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Old
01-11-2010, 12:20 PM
  #76
Melrose_Jr.
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Originally Posted by kennglin13 View Post
-Guys the answer to clearing cap space is simple....
That's not what motivates the potential trades. It's about whether you want to try and get something for these assets that might walk away at the end of the year.

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01-11-2010, 12:21 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by offdacrossbar View Post
nope.

with guys like dubi, drury and cally we have enough 3rd line energy mucker types already. i mean how many penalty killers do we need?

we need a true 1c. someone with enough speed and creativity to play with gaby. actually we need erik christensen to be the "real deal" and not the -flash in the pan 10 game guy who comes back to earth and goes 5 games without a point- like i think hes gonna. it would be great if he could keep this up though.

i like dubi at wing better and always have so hes not your future 1c. arty seems to be the future 2c for now.

if we resign prospal i play him with gaby and all we need is a true 1c for those 2.

next year ya gotta believe ev grachev will have a top 9 wing spot to grab not to mention enver lisin who is making solid progress and will be affordable as well. we have options at the wing.

we need a true impact centerman in the worst way and the higgins money we will save by not resigning him will help us there.
What stinks is we had this exact problem a couple years ago and solved it by giving two centers a combined 14 million dollars+.

What pains me the most is I am sick of being forced to make moves to clear for the future when you'd think after 4 years of playoffs we'd be past this. I am willing to accept that the past two years it's been a different team, but even with Girardi... will we be doing the same thing in a couple years when Sangs, MDZ, or Gilroy are free agents (hopefully not because Redden and Rosy will be gone.. but you never know what good old Glen will do)

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Old
01-11-2010, 12:22 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Edge View Post
I think the flaw with Brooks approach is that the guys you want to sell, you can't.

And it doesn't make sense to sell the players you want to keep, that defeats the whole point.

The Rangers challenge right now is that they may have to dump players they don't want to (Girardi), because they can't dump the guys like they'd like to (Redden, Rozy, etc.).

Personally, I'm interested to see where their discussions with Edmonton about Cogliano are.


Rozsi/Redden for Souray anyone?

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01-11-2010, 12:26 PM
  #79
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I would jump for joy if we sold at the deadline.

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01-11-2010, 12:27 PM
  #80
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I would deal Girardi and Higgins, but keep Prospal. I don't know if he'll stay for a discount next year, but frankly, I feel that if we sneak into the playoffs, Prospal could do a lot of damage for us. The other two are more replaceable. I think we could be smart selling but at the same time maintain our best chance to win this year too. It's a delicate balance.

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01-11-2010, 12:28 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Noone has sold off assets while in a playoff spot? Noone???

I think you should do some research.

Its not only possible, its logical.
to BETTER THEMSELVES FOR THE PLAYOFF RUN.

not for picks and prospects that make the team worse off for the year.

give me a break

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Old
01-11-2010, 12:33 PM
  #82
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Prospal is one of our best contracts right now, and kinda makes up a little bit for one of the crappy ones.

He's on his way to a 60 point season and is basically getting entry level pay..

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01-11-2010, 12:42 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Salz View Post
I would deal Girardi and Higgins, but keep Prospal. I don't know if he'll stay for a discount next year, but frankly, I feel that if we sneak into the playoffs, Prospal could do a lot of damage for us. The other two are more replaceable. I think we could be smart selling but at the same time maintain our best chance to win this year too. It's a delicate balance.
That's pretty much my feeling. I'm not sold yet on trading Prospal. I could see us trying to use Girardi and Higgins in a package to improve this team at the deadline. Not that we will win it all in spring, but seeing how correctly we drafted recently, I think that's worth it to keep fighting for something, we're within reach of the 5th place right now for god's sake. Edge said it well, we may have to move Girardi because of Redden and Rozsival, but I don't think we should wide open our store yet.

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01-11-2010, 12:43 PM
  #84
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I have the same feeling about Girardi and Higgins as I did about Prucha and Dawes last year.... they will probably be moved at the deadline.

However, I'm not sure if they will be traded for picks. I could see Glen using that package to trade for a young player or pending RFA that may help us in the future. I hope he avoids making another Morris/Antropov type deal, it's absolutely pointless to acquire rental vets just to get ousted in the first round again.

As for Prospal, he's not a necessity. There's a chance the Rangers could still make the playoffs without him - he does great on Gabby's line but has been ineffective on other lines. The team is managing to win games in his absence. Trade him for a pick or prospects. If he likes it here so much he can come back next year for another $1.15 million year, doubt that happens though.

