HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

So, what are everyone's thoughts on Emery at this point?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-02-2010, 12:16 PM
  #76
Jester
Registered User
 
Jester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: St. Andrews
Country: Scotland
Posts: 34,075
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
I can seem him getting a night off during one of the home and homes. Probably against the Canadiens.
Eh, it's the only back-to-back left, and there is a LONG lay off after those two games.

Jester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 12:28 PM
  #77
Mgkibbles
Registered User
 
Mgkibbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Gilbertsville, Pa
Posts: 2,024
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan85 View Post
Elite???? Hahahaha!!!! I don't even know how i'm supposed to reply to that, that's a HUGE joke. Elite goaltenders are Brodeur, Luongo, Roy... Comparing Ray Emery to those goalies is an insult to them. If Ray Emery was going to be elite, he would have been there by now when he's in his prime, he's not just suddenly going to become elite at 28 years old.

The Flyers are winning games right now because the defense is playing well in front of Emery. I realize that he just came back from an injury, but i still don't think he'll get that much better. You could stick any above average goaltender in nets for the Flyers at this point and they'd all put up roughly the same numbers because the team is playing so well.

For the sake of maybe winning a cup, i hope he gets better, but he's definitely not the answer to their goaltending problem.
How many goalies have the athletic potential of Emery? Not many, his game needs refinement and thats it.

Mgkibbles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 12:30 PM
  #78
decadentia
Registered User
 
decadentia's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: New Brunswick
Country: Canada
Posts: 4,547
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
If he had any chance of being elite Ottawa would not have let him walk away.
If he had any chance of being elite someone in the NHL would have taken him last year


His numbers are ok, but he was in the KHL last year for a reason and I am sure that if the Flyers werent desparate for a goalie, he would still be there. No other NHL team would have taken the chance.
You're right, Ottawa always keeps their elite players and especially the ones that have the potential to be.



Your whole paragraph is simply over-simplifying things. Go read back on the whole locker room drama/personal crap, swish it around in your head a little and expand a bit.
You can teach a goalie sounder positioning and goalies have expanded on rebound control, athleticism is a bit different. He's clearly got some upside to him, trying to predict the extent with precise accuracy is a step towards futility.

I would agree however that it is a lot more likely he is going to be an average/possibly above average goalie.


Last edited by decadentia: 02-02-2010 at 12:38 PM.
decadentia is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 12:30 PM
  #79
Kambo
 
Kambo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Pennsauken, NJ
Country: Ireland
Posts: 5,357
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Kambo
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
If he had any chance of being elite Ottawa would not have let him walk away.
If he had any chance of being elite someone in the NHL would have taken him last year


His numbers are ok, but he was in the KHL last year for a reason and I am sure that if the Flyers werent desparate for a goalie, he would still be there. No other NHL team would have taken the chance.
FWIW, he was tossed out of Ottawa for being a head case.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan85 View Post
Elite???? Hahahaha!!!! I don't even know how i'm supposed to reply to that, that's a HUGE joke. Elite goaltenders are Brodeur, Luongo, Roy... Comparing Ray Emery to those goalies is an insult to them. If Ray Emery was going to be elite, he would have been there by now when he's in his prime, he's not just suddenly going to become elite at 28 years old.

The Flyers are winning games right now because the defense is playing well in front of Emery. I realize that he just came back from an injury, but i still don't think he'll get that much better. You could stick any above average goaltender in nets for the Flyers at this point and they'd all put up roughly the same numbers because the team is playing so well.

For the sake of maybe winning a cup, i hope he gets better, but he's definitely not the answer to their goaltending problem.
I would agree that elite is much too strong a word for Emery, but you do remember him taking the Sens to the cup finals a few years back, right? You're throwing him under the bus like he's the worst goalie ever. Honestly, I feel a lot more confident having him back there, then I ever did with Biron. And if you seriously want to believe Leighton or Boosh would have put up the same numbers, you're dreaming. Leighton was very good for us, but he's not a starter, and neither is Boosh. They're both backup goalies, and Leighton I would go as far as saying being a fringe NHL'er. Goalies go on hot streaks, and then they come back down to earth. You could say Emery is on one now, but the fact of the matter is, aside from when he was playing injured, he's been very solid for us. That's all we should be asking for.

