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Brooks Orpik wanted to be a Ranger

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Old
12-01-2009, 11:28 PM
  #26
BKBlackRanger
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wow..some ppl don't watch hockey..Lisin has regressed defensivley in his own zone since the foort injury....either he gets it now or he never will

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12-01-2009, 11:28 PM
  #27
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I really think he benches players because flat out doesn't like them. I mean its stupid if thats the case, but thats what I think.

flame away.

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12-01-2009, 11:29 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobgoblin Steve View Post
I really think he benches players because flat out doesn't like them. I mean its stupid if thats the case, but thats what I think.

flame away.
i feel like if this were the case he would never have given Avery ice time

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12-01-2009, 11:30 PM
  #29
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Didn't Orpik take a discount to go back to the Pens? I'm calling shenanigans here.

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12-01-2009, 11:31 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
im sure that he is a favorite...seems like a good kid

but where was this article you read?

i highly doubt that's the case and until i see something other than wild speculation, im going to assume its not true

honestly, i cant see professional athletes pissing and moaning because they didnt totally agree with the coach benching their buddy
I read it over on the Hockey Rodent messageboard. In fact, it may have been Squishy who said it, and she has a pretty good handle on the Russian players on the team. I haven't seen her around here in awhile but perhaps she could shed some insight on it.

I doubt that the players were openly whining about Lisin's benching, but it is an interesting motivational tactic by Torts to say the least.

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12-01-2009, 11:32 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by theMessiah1194 View Post
Not signing Orpik was a mistake.

I love Orpik.

Hindsights 20/20
He was a major player in winning the cup last year, crushed everyone crossing the blueline and wore down opponents.

Wish we had somebody like that

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Old
12-01-2009, 11:34 PM
  #32
mullichicken25
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
I read it over on the Hockey Rodent messageboard. In fact, it may have been Squishy who said it, and she has a pretty good handle on the Russian players on the team. I haven't seen her around here in awhile but perhaps she could shed some insight on it.

I doubt that the players were openly whining about Lisin's benching, but it is an interesting motivational tactic by Torts to say the least.
certainlly is....but theres no basis for brooks to use this to imply any sort of "revolution" or even dislike brewing amongst the team against torts

its just him being a sensationalist....again

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12-02-2009, 12:01 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
This team has needed a player like Orpick. Rather than having one, the player we've needed helped sweep us in a home-and-home this week.

Sounds like a regret of the present to me.
This... we really need someone to stand up for players like Gaborik and clear out for Lundqvuist and he is exactly what we need.

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Old
12-02-2009, 12:07 AM
  #34
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Originally Posted by LyNX27 View Post
This... we really need someone to stand up for players like Gaborik and clear out for Lundqvuist and he is exactly what we need.
Hoping McDonagh becomes someone who can play like that. I still wish the Rangers drafted Petrecki, I really think he is going to be a very intimidating, hard-hitting, gritty d-man. It also helps that I played against him.

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Old
12-02-2009, 12:42 AM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Dagoon44 View Post
I Hate to say I told you so but I did, Torts is a bully and a liar. He is outdated and the NHL has passed him by. The Rangers are in a free fall and missing the playoff. WE have a GM in a time warp and a coach that is a a-hole this is worse then it ever was under Renney
I have to agree. They still only have one guy who scores and now they can't play defense.

Rennys Rangers > Torts Rangers

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12-02-2009, 02:49 AM
  #36
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Larry Brooks is incorrect. Orpik turned down more money from the Rangers to re-sign with Pittsburgh. Just Larry Brooks being Larry Brooks....trying to make a story out of nothing.

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12-02-2009, 02:54 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Draft Guru View Post
Larry Brooks is incorrect. Orpik turned down more money from the Rangers to re-sign with Pittsburgh. Just Larry Brooks being Larry Brooks....trying to make a story out of nothing.
Was about to post this.

As much as Sather deserves blame, seeing Brooksy resorting to revisionist history is just sad IMO.

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12-02-2009, 03:56 AM
  #38
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I haven't been a huge fan of Tortorella.

Renney is a far better coach then Tortorella is.

