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Habs projected Cap / line-up in 2010-2011

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:13 AM
  #26
Markowicz
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5 things:

1. Gainey is not going to trade Gomez anytime soon.
2. Gainey would never pay Plekanec that much money. Ever. He's going to be offered something between 4 and 5 million dollars. If Plekanec doesn't accept it, he'll walk. As simple as that. Besides, Marc Savard is getting paid a cap hit of 4 million over the next 7 years. Savard is 4-5 years older but he's also way more proven. It's a perfect benchmark contract for Gainey in my opinion.
3. I'd give MAB a 2 year 3.5 (total) max. For a guy who can't play defence, that's a great deal.
4. Why not sign Pouliot? I'm sure Gainey wants him.
5. I love Metro but if Gainey has to give more that 1.5, he's gone.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:43 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Pierre Jr View Post
5 things:

1. Gainey is not going to trade Gomez anytime soon.
2. Gainey would never pay Plekanec that much money. Ever. He's going to be offered something between 4 and 5 million dollars. If Plekanec doesn't accept it, he'll walk. As simple as that. Besides, Marc Savard is getting paid a cap hit of 4 million over the next 7 years. Savard is 4-5 years older but he's also way more proven. It's a perfect benchmark contract for Gainey in my opinion.
3. I'd give MAB a 2 year 3.5 (total) max. For a guy who can't play defence, that's a great deal.
4. Why not sign Pouliot? I'm sure Gainey wants him.
5. I love Metro but if Gainey has to give more that 1.5, he's gone.
while technically your logic is sound, you forget that this isn't arbitration. It doesn't matter what benchmark gainey has to use, he's not playing against pleks here, he's playing against the other gm's of the league. If the popular opinion is that some GM is gonna throw 6/year at him, he'll probably walk unless Bob matches. Now i don't think bob SHOULD match at such a high price, but then we're without a real #1 center again, and our team looks like garbage for years until maxwell or leblanc come knocking.

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Old
12-26-2009, 01:28 AM
  #28
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No way Metro gets a such raise, they will let him go before he gets close to 2 millions.. We still have Desharnais and Maxwell that could make the team, my money is on Desharnais..

Laraque will probably be bought out..

No way MAB gets a such raise.. I think we will be fine..

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:12 AM
  #29
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Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
Just trying to put some numbers together to see what the habs cap hit would be after resigning (or not) some of the rfa's / ufa's... 1st column is projected salary in mllions, 2nd column in ( ) is net increase.... Please let me know if I goofed up or missing info.

Plek 5.5 (+2.75)
Metro 2.0 (+1)
Pyatt 0
SK 1.2 (+.400)
Pouliot 0
Laps 1.0 (+.300)
Stewart 0
D'ags 0
Mara 100% won't resign
MAB 3.3 (+2.5)
Price 3.5 (+1.5)
Halak 2.2 (+1.5) *likely to be traded


With Halak, increase in cap = ~10 Million
Without Halak, increase in cap = 7.8 Million + replacement (~800K) = 8.6 M

IE: We Are Screwed.

What kind of numbers do you get?
Who would you keep and at how much? Metro? MAB (Or cross fingers on Subban?)?

Would you trade before the deadline to acquire "something" instead of losing a player for nothing? Who?
What kind of salaries would you accept in return? Or just picks?

Of the players that will still be under contract, who's salary could we dump (realistically - Gomez is not realistic)?

What would be the cap hit on buyouts of Laraque final year?

Use this as a reference point : http://www.hockeybuzz.com/cap-central/team.php?team=MON
or
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=263702

Have fun!
we are stuck with Gomez.
Price and Plekanec are going to cost serious $$ to keep. Pleks will hit UFA if we don't pay 5M$+, and Price might opt to wait for potential offer sheet no matter what we do.

Gainey needs to get Pleks re-signed as soon as possible. IF he can't get Pleks signed to an extension before the deadline, he needs to listen to the offers out there/drum up value fror him.

whatever Gainey decides to do, losing plekanec for nothing would be a huge screw up, on par with the gomez trade.

