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Skate woes - help! (flat footers needed)

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01-11-2010, 05:15 PM
  #1
wondeROY
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Skate woes - help! (flat footers needed)

Ok im in need of some desperate help here, or else I can forget about playing hockey. So here it goes, about 7 years ago i bought a pair of Bauer Vapor 3 Skates, brand new. I skated on them maybe 3x, then they sat in a closet for 6 years and just recently have i started skating again. So basically the skates are 7 years old but are in brand new condition, literally, they look brand new still.

Fast forward to a couple weeks ago, i began skating again, about 2-3x a week, i alternated my lacing so many different ways and times i can't even begin to tell you. The problem is, I was getting severe shin pains and the shin muscle on the outside-ish of each shin would become incredibly tight and would burn like hell. To the point that it basically enables me to skate. I read some stuff that it could be lace bite, shin splints, etc. I tried lacing the skates from out-to-in to alleviate the lace bite, that didn't really make any difference.

There was one tip that helped a tiny bit, which was leaving the top eyelet unlaced, however, that made my skates way too flimsy and felt like i could roll an ankle like that, and just felt a lack of control. So unlacing the top eyelet is out of the question. One other thing i am very flat footed, I hope this doesn't keep me from playing.

So my question is, has anyone experienced this shin pain and what is there i can do? And, is it possible my skates are the culprit? I'm afraid to buy new skates only to have the same problem, my skates are very comfortable, I have had them baked and punched out, they fit me great, but i'm wondering if they are the problem. On top of that, the problem wont surface unless i'm actually skating, i can put on my skates in the house and walk around and the pain wont come, so i'm afraid of trying on new skates, they would feel fine walking in, but wont hurt until i skate. I'm totally lost what to do besides go seeing a foot doctor.

Anyone have any ideas or input?

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01-11-2010, 05:38 PM
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That one eyelet hurts your skating that much? Not to say you are wrong or nothing, you obviously feel uncomfortable leaving an open eyelet but i dont even have to really tighten my skates and can skate fine without worrying about rolling an ankle.

Could it be ankle strength? or lack there of?
Could it be your general skating ability or "style" is putting your legs in an unnatural position, or i should say, an unfamiliar position which is leading to pain?
When you skate, do you make more of a "running motion" (i know it is stretching it, but some adults do skate like this) or a "striding" motion.

mind you flat feet are the leading cause of shin splints.

"Flat feet causes the posterior tibialis and other muscles of the medial shin to become overstretched, weakened, and inflamed. By strengthening these muscles, it is possible to restore the medial arch of the foot alleviating medial shin pain. It is best to discuss how to strengthen these muscles with a physiotherapist or athletic therapist."


Last edited by CanadaBacon: 01-11-2010 at 05:50 PM.
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01-11-2010, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by CanadaBacon View Post
That one eyelet hurts your skating that much?
Yes, the skate becomes very wobbly, i get the feeling my skates dont have a very high boot, looking at other modern skates it seems they go higher up the leg and have more eyelets up high. As to where mine only have 3 eyelets after the ankle bend starts. Leaving the top one undone makes them to unsupportive.

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01-11-2010, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by wondeROY View Post
Yes, the skate becomes very wobbly, i get the feeling my skates dont have a very high boot, looking at other modern skates it seems they go higher up the leg and have more eyelets up high. As to where mine only have 3 eyelets after the ankle bend starts. Leaving the top one undone makes them to unsupportive.
added more stuff to that post.

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01-11-2010, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by CanadaBacon View Post
That one eyelet hurts your skating that much? Not to say you are wrong or nothing, you obviously feel uncomfortable leaving an open eyelet but i dont even have to really tighten my skates and can skate fine without worrying about rolling an ankle.

Could it be ankle strength? or lack there of?
Could it be your general skating ability or "style" is putting your legs in an unnatural position, or i should say, an unfamiliar position which is leading to pain?
When you skate, do you make more of a "running motion" (i know it is stretching it, but some adults do skate like this) or a "striding" motion.

mind you flat feet are the leading cause of shin splints.

