As Grabner is currently on LTIR he is not taking up one of the 23 available roster spaces.
I don't believe that Grabner is on LTIR, just normal IR. From what I understand, the only Canucks on LTIR this season have been Demitra, Hansen, and Schneider. D. Sedin and Grabner seem to have been kept off of it because Demitra's exemption has given them all the room they've needed. Though I suppose they could retroactively put him on LTIR to make him eligible for an LTIR conditioning stint, but as you say, what would be the point given that he's waiver exempt and he'd still have to be paid an NHL salary?
I agree with NFiTO...as good as Grabner was looking before the injury, I think he's going to be a victim of the numbers game here and will be back in Manitoba until something like an injury allows him to come back up and play. Gillis won't waste assets(however low their value may be) by waiving players at this stage, IMO.
Grabner can be put on LTIR retroactively if needed.
Yes, but like I said in the post above yours, what would be the point? It would just cost the team more money and limit their options. Grabner can be sent up and down at will, so why not just demote him to get back in game shape, then the Moose will pay his salary and there won't be any limits on how long he can stay down there.
my mistake then.... I was under the impression that the rules stated if a player is on a conditioning loan, he would be subject to the 23 man roster requirements overall... and if he was on a conditioning stint, he would be taken off IR to count as well... if this isn't true, that it makes more sense.
but then the cap situation becomes a concern as the team is already tight against the cap.
The cap is of no concern right now since they are over it and in LTIR exemption territory. They cannot possibly save up cap space with Demitra on LTIR so whether or not they go over it is immaterial, so long as they fit within Demitra's LTIR exemption. The real maneuvering will come when Demitra is to be activated. Until then, there's no point in trying to save space because it will have no net benefit on the team's cap situation.
I think he has played well enough to deserve to stay with the club. It would be a slap in the face to lose your job due to injury. By sending him down for a conditioning stint it allows him to get a couple games in at a good pace.
You're missing the point.
A conditioning stint means he stays on the roster and counts against the cap. There's no reason for the Canucks to do this when they can just demote him, and bring him back up when they feel he's ready.
Also, it's not even remotely a slap in the face to be sent down, as he wouldn't have been in the NHL at all if it weren't for injuries to the Canucks forward group. It's not like he earned a roster spot out of camp. It's way better for him to get his legs back in the AHL, instead of having to try to break back into the roster immediately. Remember what happened to Hansen last season after his injury?
I'm being nit-plcky here, but why would the Canucks put Grabner on a conditioning assignment when they could just demote him and get his salary off the books while he's down?
Does the Conditioning stint not count within being on the IR(as in not having the salary anyways)
I agree with NFiTO...as good as Grabner was looking before the injury, I think he's going to be a victim of the numbers game here and will be back in Manitoba until something like an injury allows him to come back up and play. Gillis won't waste assets(however low their value may be) by waiving players at this stage, IMO.
~Canucklehead~
You may be right (I may be crazy...) however he did perform very well while he was up and looked like a legit top 6 so in terms of dressing the best lineup...
Besides, having a lineup without a single player that can be send down at will is unusual, no? This is the current Canucks situation I believe, none of the 23 players on the roster can be sent down without going thru waivers. What I'm saying is the Gillis has handcuffed himself here.
Does the Conditioning stint not count within being on the IR(as in not having the salary anyways)
Grabner is currently on IR (not LTIR).
Players on IR (even LTIR) count against the cap (i.e. there are no cap savings for injured players) - they do not however count against the 23 man roster.
If a player is on IR only he must first be placed on the roster and then sent for his conditioning loan per CBA 13.8 where his cap hit continues and he is part of the 23 man roster. Note a player does not have to clear waivers even if normally required for this type of conditioning loan.
As Grabner is not waiver eligible so he can be assigned directly (not a true conditioning loan) and his cap hit comes off the books and he never has to take up a roster place. He would then be paid his minor league salary. This would be the same as any other non-waiver player being assigned.
The Canucks could also retroactively put Grabner on LTIR and send him on a LTIR conditioning loan per CBA 13.9. In that case his cap hit continues, he continues to be paid his NHL salary and he does not go on the 23 man roster. The Canucks could also ask for an extension of this type of conditioning loan.
Demitra went to Slovakia to see specialist he has wrked with in past..will cont. rehab with VAN medical staff-still out indef-TC
Jim Jamieson on Canucks Live Chat today:
AV said yesterday with a smile, when asked about Demitra, that "he's on his own program."
According to Gallagher:
Tony Gallagher:
Demitra aiming to be back at end of Jan.
Tony Gallagher:
Gabe, thank heaven for the Olympics. Demitra will be desperately trying to make it back for that. He attended Slovak camp and enjoyed himself.
Last edited by Wetcoaster: 12-18-2009 at 05:02 PM.
Reason: Add Gallagher comments
Jim Jamieson on Canucks Live Chat today:
AV said yesterday with a smile, when asked about Demitra, that "he's on his own program."
According to Gallagher:
Tony Gallagher:
Demitra aiming to be back at end of Jan.
Tony Gallagher:
Gabe, thank heaven for the Olympics. Demitra will be desperately trying to make it back for that. He attended Slovak camp and enjoyed himself.
Ugh. I just hope he's ready for the playoffs. He can be this year's version of Mats Sundin.
I'd love to get him back AFTER the Olympic break. That'll give him a good 20 games or so to get back into game shape and even if he produces at a 40 point level it's still pretty solid.
There are teams out there that are going to give up 2nd round picks and prospects to add a player like Demitra at the trade deadline and if we can get him for free then that sounds pretty sweet to me.
It has now been confirmed that Demitra has left Vancouver and returned to Slovakia for treatment. Another rousing endorsement of the Canucks' medical staff?
Quote:
When Canucks head coach Alain Vigneault cryptically said Thursday Pavol Demitra was "on his own program," he wasn't kidding.
Demitra, still rehabbing a surgically repaired shoulder, has returned home to Slovakia to see a specialist he feels comfortable with.
TC Carling, the Canucks director of media relations, delivered news via his Twitter account — @TC_Carling — less than 24 hours after Vigneault chose not to disclose any information on Demitra's whereabouts.
The Canucks claim there's nothing to see here. Everything is on the up-and-up. It was Demitra's decision to leave and it does not mean there has been a setback in his recovery.
"There is nothing to see here. Everything is on the up-and-up. It was Demitra's decision to leave and it does not mean there has been a setback in his recovery."
Ryan Johnson - possible broken foot according to Ben Kuzma:
Quote:
Johnson was not credited for a blocked shot in the 3-1 loss to St. Louis on Sunday, but dove to block an attempt and missed practice Monday. There is some conceren he may have broken a foot.
if true, that opens up the roster spot for Grabner.
Rypien will be moved to center to take over Johnson's spot, with Glass and Samuelsson moving down a line, I'd think.
If it happens, hopefully AV finally starts giving PK time to the Sedins... I'd hate to see Rypien replace Johnson on the PK, as bad as Johnson has been there at times.
if true, that opens up the roster spot for Grabner.
Rypien will be moved to center to take over Johnson's spot, with Glass and Samuelsson moving down a line, I'd think.
If it happens, hopefully AV finally starts giving PK time to the Sedins... I'd hate to see Rypien replace Johnson on the PK, as bad as Johnson has been there at times.
the only danger in giving the sedin's PK time is the possibility of needless injury.
I'd rather see the sedin's play 20 more games than have them blocking shots and always praying that they don't fracture or break something.