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:31 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
we are stuck with Gomez.
Price and Plekanec are going to cost serious $$ to keep. Pleks will hit UFA if we don't pay 5M$+, and Price might opt to wait for potential offer sheet no matter what we do.

Gainey needs to get Pleks re-signed as soon as possible. IF he can't get Pleks signed to an extension before the deadline, he needs to listen to the offers out there/drum up value fror him.

whatever Gainey decides to do, losing plekanec for nothing would be a huge screw up, on par with the gomez trade.
Even if we do sign Plek and Price, how are we going to be under the cap , all while improving our chances next year? Read post 25, even if we get rid of Metro, Mara and buyout Laraque and let MAB walk (which in post 25 I signed him for 2.25 because I really think a PP specialist is a HUGE asset), we'll still be over the cap... it makes no sense, are we officially screwed for next season? And of course, this is considering that the cap stays the same. Something obviously has to give, but no matter how we look at it, we're downgrading. Am I wrong?

Subban the savior? lol

Frankly, Gomez better pick-up the pace ... because right now his effects aren't felt as much as perhaps next year - when we'll be losing assets because of his 7.3.... That's when the media / fans get ugly on him. Can be scary times in hab-land ... not trying to hit the panic button just yet, but it doesn't look good

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Old
12-26-2009, 03:37 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
Even if we do sign Plek and Price, how are we going to be under the cap , all while improving our chances next year? Read post 25, even if we get rid of Metro, Mara and buyout Laraque and let MAB walk (which in post 25 I signed him for 2.25 because I really think a PP specialist is a HUGE asset), we'll still be over the cap... it makes no sense, are we officially screwed for next season? And of course, this is considering that the cap stays the same. Something obviously has to give, but no matter how we look at it, we're downgrading. Am I wrong?

Subban the savior? lol

Frankly, Gomez better pick-up the pace ... because right now his effects aren't felt as much as perhaps next year - when we'll be losing assets because of his 7.3.... That's when the media / fans get ugly on him. Can be scary times in hab-land ... not trying to hit the panic button just yet, but it doesn't look good
not wrong at all...

we NEED for the cap to go up, pretty significantly, or else we will be stuck watching valuable assets walk out the door, again.

to say Gomez needs to pick up the pace is an understatement. Thing is that even if he were playing/producing as he has the past 2-3 seasons, that only makes us marginally better, and wouldn't do anything to diminish the potential "hurt" of losing a Plekanec/Price.

the moves made last offseason were, on the whole, foolish, and have put us in an unenviable position moving forward... which should be the opposite given how much flexibility we appeared to have going into the 09 UFA period.

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Old
12-26-2009, 06:15 AM
  #32
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GAINEY

IDIOT

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Old
12-26-2009, 07:07 AM
  #33
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Originally Posted by overlords View Post
while technically your logic is sound, you forget that this isn't arbitration. It doesn't matter what benchmark gainey has to use, he's not playing against pleks here, he's playing against the other gm's of the league. If the popular opinion is that some GM is gonna throw 6/year at him, he'll probably walk unless Bob matches. Now i don't think bob SHOULD match at such a high price, but then we're without a real #1 center again, and our team looks like garbage for years until maxwell or leblanc come knocking.
Well Savard signed that contract knowing he could probably get more if he waited for his contract to expire. I know loyalty isn't what it used to be, but I still believe that most players that are given a fair offer will re-sign with their team as long as they are happy there. Free agents most of the time are free agents because the team decided didn't want or couldn't afford the player anymore.

Maybe I'm naive, but I think the ball is in Bob's court here. If he makes a fair offer to Pleks, sooner rather than later, I think he will sign. And I believe he definitely would in the $4-5 million range. Remember, Pleks thought he got more than he deserved last year, maybe he will return the favour.