Kambo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 12:48 PM
  #80
IceDaddy
24 and Counting
 
IceDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,877
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kambo View Post
FWIW, he was tossed out of Ottawa for being a head case.



I would agree that elite is much too strong a word for Emery, but you do remember him taking the Sens to the cup finals a few years back, right? You're throwing him under the bus like he's the worst goalie ever. Honestly, I feel a lot more confident having him back there, then I ever did with Biron. And if you seriously want to believe Leighton or Boosh would have put up the same numbers, you're dreaming. Leighton was very good for us, but he's not a starter, and neither is Boosh. They're both backup goalies, and Leighton I would go as far as saying being a fringe NHL'er. Goalies go on hot streaks, and then they come back down to earth. You could say Emery is on one now, but the fact of the matter is, aside from when he was playing injured, he's been very solid for us. That's all we should be asking for.


Dany Heatley
Jason Spezza
Daniel Alfredsson
Wade Redden
Chris Phillips
Anton Volchenkov
Mike Fisher
Antoine Vermette
Joe Corvo
Mike Comrie


Ray Emery had VERY little to do with the Senators making the final that year. In that season his numbers are decent but not even that great for a team that was that good.

About your other point, the reason Ottawa let him leave. If he really had the potential to be ELITE. they would have not let him leave for NOTHING in return even if he was a head case.

IceDaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 12:52 PM
  #81
Mgkibbles
Registered User
 
Mgkibbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Gilbertsville, Pa
Posts: 2,024
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Dany Heatley
Jason Spezza
Daniel Alfredsson
Wade Redden
Chris Phillips
Anton Volchenkov
Mike Fisher
Antoine Vermette
Joe Corvo
Mike Comrie


Ray Emery had VERY little to do with the Senators making the final that year. In that season his numbers are decent but not even that great for a team that was that good.

About your other point, the reason Ottawa let him leave. If he really had the potential to be ELITE. they would have not let him leave for NOTHING in return even if he was a head case.
Yea, Emery wasn't the reason the Sens were in the finals, but as far as letting him leave for nothing...what the **** do you think they would have got in return? Emery was looked upon as a caner at that point in his career.

Mgkibbles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:13 PM
  #82
IceDaddy
24 and Counting
 
IceDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,877
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
Yea, Emery wasn't the reason the Sens were in the finals, but as far as letting him leave for nothing...what the **** do you think they would have got in return? Emery was looked upon as a caner at that point in his career.

Thats exactly my point. If he was or had the potential to be Elite, someone would have taken a shot and hope to turn him around.

He can be a decent goalie in the NHL. I just think he will be middle of the pack kind of guy....no where near elite

IceDaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:24 PM
  #83
Dan85
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 13
vCash: 500
Emery's not terrible, i didn't mean to make it seem that way. I just think the Flyers would be better off signing Vokoun, Nabokov or maybe even Rinne or Chris Mason. Having one of those 4 goaltenders could pretty much guarantee a cup and i think they're all much better than Emery. There's also a number of RFA goalies this summer who might be worthwhile to trade for. I just don't see the Flyers winning a Cup with Emery in nets, so why bother re-signing him?

Dan85 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:28 PM
  #84
Kambo
 
Kambo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Pennsauken, NJ
Country: Ireland
Posts: 5,357
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Kambo
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Thats exactly my point. If he was or had the potential to be Elite, someone would have taken a shot and hope to turn him around.

He can be a decent goalie in the NHL. I just think he will be middle of the pack kind of guy....no where near elite
Yeah, and if you reread my post, I said elite is definitely too strong a word, thus meaning, I don't think he's elite.

And as far as decent goalies, if the rest of the team continues to play like they can (see last night's game), that's all he needs to be. I have complete confidence that he can get us through the playoffs, but the rest of the team needs to play to their abilities as well. ****, Biron, of all goaltenders, practically carried the team on his back to the ECF 2 seasons ago. I'm more than certain that Emery has more skill than Biron.