Renney was tactical, smart, and could reach players on an individual basis.

Tortorella is like an abusive father. Eventually the players will tune him out, if they haven't started already.

I still have yet to see Tortorella bench any of his pets. Callahan hasn't produced, he's bullet proof. Higgins hasn't produced, he's bullet proof. Drury, Staal, Girardi...

At points in time all of those players have been terrible.

And, I have my disagreements with Dagoon, and Brooks, but they are people who have connections with the team. If they hear things I would tend to at least listen.

It wouldn't surprise me at all if Lundqvist couldn't stand Tortorella.

People here like to put blame on Henrik, as if he weren't human.

The guy faces probably more quality scoring chances then any goaltender in the league, on top of having no physical support to defend him when he is roughed up, and no scoring help. He is out there ALONE with Gaborik and Prospal. Its 3 vs a bench full of opponents every game.

Renney employed a system that gave the team a chance to win, because they would at least try to limit the damage against.

Tortorella has no concept of the defensive side of the game, and he doesn't have a roster good enough to play the system he wants. He doesn't get it and refuses to adapt.

He's a stubborn man.

And I actually agree with Dagoon, he's a bully.

Why is he a bully? Because he has no qualms about benching guys who are trying to establish themselves. However he won't bench any of his pet projects regardless how poorly they play or how little they produce.

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Old
12-02-2009, 04:58 AM
  #39
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Rangers invested $11.5 million of cap space on Redden and Rozsival on 7/1/08. Rozsival re-signed at around 4pm on the July 1. Redden signed that night at around 7pm/8pm.

The next day Tyutin was traded for Zherdev.

On the 3rd,the Rangers signed Markus Naslund for a $4 million cap hit.

After that signing,the Rangers were tapped out. They needed a winger to replace Jagr more than another defenseman.

Kalinin and Mara were signed for a combined $4 million.

After signing the two big contracts on defense,there wasn't any money for another D when they needed a forward.

How and with what (free cable,internet and phone service for the next 50 years?)were they going to pay Orpik after signing Redden and Rozsival with their need at forward?

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Old
12-02-2009, 04:58 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puckhead71 View Post
At that time I remember Sather offering a contract to Orpik and he turned it down for less money to stay in Pittsburgh. And after he re-signed in Pittsburgh, that is when Glen gave an extension to Rozsival...

I could be wrong but I'm not sure how accurate this article by LB is.
I think the Rangers beat writer knows more about the situation.

Good article by Brooks, Torts decisions are just puzzling and confusing and he just named a couple of the many in the last two weeks.

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Old
12-02-2009, 05:38 AM
  #41
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Last year, everyone is b1tching and moaning that there wasn't any accountability and Renney refused to bench anyone. This year, a guy like Lisin (who, btw, doesn't have a point in something like 12 games AND has been woeful defensively) is benched and made an example of and now everyone is b1tching that Torts is mean and plays favorites? What? Who better than Lisin to bench *especially* if he's popular amongst his teammates? This team has been stinking out the joint for well over a month. You can say whatever you want about Callahan, Higgins, and Drury and their hands of stone this year, but at least they bring it every shift and are decent two way players. Lisin, Kotalik, Brashear, etc... deserve to be benched and don't give me this "losing the team" crap when the team isn't winning anyway. Clearly, the players that comprise this team aren't likely to be mistaken for a Cup contender just yet, but if we don't get GOALS from our 2nd and 3rd lines then we're going to lose no matter what Torts does.

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Old
12-02-2009, 06:02 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RangerBoy View Post
Rangers invested $11.5 million of cap space on Redden and Rozsival on 7/1/08. Rozsival re-signed at around 4pm on the July 1. Redden signed that night at around 7pm/8pm.

The next day Tyutin was traded for Zherdev.

On the 3rd,the Rangers signed Markus Naslund for a $4 million cap hit.

After that signing,the Rangers were tapped out. They needed a winger to replace Jagr more than another defenseman.

Kalinin and Mara were signed for a combined $4 million.

After signing the two big contracts on defense,there wasn't any money for another D when they needed a forward.

