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Real reasons this team is where it is

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Old
12-23-2009, 02:06 PM
  #76
GoneFullHextall
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Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
They stood up for each other on the ice, and they knew Upshall would stand up for them. I'm not sure there are many on this team right now who absolutely know who has their back. I'm also hoping that changes in a hell of a hurry, but it's going to take a bit of confidence that comes with winning to get there.
I totally agree with this. To be a real team, a Cup contender, you have to be willing to stick up for each other on the ice. No one says you have to be pals, and drinking buddies with everyone on the team but you have to be willing to spill blood and go to war with the other 19 guys with you. If you cant do that then that is a serious problem.


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Old
12-23-2009, 02:07 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I think you're missing Mike's point. It's not that their egos were wounded and they pouted when he was traded.

Upshall's offensive stats aren't going to win a team anything. But I think the "us against the world" mentality took a hit when he was traded.

They stood up for each other on the ice, and they knew Upshall would stand up for them. I'm not sure there are many on this team right now who absolutely know who has their back. I'm also hoping that changes in a hell of a hurry, but it's going to take a bit of confidence that comes with winning to get there.
Teammates that stand up for each other is just something good teams have. Hell, it something that a lot of bad teams have. It's not as rare as your making it out to be and the loss of a roleplayer shouldn't have had an effect on that. My point still stands... the loss of a player doesn't ruin the psyche of teams that deserve to win. That means that they are a bunch of ****ing ******* lost in the big city.

Now, I don't believe that Upshall was the start of things going bad. This team had deep rooted issues that can objectively be measured while Upshall was here.

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Old
12-23-2009, 02:27 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Valhoun View Post
Teammates that stand up for each other is just something good teams have. Hell, it something that a lot of bad teams have.
You're right that it's not uncommon, but the one thing that is needed is trust between teammates to know that someone has your back. If the guy beside you is someone who has been there for a while, you know without questioning that he'll cover you. If a new guy is there, no matter how good he might be, you don't have that same trust.

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Now, I don't believe that Upshall was the start of things going bad. This team had deep rooted issues that can objectively be measured while Upshall was here.
Definitely agree - there were fundamental problems well before the Upshall trade. The team played well enough to mask them for a while.

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Old
12-23-2009, 04:59 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Valhoun View Post
LOL. You have 14 posts and half of them exist solely to make yourself look like a jackass. Which, while an admirable goal, I guess, is already an established fact and you no longer need to waste any more posts to try and convince people. But, please, continue giving everyone updates on the post count in this thread. It's really an uplifting experience to witness such douchbaggery. It's really what the holiday's are all about.
Douchbaggery? That would be you and your inability to construct an articulate thought and post it in a thread. I read this site, joined, and started a thread. If you don't like it, or don't agree with it......simple, DON'T POST IN IT.

That's what most mature people do. Instead you chose to post juvenile pictures and make fun of the thread. When I was 16 I did that stuff too. Get a life.


EDIT.....
My apologies Valhoun. I responded to your aforementioned post a few moments ago, but after reading past it to the end of the thread I see some well thought out dialogue from you with others.

For a thread you labeled a failure before the first page ended, you seem to be posting in it quite a bit?

Can you say hypocrite?


Last edited by bstreetbully: 12-23-2009 at 05:07 PM.
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Old
12-23-2009, 05:07 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by bstreetbully View Post
Douchbaggery? That would be you and your inability to construct an articulate thought and post it in a thread. I read this site, joined, and started a thread. If you don't like it, or don't agree with it......simple, DON'T POST IN IT.

That's what most mature people do. Instead you chose to post juvenile pictures and make fun of the thread. When I was 16 I did that stuff too. Get a life.
You don't have much experience with the internet, do you?

You seem like the type of person who still calls it the World Wide Web or Information Superhighway and thinks that it's not mainly used for porn, arguing, and the posting of photoshopped pictures.

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Old
12-23-2009, 05:17 PM
  #81
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2009-2010 Philadelphia Flyers: The Legion of Gloom

I like it. I need to get a shirt made.
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you wont
Let's just say that I have more motivation to make that shirt then the Flyers have the will to win games.

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Old
12-23-2009, 05:20 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
Let's just say that I have more motivation to make that shirt then the Flyers have the will to win games.
Ain't that the truth.

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Old
12-23-2009, 05:21 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
Let's just say that I have more motivation to make that shirt then the Flyers have the will to win games.
Win.

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Old
12-23-2009, 05:28 PM
  #84
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Bob Clarke for GM

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Old
12-24-2009, 04:31 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I think you're missing Mike's point. It's not that their egos were wounded and they pouted when he was traded.

Upshall's offensive stats aren't going to win a team anything. But I think the "us against the world" mentality took a hit when he was traded.