Kambo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:30 PM
  #85
Lomark
Registered User
 
Lomark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country: Sweden
Posts: 600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Dany Heatley
Jason Spezza
Daniel Alfredsson
Wade Redden
Chris Phillips
Anton Volchenkov
Mike Fisher
Antoine Vermette
Joe Corvo
Mike Comrie


Ray Emery had VERY little to do with the Senators making the final that year. In that season his numbers are decent but not even that great for a team that was that good.

About your other point, the reason Ottawa let him leave. If he really had the potential to be ELITE. they would have not let him leave for NOTHING in return even if he was a head case.
We have similar offensive talent as that team and theoretically Emery would only have to match his play from that season to get us to the finals as well. We don't need Brodeur/Luongo/Lundkvist/Miller to win this year. Emery is fine. We have other issues of bigger concern.

Lomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:36 PM
  #86
Kambo
 
Kambo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Pennsauken, NJ
Country: Ireland
Posts: 5,357
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Kambo
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan85 View Post
Emery's not terrible, i didn't mean to make it seem that way. I just think the Flyers would be better off signing Vokoun, Nabokov or maybe even Rinne or Chris Mason. Having one of those 4 goaltenders could pretty much guarantee a cup and i think they're all much better than Emery. There's also a number of RFA goalies this summer who might be worthwhile to trade for. I just don't see the Flyers winning a Cup with Emery in nets, so why bother re-signing him?
Who do the Flyers trade? Better yet, who are they willing to part with to be able to obtain a top of the line goalie? Then there's the cap. If Emery doesn't want to rob the bank next season, I have no qualms signing him for another 2 or 3 years.

Kambo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:38 PM
  #87
FlyersFanz
aut viam inveniam au
 
FlyersFanz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: BlkVanOutsideUrHouse
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,978
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Dany Heatley
Jason Spezza
Daniel Alfredsson
Wade Redden
Chris Phillips
Anton Volchenkov
Mike Fisher
Antoine Vermette
Joe Corvo
Mike Comrie


Ray Emery had VERY little to do with the Senators making the final that year. In that season his numbers are decent but not even that great for a team that was that good.

About your other point, the reason Ottawa let him leave. If he really had the potential to be ELITE. they would have not let him leave for NOTHING in return even if he was a head case.
Really? Goalies don't have to stop pucks? Emery was a young goalie at the time and played really well(.910 sv%) in net, he just had a bad attitude which seems to have disappeared this year.

Ottawa not letting good players go? Dany Heatley? (a 50 goal scorer.) Zdeno Chara (one of the best D-man in the league), Ray Emery (also has a .910 sv% and 3 SO's)
I would say Ottawa is good at letting good to great players go, it's their GM that has to go, first is was Muckler now Murray.

FlyersFanz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:41 PM
  #88
kammy
Registered User
 
kammy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 239
vCash: 500
michael leighton is better

kammy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 01:41 PM
  #89
Lomark
Registered User
 
Lomark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country: Sweden
Posts: 600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan85 View Post
Emery's not terrible, i didn't mean to make it seem that way. I just think the Flyers would be better off signing Vokoun, Nabokov or maybe even Rinne or Chris Mason. Having one of those 4 goaltenders could pretty much guarantee a cup and i think they're all much better than Emery. There's also a number of RFA goalies this summer who might be worthwhile to trade for. I just don't see the Flyers winning a Cup with Emery in nets, so why bother re-signing him?
No it wouldn't. Teams win trophies without elite goaltending all the time. Just go back to the last olympics or the playoffs two seasons ago. There were much better goaltenders than those of team Sweden and Detroit Red Wings. I'd much rather have Emery for 1.5 than Vokoun/Nabokov for 5+ and lose other important pieces. Two of the biggest favourites to win this year are the Capitals and the Blackhawks. Do you think their goaltending is much better than ours? When did Luongo/Miller/Kiprusoff/Lundkvist last win their teams a cup?

Lomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:08 PM
  #90
IceDaddy
24 and Counting
 
IceDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,877
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lomark View Post
No it wouldn't. Teams win trophies without elite goaltending all the time. Just go back to the last olympics or the playoffs two seasons ago. There were much better goaltenders than those of team Sweden and Detroit Red Wings. I'd much rather have Emery for 1.5 than Vokoun/Nabokov for 5+ and lose other important pieces. Two of the biggest favourites to win this year are the Capitals and the Blackhawks. Do you think their goaltending is much better than ours? When did Luongo/Miller/Kiprusoff/Lundkvist last win their teams a cup?

