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Kings lose one vz... the "wild" thoughts and gripes

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Old
12-29-2009, 01:51 PM
  #101
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What drove me nuts in this game was the offense. As i said before Frolov needs to shoot the damn the puck. I dont know maybe Murray needs to burn some of Fro clothes every time he doesn't shoot. Also Simmonds needs learn to stop doing the dump and chance and carry the puck in the zone. Kopitar needs to stop trying skate over to the hole on the wing because he too slow and the defense gets to him every single time, and he loses the puck. Just skating into the zone is a big problem for the Kings. (Simmonds and Kopi) While Frolov does a great job but refuses to shoot the puck. Really guys just need to drive to the net, there was 2 times one with brown when he took a poor angle shot from the side he could have driven into the net and would've created a better scoring chance. Moller also had room to bring the puck in but chose to take a slap shot from damn near the blue line... It's the stuff like that have driven me nuts.

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12-29-2009, 01:53 PM
  #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reaper45 View Post
I thought out of all the defensemen, Drewiske and Johnson were downright horrible last night.
I liked Johnson's game last night. Aside from the pinch... but someone should have back Johnson up there. Realized he was pinching and been in position to cover him in case the Wild broke free. So that was a team error more so then just a Jack Johnson error.

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12-29-2009, 02:11 PM
  #103
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first of all...............

JJ is not the problem...
He is one of the best defenders we ever had.
Hockey is not played by stats and i don't care about his plus -

One of the biggest problem is the coach staff....
We don't force goals, goals happens to us or happens because a personal effort
If everything runs fine... Murray send the Kopitar Smyth line out there and somehow
we win the game......
But if we trailing ... the Kings are so ****ing helplesss.
They just don't know what to do with the pressure they build on.
They always try a wrap around and to push it in with 2 players.
For every wraparound the KIngs doing in crunsh time, Murray deserves 10 slaps with a bamboo stick on his bare foots.

Frolov is asking for a trade.
But this problem is house made. He learned his Hockey from guys like Armstrong and Thornton.. same to Brown and Kopitar.
The dicission to bring in these "no Hockey" players hurts us so badly now.

Kopitar belongs to be benched.. really.

Richardson is the next problem. He has all the tools the Kings are missing in the top 6.
He always gives 100% he scores when anyone else is disapearing, he has the tools to make wingers beside him better (that's not possible with Ivanans and Harrold)
He is lightning fast and he klicks with more than differenty player.
It's time to send him back to a 3 minutes checking line, he is doing to much damage
to the opponent. He makes the other top 6 guys looking stupid.

The next thing is the PP.......
I don't have any clue what the staff is doing there...
Every time when the play forced Johnson and Doughty to the correct side,
they score a one-timer goal.....
But the staff still send them out on their wrong side......
This is absolutely beyond me, the first games i was head scratching...
but now i think this is criminal. The fans giving their hard earned money to the Kings
and they cancel the most dangerous weapon we have at the PP.
28 Teams are jealous because a PP blue line with Johnson and Doughty.
I think this is not only beyond me...

and there is so much more to fix...... Murray is not able to see this or he doesn't wanna see this...

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Old
12-29-2009, 02:40 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
All this talk on Kopitar, yet his coach and I thought he played a dynamic game.
Then both of you need to watch the game again.

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12-29-2009, 03:41 PM
  #105
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Originally Posted by DIEHARD the King fan View Post
Then both of you need to watch the game again.
Nah, Kopitar played fine. Doughty was terrible and Quick should have stopped the Havlat shot.

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12-29-2009, 05:11 PM
  #106
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I have calmed down enough to write a post game article on http://www.lakingsnews.com

Click on the link for the rest.

Quote:
The first thing I thought about after the buzzer sounded ending the game was the grief I may receive from my dear friend Tyler, who is a Minnesota Wild fan, as any good Wisconsin boy should be.

The second thing I thought about was where my friends and I should go to drown our sorrows of this loss as well as the four we have been handed in the last five games.

Injury issues aside for a moment, this game highlighted one very important fact - our best players were not our best players. Ryan Smyth very much gets a pass. He wasn't spectacular out there but he shouldn't be yet coming off his injury. Even at the level he was playing however, he was leaps and a few bounds above Anze Kopitar and Alexander Frolov. Kopitar looked like a shadow of himself. Frolov had defensive lapses and made some odd decisions in the offensive zone when he had opportunities to take high percentage shots.

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Old
12-29-2009, 05:12 PM
  #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Nah, Kopitar played fine. Doughty was terrible and Quick should have stopped the Havlat shot.
Sometimes in hockey there are just freakin' stellar shots that a goalie is not gonna stop. This was one of them.

