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EKLUND: Flyers on the brink of pulling trigger on MAJOR deal

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:02 PM
  #51
sa cyred
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 25 Pronger D PHI View Post
i want to get rid of the guys who take nights off consistently, so that on a given night we at least have a team that gives an honost effort through and through

guys i wouldnt trade (or at least dont want too)

asham, betts, briere, carcillo, gagne, giroux, laperriere, powe, richards jvr

carle, parent, pronger, timonen

guys i would trade:

carter hartnell coburn pyorala cote (mika and riley could just be sent down too)

leaves us with:

betts carcillo laperriere (why not it was our best line)
gagne richards jvr (these guys have good work ethics usually)
giroux briere ? (both theses guys play hard every night)
powe asham ? (always an honost effort from these two)

pronger carle
timonen parent
bartulis ?

so according to my plan:

trade hartnell carter and coburn for a scoring winger, a defenseman, and maybe a checking line/third line type winger/grinder (preferably a guy with a ton of heart similar to powe)

it is not going to be easy...good luck homer

also maybe make lappy or pronger captain if there really is a dressing room probelm...but thats all speculation, so as of now i will continue to give richards the benefit of the doubt....but he better start playing like he gives a damn or i would strip it solely for that reason

we are a mess and certainly need some sort of shakeup and i hope to god that the hartnell carter rumors isnt true bc the team doesnt need **** like that right now
And we miss playoffs... I know people here love Carcillo and Betts and all but they arent a top line. Sorry. Mika has been playing good, why trade him? (oh wait he doesnt hit and cheap shot and fight sorry). Once Gagne/Powe and all are back I expect Carcillo to be back on the 4th line with Betts and Lappy.

JVR-Richards-Carter
Hartnell-Giroux-Briere
Gagne-Pyorala-Powe
Carcillo-Betts-Lappy

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:05 PM
  #52
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Old
12-16-2009, 03:06 PM
  #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RichardsCannon View Post
at this point, im willing to trade anyone but richards, giroux, jvr, pronger, or timonen.

question;
what would kovalchuks value be in a trade to the flyers, considering that he will be a UFA after this season?
how about...

to philly:
Ilya Kovalchuk + 6.4

to atlanta:
Jeff Carter - 5
Braydon Coburn - 1.3
Jonathan Matsumoto - .525

this gives us a bonafide superstar scorer and moves salary to give us a better chance to keep him here, especially with prongers cap hit going down after this year.
My god I would love that!

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:06 PM
  #54
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Old
12-16-2009, 03:09 PM
  #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
And we miss playoffs... I know people here love Carcillo and Betts and all but they arent a top line. Sorry. Mika has been playing good, why trade him? (oh wait he doesnt hit and cheap shot and fight sorry). Once Gagne/Powe and all are back I expect Carcillo to be back on the 4th line with Betts and Lappy.

JVR-Richards-Carter
Hartnell-Giroux-Briere
Gagne-Pyorala-Powe
Carcillo-Betts-Lappy
well were not going to make the playoffs with this team

i didnt mean to say they were our scoring line, but they are a group of guys that first came to mind when i was making my mock lineup..i cant believe i even had to explain myself on that one...they would be my third line if that clears it up.

pyorala hasnt been bad but he has what 2 points? and he has had a ton of chances to score playing with richards and gagne alot early...for a team that desperately needs goals, i dont think a guy who cant buy his way on to the score sheet is the answer

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:09 PM
  #56
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Is there a chance we'll make a deal with the Pens?

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:10 PM
  #57
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They're making a deal to bring Jones back?

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:11 PM
  #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 25 Pronger D PHI View Post
well were not going to make the playoffs with this team

i didnt mean to say they were our scoring line, but they are a group of guys that first came to mind when i was making my mock lineup..i cant believe i even had to explain myself on that one...they would be my third line if that clears it up.

pyorala hasnt been bad but he has what 2 points? and he has had a ton of chances to score playing with richards and gagne alot early...for a team that desperately needs goals, i dont think a guy who cant buy his way on to the score sheet is the answer
4 points, 2 less then Carcillo. Thing is though, he is one of our better defensive forwards on the team. He is always the first one back and lately has been playing more on the pk. He's also very versitle. He can play any position. I think when injuries happen, you need those kind of players.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:12 PM
  #59
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Do you guys think that all this pressure on the team to perform is actually becoming a damper rather than motivation? I mean, I'm pretty sure they all know now that if they don't get their **** together within the next game or 2 they are going to see people shipped out and I'm sure they don't want that.