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01-11-2010, 12:48 PM
  #85
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I'd gladly take Souray if Sather can use his mind tricks to somehow dump Rozsival to get it done.

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01-11-2010, 12:49 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
As for Prospal, he's not a necessity. There's a chance the Rangers could still make the playoffs without him - he does great on Gabby's line but has been ineffective on other lines. The team is managing to win games in his absence. Trade him for a pick or prospects. If he likes it here so much he can come back next year for another $1.15 million year, doubt that happens though.
Renting a player out will almost certainly eliminate the possibility of him coming back to play for a discount.

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01-11-2010, 12:51 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Edge View Post
I think the flaw with Brooks approach is that the guys you want to sell, you can't.

And it doesn't make sense to sell the players you want to keep, that defeats the whole point.

The Rangers challenge right now is that they may have to dump players they don't want to (Girardi), because they can't dump the guys like they'd like to (Redden, Rozy, etc.).

Personally, I'm interested to see where their discussions with Edmonton about Cogliano are.
I am more intrigued by the Peter Mueller rumor you dropped a month ago. If Dubi's future is 1st line LW, bringing in Mueller would be a natural fit. I posed this question earlier, but, I wonder if Phoenix might be interested in Prospal for scoring/veteran leadership?

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01-11-2010, 12:54 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by jas View Post
I am more intrigued by the Peter Mueller rumor you dropped a month ago. If Dubi's future is 1st line LW, bringing in Mueller would be a natural fit. I posed this question earlier, but, I wonder if Phoenix might be interested in Prospal for scoring/veteran leadership?
My understanding is that, for right now, the Mueller deal is nowhere. I've heard conflicts about the hold-up (one has it as a player, the other a pick).

However, I think I am far more interested in the Cogliano rumors at this point.

If they found a way to land him, and put him between Gaborik and Dubinsky, I think he would be awesome.

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01-11-2010, 12:59 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by f2d View Post
Renting a player out will almost certainly eliminate the possibility of him coming back to play for a discount.
Not necessarily.

Tampa traded Prospal to Philly at the deadline a few years ago and he re-signed with the Lightning.

Tkachuk and Weight have done the same thing.

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01-11-2010, 01:16 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by OverTheCap View Post
Not necessarily.

Tampa traded Prospal to Philly at the deadline a few years ago and he re-signed with the Lightning.

Tkachuk and Weight have done the same thing.
And we all remember Rucinsky.

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Old
01-11-2010, 01:18 PM
  #91
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.

The likelyhood of the Rangers selling while in the PO picture is very slim however sould the logic may be.

That said, should we start losing again once we start facing tougher competition, we really have to look at dealing guys.

Prospal has taken a nice discount this year, lets not expect that to happen again next summer should get post a 60+ point season, which I don't think he will do even though he is on pace for 62 points.)

In fact, I could all but guarantee that he looks for and get an offer in the 3-3.5 million range.

I would tell him now that I would be willing to give him a 2 year deal for 7 million, but that I am going to trade him to get a decent pick.

While that conversation couldn't be made public, I'm sure the Blues had a very similar one with Keith Tkachuk before dealing him.

However, Sather trying to convince Dolan to forefit 2 maybe 3 home PO games (not getting out of the 1st round no matter who they play) would also be convincing Dolan that he (Sather) failed in constructing a good team for the 10th year in a row.

While the article is logical and the suggestion to move spare parts and impending UFA's makes sense, Sather is never going to do it.

I really cannot wait for the Sather era to end.

Same goes for this ownership group.

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Old
01-11-2010, 01:22 PM
  #92
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Of all the players mentioned as possible trade bate, Girardi makes the most sense to me. This is not a condemnation on Dan's play - far from it, I'm a Girardi fan - but we have to face up to some facts here:

1. The Rangers do have a cap crunch facing them in the face. We'd all love to solve it by moving a Roszival or a Redden, but assuming that such a move is possible is a bad idea. If it can be done, great, but it should not be banked on.
2. Girardi's contract is up and he will be due for a raise. Dan's a solid defensemen, a precious commodity in this league, but Staal is the priority here.
3. Girardi is replaceable. There's a guy sitting in Hartford that is ready to step in and take Girardi's minutes, and has a higher ceiling. There's also a guy in Wisconsin that's ready to step in and replace Sanguinetti in Hartford, and in the general pipeline. The infrastructure is there to sustain Girardi's loss.
4. Girardi has some value: he's a solid second pairing defensemen under 26, you can probably get a reasonable asset for him.

