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Old
11-29-2009, 03:43 PM
  #26
Choice
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AXN View Post
Why did they give Callahan the A? I think they ruined him doing that. Should have went with a veteran player.
Agreed. I didn't like giving the A to such a young guy. But perhaps its just indicative of the overall lack of leadership on the squad, especially before Vinny P emerged.

Quote:
Originally Posted by eco's bones View Post

I'd be more interested in trading the following--Drury, Redden and Rozsival because of their contracts--though at least Redden has played fairly well this year. Kotalik and Higgins are tradeable as well. Brashear, Boyle and Voros really doesn't send much of a message IMO. Making 4th liners walk the plank because the 2nd and 3rd liners aren't producing.
What are you going to get for Drury, Redden or Rozsi? Their contracts make them basically untradeable , unless you are taking on another team's headache in return. Kotalik likewise, because he just signed a UFA deal. Higgins maybe, but his value is at an all time low.

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Old
11-29-2009, 03:43 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Choice View Post
I would consider trading Dubi at this point also.
Perhaps Dubinky and Rosival for Heatley or Girardi and Dubinsky for Kessel? Oh wait...

Maybe those deals dont sound too bad now

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11-29-2009, 03:45 PM
  #28
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I don't see Lisin or Boyle being moved.

They are both projects. Projects that cost us assets.

I'm pretty sure Sather knew this when he acquired them. They're not going to develop over-night. Unless a GM specifically requests one of these two players, I don't think they're getting moved.

There's no chance in hell Anisimov gets moved, unless he's packaged for something bigger.

Avery isn't going anywhere. No team is going to give up any assets for him when they could have had him for free a few months ago. (Free as in, no compensation)

Lundqvist and Gaborik are the NYR's. No chance in hell they are even considered in a trade.

P.A has no value. Voros and Brashear don't either.

No GM is going to take Redden's contract, regardless of how good he plays.

Staal, Del Zotto, and Gilroy are pretty untouchable. 50% of our defense for the next decade +.

I know a lot of people here are pretty bummed about Callahan and Dubinsky this year. I think a few set their expectations a little too high. Considering how Sather refused to part with Dubi for Heatley, and how Cally is already a co-captain, I really can't imagine them being moved. Or shopped.

Unless Prospal asks for something ridiculous, I see him being re-signed.

Unless Torts+Sather go to extreme measure to make Drury unhappy, I don't see him waiving his NMC.

That leaves Higgins, Kotalik, Girardi, and Rozsival.

There are a lot of teams in the league that can use a top-6 player. Higgins isn't a great option, but he's affordable, smart, has recorded multiple 20-goal season's, and is surprisingly under 30.

I think he can be a very handy addition to teams looking for an inexpensive rental during the deadline. Especially if it's a legitimate contender that's been hit with an injury.

Most of us have been hating on Kotalik lately. The only impressive aspect of his game, is his shot. 3 years @3M isn't a terrible contract. Again, I see him being considered during the deadline if Sather decides to invest in tomorrow. A team trading for Kotalik will only have him for a little over 2 years, which isn't brutal.

Rozsival.. Oh Rozsival.. Yes, Sather did a good job the way he structured his contract, but who the hell wants this guy and his 5M cap hit? What's the point of moving a bad salary, for another one, which is what will ultimately happen if he is moved.

We're not going to get lucky again, like we did with the Gomez trade.. If Sather wants some type of exceptional compensation for Rozy, he's going to have to sweeten the offer.

Girardi is another player I can see being moved. But I don't want to see another Tyutin type gamble. If he's part of a bigger move, I may think twice about letting him go though, and maybe having Sangs replace him.

Just for ****'s and giggles. . . . .

I traded Rozsival+Higgins to St. Louis for Brewer and a 2nd. Then traded Lisin+Brashear to the Kings for Frolov.. This is after I managed to dump Voros and some Hartford clutter for draft picks. It worked out pretty well.

Prospal-Dubinsky-Gaborik
Frolov-Drury-Callahan
Avery-Anisimov-Kotalik
Byers-Boyle-P.A

Staal-Gilroy
Brewer-Del Z
Redden-Girardi


Aside from Sanguinetti, and one day McDonaugh, which of our defensive prospects do you guys think have a realistic chance at being regular NHL players? I rarely get to see a Wolpack game.. I occasionally check our prospects thread, but reading about a player is a lot different from watching them play..

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11-29-2009, 03:50 PM
  #29
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Neither of those trades, BBG, are even remotely plausible.