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Old
12-26-2009, 09:40 AM
  #34
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BTW, Cedrick Desjardins played better than Sanford recently.

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Old
12-26-2009, 09:41 AM
  #35
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Pleks is making me nervous... always be leary of the guy having a career year during a contract year...

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Old
12-26-2009, 10:38 AM
  #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hendextall View Post
Well Savard signed that contract knowing he could probably get more if he waited for his contract to expire. I know loyalty isn't what it used to be, but I still believe that most players that are given a fair offer will re-sign with their team as long as they are happy there. Free agents most of the time are free agents because the team decided didn't want or couldn't afford the player anymore.

Maybe I'm naive, but I think the ball is in Bob's court here. If he makes a fair offer to Pleks, sooner rather than later, I think he will sign. And I believe he definitely would in the $4-5 million range. Remember, Pleks thought he got more than he deserved last year, maybe he will return the favour.
Well that's what i wanted to say, that if Gainey takes care of business now, he can sign Plex to a Savard like contract. If he waits till next July, and gets other GM's involved, then he's screwed.

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Old
12-26-2009, 11:42 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by hendextall View Post
. And I believe he definitely would in the $4-5 million range. Remember, Pleks thought he got more than he deserved last year, maybe he will return the favour.
Well, I hope Plek REALLY likes it here, because if he were given between 4 and 5, he'd be getting less than Gomez, Cam and Gio... and if he continues this pace, we're looking at a top 10 - 15 point getter in the NHL.

I don't buy it (unless he tails-off).... And it's not even about dollars, but rather a question of self-worth and recognition.

It also sucks that we have to be talking about contract when his value has never been so high

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Old
12-26-2009, 11:55 AM
  #38
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Originally Posted by coolasprICE View Post
Well, I hope Plek REALLY likes it here, because if he were given between 4 and 5, he'd be getting less than Gomez, Cam and Gio... and if he continues this pace, we're looking at a top 10 - 15 point getter in the NHL.

I don't buy it (unless he tails-off).... And it's not even about dollars, but rather a question of self-worth and recognition.

It also sucks that we have to be talking about contract when his value has never been so high
I think Gainey has to take advantage of the way the CBA is structured if he wants to be successful keeping this team together. However, there will be a need to remove one of Hamrlik or Gomez's contract this summer.. This is all but assured.

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:03 PM
  #39
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I wouldn't resign MAB to anything over 1M cap hit. Nor would I give Metro a big raise.

A first-rate point shot is valuable asset, I agree, but I think Markov has shown that he is the secret ingredient and the trigger-puller is a commodity. MAB can probably get better offer somewhere else and will walk. We thank him for a fine season and get a big shot to complement Markov from somewhere else: try out your own guys, get a cheap free agent or trade near the trade deadline.

Metro I really like, but he's going to be 36 going into the next season. This is going his last chance at a retirement fund. If he keeps up his production (20g/40p season), he's going to get a front-loaded multiyear deal from somebody (maybe 6M over 3y). We won't be able to offer that. He is good, damn excellent at his current price, but he is not part of the team core, and thus can't endanger getting the core signed.

We have just one NHL center signed for the next year and that's Gomez. The only other nominal center under contract for next year is Ryan White. Sign Pleknanec to a sane contract and we're in decent shape, lose him and we're in deep trouble. (Also the reason Gainey should sign Pleks during the season; before he does do it he can't know what has to spend and what he needs.)

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Old
12-26-2009, 12:05 PM
  #40
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I think Gainey has to take advantage of the way the CBA is structured if he wants to be successful keeping this team together. However, there will be a need to remove one of Hamrlik or Gomez's contract this summer.. This is all but assured.
Freeing up 5 Milloin could do the trick in keeping Plek and MAB...

But it still means we're going to lose Halak, Metro... and will be thinner on D too.


Perhaps I'm underrating Desjardins in Hamilton... but here's the scary part...