"Flat feet causes the posterior tibialis and other muscles of the medial shin to become overstretched, weakened, and inflamed. By strengthening these muscles, it is possible to restore the medial arch of the foot alleviating medial shin pain. It is best to discuss how to strengthen these muscles with a physiotherapist or athletic therapist."
The last time I went to a dr he actually told me I have very strong ankles, pretty strange but thats what he told me. I dont think my skating style is bad or wierd, its the one thing i picked up pretty quickly and feels pretty natural. Back to the eyelet thing, perhaps my skates are just too outdated even they are in like new condition. I know my flat feet are a part of the problem, I bought one pair of arch supports but couldn't fit them into my skate bed. I just hate to spend a small fortune on new skates and have the same problem.

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01-11-2010, 06:44 PM
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anyone else have this pain? Am i the only person? lol

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01-11-2010, 07:40 PM
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did you read my reply to the first thread you started about this problem?

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01-11-2010, 07:47 PM
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did you read my reply to the first thread you started about this problem?
oops, i did just now see that, i lost that thread somehow, i did try lacing them up tighter around the front part, but just seemed to hurt my feet more. I dont think they are too wide, however i do think my toes might be coming up a bit when i start to fall back. Someone suggested to try the superfeet insoles, i'm going to try a pair of them out and see if they help. I can only hope.

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01-11-2010, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by wondeROY View Post
oops, i did just now see that, i lost that thread somehow, i did try lacing them up tighter around the front part, but just seemed to hurt my feet more. I dont think they are too wide, however i do think my toes might be coming up a bit when i start to fall back. Someone suggested to try the superfeet insoles, i'm going to try a pair of them out and see if they help. I can only hope.
Sounds like you have a volume problem. Superfeet eat up volume in the skate.

Get yourself into a shop to be properly fitted.

Also, when you're walking around in the house are you bending your knees as deep as you would when you skate?

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01-11-2010, 10:56 PM
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Sounds like you have a volume problem. Superfeet eat up volume in the skate.

Get yourself into a shop to be properly fitted.

Also, when you're walking around in the house are you bending your knees as deep as you would when you skate?
You might be onto something, i doubt i bend my knees at home as much, its really just hard to replicate skating at home walking on carpet. Another thing is, i notice the inflammation doesnt start until i really start pushing it, if i'm just lightly skating it wont bother me, but once i start pushing it then it flares up and becomes painful as hell.

My feet are weird, they are pretty wide but not very long, and flat. I'm hoping the superfeet will help. If not i'll be looking into new skates.

I did get input from a DR tonight, he said most likely my problem is whats called "lactic acid buildup" in my tibialis anterior, commonly mistaken for shin splints. He said to stretch the muscle by dragging the toes along the carpet, bent downward, drink lots of fluids and massage the muscle. And get this, to take tums or rolaids before i skate, they are antacids and will help tremendously with the build up. He said olympic athletes get tested for them because they work so well.

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01-11-2010, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by wondeROY View Post
You might be onto something, i doubt i bend my knees at home as much, its really just hard to replicate skating at home walking on carpet. Another thing is, i notice the inflammation doesnt start until i really start pushing it, if i'm just lightly skating it wont bother me, but once i start pushing it then it flares up and becomes painful as hell.

My feet are weird, they are pretty wide but not very long, and flat. I'm hoping the superfeet will help. If not i'll be looking into new skates.

I did get input from a DR tonight, he said most likely my problem is whats called "lactic acid buildup" in my tibialis anterior, commonly mistaken for shin splints. He said to stretch the muscle by dragging the toes along the carpet, bent downward, drink lots of fluids and massage the muscle. And get this, to take tums or rolaids before i skate, they are antacids and will help tremendously with the build up. He said olympic athletes get tested for them because they work so well.
Superfeet are great if you're having issues with the arch.

Lactic acid seems like an odd diagnosis, but he's the doctor, not me, so give that a shot.

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01-12-2010, 12:02 AM
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Originally Posted by wondeROY View Post
anyone else have this pain? Am i the only person? lol
http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=722095

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01-12-2010, 12:08 AM
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Interesting, appears we have the same problem. Have you been able to alleviate any of your pains?

