HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Phaneuf, Giguere traded to Leafs, part of two separate trades

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-01-2010, 01:53 PM
  #201
Talbetts
Registered User
 
Talbetts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Schwenksville?, PA
Posts: 829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
They still have their prospects with exception of 2 1st round picks. They still planning to move Poni and maybe others.

I did not expect Leafs to make playoffs this year but I also did not expect Leafs to get those type of players in such a short period of time. Burke did not just spent, he invested. There is a difference. Gainey and Sather just went out and spent.

imo It is much easier to fix forwards then d-nce or goaltending.
You have a great point. Forwards also peek quicker than D and Goaltending, so I guess I could rule out the possibility of the D/Goal becoming a bit too aged while waiting for the Forwards to catch up. I'm interested to see what the Forwards on this team look like now. This is something that I have looked at yet. Maybe they aren't as bad as I originally thought. I know they have Kessel, Bozak, Poni (for now), and guys like Kadri waiting in the winds, but who else do they have? I'm going to look now, so you don't have to school me unless you really want.

Talbetts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 01:55 PM
  #202
Talbetts
Registered User
 
Talbetts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Schwenksville?, PA
Posts: 829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by FireHolmgrenDotCom View Post
Phaneuf is so overrated by the Canadian media its not even funny.
Dont get me wrong, he is a good player, but if you believe some of the stuff written about him you would think hes a finalist for the Norris every year. Now that hes in Toronto that is going to get magnified times a thousand.

I appologize for initially getting this thread off topic btw by bringing up Nick Boynton getting put on waivers. maybe we can move that part of the convo to the Obsequious Thread.
No need to apologize. I was intrigued by Boynton on waivers when I first saw it too.....I didn't know he was THAT bad these days. I miss my Center Ice package.

Talbetts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 01:55 PM
  #203
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
Maybe I am by my self but I honestly do not have any problems if Flyers had Kaberle, Komisarek, Beauchemin, Schenn, Phaneuf, Exelby with Jean-Sebastien Giguere in the net.

That’s a good start.

Maybe Phaneuf is not the best all around d-men but I think he is very similar to Jovo. Ain’t so bad.
I would have a problem if that was our defense.

The Leafs are not last in the NHL in GA/G only because of goaltending issues. Phaneuf and Giguere do not do a whole lot to solve that immediately. On top of all that, with as much money as the Leafs are currently forking over to their blueline, they better make Giguere look like the second coming of Martin Brodeur.

I'm not too thrilled with our GA/G this year either, but it's nowhere near as bad as 30th in the NHL. On top of that, our little slump wasn't without some blowout losses. For some reason the Caps also have this phenomenon with scoring 6+ goals against us per game this year as well, no thanks to Carcillo giving us a half of period worth of penalty killing.

Frankly I think as a collective on this board we have a tendency to nit-pick about our defenders a little too much. Granted, nobody likes to see mistakes or turnovers, but those things happen elsewhere too. It's not like Coburn suddenly became the worst defender in the league because he got caught flatfooted a few times while earning other teams some highlight reel goals.

I'd rather have a healthy:

Pronger - Carle
Timonen - Coburn
Parent - Bartulis
Syvret

At 19.28m, than a healthy:

Kaberle - Schenn
Phaneuf - Komisarek
Finger - Beachemin
Exelby

Or whatever their pairings are, at 26.92m.

CS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:00 PM
  #204
Talbetts
Registered User
 
Talbetts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Schwenksville?, PA
Posts: 829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
I would have a problem if that was our defense.

The Leafs are not last in the NHL in GA/G only because of goaltending issues. Phaneuf and Giguere do not do a whole lot to solve that immediately. On top of all that, with as much money as the Leafs are currently forking over to their blueline, they better make Giguere look like the second coming of Martin Brodeur.

I'm not too thrilled with our GA/G this year either, but it's nowhere near as bad as 30th in the NHL. On top of that, our little slump wasn't without some blowout losses. For some reason the Caps also have this phenomenon with scoring 6+ goals against us per game this year as well, no thanks to Carcillo giving us a half of period worth of penalty killing.