Over the past 20 years, only 1 team has won the cup without a true elite goalie.

The Red Wings.


Oh and for the record, the Caps or Hawks wont win the cup either without a real #1 guy.....


Last edited by IceDaddy: 02-02-2010 at 02:29 PM.
IceDaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:28 PM
  #91
HoverCarle*
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Country: Canada
Posts: 17,859
vCash: 500
Send a message via MSN to HoverCarle*
Emery was for sure a reason they got to the finals.
He keeps you in games, and gives you every chance to win. The reason Ottawa lost was because of soft d like Corvo, Preissing, Meszaros

HoverCarle* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:29 PM
  #92
Lomark
Registered User
 
Lomark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country: Sweden
Posts: 600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Over the past 20 years, only 1 team has won the cup without a true elite goalie.

The Red Wings.
Osgood has quite a few of those rings tho, yes?

And it's not like the teams that have won only had their goalie to thank for winning. If you think about Tampa Bay Lightning, Anaheim Ducks, Carolina Hurricanes cup wins would you say their goaltenders is what defined them? If you do I think Lecavalier, St' Louis, B.Richards, Pronger, Niedermayer, Staal and the other warriors on that team would be pretty offended. Granted the goalies of those teams had good runs but how much of that was due to the team playing in front of them? How have those goalies fared since then?

Lomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:39 PM
  #93
Mgkibbles
Registered User
 
Mgkibbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Gilbertsville, Pa
Posts: 2,024
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lomark View Post
Osgood has quite a few of those rings tho, yes?

And it's not like the teams that have won only had their goalie to thank for winning. If you think about Tampa Bay Lightning, Anaheim Ducks, Carolina Hurricanes cup wins would you say their goaltenders is what defined them? If you do I think Lecavalier, St' Louis, B.Richards, Pronger, Niedermayer, Staal and the other warriors on that team would be pretty offended. Granted the goalies of those teams had good runs but how much of that was due to the team playing in front of them? How have those goalies fared since then?
Cam Ward and Khabibulin carried their clubs, JSG was good, but the team's success was more because of the Ducks defense, but when talking about Carolina and TB the first thing that comes to my mind is goaltending during their cup runs.

Mgkibbles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:44 PM
  #94
IceDaddy
24 and Counting
 
IceDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,877
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lomark View Post
Osgood has quite a few of those rings tho, yes?

And it's not like the teams that have won only had their goalie to thank for winning. If you think about Tampa Bay Lightning, Anaheim Ducks, Carolina Hurricanes cup wins would you say their goaltenders is what defined them? If you do I think Lecavalier, St' Louis, B.Richards, Pronger, Niedermayer, Staal and the other warriors on that team would be pretty offended. Granted the goalies of those teams had good runs but how much of that was due to the team playing in front of them? How have those goalies fared since then?

Osgood has 3 cups. He was the starter for 2 of them. Also, with the team they had, they did not need an elite guy.

Like I said, 1 team has won without an elite goalie. Of course those teams had awesome players, but I will contend that most of them dont win it without the elite goalie backing them up

IceDaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:46 PM
  #95
Lomark
Registered User
 
Lomark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country: Sweden
Posts: 600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mgkibbles View Post
Cam Ward and Khabibulin carried their clubs, JSG was good, but the team's success was more because of the Ducks defense, but when talking about Carolina and TB the first thing that comes to my mind is goaltending during their cup runs.
Cam Ward was spectacular. I do think Tampa won more because of the team in front of Bulin tho. And is it just a coincidence that those goalies never got back to that playoff standard? (again Ward might be a bad example) An elite goalie is ofc a plus but in no ways necessary to win a cup. Good teams make their goalies look good.

Lomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:48 PM
  #96
Lomark
Registered User
 
Lomark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Country: Sweden
Posts: 600
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Osgood has 3 cups. He was the starter for 2 of them. Also, with the team they had, they did not need an elite guy.

Like I said, 1 team has won without an elite goalie. Of course those teams had awesome players, but I will contend that most of them dont win it without the elite goalie backing them up
Yeah well that's exactly my point..