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11-29-2009, 03:53 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LordStanleysMug View Post
Perhaps Dubinky and Rosival for Heatley or Girardi and Dubinsky for Kessel? Oh wait...

Maybe those deals dont sound too bad now
I was praying for a Dubinsky + trade for Kessel this offseason, but I just don't think there was any way to make it work under the cap.

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11-29-2009, 03:55 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
Neither of those trades, BBG, are even remotely plausible.


Believe me, I'm completely aware of this..

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Old
11-29-2009, 04:21 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Choice View Post
Agreed. I didn't like giving the A to such a young guy. But perhaps its just indicative of the overall lack of leadership on the squad, especially before Vinny P emerged.



What are you going to get for Drury, Redden or Rozsi? Their contracts make them basically untradeable , unless you are taking on another team's headache in return. Kotalik likewise, because he just signed a UFA deal. Higgins maybe, but his value is at an all time low.
It's just a personal opinion so take it for what it is worth but I don't see the Rangers ship getting righted until we manage to find a way to crawl away from Drury, Redden, Rozsival. Is it going to be easy to find takers? I don't believe so but hey the Rangers are paying GM Glen a lot of money. It's up to him to figure out a way.

The fact that those 3 are ordinary players still slotted into important roles is a good part of the reason why this team is so disfunctional. To be honest I'm wondering about the coaching a bit as well though as other teams have adjusted to the Rangers big start and the Rangers don't seem able or want to re-adjust. Be that as it may--the Rangers are slowly building a core of younger players and vets--Gaborik, Lundqvist, Staal, MDZ, Gilroy, Anisimov, Dubinsky--possibly Callahan, Girardi, Lisin and with Grachev, Sanguinetti, Stepan, McDonagh and a bunch of potential etc.'s on the way.

Anyway as I see it Dubinsky is the part of the future core of the team--which doesn't mean I think he's untradeable but I'd want something very serious in return.

As for Higgins I'm thinking that he's a guy you just let hit UFA at the end of the year. He hasn't shown enough to justify spending a lot of money on.

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Old
11-29-2009, 04:27 PM
  #33
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i think PA has some value for teams needing some offensive depth on the wing, he's proven to have some ability. At the same time, guys like him get waived all the time, I think we should keep him as a 14th forward for some insurance.

The following would never happen but I think it could improve the team

Higgins
for
Prucha + Lepisto

both forwards haven't been doing much for each of their teams, this gives nyr 500k in capspace and a #7 dman. Higgins has never played with the intensity that prucha displayed when he was here, nor has he been as willing to get his nose dirty in front of the net. Higgins has the size advantage, but have we seen him use it anyways? he's a soft player through and through.

I don't know much about lepisto's game but he was real good in the AHL the other season, i'm sure he has some upside. As we've seen, sangs is not ready for the NHL yet, we need someone to fill in on a spot basis and that person is probably not in Hartford at the moment.

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Old
11-29-2009, 05:23 PM
  #34
Gardner McKay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ColonialsHockey10 View Post
Pretty much every single forward on this team is playing themselves into a trade. We were all excited about this team because we were SUPPOSED to have some good depth. Unfortunately Drury, Higgins, Callahan, Avery and Dubsinky, all of whom were capable of scoring 20 goals or more this season, forgot how to play hockey. Remember when we all looked at Dubinsky as a budding top 6 power forward? What happened to that; he hasn't made a cheer-worthy hit or fought since 2008, and he thinks he can undress everyone on the ice. Callahan can barely stickhandle anymore and his strength on the puck is half of what it was last season. Frankly I don't think any team wants Avery or Drury, and there is no way we are getting good value for Dubinsky, Callahan or Higgins, all of whom look like 3rd/4th liners. Guys like Boyle, Brashear and Voros have no value, so including them in a trade is useless because they all have horrible cap hits for their productions anyway.

The only defenseman who I think has a probable chance of being traded (and he isn't playing himself into one unfortunately) is Girardi. Sather isn't trading Staal, MDZ, Sangs or Gilroy, and no team wants Redden because of his salary, Rosy either but he also is playing piss poor hockey on top of that.

Other teams fail because they simply have a bad lineup, but this team fails because nobody plays to their potential aside from a select few.

Why trade forwards when your fourth in the eastern conference for goals scored? and bottom 5 in goals against?

Why are you going to trade away offense, and **** that up, when the defense is what needs to be fixed?

