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Put OReilly and Hornqvist on scoring lines

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Old
12-04-2009, 04:38 PM
  #1
lightning_legwand*
 
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Put OReilly and Hornqvist on scoring lines

Maybe more Cal than Patric because I know Patric has been struggling as of late after a great start to the season.

But I mean how about O'Reilly?? Put this guy on a top line and I have a gut feeling he would produce, not this crap! http://blogs.tennessean.com/predator...p-fourth-line/


How can he perform with no major talent around him, he is only a rookie, lol


Any thoguhts?

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12-04-2009, 04:50 PM
  #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightning_legwand View Post
Maybe more Cal than Patric because I know Patric has been struggling as of late after a great start to the season.

But I mean how about O'Reilly?? Put this guy on a top line and I have a gut feeling he would produce, not this crap! http://blogs.tennessean.com/predator...p-fourth-line/


How can he perform with no major talent around him, he is only a rookie, lol


Any thoguhts?
Trotz gives Jones /O’Reilly/Hornqvist three shifts, says "...this isn't working..." and sends somebody down to MIL tomorrow because they "weren't producing". Wait a minute, haven't you heard this before?

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12-04-2009, 07:04 PM
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Fortheloveofthegame
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightning_legwand View Post
Maybe more Cal than Patric because I know Patric has been struggling as of late after a great start to the season.

But I mean how about O'Reilly?? Put this guy on a top line and I have a gut feeling he would produce, not this crap! http://blogs.tennessean.com/predator...p-fourth-line/


How can he perform with no major talent around him, he is only a rookie, lol


Any thoguhts?
they tried that in pre season and he did not produce. He will have to work his way up to that

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12-05-2009, 01:44 AM
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hahahahaha, preseason?? I wish that didnt even exist!! Preseason is nothing. its not even a practice. teams dont play serious hockey then.

Example,

Stalberg led leafs in points and had 6 preseason goals, but is now playing in AHL for a while now! lol

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12-05-2009, 02:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Preds Partisan View Post
Trotz gives Jones /O’Reilly/Hornqvist three shifts, says "...this isn't working..." and sends somebody down to MIL
It's not like we have anybody super talented to put those guys with. The top line is the top line, they don't belong there. The second line is supposed to shut down top lines, they don't belong there either.

So the only room is the third line with Erat.

I guess Trotz has a method to his madness, because both lines of Erat-Goc-Tootoo and Jones-O'Reilly-Hornqvist seemed to play well.

Hornqvist is the one I thought deserved ice time on a more skilled line. But maybe with O'Reilly that is a skill line now, and Jones to play the beefier drive to the net role. It may continue to work and be the best spot for all three players. But sure, they still get less minutes than the top two lines.

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12-06-2009, 07:42 AM
  #6
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Sully-Arnott-Dumont
Ward-Legwand-Hornqvist
Tootoo-O'reilly-Erat
Smitty-Goc-Jones

Golden, IMO. Scratch Belak EVERY NIGHT, except when we need a heavyweight. All four lines have a decent mix of speed, grit, playmaking and finishing ability. SAD and WLH get majority of ice time with TOE getting a decent amount. SGJ when we need a jump and/or a break for top nine.

Swap Wilson with O'reilly and/or Erat for Horns if not producing. Have the option of Jones back to Mil for Santo, Thuressan or really anyone for that matter and moving Tootoo with 3rd and 4th line time, ie if Santo was called back up. Could be way off, but I like how it looks on paper.

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12-07-2009, 11:04 AM
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Um, they ARE on a scoring line? Together...

Leggy's line is our shut down line and Goc, Tootoo, and Erat is our other shut down line.


So, uh, what do you want? Them to each get one more even strength shift on the ice per game?

O wait, they haven't produced, so who do you want to kick off a scoring line that has produced? Sully? Arnott? JP? Leggy? Erat? Ward? Yeah...

Tell them to start scoring against other team's 3rd and 4th line guys, THEN they can play against 1st and 2nd line guys on other teams.

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12-07-2009, 03:50 PM
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David Singleton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by utmfisher19 View Post
Um, they ARE on a scoring line? Together...