Lomark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 02:49 PM
  #97
Mgkibbles
Registered User
 
Mgkibbles's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Gilbertsville, Pa
Posts: 2,024
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lomark View Post
Cam Ward was spectacular. I do think Tampa won more because of the team in front of Bulin tho. And is it just a coincidence that those goalies never got back to that playoff standard? (again Ward might be a bad example) An elite goalie is ofc a plus but in no ways necessary to win a cup. Good teams make their goalies look good.
Khabibulin left directly following the Stanley Cup season and went to a pretty crummy Blackhawks team were he couldn't stay healthy so I don't think its fair to point at him and say well he never replicated his performance. Though I do agree the team in front makes the goalie look better than he is many times, take Giggy with the Ducks and the Red Wings with Osgood for recent examples.

Mgkibbles is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 03:04 PM
  #98
Giroux tha Damaja
Registered User
 
Giroux tha Damaja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mount Holly, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,232
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Giroux tha Damaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Osgood has 3 cups. He was the starter for 2 of them. Also, with the team they had, they did not need an elite guy.

Like I said, 1 team has won without an elite goalie. Of course those teams had awesome players, but I will contend that most of them dont win it without the elite goalie backing them up
Cam Ward wasn't an elite goalie the season he won or the next season after (he was a talented rookie that got hot). Khabibulin was a good starter that got hot. Marc Andre Fleury was a very good goalie that got hot. Osgood we've covered. There are probably three or four elite goalies in the NHL right now (Miller, Lundqvist, Brodeur and Luongo), and two of them don't even have rings. Giguere and Brodeur are probably the only two goalies who I would say were playing on a whole other level the year they won the cup in the last decade. The rest of the years were just good goalies playing their best. You don't need an elite goalie to win, you just need a decent one playing well.

When you're comparing their A-games only, the difference between the top 20 or so goalies in the NHL is not that huge. They're all pretty sick when they're on.

Giroux tha Damaja is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 06:19 PM
  #99
IceDaddy
24 and Counting
 
IceDaddy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Canada
Country: Canada
Posts: 5,877
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am The Mush View Post
Cam Ward wasn't an elite goalie the season he won or the next season after (he was a talented rookie that got hot). Khabibulin was a good starter that got hot. Marc Andre Fleury was a very good goalie that got hot. Osgood we've covered. There are probably three or four elite goalies in the NHL right now (Miller, Lundqvist, Brodeur and Luongo), and two of them don't even have rings. Giguere and Brodeur are probably the only two goalies who I would say were playing on a whole other level the year they won the cup in the last decade. The rest of the years were just good goalies playing their best. You don't need an elite goalie to win, you just need a decent one playing well.

When you're comparing their A-games only, the difference between the top 20 or so goalies in the NHL is not that huge. They're all pretty sick when they're on.
I would agree with that. I simply meant I dont think that Emery has it in him.

By the way, there was a post above that mentioned that emery was a main reason the Sens went to the final. Well these are his play offs stats. .904 2.46, Those numbers do not win any team a cup. He will have to be totally unbelievable. He would have to out play Lundqvist, Brodeur, Fleury, Miller and thats just in the east.

Maybe I am wrong and he has it in him, but I believe he is 28, and he has not shown anything "elite" yet. I will always have my doubts..

IceDaddy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-02-2010, 11:44 PM
  #100
GoneFullHextall
adios Holmgren
 
GoneFullHextall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Somewhere in NH
Country: United States
Posts: 31,481
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by HabsRock View Post
Dany Heatley
Jason Spezza
Daniel Alfredsson
Wade Redden
Chris Phillips
Anton Volchenkov
Mike Fisher
Antoine Vermette
Joe Corvo
Mike Comrie


Ray Emery had VERY little to do with the Senators making the final that year. In that season his numbers are decent but not even that great for a team that was that good.

About your other point, the reason Ottawa let him leave. If he really had the potential to be ELITE. they would have not let him leave for NOTHING in return even if he was a head case.

So are you trying to say if Patrick Lalime or Prusek was the goalie for Ottawa they would have still went to the Final?
I dont see it.


Last edited by GoneFullHextall: 02-02-2010 at 11:49 PM.
GoneFullHextall is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 06:02 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.