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01-12-2010, 06:58 AM
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Originally Posted by wondeROY View Post
Interesting, appears we have the same problem. Have you been able to alleviate any of your pains?
No unfortunately not completely. I also don't know anybody who has similar problems.

Those make things better:
- warm-up with a jumping rope (in a beer league )
- start slowly on the ice
- untighten the skates after 10 minutes during 5 minutes, tighten skates strongly after
- dont' tighten the shin guards too much
- get drunk the day before

I have this with different types of skates (all high end, Grafs and Bauer Vapor) and also with inline skates. Its worse when it's really cold.
My feet do not like skates that are too tight.
I do not workout, practice once a week, 1 game per week, pickup hockey with my kids once/twice a week. I practice some other sports (alpine skiing and others) and am in rather good shape. I have learnt to live with it and generally start scoring after half the game is over (when the other guys start getting tired).

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01-12-2010, 09:46 AM
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Do you feel like your skates fit properly?

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01-12-2010, 09:52 AM
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With regard to the lace thing, try leaving the second-from-top eyelets unlaced, i.e. skip them when you're lacing your skates. You'll still get the support of the top eyelet, but you'll alleviate a bit of the pressure on your ankle.

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01-12-2010, 11:53 AM
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Do you feel like your skates fit properly?
They are comfortable, do they fit good, yes, perfect, maybe not, there might be some free space width wise around the toes, but overall i think they are a good fit, the heel locks in nicely, but i'm gonna try the superfeet insole and see what i think.

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With regard to the lace thing, try leaving the second-from-top eyelets unlaced, i.e. skip them when you're lacing your skates. You'll still get the support of the top eyelet, but you'll alleviate a bit of the pressure on your ankle.
I'll give that a shot, thanks.

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01-14-2010, 10:44 PM
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I suspect that the problem may be your skates. I have pretty low arches/wide foot myself and had almost always experienced some pain skating. A couple of years ago I went to a very good shop to get fitted for skates. The guy who fitted me said that Bauer skates generally fit narrow feet best whereas CCM have a little more room and are better if you have a wider foot like mine. In any event, I bought some CCM skates. They were heatmolded to my foot (and, although I wear orthotics, I don't wear an insert in my skate and only wear a thin sock). Best skates I have ever had - I have never had any foot pain since and, thinking back, I had been using Bauer skates for a long time. IIn the past couple of years I have also found out that ski boot manufacturers also use different templates for foot sizes so that you want to try on boots from different manufacturers to see what works best for your particular foot. In any event, I am not sure if the skate manufacturers are still doing things the same way; however, you might get the most relief for your feet by looking into getting a different pair of skates. Hope this helps. Cheers.

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01-14-2010, 11:06 PM
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I found the antacid info very interesting ... Tums or Rol-Aids huh?

I never knew that. Eliminate lactic acid buildup with antacids lmao .... awesome.

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01-15-2010, 12:08 AM
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I found the antacid info very interesting ... Tums or Rol-Aids huh?

I never knew that. Eliminate lactic acid buildup with antacids lmao .... awesome.



Yeah, and I can win the lottery using a magical computer program

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01-15-2010, 12:12 AM
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[/B]

Yeah, and I can win the lottery using a magical computer program
It is actually true, research it via Google and read about it. I found it to very interesting though one needs a lot of baking soda to accomplish good results as far as athletic advantage over others goes.

in this case helping a small muscle issue for him .... and his DOCTOR told him to should be fine with this antacid thing.

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01-15-2010, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mickle View Post
I suspect that the problem may be your skates. I have pretty low arches/wide foot myself and had almost always experienced some pain skating. A couple of years ago I went to a very good shop to get fitted for skates. The guy who fitted me said that Bauer skates generally fit narrow feet best whereas CCM have a little more room and are better if you have a wider foot like mine. In any event, I bought some CCM skates. They were heatmolded to my foot (and, although I wear orthotics, I don't wear an insert in my skate and only wear a thin sock). Best skates I have ever had - I have never had any foot pain since and, thinking back, I had been using Bauer skates for a long time. IIn the past couple of years I have also found out that ski boot manufacturers also use different templates for foot sizes so that you want to try on boots from different manufacturers to see what works best for your particular foot. In any event, I am not sure if the skate manufacturers are still doing things the same way; however, you might get the most relief for your feet by looking into getting a different pair of skates. Hope this helps. Cheers.
Thanks for the info, i'm going to try on some different skates tomorrow and i'm bringing my bauers with me to do a comparison.