Frankly I think as a collective on this board we have a tendency to nit-pick about our defenders a little too much. Granted, nobody likes to see mistakes or turnovers, but those things happen elsewhere too. It's not like Coburn suddenly became the worst defender in the league because he got caught flatfooted a few times while earning other teams some highlight reel goals.

I'd rather have a healthy:

Pronger - Carle
Timonen - Coburn
Parent - Bartulis
Syvret

At 19.28m, than a healthy:

Kaberle - Schenn
Phaneuf - Komisarek
Finger - Beachemin
Exelby

Or whatever their pairings are, at 26.92m.
Oh yeah, forgot about that Finger guy. What's he making...4m or something ridiculous like that??? They definitely need to dump one of them for a forward at this point...

I like our D better too....Ponger!

Talbetts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:04 PM
  #205
MsWoof
Registered User
 
MsWoof's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 13,145
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Sometimes I forget what you and Opus have to put up with in Canada...then I remember that I've lost friendships with people based on their opinion that hockey is an inferior sport to basketball.
You have no idea what it's like here, but I love it because I just laugh at the Laffs and their fans. The Toronto Star today looks like it would have looked when World War II ended, huge headlines on the front page and in the sports section with everyone falling all over themselves while trying to decide who, if anyone, won this trade. Interesting how the deal was finally done after they were up 3-0 and lost 5-3 to Vancouver Saturday. Nobody even remembers that game anymore!

I don't think either team will be much better or worse. Calgary hasn't been scoring and the Laffs' defence/goaltending sucks, so maybe in each case there will be slight improvement, but it also cost each team. Phaneuf has been compared to both Chris Pronger and Bryan McCabe. He's young but makes a ton of money and should help the defence but White was doing a good job as well. He isn't as flashy but it seems he has more hockey sense than Phaneuf does.

I'm just glad I became a Flyers fan in 1974 because if I had stuck with the Leafs, I would have lost interest in hockey altogether. I'm seeing it in a lot of my friends who either don't watch at all or only have a passing interest.

MsWoof is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:06 PM
  #206
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woof View Post
You have no idea what it's like here, but I love it because I just laugh at the Laffs and their fans. The Toronto Star today looks like it would have looked when World War II ended, huge headlines on the front page and in the sports section with everyone falling all over themselves while trying to decide who, if anyone, won this trade. Interesting how the deal was finally done after they were up 3-0 and lost 5-3 to Vancouver Saturday. Nobody even remembers that game anymore!
For someone reason that line cracked me up. I could definitely imagine it.

CS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:08 PM
  #207
GoneFullHextall
Fire Berube
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,961
vCash: 500
Toronto is going to have to hope Kaberle waives his NTC. He has the most trade value of anyone on that blueline.
Having nearly 48 percent of your payroll tied up on the blueline makes little to no sense. Especially when the only real threat you have up front is Phil Kessel.

GoneFullHextall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:11 PM
  #208
Kaktus*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 22,389
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
The Leafs are not last in the NHL in GA/G only because of goaltending issues. Phaneuf and Giguere do not do a whole lot to solve that immediately. On top of all that, with as much money as the Leafs are currently forking over to their blueline, they better make Giguere look like the second coming of Martin Brodeur.

I'm not too thrilled with our GA/G this year either, but it's nowhere near as bad as 30th in the NHL. On top of that, our little slump wasn't without some blowout losses. For some reason the Caps also have this phenomenon with scoring 6+ goals against us per game this year as well, no thanks to Carcillo giving us a half of period worth of penalty killing.
Nothing will be solved immediately in Toronto. Goaltending was Leafs one of the biggest issues. Toskala sucked, Monster had some health issues too (he underwent some minor heart procedure), Komie was injured(and he was bad at the beginning of the season with out Markov), Kessel was injured (Leafs best most talented forward), Grabovski missed a few games. It is tough to add/change roster and then make it work. Flyers did it but we had a much better core.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Frankly I think as a collective on this board we have a tendency to nit-pick about our defenders a little too much. Granted, nobody likes to see mistakes or turnovers, but those things happen elsewhere too. It's not like Coburn suddenly became the worst defender in the league because he got caught flatfooted a few times while earning other teams some highlight reel goals.

