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Rangers Prospects Thread (NCAA, Juniors, International, ECHL, Other) *Part 2*

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Old
01-07-2010, 11:23 AM
  #51
Bluenote13
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Yeah, that bit stood out to me as well. Interesting to see how expectations differ between Clarke and the actual fan base. I know a majority of posters around here had never seen Stepan, Bourque, or Kreider before, but now they're pegging them as 2/3rds of the 1st line moving forward.

If they all ended up being 2nd line players, that's fantastic, but part of me thinks, "Well, if these guys are supposed to be 2nd liners, what is the organization going to do to address the lack of 1st liners?"
I like what Clark said, doesnt put too much pressure on these kids...yet. If Clark thinks Dubi & Gaby will be Rangers for a longtime playing on the 1st line then what he said last night was correct. 2nd liners. But that doesn't mean Stepan can't steal away the 1st line center position down the road.

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01-07-2010, 11:26 AM
  #52
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Anyone catch the Gordie Clark interview in between periods last night? Thought it was pretty informative. Truly shows how much of a guessing game the Draft truly is.
He seemed genuineley surprised that Stepan ended up captaining the team. Said he thought he was going to make the squad, but didn't know he would be captain.


Also said he didn't know if Kreider and Bourque would make the club, that Kreider was an unknown out of the prep school and all.

Also referred to them, Ethan Werek and Gratchev all as 2nd line players
Eh, it wasn't one of his better interviews.

He only referred to Stepan, Kreider, Grachev(no t), and Werek as second line players because he also referred to Dubinsky and Callahan as first line players... Which is false.

He was also playing coy.

They knew well the potentiual of Stepan and Kreider.

Kreider was one of their most scouted players in recent years, they heavily scouted him.

They knew well of Stepan's well rounded game.

They knew well that Werek was a very good player, when he was drafted they talked about him being a future natural goal scorer.

I don't buy this recent interview where they didn't know what they were getting.

They did their homework, they knew exactly the kinds of players they were getting in those kids.

Again, Gordie was playing coy.

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01-07-2010, 11:26 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I like what Clark said, doesnt put too much pressure on these kids...yet. If Clark thinks Dubi & Gaby will be Rangers for a longtime playing on the 1st line then what he said last night was correct. 2nd liners. But that doesn't mean Stepan can't steal away the 1st line center position down the road.
That's immediately what I thought as well...trying to not build them up too much.

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01-07-2010, 12:06 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I like what Clark said, doesnt put too much pressure on these kids...yet. If Clark thinks Dubi & Gaby will be Rangers for a longtime playing on the 1st line then what he said last night was correct. 2nd liners. But that doesn't mean Stepan can't steal away the 1st line center position down the road.

I think he's saying the right things but how much of it is spin and how much is what he really feels? He wasn't holding back the hype for Grachev early on, what changed? Is he tempering expectations so people aren't disappointed, or does he actually feel that this is their ceiling?

I'm probably reading too much into it, but oh well.

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01-07-2010, 12:11 PM
  #55
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Like I said, he was playing coy in the interview.

There had been several interviews in the past where he sings praises out the wazoo about Stepan, Kreider, Grachev, and Werek.

If they felt they were only getting second line potential, they would not have drafted them.

They drafted them because they have top line potential.

Now, weather or not the top line will be filled, or even second line will be filled when they arrive on the scene is another thing.

It seems like they pick and chose when to laud the kids and when to play coy.

On any random interview Gordie would have lauded them.

I think majority of Ranges fans don't give a rats ass about prospects or the WJC or the draft.

We do, because on this board, we are more educated fans.

So why would he need to hype them in that interview.

When I talk to Rangers fans at MSG or anywhere else in general, usually people never heard of Grachev. And they don't remember who Cherepanov was. Usually he's "oh the Russian that died"

Anyway, just saying. Depending on who he's addressing, I guess he picks and choses his words.

Because, I can find interviews where he says the opposite of what he said last night.

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01-07-2010, 12:24 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Yeah, that bit stood out to me as well. Interesting to see how expectations differ between Clarke and the actual fan base. I know a majority of posters around here had never seen Stepan, Bourque, or Kreider before, but now they're pegging them as 2/3rds of the 1st line moving forward.