If anything Johnson didn't put enough pressure on him and angle him off towards the boards, especially with it being a 1 on 3.

Might I suggest re-watching that goal on NHL.com, then come talk to me.

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Old
12-29-2009, 06:07 PM
  #108
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Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Nah, Kopitar played fine. Doughty was terrible and Quick should have stopped the Havlat shot.
Played fine for a 3rd line checker. Seriously go back and watch the game again. I can't remember the last time getting excited about a shot Kopitar actually took. They are all wrist shots along the boards that miss the net.

Watching Havlat made me wish we had him instead of Kopitar. Havlat CREATED his own scoring chances and was physical along the boards. Same build, similar talent, one is playing hockey while the other is not earning his paycheck.

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Old
12-29-2009, 06:08 PM
  #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFKingshomer View Post
Nah, Kopitar played fine. Doughty was terrible and Quick should have stopped the Havlat shot.
Even if he played "fine", you can't win in this league if your #1 center just plays "fine" every game.

Doughty wasn't terrible and that was a hell of a shot by Havlat.

I'm not rough on JJ usually, but he was beyond awful last night. I felt he should have done more to take away the Havlat shot and he was extremely weak behind the net on the 3rd goal. Then, his pinch ultimately was the deciding factor in the game. Why is he pinching in that situation when you just tied the game? I don't want to hear that a forward should have recognized it: he never should have jumped up to begin with.

Sure he scored. All it took was another off-the-mark shot that was fortunate enough to hit the Wild player in the stomach and bounce in. He never uses his legs when he hits...it's all upper-body and it showed on the 3rd goal against: he needs to finish that guy into the glass instead of trying to just shove him as these aren't college and high-school kids out there. He isn't the strongest guy on the ice anymore and he needs to realize it.

Anyways, he was terrible and earned each of those minuses last night. I'm not a "hater" and I don't want to run him out of town or anything, but those of you that try that "+/- doesn't indicate anything ever" or "he plays with Randy Jones" or "his best games are when he is a minus" or "he just jumps on the ice right when the other team gets a breakaway and scores" need to stop embarassing yourselves: especially on the main board.

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Old
12-29-2009, 06:10 PM
  #110
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Frolov is going to excel on another team that is better coached. TM has him so flustered out there about making mistake his only concern is keep the puck along the board avoiding a turnover. He was dominating at times last night but was too scared to do anything more with the puck. Yes he had that one chance going down the middle where he should have shot. Guess thats what happens when playing with a noose around your neck.

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12-29-2009, 06:40 PM
  #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger23 View Post
Frolov is going to excel on another team that is better coached. TM has him so flustered out there about making mistake his only concern is keep the puck along the board avoiding a turnover. He was dominating at times last night but was too scared to do anything more with the puck. Yes he had that one chance going down the middle where he should have shot. Guess thats what happens when playing with a noose around your neck.
I've seen this excuse with every coach. AM has him worried about making a mistake. Crawford benches him, he's on edge. Now TM has him flustered about mistakes. Newsflash: All coaches require their players to be responsible defensively, that's just how it is.

Frolov isn't gripping, and he certainly wasn't scared to do anything with the puck. He just needs to put up points, bottom line. Very few people have his level of talent, he needs to finish. The blame for that falls on Frolov himself, not his coaches. All the Kings' coaches preach shoot-shoot-shoot, and I highly doubt there are any other coaches out there that would tell Frolov to shoot/score more than he already is being told now. There's that old saying to put the puck on net and good things happen. Well, good things aren't happening because he's not putting the puck on the net. It's not the coach, it's not his linemates, it's up to him.

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12-29-2009, 06:43 PM
  #112
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Originally Posted by Fishhead View Post
I've seen this excuse with every coach. AM has him worried about making a mistake. Crawford benches him, he's on edge. Now TM has him flustered about mistakes. Newsflash: All coaches require their players to be responsible defensively, that's just how it is.

Frolov isn't gripping, and he certainly wasn't scared to do anything with the puck. He just needs to put up points, bottom line. Very few people have his level of talent, he needs to finish. The blame for that falls on Frolov himself, not his coaches. All the Kings' coaches preach shoot-shoot-shoot, and I highly doubt there are any other coaches out there that would tell Frolov to shoot/score more than he already is being told now. There's that old saying to put the puck on net and good things happen. Well, good things aren't happening because he's not putting the puck on the net. It's not the coach, it's not his linemates, it's up to him.