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12-16-2009, 03:13 PM
  #60
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Wasn't Pittsburgh in this same situation last year?

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12-16-2009, 03:14 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JLHockeyKnight View Post
They're making a deal to bring Jones back?
and re-hire Stevens...

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:15 PM
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
4 points, 2 less then Carcillo. Thing is though, he is one of our better defensive forwards on the team. He is always the first one back and lately has been playing more on the pk. He's also very versitle. He can play any position. I think when injuries happen, you need those kind of players.
what does carcillos points have to do with anything? pyorala is a guy that can be plugged in anywhere sure, but he is just a space filler, he doesnt actually contribute which is what you need from a guy like that...think of umberger a few years ago, he played every position on every line pretty much but still scored...man i wish we still had him.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:16 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Quacker912 View Post
Do you guys think that all this pressure on the team to perform is actually becoming a damper rather than motivation? I mean, I'm pretty sure they all know now that if they don't get their **** together within the next game or 2 they are going to see people shipped out and I'm sure they don't want that.
Here's something to keep in mind. They really don't like what happened to Stevens, it killed motivation.

And they probably don't like Laviolette, he's yelling all the time. Sounds like success? No.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:16 PM
  #64
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Old
12-16-2009, 03:19 PM
  #65
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This is epic.

I laughed out loud at my desk at work.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:20 PM
  #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfy View Post
Here's something to keep in mind. They really don't like what happened to Stevens, it killed motivation.

And they probably don't like Laviolette, he's yelling all the time. Sounds like success? No.



They had a coach who wasn't into yelling. Now they have someone who wil, at times yell.

I'm not saying get rid of Lavi but, wtf do these players want?

Coaches get angry get over it. I had many coaches in sports who yelled. It's just a packaged deal.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:22 PM
  #67
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Old
12-16-2009, 03:23 PM
  #68
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my old football coach was a yeller, he would practcally foam at the mouth if you got him mad enough

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:24 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by duffy9748 View Post
Swapping Jeff Carter and another minor piece for Staal would make the flyers a much better team. Especially come playoff time when Staal's an absolute beast.
I would take Staal for Carter but what is Staal's contract like? And why the hell would Carolina do this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 25 Pronger D PHI View Post
i want to get rid of the guys who take nights off consistently, so that on a given night we at least have a team that gives an honost effort through and through

guys i wouldnt trade (or at least dont want too)

asham, betts, briere, carcillo, gagne, giroux, laperriere, powe, richards jvr

carle, parent, pronger, timonen

guys i would trade:

carter hartnell coburn pyorala cote (mika and riley could just be sent down too)

leaves us with:

betts carcillo laperriere (why not it was our best line)
gagne richards jvr (these guys have good work ethics usually)
giroux briere ? (both theses guys play hard every night)
powe asham ? (always an honost effort from these two)

pronger carle
timonen parent
bartulis ?

so according to my plan:

trade hartnell carter and coburn for a scoring winger, a defenseman, and maybe a checking line/third line type winger/grinder (preferably a guy with a ton of heart similar to powe)

it is not going to be easy...good luck homer

also maybe make lappy or pronger captain if there really is a dressing room probelm...but thats all speculation, so as of now i will continue to give richards the benefit of the doubt....but he better start playing like he gives a damn or i would strip it solely for that reason

we are a mess and certainly need some sort of shakeup and i hope to god that the hartnell carter rumors isnt true bc the team doesnt need **** like that right now
I dont think Hartnell and Coburn's problems are work ethic, I think they are just dumb, at least at the moment. Hartnell I think is taking unnecessary flak at the moment....He is what he is, it just looks much worse when the team is playing this bad.

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Originally Posted by Crossbar Ping View Post
My god I would love that!
Who does Kovalchuk play with here though??? These are things people dont think about when proposing trades. Richards? Probably not, both like to carry the puck a lot....Giroux? Nope, Giroux likes to carry the puck....

As great as Kovalchuk is, I dont see him fitting with the players that would remain on this team if we trade for him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wolfy View Post
Here's something to keep in mind. They really don't like what happened to Stevens, it killed motivation.

And they probably don't like Laviolette, he's yelling all the time. Sounds like success? No.
Oh well, time to grow up and get over it......This organization fired a tough coach in Hitch to coddle the young guys and gave them a nice guy, they ****ed up with the nice guy and now got a touch guy back.

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12-16-2009, 03:27 PM
  #70
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I would take Staal for Carter but what is Staal's contract like? And why the hell would Carolina do this?