I'd rather have a healthy:
This has noting to do with Burke and moves he made.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Pronger - Carle
Timonen - Coburn
Parent - Bartulis
Syvret

At 19.28m, than a healthy:

Kaberle - Schenn
Phaneuf - Komisarek
Finger - Beachemin
Exelby

Or whatever their pairings are, at 26.92m.
I really do not know.. Leafs top 6 looks a lot better and a lot more physical, bigger and just as fast. You and I can go into <>=<> to compare each and every player.. Consider age of our top players Pronger and Timonen and maybe Leafs will have an edge in the end. If we compare Giggy and Emery.. who will win that argument.. While well overpaid Giggy can still play at the age of 32 while Emery having a very so so season.

I can see why Leafs fans going nuts.. Last year Fletcher gave Leafs a finger a year before JFJ gave Leafs Blake and Toskala. Burke is doing a much better job imo.


Last edited by Kaktus*: 02-01-2010 at 02:18 PM.
Kaktus* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:12 PM
  #209
Talbetts
Registered User
 
Talbetts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Schwenksville?, PA
Posts: 829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woof View Post
I'm seeing it in a lot of my friends who either don't watch at all or only have a passing interest.
I am very surpised by this. Were they atleast involved in the excitement today or just lost interest all together?

Talbetts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:13 PM
  #210
CharlieGirl
Get well soon Kimmo
 
CharlieGirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Kitchener, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 29,933
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Sometimes I forget what you and Opus have to put up with in Canada...then I remember that I've lost friendships with people based on their opinion that hockey is an inferior sport to basketball.

The grass is always greener?
I think I win... this was on a friend's facebook:

Quote:
hey flames fans enjoy stajans consistent losses in battles for the puck, ian whites ridiculous giveaways and mayers is a waste already...phaneuf played the way he did cuz he hated calgary...most overrated team in the league...new life in TO, lets go LEAFS!

btw thanks for the aulie, next tyler myers...

CharlieGirl is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:16 PM
  #211
IrishSniper87
Registered User
 
IrishSniper87's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Media, PA
Country: United States
Posts: 13,402
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I think I win... this was on a friend's facebook:
Delusional and Leafs fans go together like cheese and steak.

Habs are a tight 2nd though in most delusional fans in the league.

IrishSniper87 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:22 PM
  #212
Talbetts
Registered User
 
Talbetts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Schwenksville?, PA
Posts: 829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I think I win... this was on a friend's facebook:
That is some funny stuff though. You just can't take it seriously!!!

Around here,

"The Phlyers need a goalie, they have since that Hextall guy"

"They don't need a coach, they need a goaly"

"That Richards guy sucks, Crosby is a better"

"Pronger sucks, he hasn't hit anyone all year"

"They should play Cote more"

"Bunch of goons, gooning it up (not only in Pittsburg, Philly too" (contradicting much)

"E A G L E S, oh....this is a Flyers game?"

"Randy Jones is good"

"OKT is the my hero"

"I stopped watching when they got rid of Lindros"

"Andy Reid, Donavon, Iverson, blah, blah, blah"

"Drop the puck"

"Shoot it"

ect. etc. etc.

Talbetts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:23 PM
  #213
Talbetts
Registered User
 
Talbetts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Schwenksville?, PA
Posts: 829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by IrishSniper87 View Post
Delusional and Leafs fans go together like cheese and steak.

Habs are a tight 2nd though in most delusional fans in the league.
Agreed 100%! Pittsburgh is right up there, as well.

Talbetts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:32 PM
  #214
dbr2
Lockout Beard
 
dbr2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,340
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to dbr2
Quote:
Originally Posted by BernieHexBergEry View Post
That is some funny stuff though. You just can't take it seriously!!!

Around here,

"The Phlyers need a goalie, they have since that Hextall guy"

"They don't need a coach, they need a goaly"

"That Richards guy sucks, Crosby is a better"

"Pronger sucks, he hasn't hit anyone all year"

"They should play Cote more"

"Bunch of goons, gooning it up (not only in Pittsburg, Philly too" (contradicting much)

"E A G L E S, oh....this is a Flyers game?"

"Randy Jones is good"

"OKT is the my hero"

"I stopped watching when they got rid of Lindros"

"Andy Reid, Donavon, Iverson, blah, blah, blah"

"Drop the puck"

"Shoot it"

ect. etc. etc.
Classic. You go to a game, and you hear some people around you yell shoot! I want to turn to them and say, "haven't you ever heard of a counter attack in hockey?"