If they all ended up being 2nd line players, that's fantastic, but part of me thinks, "Well, if these guys are supposed to be 2nd liners, what is the organization going to do to address the lack of 1st liners?"
Frankly, I took that more to mean that the organization sees them - Kreider, Stepan, Grachev and Werek, (Clark made sure to mention Werek,too) - as at least 2nd liners. The two things that I took notice of was that, 1) he mentioned Dubinsky as a 1st line player, which does not coincide with the perception of some of tbe posters here, and 3) he didn't mention either Anisimov or Callahan as 2nd liners, meaning the organization sees them as 3rd liners.

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01-07-2010, 12:24 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I think he's saying the right things but how much of it is spin and how much is what he really feels? He wasn't holding back the hype for Grachev early on, what changed? Is he tempering expectations so people aren't disappointed, or does he actually feel that this is their ceiling?

I'm probably reading too much into it, but oh well.
I think he feels they are young players and when young players come up they dont play 1st line right away, at least, most don't start that way. So they'll be on the 2nd line behind guys like Gaby and Dubi at first. Down the road they may all challenge for the top spots, but thats getting too far ahead. Potential vs reality on this one, neither is out of the question entirely.

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01-07-2010, 12:46 PM
  #58
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Also, he said Kreider had "natural goal-scoring ability", and that the last two goals of the tournament were "goal-scorer's" goals. He said his staff scouted Kreider heavily, and felt that his production was a result of his ability, and not the quality (or lack thereof) of the competition, which he himself called the lowest form of organized leagues, (that being US high school hockey.)

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01-07-2010, 01:19 PM
  #59
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Don't like the insult to US high school hockey.

Its not that bad.

Not every parent has the money to put their kid through travel league.

As a result, you get some very good talent in the high school ranks.

I watch local travel league games, and kids from the local public high school would own the travel league.

Not sure where else the US is suppossed to target, when developing its players at the 'grass roots' levels.

Again, public HS hockey is more affordable then travel league.

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01-07-2010, 01:26 PM
  #60
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
If they all ended up being 2nd line players, that's fantastic, but part of me thinks, "Well, if these guys are supposed to be 2nd liners, what is the organization going to do to address the lack of 1st liners?"
This is the issue, really. It's a big problem, because at this point, I'm looking at most of these guys as second liners. All impressive players, but I don't see a star among them. We need a superior talent somewhere in that group.

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01-07-2010, 01:45 PM
  #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jas View Post
Also, he said Kreider had "natural goal-scoring ability", and that the last two goals of the tournament were "goal-scorer's" goals. He said his staff scouted Kreider heavily, and felt that his production was a result of his ability, and not the quality (or lack thereof) of the competition, which he himself called the lowest form of organized leagues, (that being US high school hockey.)
Kreiders snipe in that gold medal game was amazing....i might regret a deal involving me trading him in a sim nhl rerate league

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01-07-2010, 02:14 PM
  #62
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This is the issue, really. It's a big problem, because at this point, I'm looking at most of these guys as second liners. All impressive players, but I don't see a star among them. We need a superior talent somewhere in that group.
Do you look at them as such because that is what you see from their talent or because they were drafted by this organization, specifically Sather?

Think about it before you answer, its a fair question considering this organizations past penchant for failing as well as your extreme pessimism.

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01-07-2010, 02:32 PM
  #63
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Keep reading about Kingston making a trade with Saginaw. Both teams have similar records.

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Saginaw-Kingston OHL deal still on the table but one side getting cold feet.
https://twitter.com/loosepucks

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01-07-2010, 02:34 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by McRanger View Post
Do you look at them as such because that is what you see from their talent or because they were drafted by this organization, specifically Sather?

Think about it before you answer, its a fair question considering this organizations past penchant for failing as well as your extreme pessimism.
Stepan - This kid is very solid and I can't wait to see him on this team, he's a smart player. But I don't see top, top talent from him.

Grachev - I think I could see him scoring 25-30, but I don't see him carrying a team, and I came to that conclusion prior to this season.

Kreider - Biggest wildcard. Highest ceiling, IMO. It's too early to tell with him for sure, but I can't say that watching him I immediately was like, "wow, this kid is amazing." I was definitely impressed.

Werek - Loved the pick, still do. Don't see him as a first liner, though.

I like all four. I just don't see that extra something in them.

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01-07-2010, 02:38 PM
  #65
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Kreider is not a "wild card".