How and with what (free cable,internet and phone service for the next 50 years?)were they going to pay Orpik after signing Redden and Rozsival with their need at forward?
I remember reading up TSN on july 1st and i'm fairly certain redden signed first or at least earlier than that (around 3-4pm)

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Old
12-02-2009, 06:18 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Dagoon44 View Post
I Hate to say I told you so but I did, Torts is a bully and a liar. He is outdated and the NHL has passed him by. The Rangers are in a free fall and missing the playoff. WE have a GM in a time warp and a coach that is a a-hole this is worse then it ever was under Renney

I really doubt that, you dont get passed so quickly. He doesnt have right personell to play his style right now that's all. Give him more time with this group (plus additions) and lets judge him in say 12 months time.

Plus any team that has 3 players that aren't worth much YET take up 1/3 of team's salary cap (Redden, Drury and Rozsival) isn't going anywhere until the problem is rectified.

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Old
12-02-2009, 06:27 AM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
What I remember of the story, and perhaps digging up some of our old threads on the Pens board can help find the exact situation that went down, Orpik was all but ready to leave for "another team" when he received a few calls from Crosby and a few of the other guys on the team that pleaded with Orpik to stay in Pittsburgh. There were rumors that the other team was San Jose, but most of us on the board believed it was the Rangers...probably because of all of the rumored interest on Orpik's part for joining the Blueshirts.

That was the summer Shero was trying to re-sign Hossa. Had Hossa re-signed, I think Orpik would have been sacrificed...and he probably would have landed either in New York or San Jose--depending on what rumor you believe.

July 1 is a total domino effect every year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by There's only one 66 View Post
This is a silly story from Larry Brooks. As much as I enjoy blame Sather commentary, this one is groundless.

Orpik is on record saying he refused more money from the Rangers (and Buffalo, it is thought) to sign with the Pens. I believe it is common knowledge here also, that Rangers were bidders.
Larry has since then been of the mind that it was unbelievable that Rangers didn't get this UFA. As if the perks for Orpik in re-signing with a team stacked on talent that he'd just gone to the cup final with weren't obvious. The team that drafted him, even.
This is exactly the story that I remember from back then. In fact, I thought it was Brooks that reported this version the during the opening of free agency. It seemed like the Rangers were about to announce a press conference and then the word was spreading that Crosby got involved with calls to Orpik. I like Brooks but he is writing more fiction than fact with this one.

I think its tough to fault Sather here. As much as we could really use Orpik, he would have come at a much higher price than the $3.8m the Pens are giving... I think it would've been too high for another Colin White. Sather tried to get Neil but he had second thoughts and decided to stay with the only NHL he has known. It's not like Glen ignored the lack of toughness over the years, it's just that he keeps picking the guys with great character and integrity... so much so that they decide to stay with their clubs for discounts.

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Old
12-02-2009, 06:55 AM
  #45
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Originally Posted by dedalus View Post
But it's not hindsight if you were saying during the summer, "We desperately need a guy like this."

That's foresight, foresight that Sather either lacked or couldn't/wouldn't operate on.
I remeber LB wrote about how the Rangers needed to sign Orpik.

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12-02-2009, 06:57 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
we know nothing of the terms that Orpik wanted to come to new york

and the bolded part is nothing short of pure speculation

this article is brooks sensationalism at its best (or worst?)

i love how so much of journalism is "just write anything, who gives a **** about details and credibility"
It's not speculation if several players told him so.

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12-02-2009, 07:14 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
I don't think Uncle Larry is making this one up.
Larry IS making it up, or else he'd say that he was told that it pissed the players off. If someone in the locker room actually gave him that info then Brooks wouldn't waste time writing his article as speculation, which he did. Even if the player didn't want to be identified, Brooks would do something like "rumors in the locker room are..."

People forget that while Brooks sometimes has great information (he's gotten a lot more accurate recently...must have found someone willing to leak him information) he still writes for a ****** rumor mongering "newspaper" and he blatantly will make **** up and write incendiary articles when he doesn't have straight news to report. He has ALWAYS done this and people can't seem to figure out how to separate his good info from his ********.

