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Old
01-17-2010, 04:47 PM
  #26
In The Flesh
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I don't think the other team does any of these deals.

- Higgins for Artyukhin would be alright, would rather have Mike Brown if ANA was willing.
- No need for Belak, we'll sign John Scott in the offseason, Brash to retire or Hartford.

Most important thing we should pursue this offseason is to try and take Adv. of Chicago's cap issues and do whatever we can to get Byfuglien. Not sure what it will take.


Last edited by In The Flesh: 01-17-2010 at 04:57 PM.
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Old
01-17-2010, 04:56 PM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
why not? if hes not on the active roster why would he count against the cap?
The 35-and-Older Clause:

* When a player aged 35 or older signs a multi-year contract, his average salary is counted against the team's salary cap during every year of the contract, even if the player retires before the contract is up.
* If the player is sent to the minor leagues, his cap hit is reduced by $100,000.

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Old
01-17-2010, 04:57 PM
  #28
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I'd be thrilled if this was our team next season

Buff Dubinsky Gaborik
Avery AA C. Armstrong (UFA)
Grachev Drury Callahan
Byers Boyle Scott (UFA)
Voros

Staal DZ
Girardi Gilroy
Redden Sanguinetti/Sauer

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Old
01-17-2010, 04:58 PM
  #29
Richie Rich
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No Christensen?

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Old
01-17-2010, 04:59 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
i dont see us packing it in this year if we are close to a playoff spot at the deadline.

could a possible trade of roszival and girardi to anaheim for marchant+ work out for both sides? anaheim doesnt have the issues with this cap wise but maybe they would prefer to look elsewhere.

try and trade kotalik at the draft.

Ilya Kovalchuk ($8.000m)/ Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)/ Ryan Callahan ($2.300m)
Evgeny Grachev ($0.933m) / Chris Drury ($7m) / Enver Lisin ($1m)
Donald Brashear ($1.400m) / Todd Marchant (1.125m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)

extra: Aaron Voros ($1m)

Marc Staal ($3.000m) / Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m)
Wade Redden ($6.500m) / Matt Gilroy ($1.750m)
Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m) / Michael Sauer ($0.850m)


Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Chad Johnson ($0.850m)

57.16m cap hit for next year.
To answer your other post, brash is a 35+ signing so the hit counts regardless on a multiyear deal. Your proposed d is way too young. You also seem to view rozy as a straight dump (using dan as a sweetner for marchant of all people), where he may be able to fetch a worthwhile return. I'm calling rozy to atl in a deal similar to the kubina deal last summer, it'll work out for both teams
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Old
01-17-2010, 05:05 PM
  #31
ecemleafs
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Richter35 View Post
To answer your other post, brash is a 35+ signing so the hit counts regardless on a multiyear deal. Your proposed d is way too young. You also seem to view rozy as a straight dump (using dan as a sweetner for marchant of all people), where he may be able to fetch a worthwhile return. I'm calling rozy to atl in a deal similar to the kubina deal last summer, it'll work out for both teams
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i included a + next to marchant. obviously trying to get the most out of anaheim but i dont know how much sather could get. sanguinetti and sauer replace rozy and girardi. younger, true....but mdz staal and gilroy will have more experience and id take that cost to acquire kovalchuk.

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Old
01-17-2010, 05:19 PM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
i dont see us packing it in this year if we are close to a playoff spot at the deadline.

could a possible trade of roszival and girardi to anaheim for marchant+ work out for both sides? anaheim doesnt have the issues with this cap wise but maybe they would prefer to look elsewhere.

try and trade kotalik at the draft.

Ilya Kovalchuk ($8.000m)/ Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)/ Ryan Callahan ($2.300m)
Evgeny Grachev ($0.933m) / Chris Drury ($7m) / Enver Lisin ($1m)
Donald Brashear ($1.400m) / Todd Marchant (1.125m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)

extra: Aaron Voros ($1m)

Marc Staal ($3.000m) / Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m)
Wade Redden ($6.500m) / Matt Gilroy ($1.750m)
Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m) / Michael Sauer ($0.850m)


Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m)
Chad Johnson ($0.850m)

57.16m cap hit for next year.
I doubt Redden is on the team next year. I say Sather finally gets over his major ego and send him packing to Hartford.

