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KOVALCHUK traded to the New Jersey Devils for Bergfors, Oduya, Cormier & 1st rounder

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Old
02-03-2010, 07:33 PM
  #126
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Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
I would think the same if he played anywhere in the league. And to say Niedermeyer stats were a reflection of his progression is incredibly inaccurate as it was the system he played in NJ. Any expert or even Niedermeyer himself would tell you he would have been a 60-70 point Dman in any other system.
this whole system stuff is way over rated

Gomez was suppose to become a high scoring machine after leaving the "defensive NJ system"..

obviously stats are not saying everything but you cant blame a 100% difference solely on system..many players enjoyed good offensive seasons in NJ..

I think its more on the fact when you are young you get less responsability and ice time..and to be able to produce like Phaneuf has..its something special..
_____________

as for Kovalchuk I think he'll go to Chicago..Atlanta said they need "name "player and Boston has none+ they are not close enough to contetion..

LA would have the assets too

and do not rule out the Pens..we never know with them..they can afford to go for a rental Kovalchuk as it gives them such great chance to win another cup..

unlike a team like LA where it would only give them better odds to go deep but they're still short for a cup run..I believe..

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Old
02-03-2010, 07:37 PM
  #127
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I like Cammalleri, but he's not in the same league as Gaborik. It's true that he had injury problems and that it was a risky move to sign him. I understand why Bob went this way. He chose the safe way. However, Cammalleri is not a guy who can carry your team. Gabby is.
Which is why the NYR is below the Habs in the standing? He's doing a great job!!

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02-03-2010, 07:40 PM
  #128
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Which is why the NYR is below the Habs in the standing? He's doing a great job!!
Cammalleri actually has a supporting cast.

Gaborik has almost 30 more points than Prospal who is 2nd on the team in scoring. He also has 21 more goals than Callahan who is 2nd on the team in that department.

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Old
02-03-2010, 07:41 PM
  #129
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Cammalleri actually has a supporting cast.

Gaborik has almost 30 more points than Prospal who is 2nd on the team in scoring. He also has 21 more goals than Callahan who is 2nd on the team in that department.
That is pretty astounding.

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Old
02-03-2010, 07:44 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by JGRB View Post
Je suis, Mike Cammalleri.
im talking about in a trade

and as much as i love cammalleri, as you can see on my avatar, kovalchuk is in a whole other league compared to cammy...

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02-03-2010, 07:46 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
Cammalleri actually has a supporting cast.

Gaborik has almost 30 more points than Prospal who is 2nd on the team in scoring. He also has 21 more goals than Callahan who is 2nd on the team in that department.
So he's carrying them to a 9th place finish?

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02-03-2010, 07:46 PM
  #132
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That is pretty astounding.
Think that is good? Look at this from Pavel Bure...

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/l...002342001.html

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02-03-2010, 07:48 PM
  #133
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So he's carrying them to a 9th place finish?
Which is a far cry from last place if they don't have him on the team.

Regardless of the fact they are 9th does not negate the fact he can carry a team better than Cammalleri. Cam is not even the best offensive player this year for the Habs.

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Old
02-03-2010, 07:52 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by Jay1337 View Post
this whole system stuff is way over rated

Gomez was suppose to become a high scoring machine after leaving the "defensive NJ system"..

obviously stats are not saying everything but you cant blame a 100% difference solely on system..many players enjoyed good offensive seasons in NJ..

I think its more on the fact when you are young you get less responsability and ice time..and to be able to produce like Phaneuf has..its something special..
_____________

as for Kovalchuk I think he'll go to Chicago..Atlanta said they need "name "player and Boston has none+ they are not close enough to contetion..

LA would have the assets too

and do not rule out the Pens..we never know with them..they can afford to go for a rental Kovalchuk as it gives them such great chance to win another cup..

unlike a team like LA where it would only give them better odds to go deep but they're still short for a cup run..I believe..
Tell that to Marty St.Louis, Latendresse, Pouliot, Brule, Sullivan....the coaching and system has a lot to play into the true calibre you get from a player.

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Old
02-03-2010, 07:53 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by le_sean View Post
Think that is good? Look at this from Pavel Bure...

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/l...002342001.html
Considering the low point totals and assist totals to all the players it looked like Pavel generated the majority of his goals on his own.

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02-03-2010, 08:00 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
Tell that to Marty St.Louis, Latendresse, Pouliot, Brule, Sullivan....the coaching and system has a lot to play into the true calibre you get from a player.
what ?

almost all the players you named there did receive increased responsabilities with their new teams..that's why you see an improve..

st louis wasnt really given a chance by the Flames..to produce in an offensive role..

Latendresse/Pouliot were both old prospects who were not going anywhere and got traded because their own team lost hope with them

Brule/Sullivan pretty much the same thing as Latendresse and Pouliot..and to be honest Sullivan is over rated imo..