They stood up for each other on the ice, and they knew Upshall would stand up for them. I'm not sure there are many on this team right now who absolutely know who has their back. I'm also hoping that changes in a hell of a hurry, but it's going to take a bit of confidence that comes with winning to get there.
i think thats part of it but its more than upshall. we look at this team and think it revolves around richards and carter ala malkin and crosby but thats not who they are. these guys were built around a team mentality. i think alot of the atmosphere was the bonding experience of growing together. coming up and winning the calder and knowing success and then the pressure of the dark year. that group of guys umburger upshall coburn carter and richie and yeah maybe even randy jones plus the additions of hartnell and lupul i think thats the team they identify with and those guys for the most part are gone. proving to themselves and each other that that team can win. when you build a team to play for the front of the jersey and the guy next to you and then poor cap management leads to losing teh guys next to you behind you and in front of you and then the same managemant trades a key supporting player for superstar defenseman i can see why they start feeling cynical and unmotivated.

while we are looking to richards and carter to steup up and play like stars i think theyre looking to briere and gagne. while smith hatcher and knuble were give it all for the team style veterans briere was a supestar free agent and gags an elite goal scorer these guys watched on tv. i think its less about how e see this team as much as how they see themselves.

in the end i think they need to put each player where they can best showcase thier abilities. i think richie is suffering from what i call the primeau effect and overcoming that role confusion will be the first step in turning things around. distinct lines and pairings reinforcing who these players are and what thier roles are on this team.

gagne briere giroux
jvr carter hartnell
carcillo richards powe
asham betts lapi

pronger timo
coburn carle
parent bartulis

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Old
12-26-2009, 01:33 PM
  #86
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In my opinion, the Flyers are probably the 3rd most talented team in the conference. Those that screamed that Stevens was the problem have already been proven wrong. Whether it be a clubhouse issue or not, clearly there is something else wrong with the Flyers.

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12-26-2009, 01:43 PM
  #87
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In my opinion, the Flyers are probably the 3rd most talented team in the conference. Those that screamed that Stevens was the problem have already been proven wrong. Whether it be a clubhouse issue or not, clearly there is something else wrong with the Flyers.
Yes, because a coach's success can be determined in the space of a month and without the benefit of a training camp and having to play in an extremely compressed schedule due to the Olympic break.

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12-27-2009, 09:30 AM
  #88
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Yes, because a coach's success can be determined in the space of a month and without the benefit of a training camp and having to play in an extremely compressed schedule due to the Olympic break.
There are many examples of new coaches having an immediate impact in every sport, including hockey. You can argue that some might be coincidence but they can't all be.

The coach isn't responsible for a player going from 40 something goals to 20 something goals the following year. Something is amiss that goes far deeper than Stevens' shortcomings. I'm not sure I've seen a Flyers team that plays with less passion than the current group.

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12-27-2009, 09:44 AM
  #89
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Originally Posted by chosen View Post
There are many examples of new coaches having an immediate impact in every sport, including hockey. You can argue that some might be coincidence but they can't all be.

The coach isn't responsible for a player going from 40 something goals to 20 something goals the following year. Something is amiss that goes far deeper than Stevens' shortcomings. I'm not sure I've seen a Flyers team that plays with less passion than the current group.
When a coach has lost the room and the team has quit on him, there can be an immediate impact. For example, Crosby and company decided that Therrien was a big, bad meanie and quit. Now, I don't think that Therrien was all that great of a coach... far from it. But you don't have a team turn around that quickly if there are deep seeded flaws to work out. This Flyers team does have such flaws. I am sure that there are numerous variables that were at work. But Stevens, at the very least with even the most lenient point of view, did nothing to mitigate any of the team's issues and, in all likelihood, was one of the bigger issues that the team had. At any rate, out of the problems with the Flyers, he was the easiest to fix (coaches don't have NMC) and one of the bigger ones. He tried to be a friend when the team needed a coach.

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Old
12-27-2009, 10:15 AM
  #90
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Lavi's honeymoon sure has stretched out.

At first it was "we'll see the difference in a couple games". AND WE DID - someone saw all five Flyers on their TV at the same time during a breakout!

Then it was "a couple weeks".

Then it was "ten games".

Now it's "a month" (with a built in fallback for "next training camp").

Ah well, whatever the case, they do have good players and if they can get Emery back strong and avoid injuries they ought to make some good runs and be dangerous in April.

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Old
12-28-2009, 11:08 AM
  #91
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Originally Posted by JXC View Post
Lavi's honeymoon sure has stretched out.

At first it was "we'll see the difference in a couple games". AND WE DID - someone saw all five Flyers on their TV at the same time during a breakout!

Then it was "a couple weeks".

Then it was "ten games".

Now it's "a month" (with a built in fallback for "next training camp").

Ah well, whatever the case, they do have good players and if they can get Emery back strong and avoid injuries they ought to make some good runs and be dangerous in April.
Anyone who thought rationally said ten games right from the start. Lo and behold, they continued to **** the bed for ten games and promptly went on a three game winning streak after those ten games.

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Old
12-28-2009, 11:59 AM
  #92
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Originally Posted by CantSeeColors View Post
Anyone who thought rationally said ten games right from the start. Lo and behold, they continued to **** the bed for ten games and promptly went on a three game winning streak after those ten games.
But, but, but...they're teams they should have beat! They don't count!

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Old
12-28-2009, 12:54 PM
  #93
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Old
12-28-2009, 01:04 PM
  #94
GoneFullHextall
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funny how JXC is saying some of the things after a few weeks that we were saying after 2 and half seasons when Stevens was the coach.
almost ironic.
almost.

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Old
12-28-2009, 03:04 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by chosen View Post
In my opinion, the Flyers are probably the 3rd most talented team in the conference. Those that screamed that Stevens was the problem have already been proven wrong. Whether it be a clubhouse issue or not, clearly there is something else wrong with the Flyers.
Are you even a Flyers fan? IIRC you're not.

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