McDonaugh will be one of the D-man. Sanguinetti will get traded. I don't think Tortorella is a big Sauer fan. He got cut quick in pre-season. Think Girardi is re-signed.

Staal Girardi
Del Zotto Gilroy
McDonaugh veteran-d

I agree on the Rangers getting Kovalchuk. Especially with Redden and possibly Rozsival being gone. I would love to see Grachev but anything short of a big second half this year and a big showing in pre-season, he will spend next year in Hartford.

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Old
01-17-2010, 05:48 PM
  #33
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Give Bobby Ryan an offer sheet.

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Old
01-17-2010, 05:50 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Renegade of Funk View Post
Give Bobby Ryan an offer sheet.
id imagine anaheim would match anything that doesnt get them 4 firsts

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Old
01-17-2010, 05:53 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ecemleafs View Post
id imagine anaheim would match anything that doesnt get them 4 firsts
Yea I see that happening too but I can dream can't I? haha

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Old
01-17-2010, 08:22 PM
  #36
In The Flesh
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Originally Posted by Renegade of Funk View Post
No Christensen?
forgot him, maybe, depends if Grachev is ready

if we can get anything for him at the deadline, deal em

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Old
01-18-2010, 05:48 PM
  #37
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What the hell, let's do this.

Acquire Lecavalier --> Callahan, Gilroy, First rounder.

Acquire Kovalchuk in the offseason, 10 years 9 mil per.

Dump Rozsival, Redden, Kotalik, Brashear for picks/into the minors

re-sign Prospal

Kovalchuk Lecavalier Drury
Prospal Dubinsky Gaborik
Avery Anisimov Lisin
Byers Boyle Voros

Staal Girardi
MDZ Sauer
Sanguinetti UFA


AUTO-GENERATED CAPGEEK.COM LINES
FORWARDS
* Ilya Kovalchuk ($9.000m) / * Vincent Lecavalier ($7.727m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Chris Drury ($7.050m) / Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)
* Vaclav Prospal ($1.500m) / Aaron Voros ($1.000m) / * Enver Lisin ($0.825m)
Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / * Dane Byers ($0.550m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)
DEFENSEMEN
* Marc Staal ($2.826m) / * Daniel Girardi ($1.550m)
* Misc Defenseman ($1.500m) / Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m)
Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m) / * Mike Sauer ($0.846m)
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) / Chad Johnson ($0.850m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER: 20; PAYROLL: $56.676m; CAP ROOM: $0.507m BONUSES: $0.383m

.5mil for a spare forward.

Exceptionally young defense, but, our offense should be leaps and bounds better. And Henrik is still Henrik.

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Old
01-18-2010, 06:13 PM
  #38
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I really get aggravated thinking about these bad contracts.

It wouldn't matter if there was no salary cap, Sather could just buy everyone out.

These contracts really prohibit us from being a good team.

Hopefully, and its a shot in the dark, last nights game is the start of something good.

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Old
01-18-2010, 06:22 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
[*]Captain Crutch Chris Drury (waives his no-movement clause after first being called out by Torts and then stripped of his captaincy) to for Colorados 2nd rounder in 2010, T Pressing and Ryan O´Reilly
Colorado is on a budget. Taking on Drury's deal increases their payroll almost 25 percent. Why would they do this?

How are they benefitting in this at all? How can NYR demand any draft pick here whatsoever? Hell, NYR should be donating two first-rounders plus Krieder plus Stepan just to motivate the Avs to take Drury off our hands.

Not to mention... Colorado fandom isn't exactly anxious to do any deal with NYR after the Sakic offer sheet that doesn't royally screw NYR a hundred-fold. If the fans can't mock NYR after completion of a deal, it ain't happening.

Furthermore... Hypotheticals involving Chris Drury are plain stupid.

Stripping him of the captaincy changes nothing.

Having Torts badmouth Chris in public not only leads to an NHLPA grievance, but places NYR into a bad light with anyone who'd otherwise potentially sign here. It screams to the world: "No-movement clauses from Slats are worthless!!!!!"

How does that benefit NYR?

Chris and Rory insisted upon the no-movement clause so as to provide stability for their children.