Of all the players you listed he's the only one that in a worst case scenario, due to his size, skating, strength, and skill, is a third line NHL player.

And that is if he busts.

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01-07-2010, 02:41 PM
  #66
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Originally Posted by SupersonicMonkey View Post
Kreider is not a "wild card".

Of all the players you listed he's the only one that in a worst case scenario, due to his size, skating, strength, and skill, is a third line NHL player.

And that is if he busts.
no..i think at worst hes an nhl 4th liner...a penalty killing specialist like Sjostrom or Korpedo. his ceiling is enormous though.

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01-07-2010, 02:48 PM
  #67
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no..i think at worst hes an nhl 4th liner...a penalty killing specialist like Sjostrom or Korpedo. his ceiling is enormous though.
Either way, the point is if he busts, he's still a serviceable NHL regular.

Kreider is the safest bet of all of our prospects.

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01-07-2010, 03:28 PM
  #68
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Stepan - This kid is very solid and I can't wait to see him on this team, he's a smart player. But I don't see top, top talent from him.

Grachev - I think I could see him scoring 25-30, but I don't see him carrying a team, and I came to that conclusion prior to this season.

Kreider - Biggest wildcard. Highest ceiling, IMO. It's too early to tell with him for sure, but I can't say that watching him I immediately was like, "wow, this kid is amazing." I was definitely impressed.

Werek - Loved the pick, still do. Don't see him as a first liner, though.

I like all four. I just don't see that extra something in them.
What exactly do you expect? You usually just don't get the sure-fire superstars outside the top-5 in the draft (and even there they are rare). And I think Stepan, Kreider and Grachev could very well turn out to be legit first liners. No Crosbys, Malkins or Ovechkins, but first liners nontheless.

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01-07-2010, 03:29 PM
  #69
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i think it's fair to say that there's no superstar in the Rangers group of prospects. There are several guys who could be really good players and contribute offensively quite well, but there's no Gaborik or Ovechkin or anything like that. Those guys are pretty hard to find unless you get lucky, or you're drafting really high in a good draft.

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01-07-2010, 03:53 PM
  #70
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I love how little attention Grachev gets now that he isn't dominating the AHL at 19.

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01-07-2010, 03:54 PM
  #71
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no..i think at worst hes an nhl 4th liner...a penalty killing specialist like Sjostrom or Korpedo. his ceiling is enormous though.
I've said this time and time again and people still wag their finger at me... well i wag back!

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01-07-2010, 04:00 PM
  #72
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Could see him almost making the bottom pair for Rangers if he works hard in the offseason and Redden and Rozi are turned over for a couple of pucks/picks... im not really picky about which one.
Hard to see that with Sanguinetti in front of him (and deserving.)

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01-07-2010, 04:15 PM
  #73
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I love how little attention Grachev gets now that he isn't dominating the AHL at 19.
Thats fine with me. Leave these kids alone, let them mature, no need to discuss them every week like people do around here.

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01-07-2010, 04:19 PM
  #74
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Michigan coach Red Berenson refers to Hagelin as the team's hardest worker, playing at full speed whether it is in games or in routine practice drills.

In games, Berenson has seen Hagelin skate around defensemen or out-skate them to get to a loose puck, making him Michigan's most dangerous player. Although Hagelin is far from being alone in his desire to do more to improve Michigan's CCHA and NCAA chances, Berenson appreciates Hagelin's attitude to improve on a daily basis.

And if Hagelin's hard work can rub off on his teammates, Berenson believes the Wolverines could be headed for the kind of CCHA run they've become accustomed to over the past two decades.

"We're still challenged by a lot of players on our team that have to play better," Berenson said. "And they will probably tell you the same thing - that they've got to do more. That's a good attitude to have whether how well or how poorly you're playing.

"But it's good to hear your best player say that. They're not going to become complacent. They're going to be pushing themselves all the way, and Carl does that every day."
http://www.annarbor.com/sports/michi...e-second-half/

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01-07-2010, 04:33 PM
  #75
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Originally Posted by ColonialsHockey10 View Post
I love how little attention Grachev gets now that he isn't dominating the AHL at 19.
There's not a whole lot to talk about with him. We always focus discussion on the "hot" prospects; but the people that pay close attention to this thread haven't forgotten about him for sure.

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