I don't listen to WIP anymore, because all the talk about is the Eagles. You may think, since it's the off season that WIP would switch topics up, but oh yes they have failed to do so. I love the Eagles, however the team is a bunch of choke artiest. I've watched my father, lose his voice over that team over the years. Trust me he is no where near as bad as he was when he was in his 30s. With that being said, nothing changes with that team. I'm not surprised when the Eagles fail to win the big game. I guess you can say, I'm used to getting punched in the stomach.

dbr2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:41 PM
  #215
CharlieGirl
Get well soon Kimmo
 
CharlieGirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Kitchener, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 29,933
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbr2 View Post
Classic. You go to a game, and you hear some people around you yell shoot!
I know a few guys who will yell "pass" during a PP. Screws up everyone nearby something fierce! It's hilarious to see the look on people's faces.

CharlieGirl is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:43 PM
  #216
Talbetts
Registered User
 
Talbetts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Schwenksville?, PA
Posts: 829
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I know a few guys who will yell "pass" during a PP. Screws up everyone nearby something fierce! It's hilarious to see the look on people's faces.
Hilarious! I may have to try that if I ever can afford to get to another game.

Talbetts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:52 PM
  #217
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 111,244
vCash: 500
I yell "pass" all the time.

GKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 02:58 PM
  #218
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,728
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
Quote:
Originally Posted by dbr2 View Post
Classic. You go to a game, and you hear some people around you yell shoot! I want to turn to them and say, "haven't you ever heard of a counter attack in hockey?"

I don't listen to WIP anymore, because all the talk about is the Eagles. You may think, since it's the off season that WIP would switch topics up, but oh yes they have failed to do so. I love the Eagles, however the team is a bunch of choke artiest. I've watched my father, lose his voice over that team over the years. Trust me he is no where near as bad as he was when he was in his 30s. With that being said, nothing changes with that team. I'm not surprised when the Eagles fail to win the big game. I guess you can say, I'm used to getting punched in the stomach.
I yell SHOOT! constantly on the power play just because then everyone around starts yelling it. I find it funny.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 03:03 PM
  #219
HoverCarle*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to HoverCarle*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Sometimes I forget what you and Opus have to put up with in Canada...then I remember that I've lost friendships with people based on their opinion that hockey is an inferior sport to basketball.

The grass is always greener?
Ahem. Infraction for forgetting me?

Leafs fans with false hope is always funny. "Pogge is the next great goalie" to "Kulemin was the best player in the KHL" to "Kessel is a 90 point player" to "The monster is the best goalie ever"

it never ends. Phaneuf is an overrated overpaid cocky D man. He has great skills, but im not sure about whats going on in his head

HoverCarle* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 03:03 PM
  #220
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie_Girl View Post
I think I win... this was on a friend's facebook:
Hahaha. "next Tyler Myers"

You win.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaktus View Post
I really do not know.. Leafs top 6 looks a lot better and a lot more physical, bigger and just as fast. You and I can go into <>=<> to compare each and every player.. Consider age of our top players Pronger and Timonen and maybe Leafs will have an edge in the end. If we compare Giggy and Emery.. who will win that argument.. While well overpaid Giggy can still play at the age of 32 while Emery having a very so so season.
1T. Kaberle is self-explanatory. He's a very gifted puck-moving defenseman but is very good in his own zone as well. He also happens to be a -10, as I mentioned. Kaberle is at $4.25 again next year.

1P. Against our best defenseman at $4.92m a season starting next year, I take Pronger every time. Even if Pronger was at $6.92m like he is this season, I'd take him.

---------------------------------------------------

2T. Dion Phaneuf has been joked about all season. He's being joked about in this thread. His defensive problems are as legendary as Mike Green's by now. He's supposed to be a heavy hitter, which he is, but over-committing is a big part of his defensive woes. He's also supposed to be a big-time offensive defenseman, a big enough one to the point where his defensive problems should just get sort of swept under the rug. Instead he has 22 points in 55 games. He is a +3, but that's with the Flames.

2F. I'll take Kimmo Timonen right now easy. He's even a bit cheaper.