HE IS NOT GOING ANYWHERE

What is it about this lesson folks find so hard to understand?

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Old
01-18-2010, 07:27 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
What the hell, let's do this.

Acquire Lecavalier --> Callahan, Gilroy, First rounder.

Acquire Kovalchuk in the offseason, 10 years 9 mil per.

Dump Rozsival, Redden, Kotalik, Brashear for picks/into the minors

re-sign Prospal

Kovalchuk Lecavalier Drury
Prospal Dubinsky Gaborik
Avery Anisimov Lisin
Byers Boyle Voros

Staal Girardi
MDZ Sauer
Sanguinetti UFA


AUTO-GENERATED CAPGEEK.COM LINES
FORWARDS
* Ilya Kovalchuk ($9.000m) / * Vincent Lecavalier ($7.727m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Chris Drury ($7.050m) / Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)
* Vaclav Prospal ($1.500m) / Aaron Voros ($1.000m) / * Enver Lisin ($0.825m)
Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / * Dane Byers ($0.550m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)
DEFENSEMEN
* Marc Staal ($2.826m) / * Daniel Girardi ($1.550m)
* Misc Defenseman ($1.500m) / Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m)
Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m) / * Mike Sauer ($0.846m)
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) / Chad Johnson ($0.850m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER: 20; PAYROLL: $56.676m; CAP ROOM: $0.507m BONUSES: $0.383m

.5mil for a spare forward.

Exceptionally young defense, but, our offense should be leaps and bounds better. And Henrik is still Henrik.
Slash and burn, eh?

Well, I'll give you credit for coming up with your lineup the honest way, without screwy shenanigan trades that have zero chance of happening.

It's risky. But at least it's viable. And it is a salivating concept, great for marketing upscale tickets.

My concern is that it locks NYR into a thin supporting cast for several years on account of the long-duration deals. NYR needs to pray for an improved economy so's the cap will lift a bit.

Let's discuss this intellectually.

You've got $38M invested annually for just five roster spots.

That means you've got to populate a minimum of 15 more with about $18M... which (as you've illustrated) is indeed doable. But is this really a cup contender?

If not... then you're basically relegating NYR to "also-ran" status for the next four years.

Hey. Don't get me wrong(ly). Lot's of reason to tune into each game. But I don't think you win it all.

But it's a fun lineup. So let's see if we can tweak it a bit to help out.

You've basically got three all-stars here, two of whom do not need a feeder:

- Gaborik
- Kovalchuk

Both of them can run up numbers without the help of a playmaking pivot.

I'm kinda wondering if maybe it makes more sense to tweak your lineup such that Lecavalier is on a different line than the other two.

My motive is to spread the offense around so much that enemy coaches could only skate their shutdown lines against one NYR line, leaving two of Kovalchuk/Gaborik/Lecavalier unmarked.

Now Lecavalier is not exactly like Joe Thornton. Vinnie can score goals, not just accumulate assists.

Furthermore, I prefer Dubinsky on the wing where he can remain deep and do less backchecking. As a center, he doesn't have the liberty to loiter at the enemy crease looking for garbage goals. So what if you tried Dubinsky with Lecavalier. My observation here is that Vinnie averages about 300 SOG per season... i.e., mucho rebound potential. Brandon appears to be blossoming as a rebound-putter-homer. So I'm trying that combo and am promoting Lisin and Anisimov with Kovalchuk.

Better yet, here's my twist to your lines:

Kovalchuk-Anisimov-Lisin
Dubinsky-Lecavalier-Drury
Avery-Prospal-Gaborik

or maybe the following, if you're more comfortable with what Torts has already done with Dubi:

Kovalchuk-Anisimov-Lisin
Avery-Lecavalier-Drury
Dubinsky-Prospal-Gaborik

Problems:

1) How many years can NYR count on Prospal? He's getting long of tooth.

2) I don't think Girardi is going to cooperate with your budget, Inferno. He's RFA this summer and I think he's arbitration eligible and may get $2.25M.

3) How many goals can you really count upon generating with these lines?

