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Cole (out 2-3 weeks) and Larose (out 3-4 weeks) placed on IR. Dwyer, Tlusty recalled

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Old
12-13-2009, 02:40 PM
  #76
DaveG
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Originally Posted by StormCast View Post
Everybody has switched lines constantly and the same was true for LaRose much of last year. Your line of reasoning is really just a LaRose apologist' spin and it's pretty obvious. It's ok to criticize one of your favorite players, it really is.

He isn't be singled out, as plenty of guys are getting blasted. My point is that he shouldn't get a free pass because he is a fan favorite and has a nice story in making the NHL. Paint it any color you want, he hasn't been good this year. Period.
Really I'm trying to think of a player, other then Cam, who HASN'T been torpedoed over his play this season. I really can't come up with any, even Gleason, Ruutu and Whitney have taken their fair share of shots. Biggest difference is that they've done enough to make up for their deficiencies in other areas, whereas the ones that people are labeling as whipping boys (Brindy, A Ward and LaRose) simply haven't.

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12-13-2009, 02:43 PM
  #77
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^kostopolous?

He is adequately doing his job IMO

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12-13-2009, 02:49 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Kaberlay View Post
^kostopolous?

He is adequately doing his job IMO
Even then there were a lot of people early in the season saying "why did we bring this guy in?". Personally I've liked the way he has played since game 1 here, he's a grinder that actually has some skill and can be used on the PK. His play is about right for what he makes.

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12-13-2009, 02:53 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by DaveG View Post
Even then there were a lot of people early in the season saying "why did we bring this guy in?". Personally I've liked the way he has played since game 1 here, he's a grinder that actually has some skill and can be used on the PK. His play is about right for what he makes.
those people has unrealistic expectations or they didnt know what they were watching....sorry if it sounds harsh but its true

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12-13-2009, 03:43 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by StormCast View Post
Everybody has switched lines constantly and the same was true for LaRose much of last year. Your line of reasoning is really just a LaRose apologist's spin and it's pretty obvious. It's ok to criticize one of your favorite players, it really is.

He isn't be singled out, as plenty of guys are getting blasted. My point is that he shouldn't get a free pass because he is a fan favorite and has a nice story in making the NHL. Paint it any color you want, he hasn't been good this year. Period.
Never said he was playing well this year nor have I seen anyone give him a "free pass". Everyone is playing below expectations (Yeah, even the guys with low ones), and LaRose is no different.

I'm simply saying if you're going to go after LaRose, his point totals compared to his contract is an odd thing to go after, since everyone (sans a select few in the organization) knows he's not going to put up a lot of points.

Past that, he's an energy guy and there's been little change in that.

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12-13-2009, 04:08 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
Never said he was playing well this year nor have I seen anyone give him a "free pass".
That prior excuse-fest post of yours had "free pass" written all over it.

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12-13-2009, 04:45 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
Never said he was playing well this year nor have I seen anyone give him a "free pass".
But this is what started it all:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
Did anyone catch John saying LaRose has been playing with this injury for 2 weeks now? Might explain why he's not been as noticeable lately.
You're offering his injury as a free pass for "why he's not been as noticeable lately"...I will acknowledge the "might explain" portion of the statement, however. Secondly, the "lately" part serves to say that his play recently is different than what we saw earlier in the year.

I'm sure it was just off-hand and not full of deep reflection on LaRose's problem(s), but it does directly contradict the first quote above.

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12-13-2009, 05:04 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geehaad View Post
But this is what started it all:



You're offering his injury as a free pass for "why he's not been as noticeable lately"...I will acknowledge the "might explain" portion of the statement, however. Secondly, the "lately" part serves to say that his play recently is different than what we saw earlier in the year.

I'm sure it was just off-hand and not full of deep reflection on LaRose's problem(s), but it does directly contradict the first quote above.
Mostly it was a reflection of LaRose's recent play before sitting out in the injury.

LaRose is typically very noticeable out there, at least in my opinion. I believe he stands out mostly because his skating stance is different than most other players that I've seen. He takes quick strides that seem shorter than the others on our team. That, plus he's typically the forechecking forward, makes it easy to spot him during the game or on TV.

And normally, he's got that stride and he'll bang opponents around on the forecheck (even if he does bounce off most of the time). His play recently has turned away from that, turning back toward the puck rather than finishing a check.

So (to sum it up and repeat myself), the injury might explain why he's been less noticeable lately.