I believe ice time and responsabilities is much more important then coaching and system..its the same coaching and same system for every player of the team..but not the same responsabilities for every player..

some player believe "they can do it" but are not given a chance and they end up boiling/frustrated..and want to "prove" themselves when traded

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02-03-2010, 08:13 PM
  #137
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what ?

almost all the players you named there did receive increased responsabilities with their new teams..that's why you see an improve..

st louis wasnt really given a chance by the Flames..to produce in an offensive role..

Latendresse/Pouliot were both old prospects who were not going anywhere and got traded because their own team lost hope with them

Brule/Sullivan pretty much the same thing as Latendresse and Pouliot..and to be honest Sullivan is over rated imo..

I believe ice time and responsabilities is much more important then coaching and system..its the same coaching and same system for every player of the team..but not the same responsabilities for every player..

some player believe "they can do it" but are not given a chance and they end up boiling/frustrated..and want to "prove" themselves when traded
That's what I'm saying, they got to play a different game that suited their play and that is why they succeeded elsewhere.

System comes into play, so does a coaches approach on how to use a player.

In regards to Sullivan I am talking about his transfer to Chicago out of Toronto, not Chicago to Nashville...although he did well there before injury.

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Old
02-03-2010, 08:14 PM
  #138
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Gomez + Gionta + Halak + Weber + 1st
vs

Kovalchuk, Lethonen, Paquette + maybe something else

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02-03-2010, 08:16 PM
  #139
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http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie/?id=308816

Quote:
Teams have been told Waddell wants one top six forward, one top four defenceman and a prospect or high end draft pick.
Andrei Kostitsyn
Roman Hamrlik/Jaroslav Spacek
Yannick Weber/Matt D'Agostini

vs

Kovalchuk


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02-03-2010, 08:19 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by Jimmy Ballzilly View Post
Gomez + Gionta + Halak + Weber + 1st
vs

Kovalchuk, Lethonen, Paquette + maybe something else
That deal gives Atlanta another line to go with the likes of Little, Kane, Antropov, Kozlov and others...but takes away a large chunk of our top 2 lines.

Sure, I would love to see a Pouiliot-Plekanec-Kovalhuck line, but what do we have after that with Andrei Kostitsyn and Mike Cammarelli out???

And who centres them???

Plus, we could lose both Kovalchuk and Plekanec to UFA. Only plus is we would open up almost 13 million in payroll.

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02-03-2010, 08:21 PM
  #141
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if the habs can either rid themselves of the gomez contract or guarantee that kovalchuk signs an extension, we have NO business of being in these trade talks.

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02-03-2010, 08:23 PM
  #142
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Habsfan18 View Post
http://www.tsn.ca/columnists/bob_mckenzie/?id=308816



Andrei Kostitsyn
Roman Hamrlik/Jaroslav Spacek
Yannick Weber/Matt D'Agostini

vs

Kovalchuk

probably more like

A.Kostitsyn
R.Hamrlik
M.Pacioretty or PK Subban
+ maybe more because I believe some teams can offer better package !

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02-03-2010, 08:25 PM
  #143
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Kovalchuk would equal.


Andrei Kostitsyn
Roman Hamrlik
PK Subban/Max Pacioretty
1st round pick

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02-03-2010, 08:28 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by odishabs View Post
Kovalchuk would equal.


Andrei Kostitsyn
Roman Hamrlik
PK Subban/Max Pacioretty
1st round pick
Which is IMO way too much for a rental when there's hardly any guarantee we'll make the playoffs.

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Old
02-03-2010, 08:31 PM
  #145
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Originally Posted by Jimmy Ballzilly View Post
Gomez + Gionta + Halak + Weber + 1st
vs

Kovalchuk, Lethonen, Paquette + maybe something else
That's one mega ****in' facepalm.

He's not coming here. And if he does, it will be the dumbest thing Gainey has ever done. Unless of course he comes with an extension and then it would depend on the price of the extension.

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02-03-2010, 08:34 PM
  #146
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I don't think anyone over 30 is of interest to Wadell.

It would be more like

AKos
Gorges
MaxPac

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Old
02-03-2010, 08:42 PM
  #147
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http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=515802

Boston and Philly are out of the race now

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Old
02-03-2010, 08:49 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by marc88 View Post
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=515802

Boston and Philly are out of the race now
Montréal isn't even in it, so why does this get it's own thread ?

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Old
02-03-2010, 08:49 PM
  #149
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I'd do:

Hamr/Spacek
A. Kosty
S. Kosty

for

Kovy
Armstrong

in a second. I'd even throw in Weber or a 2nd to sweeten the pot. No brainer imo as Kovalchuk is a SUPER STAR player we haven't had since... Lafleur. Only problem would be signing him in the off season. Mind you, I don't think anyone will pay him the $10M he's apparently looking for and Russian tend to like playing in Montreal.

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Old
02-03-2010, 08:50 PM
  #150
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Montréal isn't even in it, so why does this get it's own thread ?
Surely you know what an OT thread is?

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