Also, if Lundqvist has a beef with Tortorella then Lundqvist can get ****ed. Tortorella has handled him with kid gloves to the media, has given him just as many games as he would have gotten under Renney, so unless he's yelling at him non stop when practice is over or between periods, then Lundqvist doesn't have **** to complain about.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
It's not speculation if several players told him so.
Except he didn't say several players told him so!

edit: and you know what, **** these players if they're getting whiny about ****. They're the ones failing to put the puck in the net, losing battles along the boards every game, coughing up the puck in the neutral zone over and over, and failing to give their defense and goaltender any support. The coaching staff can do everything perfectly but if the players play a perimeter game all the time and get out battled for pucks along the boards EVERY SINGLE GAME, then you know what, the blame falls on the players.

So many players are underachieving and do not have a good reason to be doing so. It's their own fault at this point and I'm tired of the idea that a magical coaching change will fix everything. Is that going to make Higgins hit the net? Is it going to make Callahan stop losing every battle for the puck and make him stop being nearly invisible on the ice?

The players deserve a huge amount of blame in this because for the most part they simply aren't living up to their contracts in any way at all.

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Old
12-02-2009, 08:00 AM
  #48
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this whole torts thing is real. hes making silly attempts to make examples out of players when its him who needs to make changes.

he simply needs to look in the mirror and realize that as much as he wants his players to play his system, if he doesnt have the horses to do so, he needs to make adjustments and so far, he has not done that.

theres something up with him and hank. something isnt right with him this season beyond his glove hand. im not so sure the torts iron fist method is playing so well on broadway.

and its not like its only 1 or 2 players who are out of step with his system or are not producing. its every forward on the team not named prospal or gaborik. i mean what good does it do benching lisin or boyle or playing kotes 3 minutes total last game ? they arent the only offenders or under performers. in fact, the +/- of most of the forwards is abysmal signaling a lack of defensive awareness way beyond just lisin, boyle and kotalik.

and whats with not playing ales on the pp ? i mean, does torts prefer losing a game while making his silly statement to his team over winning with the right players on the ice ?? weird.

if torts is to apply his discipline to all players, he would bench everyone. he wont. im sure his faves like callahan (-6 8 points in 27 g), drury (-7 9/22 g) higgins (-10 7/26 g ) and pap (-4 6/10 g) are all do to be sat soon right ?

and what about dressing lisin and then sitting him the entire game. thats the kind of stuff i would expect for a player whos a discipline problem or perhaps takes too many bad penalties or plays like..........say... mike rozy. with lisin playing "bad" he sits an entire game at the end of the bench and is made a fool of by his coach while mike rozy plays like stevie wonder and is rewarded with MORE ice time and pp time at that. i still cannot believe the decision mike made on that 2 on 2 with rupp. i mean, a high school dman would have played the man with the puck better than mike did.

and what of drury ? where has he been this whole losing streak. lsitening to him after the games is dreadful. the guy seems like hes on qualudes. i mean is there a less dynamic leader in sports ? is there? talk about the anti- messier.

yeah torts, way to go. nothing like sending a clear message to your players.

look in the mirror coach and you may just see whos responsible for this teams failures.

edit: and before the regular bashers go off on what i wrote, here this. the players play, the coaches coach. i know that. the teamm needs to score a few goals and hank needs to make a few more glove saves, thats clear but.......

how is it all of the forwards, and i mean every one of them other than vinny and gabs, are suking horse at the same time ??

is it coincidence or is it something else ?


Last edited by offdacrossbar: 12-02-2009 at 08:06 AM.
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Old
12-02-2009, 08:18 AM
  #49
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Would have been nice to have Orpik on the blueline. No doubt about that. But when you factor in the cost of free agency, it could have ended up being another silly overpayment by Sather.

He probably would have gotten somewhere in the neighborhood of Komisarek's deal. Personally, I think that's far too much for either player.

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Old
12-02-2009, 08:21 AM
  #50
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wow..some ppl don't watch hockey..Lisin has regressed defensivley in his own zone since the foort injury....either he gets it now or he never will
yes true. some people dont watch hockey.

please explain something. if lisin has "regressed" what would you call what these guys have done ?

higgins -10
cally -6
drury -7

waiting........

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