As for the free pass thing, you can hardly say he's getting a free pass if he's being torpedoed for his play.

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Old
12-13-2009, 05:26 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by eerodynamic View Post
those people has unrealistic expectations or they didnt know what they were watching....sorry if it sounds harsh but its true
Well then lump me in with those people. Kostopoulos coasted through his first 20 games here with the security of a new contract. His hustle was gone. I have liked what I have seen in him turning his game around lately, but it wasn't there to start the season. He was terrible early.

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12-13-2009, 06:24 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Vagrant View Post
Well then lump me in with those people. Kostopoulos coasted through his first 20 games here with the security of a new contract. His hustle was gone. I have liked what I have seen in him turning his game around lately, but it wasn't there to start the season. He was terrible early.
the first 20 games??? that is a gross overstatement and its simply not true. I would agree with the first 5 or 6 games but I personally think he gets a pass on those considering he was learning a new system, a new place to live, he was playing with 2non existent teammates who were putting forth the worst effort on the team, and he had virtually no preseason/in-game time to get used to Maurice and how he was going to be used. He should have been playing 10 minutes plus per game after about the 5 game mark but Maurice was content to ride the underachieving top 9, especially since Yelle(who wasnt worth the roster spot at the time) was centering the 4th line. Hell some nights he had Conboy on his opposite wing.

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Old
12-13-2009, 07:57 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by eerodynamic View Post
the first 20 games??? that is a gross overstatement and its simply not true. I would agree with the first 5 or 6 games but I personally think he gets a pass on those considering he was learning a new system, a new place to live, he was playing with 2non existent teammates who were putting forth the worst effort on the team, and he had virtually no preseason/in-game time to get used to Maurice and how he was going to be used. He should have been playing 10 minutes plus per game after about the 5 game mark but Maurice was content to ride the underachieving top 9, especially since Yelle(who wasnt worth the roster spot at the time) was centering the 4th line. Hell some nights he had Conboy on his opposite wing.
I'm not sure what you're getting at when you say "its simply not true"... Just because you don't see it the same way means you are right???

I actually agree with Vagrant. I didn't watch TK much before he came here, but had heard how much of a fan favorite he was and how hard he worked. I didn't see any of that until recently. Yes, he had some adjustments to make, but that's not much of an excuse to not bust your butt when you're on the ice. Thats what we got him for and I like what I've been seeing out of him now...

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Old
12-13-2009, 08:11 PM
  #87
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I thought TK hustled enough, he was just never on the ice, so there wasn't much to notice.

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12-13-2009, 08:24 PM
  #88
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If Brindy retire in the end of season, i'll be happy to see 4th like to look like Blanchard- Angelidis- Kostopoulos next season. What a awesome energy and shutdown line.

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12-13-2009, 09:12 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by geehaad View Post
I thought TK hustled enough, he was just never on the ice, so there wasn't much to notice.
i fully agree and that was my point.

I guess i shouldnt have presented that opinion as fact but Im sorry I dont really see anyway that someone could watch TK without bias from about the 5 game mark and question his work ethic. There were certainly nights where the guy was terribly ineffective but i strongly disagree with any opinion that the guy was loafing or cruising. Maybe this is a seeing on TV versus seeing in person thing, i dont know.

And i do think you get a pass on the first few games....its damn near impossible to play at 100% speed if you arent comfortable with the new system and teammates regardless of the skill level

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12-13-2009, 09:26 PM
  #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eerodynamic View Post
i fully agree and that was my point.

I guess i shouldnt have presented that opinion as fact but Im sorry I dont really see anyway that someone could watch TK without bias from about the 5 game mark and question his work ethic. There were certainly nights where the guy was terribly ineffective but i strongly disagree with any opinion that the guy was loafing or cruising. Maybe this is a seeing on TV versus seeing in person thing, i dont know.

And i do think you get a pass on the first few games....its damn near impossible to play at 100% speed if you arent comfortable with the new system and teammates regardless of the skill level
There is a reason that TK was getting like 6 or 7 minutes a night compared to the time he's getting now, and it's not because he all of a sudden became a better hockey player. Nor is it injuries. For a majority of this season thus far, he has been a non-factor in the effort and grit department and has only recently come around to look like the kind of player that we thought we signed when he first came here.

Maybe it is a TV to in person situation, because in the building it was very obvious to me that he wasn't going full speed out there and wasn't finishing his checks. I really think TK turned his game around when Yelle was waived and he realized that it could be him in the very near future if he didn't pick it up.