Leggy's line is our shut down line and Goc, Tootoo, and Erat is our other shut down line.


So, uh, what do you want? Them to each get one more even strength shift on the ice per game?

O wait, they haven't produced, so who do you want to kick off a scoring line that has produced? Sully? Arnott? JP? Leggy? Erat? Ward? Yeah...

Tell them to start scoring against other team's 3rd and 4th line guys, THEN they can play against 1st and 2nd line guys on other teams.
UTM, I've tried to post on this discussion point (not all in this thread) three for four times now and end up losing everything with some server problem.

I don't think what you are suggesting is reasonable.

This team is going to ice three rookies/inexperienced forwards. They are all skilled/offensive forwards. Putting them all on one line does not provide them any mentorship on the ice and stunts their development. It also leads Trotz to shorten the bench too much thereby overworking his veterans (for results see the Calgary and Minnesota games) and stunting their development even more.

Trotz just has to use the rookies better. Those are his assets right now. He's got to get more production from them.

Sure the SAD line produces really well for spurts. It can also go a long time without any production becoming a defensive liability on the ice. You've been around for a long time, that's not new to you.

Is it better to break up the veterans (including the SAD line) if you get three offensive lines plus a fourth energy line that you can consistenly roll and get production from? Or is better to hide the rookies, play the veterans as much as you can even if you get several games with mental lapses or players just too tired to move their feet? The guys making these mistakes out there are just too good for the level of mistakes we are seeing. It's a lack of focus.

If we're going to live with some level of mistakes, I prefer the former. Long term, I think you would see less streakiness and more energy late in the season and in the playoffs.

I'm not saying you can't shorten the bench on occasion- even occassionally for an entire game. Right now, however, you are seeing the young kids thrown together and told to produce. Yes it might be against an opposing team's third line, but that often includes really savvy veterans like a Kirk Maltby, Mike Grier, etc. (Edited to add) They are talented enough to produce at times, but not as consistently as they most likely would when playing with more experienced skill players (see Patric Hornqvist).

Mike Russo of the Minnesota Star Tribune wrote an article after interviewing Trotz and J.P. Dumont. I took issue with some of the things Trotz said.

Thanks.

David Singleton
HockeyIndependent.com


Last edited by David Singleton: 12-07-2009 at 04:28 PM.
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Old
12-07-2009, 04:09 PM
  #9
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I'm with utm..

I don't have the time to analyze other teams, but I imagine it's not commonplace to put a rookie on the top 2 lines. (Let's leave superstars out of the equation, cause we don't have any.) I can't think of any team we play on a regular basis where that is true. (well, just thought of Tyler Myers for Buffalo. an exceptional d man and a rookie)

My main beef with Trotz is using Belak. I think there is no place on the team for someone who is past his prime in fighting this year and appears to be phoning it in. The fight in Minny was a joke.
We've got to roll 4 lines to have a chance. And I like the energy of that line, even if they don't score. And I think they will given time.

Frankly, I'm worried that Weber is playing hurt.

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Old
12-09-2009, 04:20 PM
  #10
Federko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by utmfisher19 View Post
Um, they ARE on a scoring line? Together...

Leggy's line is our shut down line and Goc, Tootoo, and Erat is our other shut down line.


So, uh, what do you want? Them to each get one more even strength shift on the ice per game?

O wait, they haven't produced, so who do you want to kick off a scoring line that has produced? Sully? Arnott? JP? Leggy? Erat? Ward? Yeah...

Tell them to start scoring against other team's 3rd and 4th line guys, THEN they can play against 1st and 2nd line guys on other teams.
I'm with you too UTM.

Main Example:
When Getzlaf, Perry and Ryan were coming up with the Ducks --Carlyle made them EARN there spots. This means..they were 4th liners..then 3rd liners..and so on..After they had proven themselves the Ducks parted ways with the likes of Andy MacDonald and Joffrey Lupul, etc.

It's not a bad strategy..to build build build..win...firesale..repeat. The Preds top six is too valuable to the team (which is now a top 10 team in the league) to start putting kids on the first two lines? That would be called "rushing the development".

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