---------------------------------------------------

3T. Don't forget Beauchemin was coming off a season-ending injury with the Ducks. Remember discussing that this past offseason? We thought he would make a good defenseman possibly acquired on the cheap due to injury? $3.80m a year (2 years left to go) was probably a little more than we wanted to give, but he seems to be in the middle of a career year offensively. I would make note that he is a -10 right now, tied for 2nd worst on the team, but he's actually tied with Kaberle, who I know is at the very least respectable in his own zone. I will reserve judgement on Beauchemin, but I haven't heard word about him either way. I assume if he was playing well he would be the next Toronto godsend on defense, ala White.

3F. Carle has had a great year. He has been a two-way defenseman for a change. People think it was Pronger, but I agree only to the point where I think it was Pronger's influence. Carle, with confidence, has emerged a changed defenseman. At $3.44m, it's hard to weigh against Beauchemin without knowing the full extent of what he has done. Even so, I'll take Carle even with a few minor slip-ups. Without question Beauchemin has had his fair share. All defensemen do, but Carle has been about as good as he can be.

---------------------------------------------------

4T. Luke Schenn, the "best shut-down defensive prospect the league has ever seen," has 9 points in 53 games. I won't complain about that as a shut-down defenseman. His even +/- on the Leafs is what really impresses me.

4F. Braydon Coburn has had a horrible year. He's still young and seems to have finally got it together recently though. Still, it's hard to compare the two even when considering Coburn is less than half the price of Schenn right now. I'll take Schenn.

---------------------------------------------------

5T. Mike Komisarek was an absolute disaster earlier in the season but has apparently been better recently. That's news to me. He did run into injury trouble as well, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. He only has 4 assists, but you can't complain about a defensive defenseman with no points. You're just not allowed. I will point out however that $4.50m a year for as long as Phaneuf is signed and is an ugly minus 9.

5F. Like Komisarek, Parent is a shutdown defenseman who won't put up many points. In 6 less games than Komi, he has 2 less assists. Parent also went through his stint of injuries and had a few bad games after returning for brief stints. Even so, Parent was classic Parent at the beginning of the season; quiet, invisible, and effective. Shutdown defensemen are pretty black and white. They're either doing their job or not doing their job. Doing their job entails good body positioning, effective stick-work, and a lack of turnovers. Not doing their job entails the opposite. It's hard to be anymore effective as a shutdown defenseman than Parent was at full health without being the top guy in charge of specifically shutting down the elite forwards of the hockey world. Komisarek proved incapable of that early on this season when healthy. Parent, when healthy early in the season, did a very good job regardless of who he was skating into his zone with the puck. It's hard to argue against Parent at under a mil right now and unlikely to get much higher. Advantage Parent.

---------------------------------------------------

6T. The disaster that is Jeff Finger was signed to $3.50m per year deal that carries him on the team two more seasons. He is a -12, and he has accounted for 9 points. He has only played 30 games this season though. Injuries have stunted him this year, but from all accounts he has been terrible.

6F. Meet the rookie that is Oscars Bartulis. Bartulis is also a -12 on a better team. I'll give the slight advantage to Jeff Finger even though Bartulis has had a who's who of disaster working on that bottom pairing from an injured Parent, to a half-mast Coburn, to a freaking terrible Tollefsen, to a decent but raw Syvret.

---------------------------------------------------

Tollefsen, Syvret, Krajicek vs. Exelby, Gunnarson, van Ryn

I'll consider that an advantage to Toronto even though it's costing them nearly 5x as much. Tollefsen is bad, and we don't know what we have with Krajicek yet.

So, Flyers win #1, #2, #3, and #5. Toronto wins #4, #6 (maybe), and spare parts.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hovercraft View Post
Ahem. Infraction for forgetting me?

Leafs fans with false hope is always funny. "Pogge is the next great goalie" to "Kulemin was the best player in the KHL" to "Kessel is a 90 point player" to "The monster is the best goalie ever"

it never ends. Phaneuf is an overrated overpaid cocky D man. He has great skills, but im not sure about whats going on in his head
I might deserve an infraction for typing too much, and I'm completely refusing to spell-check it.

As for forgetting you, I have a very limited knowledge of who is from where. I do however know Opus and Charlie_Girl reside somewhere in the Eastern half of the great white north. I saw someone who lived in Mount Holly earlier. Billy_Shoe? I live right by there, that's the only reason I remembered.