Now if you can move one of the dreaded R's and keep Dan then that should be done, but I'm not optimistic that such a move can be made. I know that everyone likes to cite the Gomez trade, but the difference is that Gomez is actually a good player, he was just overpaid. Roszival and Redden are borderline crappy players. It's one thing to move a second line center making first line money, it's another to move a bottom pairing defensemen making first pairing money.

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01-11-2010, 01:26 PM
  #93
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Dolan will not let Sather become a seller. Dolan demands those two playoff home game$!

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Old
01-11-2010, 01:29 PM
  #94
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I think some of you are out of your minds. You wouldn't give up two months of Prospal for a late 1st or 2nd round pick?!? Vinny Prospal right now is the ideal deadline addition for teams in the hunt. He's got a fiery attitude, he's putting up lots of points and he's got a tiny cap hit attached.

I would love to re-sign Prospal next season to a two year deal even if it's over 3 mil per. And I don't think trading him at the deadline is going to interfere. He's not a teenager, he'll understand.

Personally I think it's ridiculous to believe that the Rangers have a legit shot at the cup this year but what's even more ridiculous is the idea that Prospal/Higgins/Girardi are essential cogs in our cup winning machine.

It seems like we're finally doing some good drafting in this organization- let's get as many picks as we can at the deadline - We've got Gaborik and Hank locked up for years to come. We've got great prospects in the system - the future is bright. Let's make it brighter.

Stop being so afraid of the word "sell."

Rangers with Prospal/Higgins/Girardi winning the cup this year: we'd need a miracle.
Rangers without Prospal/Higgins/Girardi winning the cup this year: we'd need a miracle.

SELL.

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Old
01-11-2010, 01:30 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by GarretJoseph View Post
Came close to beating the Caps last year.

I believe we can beat the Debbies.

No on the Penguins.
False, the York Rangers did not come close to beating the caps.

Henrik Lundqvist came close to beating the Caps and thats about it. If that team was worth a damn and could maybe score at anything but a meager amount then yes the team would have come close.

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Old
01-11-2010, 01:33 PM
  #96
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rosival is movable to an uncapped team (or a team having problems with the cap floor) since in the next 2 years he's getting 7 million salary for a 10 million cap hit.

redden's getting 6.5/6.5/5/5 for the next 4 years for a 6.5 cap hit a year, but yeah.. moving a bottom pairing defenseman making that much? Not counting on it. Especially since having cash as part of a trade isn't allowed anymore. Otherwise we could probably pay off a team to eat his contract for us...

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Old
01-11-2010, 01:40 PM
  #97
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I think Brooks is right in theory but I don't see Sather looking at the big picture. The shorter term prospect of making the playoffs is going to be the direction he goes in and I can see him trying to make moves instead.

In that respect as well the Rangers have young assets beyond Girardi, Higgins etc. that may be seen as redundant such as a Sanguinetti who they could deal without really hurting the talent pool they've been building.

In any case I still like where Brooks is going. It makes the most sense because playoffs or not this team is not going to beat the Caps or the Penguins. It's just that judging Sather by his past it seems (at least at this moment) extremely unlikely.

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01-11-2010, 01:59 PM
  #98
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Since we can't move Roszival and Redden, Girardi has now become the whipping boy? We're putting too much faith into our unproven depth. Sangs will not be a better defenseman than Girardi. The kid reminds me of Malahkov, so much. Heikkenen will be a good 5, 6 defenseman.

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01-11-2010, 02:00 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by pwoz View Post
He makes a good point about Prospal, but I think Prospal loves it in NY. I've never seen a happier "I SCORED!" face.

Higgins should attract at least a third, or maybe paired with Girardi something more.
I'd love to get a low-20s pick for Girardi and Higgins. For a team trying to win the Cup, it's a good pick up, while for the Rangers, it could give us a second shot in the first round.

Also, Prospal and Brash (and Kotalik if they want him) for a low 20s pick? Maybe it's too much, but maybe Slats can pull it off.

Would be really great to get three first rounders to keep our prospects at the top once DZ, AA and Gilroy graduate. More importantly, it would allow the Rangers three attempts to get a first or second line right winger.

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Old
01-11-2010, 02:03 PM
  #100
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Prospal was traded for Alexandre Picard and a 2nd round pick at the 2008 trade deadline. However, he scored 29 goals at the time of the deadline, and has only 8 goals so far this season. He has a decent amount of assists but that's largely because he's a beneficiary of playing with Gaborik. If other teams realize that, the Rangers definitely will not be getting a 2nd round pick for Prospal.

However, I would still advocate trading Prospal for a 3rd or 4th round pick. I don't think he's as important to this team as others make him out to be. Prospal needs Gaborik a lot more than Gaborik needs him.

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