I am not trying to single him out, because there hasn't been a single player on our team that has brought the goods for 30 games this year. But to say he has been exactly as advertised is a WIDE departure from where his actual play dictates. He was simply trapped in the general malaise that the team was mired with. Only his job was to be the spark plug, along with Larose, that ignited the fire and got everybody going.

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12-13-2009, 09:47 PM
  #91
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I suppose the reason TK got that shorthanded goal in the fourth game was because he was just lucky...

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12-13-2009, 09:51 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by geehaad View Post
I suppose the reason TK got that shorthanded goal in the fourth game was because he was just lucky...
One shift does not equal twenty games.

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Old
12-13-2009, 10:55 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by geehaad View Post
I suppose the reason TK got that shorthanded goal in the fourth game was because he was just lucky...
Even Anson Carter scored one goal here

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12-14-2009, 07:19 AM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Vagrant View Post
One shift does not equal twenty games.
No, but so far, that offers more concrete evidence for the argument that he hustles than there is evidence against.

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12-14-2009, 08:06 AM
  #95
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Originally Posted by eerodynamic View Post
I guess i shouldnt have presented that opinion as fact but Im sorry I dont really see anyway that someone could watch TK without bias from about the 5 game mark and question his work ethic. There were certainly nights where the guy was terribly ineffective but i strongly disagree with any opinion that the guy was loafing or cruising. Maybe this is a seeing on TV versus seeing in person thing, i dont know.

And i do think you get a pass on the first few games....its damn near impossible to play at 100% speed if you arent comfortable with the new system and teammates regardless of the skill level
From my view, TK has been fine from day one and the criticism about him coasting makes me shake my head. But then again it comes from the same guy who ripped Letowski and Eaves for not playing hard so maybe it's just an issue of overlooking 4th line contributions or not watching closely.

The only thing I see different about TK is that you see more of him now that he has been playing 3rd line minutes. In the first part of the year, he was often below 10 mins/game whereas now it's the exception if he in under 10 TTOI. He hasn't looked out of place on the 3rd line though I don't know that I'd want to see him there in a long-term role.

I think he has been far and away the best PK forward even though Yelle can be more noticeable for his prominent shot-blocking. I also think there is a big difference seeing someone in person vs. on TV, as you can see effort more fully when you decide what to focus on rather than just monitoring the feed. To me, he has been Walkeresque on his shifts, doing all the little things in all zones and never going through the motions.

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12-14-2009, 11:41 AM
  #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geehaad View Post
No, but so far, that offers more concrete evidence for the argument that he hustles than there is evidence against.
There can never be evidence for a guy not hustling unless you break out game tape because they don't exactly have an NHL video archive for guys dogging it back to the bench or conceding an icing call or some of the other small things that you notice when a guy isn't going as strong as he could be. Plus, even if you did have the evidence there is no absolute certainty, aside from repeated observation of this phenomena, that this person simply wasn't too tired to work.

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12-14-2009, 11:46 AM
  #97
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And to the gentleman that still wishes to chrip despite being on my ignore list, please keep my name out of your mouth. Nobody rattled your cage.

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12-14-2009, 03:26 PM
  #98
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I've been away for a week (did I miss much? ) ... how has Tlusty looked?

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12-14-2009, 03:30 PM
  #99
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I've been away for a week (did I miss much? ) ... how has Tlusty looked?
I was pretty impressed with Tlusty. He reminded me of a more defensively interested Radim Vrbata. He scored a goal that was essentially a tap in on a Brandon Sutter cross crease pass and hit the post several times but didn't really get enough icetime to show his full game. I think with a little more confidence, he should be a pretty valuable player for us in the near future.

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12-14-2009, 04:22 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Vagrant View Post
I was pretty impressed with Tlusty. He reminded me of a more defensively interested Radim Vrbata. He scored a goal that was essentially a tap in on a Brandon Sutter cross crease pass and hit the post several times but didn't really get enough icetime to show his full game. I think with a little more confidence, he should be a pretty valuable player for us in the near future.
I agree. It was also nice to see him dig after the puck in front of the net especially on his PP time. Though he didnt score on those opportunities it was nice to see chance within 6 feet of the crease. I was also impressed with his general decisiveness. I dont think he did alot of floating, which is really encouraging to me after watching too many of the Canes wingers do it for 2+ years. Im a little sad that we had to send him back and reinsert Sammy for Wednesday.

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