And yes, Toronto, Montreal, and Pittsburgh by far overrate things indiscriminately. I can forgive Pittsburgh because of their fanbase, mostly created in the past two years. I have far less patience for morons from the great north.

CS is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 03:12 PM
  #221
HoverCarle*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to HoverCarle*
Yeah I was only kidding round Shafer.

The NHL fan population around where I live is probably:

40% Leafs
40% Habs
5% Sens
5% Bruins/Detroit
5% Calgary/Vancover/EDM
5% Other NHL teams

HoverCarle* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 03:16 PM
  #222
GKJ
Global Moderator
Entertainment
 
GKJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Do not trade plz
Country: United States
Posts: 111,244
vCash: 500
Beauchemin's blew out his knee last year. Some doctors think it takes at least a whole year to be back at 100%

GKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 03:20 PM
  #223
Kaktus*
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: PA
Posts: 22,389
vCash: 500
Please do not be a homer.. No way Flyers win 5 ,Komie and Parent or Komie and Coburn or even Carle.. You put Parent, Coburn or Carle ahead? Are you nuts? Parent can not even get out of the hospital, Coburn can not get his **** together playing with Timonen. What did they do to deserve anything, really? Komie was top hitter and shot blocker in the league for at least 3-4 years. How can you take that away from him? Between him and Volchnekov who else was that good? Schenn is what? 20 years old? 19? You think Parent is better then Shceen, is Carle better?

Carle.. Mr.I do not kill penalties or play physical game and turn the puck over. Between him a Bouche.. debatable. Depends on your needs. Bouch was excellent in that cup run. Stepped in when Pronger was suspended did everything right. Can Carle do that? Did he ever? Will he?

Of course some of the leafs UFA signing may not work out in 1st year. That’s why you can not objectively judge them in 1st year.

I am not going to bash Flyers players but you are being very unreasonable. After 1st where most fans will take Pronger over Phaneuf (rightfully so), Timonen over Kaberle might be very well a wash (that difference is really is small) I will give an edge to Toronto with the rest especially with Giggy in the net.

So yeah, if I am Leafs fan which I am not I'd be happy about this year. 2/3 of the team is set for years to come.


Last edited by Kaktus*: 02-01-2010 at 03:36 PM.
Kaktus* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 03:20 PM
  #224
DenverBoone
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 897
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Hahaha. "next Tyler Myers"

You win.



1T. Kaberle is self-explanatory. He's a very gifted puck-moving defenseman but is very good in his own zone as well. He also happens to be a -10, as I mentioned. Kaberle is at $4.25 again next year.

1P. Against our best defenseman at $4.92m a season starting next year, I take Pronger every time. Even if Pronger was at $6.92m like he is this season, I'd take him.

---------------------------------------------------

2T. Dion Phaneuf has been joked about all season. He's being joked about in this thread. His defensive problems are as legendary as Mike Green's by now. He's supposed to be a heavy hitter, which he is, but over-committing is a big part of his defensive woes. He's also supposed to be a big-time offensive defenseman, a big enough one to the point where his defensive problems should just get sort of swept under the rug. Instead he has 22 points in 55 games. He is a +3, but that's with the Flames.

2F. I'll take Kimmo Timonen right now easy. He's even a bit cheaper.

---------------------------------------------------

3T. Don't forget Beauchemin was coming off a season-ending injury with the Ducks. Remember discussing that this past offseason? We thought he would make a good defenseman possibly acquired on the cheap due to injury? $3.80m a year (2 years left to go) was probably a little more than we wanted to give, but he seems to be in the middle of a career year offensively. I would make note that he is a -10 right now, tied for 2nd worst on the team, but he's actually tied with Kaberle, who I know is at the very least respectable in his own zone. I will reserve judgement on Beauchemin, but I haven't heard word about him either way. I assume if he was playing well he would be the next Toronto godsend on defense, ala White.

3F. Carle has had a great year. He has been a two-way defenseman for a change. People think it was Pronger, but I agree only to the point where I think it was Pronger's influence. Carle, with confidence, has emerged a changed defenseman. At $3.44m, it's hard to weigh against Beauchemin without knowing the full extent of what he has done. Even so, I'll take Carle even with a few minor slip-ups. Without question Beauchemin has had his fair share. All defensemen do, but Carle has been about as good as he can be.