Let's try:

Kovalchuk (45), Anisimov (10), Lisin (10)
Avery (15), Lecavalier (30), Drury (15)
Dubinsky (20), Prospal (15), Gaborik (45)

That's about 205 goals. And with these three lines, the fourth line will get only token shifts. So let's allow the fourth line a total of 15 goals.

How many can we count on from the rearguard?

Say DeeZee pots ten. Marc might add another five. Girardi might notch ten. And the kids will contribute ten total in their rookie years. So forty goals from the blueline.

That makes 255 goals, or 3.1 per game.

LOL!

That's just what Atlanta is pacing right now... without Gaborik, without Lecavalier.

That said... they're in a division which doesn't put much emphasis on defense. So this isn't really a fair comparison...

But 3.1 goals per game would put NYR into fourth place, equivalent to San Jose or thereabouts... which makes sense when you consider Lecavalier + Gaborik + Kovalchuk is roughly the same as Thornton + Heatley + Marleau in terms of output. So my 3.1 guesstimate passes the sanity check.

My point being that if NYR can average that many goals per game, then the downgrade in defense is tolerable to some extent.

Now if two prospects of Stepan and Kreider et al can blossom like the Blackhawk kids blossomed, then in two years, NYR might make a deep run. But that's a big if.

That said... This lineup costs the same (cap-wise) as what Slats has now and it would be a bona fide improvement... perhaps performing about as well as Pittsburgh during the regular season year after year... i.e., averaging fourth in the conference or thereabouts.

So, yeah. As radical as your roster is, Inferno... it's far, far less egregious than almost anything else I've seen. It's risky, but not horrifically flawed or overrated. It achieves success if you keep two of the big three producers away from enemy checkers.

And it relies bigtime on power play production. But with two genuine #1 power play units, it should be good.

Final point:

This is a team that is perennially a possible contender if all the stars align.

The lack of the kind of defense you need to put this team over the top is something Glen can put a band-aid on come trade deadline by renting an impending UFA blueliner so the cap hit doesn't matter.

So, even with holes in the defense corps... there is a way to temporarily fix that weakness each spring if it looks like injuries aren't an issue and NYR seems fit enough to go deep.

I see this club being vulnerable to trapping teams.

And, of course, it's vulnerable to injuries to the big three.

And, and, and... it requires relegation Roszival and Redden which won't go down well with the NHLPA.

:8=

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Old
01-18-2010, 08:05 PM
  #41
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
What the hell, let's do this.

Acquire Lecavalier --> Callahan, Gilroy, First rounder.

Acquire Kovalchuk in the offseason, 10 years 9 mil per.

Dump Rozsival, Redden, Kotalik, Brashear for picks/into the minors

re-sign Prospal

Kovalchuk Lecavalier Drury
Prospal Dubinsky Gaborik
Avery Anisimov Lisin
Byers Boyle Voros

Staal Girardi
MDZ Sauer
Sanguinetti UFA


AUTO-GENERATED CAPGEEK.COM LINES
FORWARDS
* Ilya Kovalchuk ($9.000m) / * Vincent Lecavalier ($7.727m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m)
Chris Drury ($7.050m) / Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)
* Vaclav Prospal ($1.500m) / Aaron Voros ($1.000m) / * Enver Lisin ($0.825m)
Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / * Dane Byers ($0.550m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)
DEFENSEMEN
* Marc Staal ($2.826m) / * Daniel Girardi ($1.550m)
* Misc Defenseman ($1.500m) / Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m)
Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m) / * Mike Sauer ($0.846m)
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) / Chad Johnson ($0.850m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER: 20; PAYROLL: $56.676m; CAP ROOM: $0.507m BONUSES: $0.383m

.5mil for a spare forward.

Exceptionally young defense, but, our offense should be leaps and bounds better. And Henrik is still Henrik.
You're a bit greedy, and as Rodent points out, you tie up a lot of money in four players. I leave out the Lacavlier acquisition, but I do target Kovalchuk in the off-season. I don't re-sign Higgins, I deal Girardi and replace him with Sanguinetti, I ride out the Rozsival and Drury contracts for two years, and I buyout Redden. You've got at least $8 million to work with to go after Kovalchuk, in terms of cap space.