Metropolit's statistics (NHL): 33GP 10G 9A 19PTS

Maxwell's statistics (AHL): 31GP 5G 14A 19PTS


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Old
12-26-2009, 12:33 PM
  #41
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Pleks is making me nervous... always be leary of the guy having a career year during a contract year...


I partial agree with you. When negotiating with Plekanec, Bob must remember that while Plekanec is having a great season to date, there is a really, really, really good chance he is not an every year top ten in the league in assists type player. and should make his offers accordingly.

Any contract with a cap hit over $5M a year for Plekanec really scares me. In a fair world Gainey and Plekanec would come together on a two year deal in the neighbourhood of $4M-$4.5M a year, where afterwards both sides would have a better idea where Plekanecs really value sits.....of course that isn't going to happen...but in a fair world.

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12-26-2009, 12:49 PM
  #42
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Maybe we could sign Plekanec to a 7 year contract, 30 millions. (6.5, 6.5, 5, 5, 3.5, 2.5, 1) Cap hit: 4.28. Quite similar to the Marc Savard deal.

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12-26-2009, 12:53 PM
  #43
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Maybe we could sign Plekanec to a 7 year contract, 30 millions. (6.5, 6.5, 5, 5, 3.5, 2.5, 1) Cap hit: 4.28. Quite similar to the Marc Savard deal.
This would bring him to what 34-35? The odds of him finding a contract at that point will be smaller, and at a reduced salary..

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12-26-2009, 12:57 PM
  #44
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Maybe we could sign Plekanec to a 7 year contract, 30 millions. (6.5, 6.5, 5, 5, 3.5, 2.5, 1) Cap hit: 4.28. Quite similar to the Marc Savard deal.
The difference is their age - Savard will be well past his prime in his last year ~ 40 ... Plekanec will be only 34 in his last year(2 years older than Savard today), 1 Million seems unrealistic. Big difference between 34 and 40.

And I rather have a 27 yr old Plekanec locked-up than a 32 yr old Savard - even though Savard has accomplished more in his career, he's hit his prime - Plek is just entering.

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12-26-2009, 01:34 PM
  #45
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I partial agree with you. When negotiating with Plekanec, Bob must remember that while Plekanec is having a great season to date, there is a really, really, really good chance he is not an every year top ten in the league in assists type player. and should make his offers accordingly.

Any contract with a cap hit over $5M a year for Plekanec really scares me. In a fair world Gainey and Plekanec would come together on a two year deal in the neighbourhood of $4M-$4.5M a year, where afterwards both sides would have a better idea where Plekanecs really value sits.....of course that isn't going to happen...but in a fair world.
interests me to know what the parameters of this "fair world" are?

in my mind, what's "fair" for pleks at this point is for him to test UFAgency and sign with either the highest bidder, or with the team that gives him the best playing situation (linemates, pp role, chance to win).
The team didn't show any confidence in him when they had the chance to sign him to the multiple years he wanted, so now it's only fair that he take whatever "value" he's created for himself this year and get the best contract/situation he can get from it.

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12-26-2009, 01:50 PM
  #46
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The only question I have regarding Plekanec is.. Can he does this next year? Or this just a blip like us finishing #1 in the confernce?

IMO this is what Mr.Gainey is going to have to try and figure out.

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:02 PM
  #47
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The only question I have regarding Plekanec is.. Can he does this next year? Or this just a blip like us finishing #1 in the confernce?

IMO this is what Mr.Gainey is going to have to try and figure out.
Plekanec has been part of the Canadiens "family" since 2001 - if BG can't figure this out by now there are major internal issues

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12-26-2009, 02:09 PM
  #48
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You forgot Benoit Pouliot in the count

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:12 PM
  #49
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You forgot Benoit Pouliot in the count
because I'm not ready to resign him... not after 1 game !

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Old
12-26-2009, 02:19 PM
  #50
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because I'm not ready to resign him... not after 1 game !
If Gainey doesn't resign him, he is basically stating that he traded lats for nothing. Pouliot is an RFA, we will have him next year.

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