---------------------------------------------------

4T. Luke Schenn, the "best shut-down defensive prospect the league has ever seen," has 9 points in 53 games. I won't complain about that as a shut-down defenseman. His even +/- on the Leafs is what really impresses me.

4F. Braydon Coburn has had a horrible year. He's still young and seems to have finally got it together recently though. Still, it's hard to compare the two even when considering Coburn is less than half the price of Schenn right now. I'll take Schenn.

---------------------------------------------------

5T. Mike Komisarek was an absolute disaster earlier in the season but has apparently been better recently. That's news to me. He did run into injury trouble as well, so I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. He only has 4 assists, but you can't complain about a defensive defenseman with no points. You're just not allowed. I will point out however that $4.50m a year for as long as Phaneuf is signed and is an ugly minus 9.

5F. Like Komisarek, Parent is a shutdown defenseman who won't put up many points. In 6 less games than Komi, he has 2 less assists. Parent also went through his stint of injuries and had a few bad games after returning for brief stints. Even so, Parent was classic Parent at the beginning of the season; quiet, invisible, and effective. Shutdown defensemen are pretty black and white. They're either doing their job or not doing their job. Doing their job entails good body positioning, effective stick-work, and a lack of turnovers. Not doing their job entails the opposite. It's hard to be anymore effective as a shutdown defenseman than Parent was at full health without being the top guy in charge of specifically shutting down the elite forwards of the hockey world. Komisarek proved incapable of that early on this season when healthy. Parent, when healthy early in the season, did a very good job regardless of who he was skating into his zone with the puck. It's hard to argue against Parent at under a mil right now and unlikely to get much higher. Advantage Parent.

---------------------------------------------------

6T. The disaster that is Jeff Finger was signed to $3.50m per year deal that carries him on the team two more seasons. He is a -12, and he has accounted for 9 points. He has only played 30 games this season though. Injuries have stunted him this year, but from all accounts he has been terrible.

6F. Meet the rookie that is Oscars Bartulis. Bartulis is also a -12 on a better team. I'll give the slight advantage to Jeff Finger even though Bartulis has had a who's who of disaster working on that bottom pairing from an injured Parent, to a half-mast Coburn, to a freaking terrible Tollefsen, to a decent but raw Syvret.

---------------------------------------------------

Tollefsen, Syvret, Krajicek vs. Exelby, Gunnarson, van Ryn

I'll consider that an advantage to Toronto even though it's costing them nearly 5x as much. Tollefsen is bad, and we don't know what we have with Krajicek yet.

So, Flyers win #1, #2, #3, and #5. Toronto wins #4, #6 (maybe), and spare parts.



I might deserve an infraction for typing too much, and I'm completely refusing to spell-check it.

As for forgetting you, I have a very limited knowledge of who is from where. I do however know Opus and Charlie_Girl reside somewhere in the Eastern half of the great white north. I saw someone who lived in Mount Holly earlier. Billy_Shoe? I live right by there, that's the only reason I remembered.

And yes, Toronto, Montreal, and Pittsburgh by far overrate things indiscriminately. I can forgive Pittsburgh because of their fanbase, mostly created in the past two years. I have far less patience for morons from the great north.
Damn...Nice post!

DenverBoone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-01-2010, 03:22 PM
  #225
Opus
Registered User
 
Opus's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Kingston
Country: Canada
Posts: 6,920
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Sometimes I forget what you and Opus have to put up with in Canada...then I remember that I've lost friendships with people based on their opinion that hockey is an inferior sport to basketball.

The grass is always greener?
We have to put up with quite a bit, as do the other Canadian members...especially the ones in Leaf-Land. However, it's more humourous and pipe-dreamish than anything. My Pops, a die-hard Leafs fan (god bless his heart) called me when Team Canada announced it's Olympic roster. He seemed pretty happy (at the time) that Phaneuf wasn't on the team and then went on about how overrated he felt he was. For the record, I did/do agree.

His text this afternoon, yeah. You'd swear Phaneuf was a shoe-in for the Norris.

Opus is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:20 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.