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Old
01-18-2010, 08:38 PM
  #42
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In 2 years Drury is gone, and that clears up about 7 million bucks to use on keeping our kids here. Regarding spreading the wealth among 3 lines...I think that would work with Renney, but not with Torts...Torts likes to play his guys as much ice time as possible...unless were playing a 3 line team here I dont think thats doable.

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01-18-2010, 08:41 PM
  #43
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also in 2 years Drury is gone, and that clears up about 7 million bucks to use on keeping our kids here.
Yup...both Drury and Rozsival would be off the books, and you can buyout Redden.

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01-18-2010, 08:47 PM
  #44
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also, Lisin is on pace for 8 right now, and Anisimov is on pace for 11, both of these guys have basically played on the 3rd and 4th lines the entire season with say about 5-7 games each playing with Gaborik.

If youre putting them with Kovalchuk, Id probably bump them each to 15, maybe more for Anisimov because I frankly think hes a helluva player whose still learning this game. Id probably be more inclined to guesstimate Lisin at 12 goals, and Anisimov at 20.

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01-18-2010, 08:48 PM
  #45
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Yup...both Drury and Rozsival would be off the books, and you can buyout Redden.
I have no interest in buying out redden. Waive him and have his ass play in Hartford, or loan him to the KHL or SEL or whatever a-la Kasper. Then he doesnt count against the cap whatsoever.

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Old
01-18-2010, 09:42 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
I have no interest in buying out redden. Waive him and have his ass play in Hartford, or loan him to the KHL or SEL or whatever a-la Kasper. Then he doesnt count against the cap whatsoever.

I'm well aware of that, however, I'd be a little surprised if the Rangers did that. I think they'd be more likely to buy him out.

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Old
01-18-2010, 09:44 PM
  #47
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[SIZE="3"]So --- I was a little bored. And really pissed off due to watching last nights game. So I devised a little scheme. Most of it is probably unrealistic and unrealizable - but you can discuss it if you like...

I love the effort you put into this and some trades seems plausible, but no way Colorado is trading O'Reilly.

My moves are simple:

1) Trade Prospal for a 2nd, Higgins for a 3rd, Gilroy for a 3rd, Christiansen for a 4th and Voros for a 5th.

2) Play Kotalik until his face falls off. I don't care where, just don't give up on him yet. I think he will rebound.

3) Call up Sangs and Grachev ASAP. Let Grachev get some NHL mins under his belt playing with AA. Sangs did not look out of place at all. I think he and DZ should run the point on the PP, not Drury and DZ.

4) Hold off on moving/demoting Redden, Rosie and Drury for now. Money aside, they are all capable and not stunting the development of anybody.

5) Call up Byers and PAP. Byers is better than Brashear and PAP is useful in the shootout

Avery-Dubinsky-Gaborik
Kotalik-Drury-Callahan
Grachev-AA-Lisin
Byers-Boyle-PAP

Staal-Girardi
Redden-Sangs
DZ-Rosie


Seriously, guys. The vets Sather brought in have not produced. Time to cut sling load, as they say in the 82nd Airborne. This team went three games and scored one goal with the aforementioned vets in the lineup.

Henrik has proven he can carry this team on his back come March. No reason to become buyers. We can make the playoffs, develop our youngsters, and stockpile draft picks all at the same time.

Then in 2012, we can go after a legit RFA and have money left over to keep all our core guys.


Do it, Glen.

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Old
01-18-2010, 09:50 PM
  #48
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And anyone saying redden's gonna throw a fit for being demoted...

keep in mind he's getting the last laugh. He's gonna get paid millions to basically do nothing. Chances are if he gets demoted he won't even have to play. "Either scratch me every game or I'll give you tons of grief and bad publicity".

20+ million to do nothing? Can't see someone crying about that.

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Old
01-18-2010, 11:06 PM
  #49
Rodent
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
In 2 years Drury is gone, and that clears up about 7 million bucks to use on keeping our kids here.
True dat.

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01-19-2010, 12:01 AM
  #50
darko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
[SIZE="3"][*]Captain Crutch Chris Drury (waives his no-movement clause after first being called out by Torts and then stripped of his captaincy) to for Colorados 2nd rounder in 2010, T Pressing and Ryan O´Reilly

There is no chance what so ever that Colorado does this.

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