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Old
12-29-2009, 07:13 PM
  #113
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The thing that stands out right now is that the secondary scoring is fine.

The primary scorers need to pick it up. As someone said earlier, your best players have to be your best players most nights. That means goals on the board, not just good chances. It will be nice to get Stoll back when he returns.

I still like Frolov and Brown together on a line.

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12-29-2009, 07:19 PM
  #114
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Winger23 View Post
Frolov is going to excel on another team that is better coached. TM has him so flustered out there about making mistake his only concern is keep the puck along the board avoiding a turnover. He was dominating at times last night but was too scared to do anything more with the puck. Yes he had that one chance going down the middle where he should have shot. Guess thats what happens when playing with a noose around your neck.
Sorry , this excuse isn't going to work, same as playing him on the top line because he deserves it or whatever other excuse you want to insert. It ain't the coach(s)... it's Frolov. I've never seen a talented player on a contract year de-valuate himself the way Fro has done. Tony is right, he should have been move last summer.

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12-29-2009, 07:52 PM
  #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan28 View Post
Sorry , this excuse isn't going to work, same as playing him on the top line because he deserves it or whatever other excuse you want to insert. It ain't the coach(s)... it's Frolov. I've never seen a talented player on a contract year de-valuate himself the way Fro has done. Tony is right, he should have been move last summer.
Totally agree. You know what's sad? In the interview where they asked Fro about not making the Russian team, he said he wasn't surprised. He sounded a little bummed, but not as sad as he should be. If he was playing to his ability, he would have been on that team. I expected a little more of a reaction. He just kind of shrugged. Like everyone mentioned, it is a contract year AND an Olympic year. Show some heart Fro.

At this point I can't believe people are STILL making excuses for him. It's the same every year. Fro deserves better. Fro is being picked on by the coaches. It's time for Frolov to either look in the mirror or walk out the door for good. He can go float on another team.

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Old
12-29-2009, 08:05 PM
  #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan28 View Post
Sorry , this excuse isn't going to work, same as playing him on the top line because he deserves it or whatever other excuse you want to insert. It ain't the coach(s)... it's Frolov. I've never seen a talented player on a contract year de-valuate himself the way Fro has done. Tony is right, he should have been move last summer.
tony is not right.

Fro HAS to finish yes, and he and everyone else is struggling to score. but HE has shown up and busted his ass.

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Originally Posted by JBernierFan View Post
Totally agree. You know what's sad? In the interview where they asked Fro about not making the Russian team, he said he wasn't surprised. He sounded a little bummed, but not as sad as he should be. If he was playing to his ability, he would have been on that team. I expected a little more of a reaction. He just kind of shrugged. Like everyone mentioned, it is a contract year AND an Olympic year. Show some heart Fro.

At this point I can't believe people are STILL making excuses for him. It's the same every year. Fro deserves better. Fro is being picked on by the coaches. It's time for Frolov to either look in the mirror or walk out the door for good. He can go float on another team.
a little less talkie and a little more watchie hockey... what was he supposed to do, punch Rich Hammond in the face?

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12-29-2009, 08:35 PM
  #117
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tony is not right.

a little less talkie and a little more watchie hockey... what was he supposed to do, punch Rich Hammond in the face?
I "watchie hockey" plenty. Believe me. I watch every single Kings game and every single Pens game..not to mention other games I can catch on Center Ice or Gamecenter. This has nothing to do with how much hockey I watch.

I expect him to care. Look at Samuelsson's reaction for being left off of Sweden. He was downright pissed. He wanted to play for his country and is disappointed that he didn't make it. Fro? He shrugs like it's no big deal. You can't tell me that you wouldn't like to see a little more fire in Frolov? Of course I don't want him to punch Rich in the face, but at like you F***ing care about SOMETHING.

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12-29-2009, 08:36 PM
  #118
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Originally Posted by wabwat View Post
tony is not right.

Fro HAS to finish yes, and he and everyone else is struggling to score. but HE has shown up and busted his ass.
He may show up then disappear for long streches, but he's not a top 6 forward because he bust his ass.

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12-29-2009, 08:44 PM
  #119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JBernierFan View Post
I "watchie hockey" plenty. Believe me. I watch every single Kings game and every single Pens game..not to mention other games I can catch on Center Ice or Gamecenter. This has nothing to do with how much hockey I watch.

