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Dave Babych Hired - And Now Glen Hanlon - UPD #84

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Old
12-21-2009, 02:53 AM
  #101
Moobles
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Quote:
Originally Posted by orcatown
The trouble here is that the Oilers have done this for years and it has hurt the team. I've felt for a long time that the Oilers should change the culture of cronyism and insist on getting the best person - not the best connected. This team needs new perspectives, not just a recycle of old cronies. That's what Tambo promised, but i don't see it. It is the same old hiring practices the team has always done.

But why should they -there ares so many fans that will go to the games no matter what has been served up over the years.. There is very little demand for excellence in spite of all the slogans and other crap. If the fans are willing to put up with this, and believe anything they are told, why not use the situation as big piggy bank for the alumni.
I think this is what you meant .

In all seriousness, I think you're taking this way too close to heart orcatown. What makes you qualified to judge who's the "better" person and who's available and good? What alternatives are you proposing: what did Gillis miss out on by hiring Hanlon or Babych?

I doubt you do, and I think you're just being a little over-emotional about the whole thing. By that post you'd think Babych's hiring is the coming of the next apocalypse for the Canucks. Neither of these guys are in positions like Hull or Gretzky was to dictate how they want things done to the team and they have as good a chance as anyone to make a difference here. Gillis has hired plenty of non-Canucks staff: and what's wrong with hiring old Canuck vets? If some of them are skilled and still love the team that's better for the organization.

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Old
12-21-2009, 09:20 AM
  #102
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All right, you're forcing me to defend a hiring that is largely inconsequential and likely won't have any long-term impact, but here goes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by orcatown View Post
And Hanlon flopped in all those positions. When they dumped him in Washington the team finally took off.
Won't get any argument here. He was crap in Washington but paid his dues in the minors - three years as head coach in Portland, won coach of the year in 2000.

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He flamed out in Finland as well.
Jokerit made the playoffs last year but Hanlon wasn't kept around. Hardly a 'flame out'. He left for the KHL and recently quit in Minsk.

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No way Hanlon gets this gig without having direct connections to the club.
So, are you saying that if you were unemployed - you wouldn't use the resources/friends/connections available to you to find new work?

But even then, there's no evidence that Hanlon has a relationship with anyone currently involved in a 'decision-making' capacity with the club.

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It's the team looking after their own. And I guess many would say who cares.
Right. Who cares? This is a part-time gig with no influence on the current club. You're not paying his salary.

The level of outrage doesn't equal whatever responsibilities Hanlon is receiving here.

Quote:
The trouble here is that the Canucks have done this for years and it has hurt the team. I've felt for a long time that the Canucks should change the culture of cronyism and insist on getting the best person - not the best connected. This team needs new perspectives, not just a recycle of old cronies. That's what Gillis promised, but i don't see it. It is the same old hiring practices the team has always done.
This isn't cronyism. Cronyism would be firing Vigneault and making Hanlon head coach despite his numerous failures in other locations and lack of familiarity with the Canuck team and roster.

Cronyism is keeping incompetent morons like Craig MacTavish head coach two years after they've worn out their welcome, and promoting other incompetent morons like Kevin Lowe from GM to president after years of failure at other positions.

It's pretty simple what this is: giving a guy a part-time scouting gig doing what he does best: evaluate goaltending talent.

He was a good NHL goaltender for a long time, and a solid goaltending coach when he was with the Canucks in the '90s.

As long as he's kept from being behind the bench I don't see what the issue here is.

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Old
12-21-2009, 12:42 PM
  #103
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I find it funny that people are actually complaining about Hanlon's signing... seriously orcatown, I think you're taking this "cronyism" crap too seriously.

Like Babych, Hanlon is also brought in to fill a small role with the club. Like Babych, he is not replacing a current member of the team - they created a new position for him to fill. And like Babych, they are using his actual experience in the league, in the position he's played a long time, to help provide evaluations to the club on young players and potential prospects.

And what makes this even a smaller issue is that goaltending is the one position the club doesn't really need to invest anymore in. They have their franchise guy signed for 12 years. Still Gillis felt it was worthwhile bringing in a former long-time NHL goalie to help scout future goalies. If he fails, it's hardly a big deal at all... but unlike previous administrations that didn't bring in a guy like this when they needed to turn every stone to find a good goalie, Gillis has brought in someone to help them in a time when goaltending has never been more stable or stronger in this organization.

And it's not like he's without his skills, just like Babych - who's history seems to support the role he has been brought in for - helping young dmen develop in to NHLers - and being a guy who spent the last several years helping young players develop.... likewise, Hanlon is coming from an organization that has drafted and developed goaltending pretty well in recent years - with Varlamov and Neuvirth both developing well recently, and he was also recently put in a role of goaltending scout in Washington, and in the last goalie they drafted - Braden Holtby, in the 4th round in 08, has been developing well, and is putting up phenomenal numbers currently in the AHL as a 20 YO (1.28 GAA, .952save%).

