HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Edmonton Oilers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Have we ruined Gagner?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
01-03-2010, 12:46 PM
  #51
MerryJ99
Registered User
 
MerryJ99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,151
vCash: 500
He is only 20, so he is having a so-so good season, maybe he will sign for a bit cheaper at this point as his entry level contract is up. Maybe it is a blessing in disguise just like the fact that the Oilers are missing a lot of key players to injury. If we can't win the big prize and that is not happening this year then the next best thing is a top 3 draft pick in my mind! signing Ganger for less is a good thing for the team right now considering how all of the other contracts have gone.

MerryJ99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-03-2010, 12:49 PM
  #52
Six in O6
Registered User
 
Six in O6's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Edmonton
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,491
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmi Jenkins View Post
Probably I mean, he is almost 21, that's what, nearly over the hill in prospect years. Ugh.
August is 8 months away. If 8 months is an 'almost' it'd be summer in Edmonton year round.

Six in O6 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-03-2010, 01:47 PM
  #53
CorpseFX
Registered User
 
CorpseFX's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Milwaukee
Country: Slovakia
Posts: 7,679
vCash: 872
Quote:
Originally Posted by oilerfanatic View Post
I know he's only 20 and only his third year in the league, but lets call a spade a spade:

-he's small
-not a great shot
-not a great skater

We all know his greatest attribute is his ability to read the play, but can above average awareness alone make him a legit nhl'er? The team blows and it's obviously affecting his play, but I have to say the regression is scary. It seems as though he really has nothing else in his skill set to make up for his lack of size. He seems to be mentally weak because he can't even score on shootouts anymore.

was he rushed, overhyped, or is it just to early to tell? I just can't get excited over eberle seeing how gagner's development has gone.

how can you "RUIN" someone when you list his attributes of development that happened pre-Oilers? this board is so ridiculous sometimes. the Oilers didnt ruin Sam Gagner. he just isnt good enough to be as "cool" as everyone thinks/thought.

im sure he'll mature a bit more as the level of competition around the NHL culls, and he is put into new roles. he'll probably get a little stronger and marginally quicker but what you see now is probably going to be what you get. he has no elite physical traits for him to use his hands/thinking. thats not the Oilers fault.

heres the paradox though - if solid veteran cores help "DEVELOP" players through their system - how is a rebuild of all youth going to help the Oilers unless you get the very special players like Crosby and Ovechkin who need only a little veteran "mentoring" and exemplary play to adapt? youth watching youth is going to be a very hard process to "develop" players and coaching (AS WE'VE SEEN) cant do it all.

even before Richards and Carter took off the Flyers had vets around. Crosby had Recchi, Mario and Leclair. Ovechkin could be argued to have very marginal vets around and he still had an amazing rookie season. but again, youre talking a once in a generation talent there who has drive and ability that already rivals vets

imagine how much whining would have gone on around here if Gagner went back to junior after the Fabled Super Series? wow. and then they put him through AHL stuff? people would have been whining non-stop about the glamor boy.

he got his wish to play in the NHL early. he has to put out the effort to create solid relational development with the players on his team also once he took that responsibility.

CorpseFX is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-03-2010, 01:59 PM
  #54
Wheatking
Registered User
 
Wheatking's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Country: Canada
Posts: 15,234
vCash: 500
It's kind of funny how things work around here.

Eberle(19 years old): Dominating the WHL = Endless optimism and excitement.
Gagner(8 months older): On pace for 45+ points in the NHL = Potential bust

Wheatking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-03-2010, 03:47 PM
  #55
Schitzo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,617
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by oilerfanatic View Post
lets call a spade a spade:
That's racist, you know.

Schitzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-03-2010, 04:00 PM
  #56
oilerfanatic
Registered User
 
oilerfanatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Siberia
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,183
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schitzo View Post
That's racist, you know.
no it's not..

The phrase predates the use of the word "spade" as an ethnic slur against African-Americans, which was not recorded until 1928



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/To_call_a_spade_a_spade

oilerfanatic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-03-2010, 04:07 PM
  #57
oilerfanatic
Registered User
 
oilerfanatic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Siberia
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,183
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CorpseFX View Post
how can you "RUIN" someone when you list his attributes of development that happened pre-Oilers? this board is so ridiculous sometimes. the Oilers didnt ruin Sam Gagner. he just isnt good enough to be as "cool" as everyone thinks/thought.

im sure he'll mature a bit more as the level of competition around the NHL culls, and he is put into new roles. he'll probably get a little stronger and marginally quicker but what you see now is probably going to be what you get. he has no elite physical traits for him to use his hands/thinking. thats not the Oilers fault.

