to the next level (top-6 and maybe top-3).

BTW, this move has hurted him and when he was talking, I was not feeling it was with him, he was repeating words he read over time.
A guy with confidence would have been much shorter.
Hey, pam19....all good points and it surely proves one thing for sure, we as fans don't really know all the facts, and best we can do is debate on what we do know, and theorize the rest.

What would worry me if I were a Minny fan, is if it's true that he was asked (and showed) to stand in front of the net in PP drills, and then would defiantly stand in the high slot on the next drill, then he's going to be a tough nut to crack...because that kind of behavior typically has deep roots. Plus it explains why he didn't get much PP time.

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11-27-2009, 01:32 PM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by totalrecall View Post
Sigh, are we going to follow him every game he plays?

What is this?
There have been about 750 thousand posts on Lats since he started playing 4 seasons ago... you think we're going to ignore his 1st game on a new team?

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11-27-2009, 01:33 PM
  #98
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Nolan with another goal

that guy's been good since joining the Wild

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11-27-2009, 01:34 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Mathletic View Post
Nolan with another goal

that guy's been good since joining the Wild
Exactly the type of guy I wish we picked up...

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11-27-2009, 01:40 PM
  #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
Stats don't mean everything and sometimes they really mean nothing...the only way to get the real story, is to watch the players play on a regular basis. That's all I'm saying.
If that article can reconcile you with stat guys

http://hockproject.blogspot.com/2009...remetrics.html

if the link isn't working, 5th article on the list

http://hockproject.blogspot.com/

Scouting vs Sabremetrics
The title should about say it all, ever since the whole statistics movement in baseball there has been a raging debate over the ideal way to find talent especially in the amateur ranks. The two sides couldn't be on more opposite side of the fence, in the way they think and the way they do things.

Having brief experience in both fields, I feel I can give a pro/con with a little more insight than others, if even at times it may be logical to those who haven't scouted or done any form of analysis. Of course this is for hockey, baseball people, exit stage left:

Quote:
Originally Posted by LesCanadiens View Post
Exactly the type of guy I wish we picked up...
but he can't skate



...

btw, didn't see the comment posted on the hok site before but there it is

Latendresse Traded for Pouliot
I have the strangest feeling people in Montreal are going to look at Beniot's fourth overall pick and get excited at the upside.

Make no mistake though, this was a bad trade, Pouliot barring the most miracle of breakouts, is inferior to Latendresse.

Gui has shown he can be a viable 6th forward at least, and his career ES numbers are great.

Pouliot has shown why some scouts should find a new day job.


Last edited by Mathletic: 11-27-2009 at 01:52 PM.
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