People love to fix problems that dont exist, and ignore the giant gaping ones that are the cause of this teams lack of success

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Old
11-29-2009, 05:30 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Choice View Post
I was praying for a Dubinsky + trade for Kessel this offseason, but I just don't think there was any way to make it work under the cap.
Kessel would have been tough, but Heatley was completely doable. Rosival was going to Ottawa with Dubinsky and Zherdev. But, no Glen Sather, thinking like most HFBoards fanatics was too wooed by the "potential" that maybe Dubi could one day become a 60 point player. So in turn he turns down a legitimate offensive force, in hopes that maybe Dubinsky turns into something more than a third liner. Then, as consistent as clockwork, we're all sitting here wondering what pile of crap we can throw together for a short term offensive plug.

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Old
11-29-2009, 05:36 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Lundqvist4Vezina View Post
Let's just get rid of Higgins and call up Grachev.
Id rather have Grachev play a crap-load of minutes in HF than have him see under 10 here. It makes no sense (to me anyway) to bring him up at this point. Let him score his points and get confidence in the A, and then bring him up when he is ready. It really pains me when players get brought up too soon and lose potential. (or something, really was looking for a word, but couldn't find it)

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Old
11-29-2009, 05:56 PM
  #37
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I think its unlikely the trade will involve any elite or borderline elite players. Just a locker room shake up. A swap of our under performing guy for a trading partners under performing guy.

This is the next step. To see if the rest of these guys get the message

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Old
11-29-2009, 05:56 PM
  #38
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Is that Torts telling his GM get me some damn players or what? It's not like he can sit any of the D for thier bad play. But again I find it funny he mentions the two fowards who have played the least in these last two beatings. How are they part of the issue with thier limited ice time?

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Old
11-29-2009, 06:04 PM
  #39
ColonialsHockey10
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Originally Posted by Gabborik View Post
Why trade forwards when your fourth in the eastern conference for goals scored? and bottom 5 in goals against?

Why are you going to trade away offense, and **** that up, when the defense is what needs to be fixed?

People love to fix problems that dont exist, and ignore the giant gaping ones that are the cause of this teams lack of success
Wait, so you honestly can say without hesitation that you are happy with this team's offense? In my post I even explained the only defenseman with a realistic chance of being traded is Girardi. Nobody wants Redden or Rosy, and Sather would be dumb to trade MDZ, Gilroy or Staal, because all 3 have a realistic shot at being very good defensemen, with Staal and MDZ knocking at the door.

You can say with pride that you are happy to have Higgins, Drury, Callahan and Avery as secondary scoring? If you think my post is crazy, yours is even more ridiculous because you are satisfied with this team's offense outside of Gaborik. Doesn't need to be fixed? Give me a break. Have fun with Callahan on our first powerplay unit and Higgins/Avery anchoring our second unit. A stud defenseman doesn't make this team a contender, there are way to many ****ing problems.

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Old
11-29-2009, 06:15 PM
  #40
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This thread is a hoot. Z's replacement, he of the 3 yr / $3mm contract is so invisible no one even mentions him. No Del Zotto running the PP, we'd be regretting his paycheck even more than Captain Nyquil. I laughed at people penciling in Cally for 30 goals and Dreary for 25-30, Higgy for his 20-25 and crapping all over Z's production.

Oh, but they have so much character and leadership, blah, blah, blah. The fact is you don't let a top 6 forward walk away over essentially $900k. What we need is a new GM. And he can take that blow-hard punk of a coach with him. That dude needs to look in the mirror if he wants to figure out what the problem is. At least Renny used the "talent" he was given and played a system that covered a lot of weaknesses. You put a scoring machine on a team that lost their fare share of 2-1, 3-2 games and he'd be looking pretty good right now. Yeah, safe is death. Crock of $%&t.

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Old
11-29-2009, 06:24 PM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
I can think of a dozen other players I'd rather move before Higgins. At least he's getting scoring chances.
You jumped on me last night for calling him "worthless". Now there are a dozen players on the team worse than him? Not likely. Admit it he sucks.

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11-29-2009, 06:28 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Richter35 View Post
i think PA has some value for teams needing some offensive depth on the wing, he's proven to have some ability. At the same time, guys like him get waived all the time, I think we should keep him as a 14th forward for some insurance.