heres the paradox though - if solid veteran cores help "DEVELOP" players through their system - how is a rebuild of all youth going to help the Oilers unless you get the very special players like Crosby and Ovechkin who need only a little veteran "mentoring" and exemplary play to adapt? youth watching youth is going to be a very hard process to "develop" players and coaching (AS WE'VE SEEN) cant do it all.

even before Richards and Carter took off the Flyers had vets around. Crosby had Recchi, Mario and Leclair. Ovechkin could be argued to have very marginal vets around and he still had an amazing rookie season. but again, youre talking a once in a generation talent there who has drive and ability that already rivals vets

imagine how much whining would have gone on around here if Gagner went back to junior after the Fabled Super Series? wow. and then they put him through AHL stuff? people would have been whining non-stop about the glamor boy.

he got his wish to play in the NHL early. he has to put out the effort to create solid relational development with the players on his team also once he took that responsibility.
so we agree then that he really doesn't have anything more than "good awareness"...it's not the oilers fault for drafting a slow, smallish player and bypassing a behemoth in voracek who seems to have a greater ceiling based on his size alone?

yeah, having a good solid veteran core helps younger players but i don't think it makes him bigger or faster...gagner's deficiency is not the way he sees the game, it's his lack of physical attributes as you mentioned..

oilerfanatic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-03-2010, 05:40 PM
  #58
Oilers1*
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 2,020
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheatking View Post
It's kind of funny how things work around here.

Eberle(19 years old): Dominating the WHL = Endless optimism and excitement.
Gagner(8 months older): On pace for 45+ points in the NHL = Potential bust
This should be the Hfboards' motto or something.

Oilers1* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-04-2010, 10:14 AM
  #59
Wrecker99
Registered User
 
Wrecker99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Posts: 270
vCash: 500
Gagner has an arrogance about him, and I wonder if there isn't an attitude problem with the kid. Depending on who we draft this year, I wouldn't have a problem trading Gagner for the right player....maybe someone that the Blackhawks can't afford to keep (Barker, Sharp etc).

Wrecker99 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-04-2010, 11:52 AM
  #60
joestevens29
Registered User
 
joestevens29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 25,123
vCash: 50
Not sure we ruined him, it's really hard to say. I don't really agree with bringing in anyone that can't be sent back to the AHL to regain confidence.

Quinn said in the summer that there are players that were brought in too early in the past and he wouldn't be doing the same as past coaches have done. He made it clear that while these players might have the skill offensively what do they do when their WHL moves don't work in the NHL? Then the guys go into a slump and you have no where to put them to regain confidence.

Every player is different and seeing as gagner is looking to put up 40+ once again how can we say he is ruined? Maybe he doesn't end up a top talent, but not all number 6 overall players do.

Brassard
Brule
Montoya
M.Michalek
Upshall
M.Koivu
Hartnell
Finley

Above is a list of former #6 overall players, it's not like Gagner doesn't match up well against that group. And yet which of them really did much better during their 3rd NHL year? Michalek?Koivu?

joestevens29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-04-2010, 11:56 AM
  #61
I am the Liquor
Registered User
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,261
vCash: 8345
What first line center puts up forty points? Besides Horcoff and Gagner I mean?

I am the Liquor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-04-2010, 11:59 AM
  #62
myteammytown
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 508
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wrecker99 View Post
Gagner has an arrogance about him, and I wonder if there isn't an attitude problem with the kid. Depending on who we draft this year, I wouldn't have a problem trading Gagner for the right player....maybe someone that the Blackhawks can't afford to keep (Barker, Sharp etc).




put a million bucks and the life of an NHL player in front of anyone at 18 or 19 and see if they dont develop a bit of an attitude

myteammytown is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-04-2010, 12:04 PM
  #63
joestevens29
Registered User
 
joestevens29's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 25,123
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
What first line center puts up forty points? Besides Horcoff and Gagner I mean?
It's not exactly their fault that they are being played as first liners when they should probably be 2nd liners.

joestevens29 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-04-2010, 12:07 PM
  #64
I am the Liquor
Registered User
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,261
vCash: 8345
Quote:
Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
It's not exactly their fault that they are being played as first liners when they should probably be 2nd liners.
I agree. But that is what is hurting his development more than anything else. He shouldnt have to be the go to guy. That was supposed to be Horcoff, but he cant do it.

I am the Liquor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
01-04-2010, 12:41 PM
  #65
okgooil
HFBoards Sponsor
 
okgooil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Edmonton, AB
Posts: 12,049
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheatking View Post
It's kind of funny how things work around here.

Eberle(19 years old): Dominating the WHL = Endless optimism and excitement.
Gagner(8 months older): On pace for 45+ points in the NHL = Potential bust
Exaclty.

I think this might be the tough luck year that actually really pays off for the oilers.

We will get a high pick and sign a lot of RFA's to really good deals. I could see gags signing a sweet heart deal then tear it up next year.

okgooil is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:33 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.