Quote:
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I found the antacid info very interesting ... Tums or Rol-Aids huh?

I never knew that. Eliminate lactic acid buildup with antacids lmao .... awesome.
Yeah either or, should do the same thing.

And an up update on my issue. I picked up the Superfeet insoles, and took some tums before my skate, there was some slight improvement, still some pain though. I have come to realize after several lacing jobs, that keeping the top eyelet unlaced is the only way to curb the pain. With the top eyelet unlaced the pain is almost gone. However there is a lack of support with my skates that way, unless i crank the hell out of the laces around the ankle area. Perhaps something i could get used to. I'm going to my LHS tomorrow and gonna try on some skates to see how they feel, if i'm blown away i might pick up a pair, if not i'll stick with what I have a keep the top eyelet unlaced and learn to live with it.

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01-15-2010, 03:43 PM
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best thing you could do would be to get a pair of orthotics made for your skates.

i have very flat feet, and wear orthotics everyday. while my running shoe orthotics dont fit in my skate properly (shoe orthotics are usually wider than skates), my foot doctor guy said that they make orthotics specifically for hockey skates.

i used to try and get by playing rugby and soccer without orthotics, but i was constantly in pain. i got orthotics for my cleats and no longer faced the aches and pains.

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01-15-2010, 04:29 PM
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best thing you could do would be to get a pair of orthotics made for your skates.

i have very flat feet, and wear orthotics everyday. while my running shoe orthotics dont fit in my skate properly (shoe orthotics are usually wider than skates), my foot doctor guy said that they make orthotics specifically for hockey skates.

i used to try and get by playing rugby and soccer without orthotics, but i was constantly in pain. i got orthotics for my cleats and no longer faced the aches and pains.
The Superfeet -Yellow insoles I got, are specifically made for hockey skates, they fit incredibly well. They were $35 at my LHS and def worth it. Like i mentioned before, there was some improvement with them, next step is to consider new skates.

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01-17-2010, 11:02 PM
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Update: Well it would occur that i knew less about my skate fitment then i had thought.

I skated with the Superfeet insoles on saturday at stick n puck, for about 3 hours, i found the only way to rid of the shin pain was to unlace the top eyelet, which was great no more shin pain, but in turn had to tighten the hell out of the ankle area, which gave me incredible foot pains generally all over the foot and on top...etc. And the support just never felt right, felt like my ankle wasn't properly locked in and just too much slop without the top eyelet laced... After that I had enough, after my stick time I drove to my LHS, who is awesome by the way...

Walked in with my skates and talked to them about my situation, they took a look at my skates and my feet, he noticed the skates were a 7.5D, then decided to have my feet measured and fitted...well guess what I'm a 6.5, not a 7, or a 7.5. Apparently when i bought my bauers several years ago I wasn't at a very good shop, nor do I even remember being fitted..so there you have it, i had a skate that was one full size too big.

I tried only probably 6 different pairs of skates, they had a beautiful pair of Easton S16 (or 17?) that retailed at $500 but on sale for $299, i tried them on and they simply did not like my ankles, they pinched like hell and just didnt fit my foot. Shame cause they were incredibly light! Tried on a couple CCM skates, Bauer X??, then finally the RBK 5k, putting them on was like putting my head on a down pillow, incredible fit and amazing comfort. Walked around on them for a good 15 minutes and they only got better. Knew this was the pair and had them bake them and that was that.

They were on sale for $209 + tax, plus 5 free sharpenings, which was a steal i felt. I'm skating on them either monday or tuesday night, after I get my first skate in I'll post an update. But i'm quite confident these will cure my ailments.
Thanks for everyones input, some of you guys were right, just needed proper fitting skates.

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