The following would never happen but I think it could improve the team

Higgins
for
Prucha + Lepisto

Bring back Prucha! </3

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Old
11-29-2009, 06:35 PM
  #43
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Bring in Kevin Bieska and give him the C ! We need a leader with fire and guts and the mindset to do some major damage in front of Hank . Having been a Ranger fan for over 30 years I don't think I have ever watched such a gutless team . I don't blame Avery or Brashear for not wanting to get involved every night...how many guys on the roster outside of Callahan would jump in to help them ? That is the whole frigging problem with our team and even worse is having 6 blueliners that have no guts...name me a team that ever had a group of 6 like that and ever made the playoffs ??? More team toughness would open up the ice for our Euro guys even more . It is such a no brainer that our team is too soft .

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Old
11-29-2009, 06:57 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Failure By Design View Post
You jumped on me last night for calling him "worthless". Now there are a dozen players on the team worse than him? Not likely. Admit it he sucks.
I can only name 2 forwards on this team generating more scoring chances than Higgins. If this sucky player is getting more opportunity's than his peers, what does that say about them?

Higgins was struggling real bad early in the season. He was terrible, actually. But his game has elevated significantly.

Right now the only problem with Higgins' game, is his lack of scoring. He's hitting the post, or getting robbed, or catching the puck on an angle, etc.. He's snake-bitten. But he's playing good hockey. He's forcing turnovers, winning 1-on-1 battles, and so on. He also has been close to terrific defensively.

How many other players on this roster can you say this about?

. . . .


. . . . . .


Instead, you whine about Lisin not getting ice-time. Lisin. We traded Korpikoski, for a one-dimensional player who does have offensive tools, but rarely displays them.

I've seen plenty of Envers kind. They put up a couple of sexy youtube highlights, and you guys ultimately fall in love with them because you think that's what Hockey is about.

If you honestly believe Higgins is worthless, then explain to me how he's averaged over 20G a year throughout his career? Don't hate him for not being a great 1st line player. Learn to appreciate the finer details in the game before calling a pretty good two-way NHL player, worthless.

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Old
11-29-2009, 07:00 PM
  #45
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send brashear to tor for orr back. :[

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Old
11-29-2009, 07:04 PM
  #46
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Voros
Brashear
Lisin
Boyle
Callahan
Drury
Kotalik

I think Higgins is outplaying every single one of these forwards, right now.

Avery has been good. Gaborik and Prospal have been great. Anisimov is playing close to what I expected.

If you're going to call out Higgins, there's a list of other players that deserve mention before him. Way before him.

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Old
11-29-2009, 08:35 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chariot View Post
The trade is coming. Its the logical next step. Probably a small one to shake up the room and remind these guys NY is a nice place to call home.

The player has to be at least servicable to his new team and not burden capwise, at least not long term.

The defense is thin as it is, likely a forward

Higgins
Lisin
Voros
Boyle

Expect an equally challenged player in return with the hopes of the "fresh start" helping both trading partners.


thoughts?
Trade guys when their value is low or non-existent. Not the best plan of action.

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Old
11-29-2009, 08:36 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Lundqvist4Vezina View Post
Let's just get rid of Higgins and call up Grachev.
If we traded Higgins, Kotalik and Prospal for picks and prospects, we could just move up PAP and Lisin into top-9 spots, and then either Byers or Voros can duke it out for a 4th line spot.

If Lisin or PAP fail after a couple of months, we can call up Grachev some time in March when he should be ready for a few weeks of NHL duty.

If both Voros and Byers fail, then Weise can take a shot at it in March.

The team would be weaker than as presently constructed, but both would make the playoffs and lose in the first round.

At least my way, we'd get some picks and prospects, and the kids would get a chance to prove themselves.

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Old
11-29-2009, 08:44 PM
  #49
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Trade guys when their value is low or non-existent. Not the best plan of action.
Except thats the way people seem to think around here. No one wants to move guys when their value is at its peak, i.e. Dubinsky, Staal, Callahan, now some are even adding Girardi to this list. Only once their values plummet, i.e. Higgins, Lisin, etc do we want to turn around and trade them for what we thought they were worth. Thats not the way it works. No team is going to take garbage for gold. People here, along with Glen Sather balked at the idea of giving up Dubinsky to get Heatley, or Giradri to get Kessel a few months ago. How stupid do they look now? Better question, how stupid will they look 2 years from now?


Last edited by realitystrikes*: 11-29-2009 at 08:50 PM.
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Old
11-29-2009, 08:46 PM
  #50
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Girardi and a lower pick could fetch us Pominville imo.

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