I expect him to care. Look at Samuelsson's reaction for being left off of Sweden. He was downright pissed. He wanted to play for his country and is disappointed that he didn't make it. Fro? He shrugs like it's no big deal. You can't tell me that you wouldn't like to see a little more fire in Frolov? Of course I don't want him to punch Rich in the face, but at like you F***ing care about SOMETHING.
so... that's Samuelsson. did you SEE Frolov shrug anything off? you read a couple of lines of print and drew your own conclusion.

and as far as fire is concerned... Alex has been one of the few forwards on this team with any sort of fire in his game for over a month now.

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12-29-2009, 08:45 PM
  #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan28 View Post
He may show up then disappear for long streches, but he's not a top 6 forward because he bust his ass.

and i just have no idea what you're getting at.

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12-29-2009, 08:46 PM
  #121
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No reason to single out Frolov when many of our top forwards are going into slumps, if Frolov was the only player with scoring problems I could see a reason to single him out but hes not. Murray has to find a way to get his offensive starts going, the fault lies with him. I'm not saying to fire Murray, but he needs to do something to get them going.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kingsfan28 View Post
He may show up then disappear for long stretches, but he's not a top 6 forward because he bust his ass.
If you don't consider Frolov to be a top 6 forward then you can't consider most of our top players to be top 6 forwards. Based on production over previous seasons, he is just as proven as the rest of them.


Last edited by CowMix: 12-29-2009 at 08:51 PM.
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12-29-2009, 08:55 PM
  #122
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so did i.
I thought Drewiske was fairly average. Johnson made some massive defensive blunders and as already pointed out would have shot wide, again, if it wasn't for the Wild defenseman.

I actually thought Scuderi was pretty bad last night.

Honestly, though, I've come to expect this from our defensive core. I don't know what changed from last year, but everyone, Doughty included, makes defensive abortions that end up in our own net. This season's success has been built largely upon our offense and Quick stealing a few third periods.

I know this sounds like a broken record in this thread, but when you're number one center is clipping along at a 0.5 point per game pace, you're going to lose games. I HOPE Kopitar is playing injured, because it just doesn't make sense how he went from completely dominant to completely bad in the course of six weeks.

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12-29-2009, 08:56 PM
  #123
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No reason to single out Frolov when many of our top forwards are going into slumps, if Frolov was the only player with scoring problems I could see a reason to single him out but hes not. Murray has to find a way to get his offensive starts going, the fault lies with him. I'm not saying to fire Murray, but he needs to do something to get them going.



If you don't consider Frolov to be a top 6 forward then you can't consider most of our top players to be top 6 forwards. Based on production over previous seasons, he is just as proven as the rest of them.
For me, it's because Frolov, who was our leading goal scorer last year, is on pace for 19 goals this year. Beyond that, he's not playing a responsible defensive game. In past years, he's always been a good defensive player. He has been a defensive liability several times. I'm not comparing Frolov to anyone but himself. He is not playing up to his ability. Not to mention (and I know +/- isn't everything) he is a -12, second worst on the team (by far). Johnson is the worst with -13, but after him and Frolov, the next player is Ivanans with a -5. If Frolov was either scoring, or playing smart defensively, I wouldn't be as hard on him, but lately, he's sucked at both.

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12-29-2009, 09:06 PM
  #124
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For me, it's because Frolov, who was our leading goal scorer last year, is on pace for 19 goals this year. Beyond that, he's not playing a responsible defensive game. In past years, he's always been a good defensive player. He has been a defensive liability several times. I'm not comparing Frolov to anyone but himself. He is not playing up to his ability. Not to mention (and I know +/- isn't everything) he is a -12, second worst on the team (by far). Johnson is the worst with -13, but after him and Frolov, the next player is Ivanans with a -5. If Frolov was either scoring, or playing smart defensively, I wouldn't be as hard on him, but lately, he's sucked at both.
name ONE play since the one hat got him benched two months ago where he was responsible for a goal against because he's been a defensive liability... and you don't get the going for the stick thing last night either, because 1.) that was a goal no matter which route taken, so unless you're willing to call "liability" on a broken stick... and 2.) you don't get a minus for a powerplay goal against.

you gonna blame his minus on being the furthest forward from the puck on Belanger's game winner last night?

i'll wait.

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12-29-2009, 11:26 PM
  #125
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you gonna blame his minus on being the furthest forward from the puck on Belanger's game winner last night?

i'll wait.
Since when does proximity to the puck relate to how effective a defensive forward in the defensive zone is at doing his job?

All the +- stats are saying is that Frolov isn't scoring. He's on the ice for a lot of goals against and he's not balancing that with scoring at the other end... even though every other forward on the team is managing to keep their +- within reason for a team that's scored 116 and given up 115.

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