Who does Kovalchuk play with here though??? These are things people dont think about when proposing trades. Richards? Probably not, both like to carry the puck a lot....Giroux? Nope, Giroux likes to carry the puck....

As great as Kovalchuk is, I dont see him fitting with the players that would remain on this team if we trade for him.
Staal's contract is horrendous. It's $8.25 for a long time. It's like a front loaded deal that never decreases.

Kovalchuk and Giroux would be one of the nastiest duos ever. You can't be serious.

Kovalchuk-Giroux-JVR
Hartnell-Richards-Briere

wow

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12-16-2009, 03:28 PM
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RoDu View Post
my old football coach was a yeller, he would practcally foam at the mouth if you got him mad enough


Been there!

I had a coach who could yell so loud. You'd hear him a mile down the road.

Guy was freaking huge....like 7 Ft tall. You didn't want to mess with him.

Great guy off the field. God rest his soul.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:29 PM
  #72
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This team has spent the better part of 4 seasons playing like Randall Cunningham....Buddy Ryan never coached his offense, he basically just told Randall to go out and make plays......That is how this offense has worked the past several years, they all just went out there like on the pond back in the days in Canada and tried to make plays. As a result, they are all undisciplined (and I dont mean in taking penalties) and make stupid plays with the puck. They dont know where they need to be on the ice, and look clueless out there. That is why teams with a dedicated system usually compete. When the pucks arent going in, or bouncing their way, or the goalie is a little cold they still can compensate cause they play a certain way and no where to be at all times.....Yes, they will have their ups and downs like anyteam, but it is usually win two or three here, lose two or three there its never go 12-2-4 and then 2-4-12.

I dont want to see major changes with this team. Part of the maturation process for young players is growing up on a personal level as well as a hockey player. Some of those guys (Carter, Richards, Hartnell) have basically had free reign the past few years cause the coach was their friend and not the authroity figure he should have been.

After 4 years of that, it is going to take a month maybe more to break them of these bad habits.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:29 PM
  #73
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Originally Posted by Wolfy View Post
Here's something to keep in mind. They really don't like what happened to Stevens, it killed motivation.

And they probably don't like Laviolette, he's yelling all the time. Sounds like success? No.
Too bad. So sad. These players dont get a say in that, nor should they. If this were part of the problem, it just shows that this team is moist. Nothing but a bunch of cupcakes *****footing around.

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:32 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
Staal's contract is horrendous. It's $8.25 for a long time. It's like a front loaded deal that never decreases.

Kovalchuk and Giroux would be one of the nastiest duos ever. You can't be serious.

Kovalchuk-Giroux-JVR
Hartnell-Richards-Briere

wow
On paper yes, on the ice I doubt it......Kovalchuk is similar to Carter in a lot of ways. He loves to have the puck on his stick and control the play. He shoots more often than he passes and usually creates his own chances as opposed to someone like Gagne who finds open spots and waits for a pass. Just like how Carter worked great with Lupul and Hartnell last year for that reason, they picked up his garbage and did the dirty work. That is why someone like Rich Peverly worked so well with Kovalchuk, because he just goes out there and does his job and doesnt care whether he has the puck or not.

Giroux also likes to carry the puck and make plays. I am not sure it would work very well.

Savard played mostly with Hossa and Kozlov when he was in Atlanta for that reason.

Now on the powerplay, maybe, with Kovalchuk loading up for onetimers, but I dont see it working at regular strength unless one of them adjusts their game.


As for Staal, $8.25 dollars or $8.25 cap hit??? If that is the cap hit, than NO WAY

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Old
12-16-2009, 03:35 PM
  #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mikedifr View Post
Who does Kovalchuk play with here though??? These are things people dont think about when proposing trades. Richards? Probably not, both like to carry the puck a lot....Giroux? Nope, Giroux likes to carry the puck....

As great as Kovalchuk is, I dont see him fitting with the players that would remain on this team if we trade for him.
Kovalchuk is the kind of player who doesn't need a setup man, he carries the puck, shoots and scores. But a Kovalchuk line could benefit with a slick puck handling center with defensive capabilities. Namely Claude Giroux. You put a grinder on the right to clean up Ilya's rebounds and you've got a very dangerous line

Kovalchuk-Giroux-Hartnell
Gagne-Richards-Pyorala/Powe
JVR-Briere-Asham/Powe
Carcillo-Betts-Laperriere

Pronger-Carle
Timonen-Parent/Marshalll
Bartulis-Syvret/Marshall

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