Clearly he's done some good with goaltending in that organization, so he's not exactly a guy who's got no experience or success in the small role he's being asked now to fill in Vancouver.

But something tells me that none of that matters... the Canucks could hire Cliff Ronning to fill a small PR role in Vancouver that doesn't really mean anything to the organization, and some people will be crying cronyism. Although the reality is that he would probably be excellent in that role, considering how much he's loved in this market. Still, because of his previous history with the team, it won't matter what he's hired to do, nor that he isn't replacing anyone else rather creating a new job - the fact that he was a former Canuck will have some people crying cronyism without considering whether he could be a good fit or not.

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Old
12-21-2009, 12:51 PM
  #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hedberg View Post
Sure they've hired several ex-Canucks, but Gillis has also hired guys with little to no connection to the Canucks like Dave Gagner, Inge Hammarstrom, Scott Mellanby, and Dan Palango
Are you really suggesting the pivotal piece in the Pavel Bure trade has little connection to the Canucks?

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Old
12-21-2009, 01:04 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by nuckfan in TO View Post
But something tells me that none of that matters... the Canucks could hire Cliff Ronning to fill a small PR role in Vancouver that doesn't really mean anything to the organization, and some people will be crying cronyism. Although the reality is that he would probably be excellent in that role, considering how much he's loved in this market. Still, because of his previous history with the team, it won't matter what he's hired to do, nor that he isn't replacing anyone else rather creating a new job - the fact that he was a former Canuck will have some people crying cronyism without considering whether he could be a good fit or not.
Steve Tambellini is a good example of developing and promoting management talent from within.

After he retired as a player in 1988 he was hired by the Canucks as the Director of Public and Media Relations and worked his way up through the organization with progressively more responsibility (ultimately VP Hockey Operations and Assistant GM) until July 2008 when he left to become GM of the Oilers.

The Canucks have done that with non-players as well such as Dave Cobb who began in the accounting/financial management end of things.

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Old
12-21-2009, 04:47 PM
  #106
Eddie Vedder
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A former goalie coach and former goalie whose main task is watching tape and advance pro scouting of other teams goalies. And this is a new position.. how is this a bad thing?

Also, the article specifically says he will be scouting MAINLY goalies and other undrafted college prospects. I dont see us a) drafting goalies in the first 4 or 5 rounds for at least the next 5-10 years. I also don't see adding another scout to find free players in the undrafted pool of players as a bad thing. Its not like having a total dolt like delorme in charge of our top draft picks year after year. If he proves he has an eye for talent, then you would probably see him increase responsibility at the draft table, but it specifically says hes gonna be looking at undrafted college guys. No risk really.

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Old
12-21-2009, 06:39 PM
  #107
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these signings will have a profound effect on the canucks. the next generation of players will be either redheads, have pronounced moustaches, or a mixture of both.

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Old
12-21-2009, 07:56 PM
  #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tone View Post
these signings will have a profound effect on the canucks. the next generation of players will be either redheads, have pronounced moustaches, or a mixture of both.


Oh ****. What have they done?

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Old
12-21-2009, 08:14 PM
  #109
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I think the best part about Hanlon getting a scouting job, is that it gives the Canucks a quick fix option for Manitoba should Arniel sign with an NHL team sometime this season. Much like Quennvlle was originally hired in Chicago as a scout.

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Old
12-21-2009, 08:29 PM
  #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squig View Post
I think the best part about Hanlon getting a scouting job, is that it gives the Canucks a quick fix option for Manitoba should Arniel sign with an NHL team sometime this season. Much like Quennvlle was originally hired in Chicago as a scout.
I would be really sad to see Arniel go to another team, especially since you can't get compensation for it anymore (like we did when Carlyle left (and then won a cup)).

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Old
12-21-2009, 08:42 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by timw33 View Post
I would be really sad to see Arniel go to another team, especially since you can't get compensation for it anymore (like we did when Carlyle left (and then won a cup)).
yeah it would suck, but I don't see Gillis forcing Arniel to honour his contract if a NHL team comes calling.

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Old
12-21-2009, 09:00 PM
  #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Squig View Post
I think the best part about Hanlon getting a scouting job, is that it gives the Canucks a quick fix option for Manitoba should Arniel sign with an NHL team sometime this season. Much like Quennvlle was originally hired in Chicago as a scout.
Yeah, not a bad way to smooth things over with Heisinger if we did take Arniel from him. Hanlon's from Brandon, too.

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