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Dallas interested in Goligoski

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Old
02-04-2010, 02:52 PM
  #76
Gooch
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I agree with Jiggy, I think there is a big undervaluing of Goligoski going around. Goligoski has seriously 40+ point puck moving potential, those guys dont exactly grow on trees. If they are dealing from an area of strength (their wingers) to fill an area of need (puck moving dman and future pp qb) then Goligoski for a signficant winger of theirs makes a ton of sense.

I guess we're spoiled in the sense that this team has seemingly had a plethora of talented offensive puckmoving defenseman when the majority of the NHL treasures that skillset.

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02-04-2010, 02:58 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
James Neal is on pace for a 34 goal season in his 2nd season.
omg, stop the presses!!! he's on pace for 30+ goals!!! wow -manoman!!!

Well why didn't ya say so!?!

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Old
02-04-2010, 03:23 PM
  #78
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Never trade for a guy with two first names. Guys like that are soff.

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02-04-2010, 03:23 PM
  #79
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Malkin for Neal

34 goal scorers don't grow on trees

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Old
02-04-2010, 03:28 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
You're about a million over the cap with all of that, but if Eaton gets $3 million/year I'll eat my hat so it doesn't matter anyways. It's not exactly a great setup anyways to be frank. Nick friggin' Johnson as a full time top six forward, an unproven (yes face it) Letestu getting consistent minutes, and you need to re-sign/replace Cooke as well which would definitely put it over the cap.
How do you know I'm over the cap with that unless you run the numbers?

LWCRW
Kunitz (3.725)Crosby (8.700)Benn (0.822)
FA (X.XXX)Staal (4.000)Malkin (8.700)
Cooke (1.600)FA (X.XXX)Kennedy (0.725)
Rupp (0.825)Talbot (1.050)Godard (0.750)

LDRD
Gonchar (5.000)Orpik (3.750)
Eaton (2.500)Letang (3.250)
Lovejoy (0.500)FA (X.XXX)

Goalie
Fleury (5.000)
Backup (0.525)

PositionTotal
Forwards(33.897)
Defense(17.000)
Goalies(5.525)
Total(56.422)

The players that we use as the 2nd line LW and 3rd line center could be determined in camp next season or acquired through free agency. Same with the 3rd pairing defenseman.

There would be $5 million to split between those three positions if you cut Eaton's salary to 2.5 since you don't think he'll get 3, though I suspect he easily could given what Scuderi got last year and what other free agent defensemen have gotten in recent years. All of this would most definitely be under the cap unless the cap drops, and there has been no indication so far that such would be the case.

You're going to get "hometown" discounts for Letang and Eaton if you re-sign them, whereas you'll overpay if you let them walk and try to get all of your defensemen through free agency. What would you do differently?

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02-04-2010, 03:37 PM
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnniewalker View Post
How do you know I'm over the cap with that unless you run the numbers?

Since you didn't, I'll do it for you:

LWCRW
Kunitz (3.725)Crosby (8.700)Benn (0.822)
FA (X.XXX)Staal (4.000)Malkin (8.700)
Cooke (1.600)FA (X.XXX)Kennedy (0.725)
Rupp (0.825)Talbot (1.050)Godard (0.750)

LDRD
Gonchar (5.000)Orpik (3.750)
Eaton (2.500)Letang (3.250)
Lovejoy (0.500)FA (X.XXX)

Goalie
Fleury (5.000)
Backup (0.525)

PositionTotal
Forwards(33.897)
Defense(17.000)
Goalies(5.525)
Total(56.422)

The players that we use as the 2nd line LW and 3rd line center could be determined in camp next season or acquired through free agency. Same with the 3rd pairing defenseman.

There would be $5 million to split between those three positions if you cut Eaton's salary to 2.5 since you don't think he'll get 3, though I suspect he easily could given what Scuderi got last year and what other free agent defensemen have gotten in recent years. All of this would most definitely be under the cap unless the cap drops, and there has been no indication so far that such would be the case.

You're going to get "hometown" discounts for Letang and Eaton if you re-sign them, whereas you'll overpay if you let them walk and try to get all of your defensemen through free agency. If you think my lineup is so bad, what would you do differently?
I'm not knocking you (well except the Nick Johnson part), in fact I was going to add that it's a difficult task trying to project the cap situation a season from now but I already clicked submit. Oh well, the point still stands.

You've got $56.422 million with 3 players to go so I think it would end up being a little bit over the cap. A seventh defenseman and thirteenth forward would be added to that number as well. I think the backup goalie estimate is a little low too, but we got Johnson for that amount so I can't argue with it.

It's just a little risky doing it this way to me, but we're splitting hairs a little bit. Fedotenko sucks but that doesn't mean he isn't more capable than Nick Johnson or someone like him. If Letestu doesn't pan out all of a sudden you're a two line team. I'd probably rather have the 3 centers split up like usual and try to get more value out of that 2nd LW spot, that's about it.

Also on a related note: I know we have to pinch pennies because of our big contracts, but Letang at $3+ million is ridiculous to me but I'm sure that's what he'll get.

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02-04-2010, 03:46 PM
  #82
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UnderratedBrooks44 View Post
I'm not knocking you (well except the Nick Johnson part), in fact I was going to add that it's a difficult task trying to project the cap situation a season from now but I already clicked submit. Oh well, the point still stands.

You've got $56.422 million with 3 players to go so I think it would end up being a little bit over the cap. A seventh defenseman and thirteenth forward would be added to that number as well. I think the backup goalie estimate is a little low too, but we got Johnson for that amount so I can't argue with it.

It's just a little risky doing it this way to me, but we're splitting hairs a little bit. Fedotenko sucks but that doesn't mean he isn't more capable than Nick Johnson or someone like him. If Letestu doesn't pan out all of a sudden you're a two line team. I'd probably rather have the 3 centers split up like usual and try to get more value out of that 2nd LW spot, that's about it.

Also on a related note: I know we have to pinch pennies because of our big contracts, but Letang at $3+ million is ridiculous to me but I'm sure that's what he'll get.
I explained badly in my example, but the 56.422 is already allocating $5 million to split between the 3 positions with X salary. I also edited my post to undo what appeared to be snarkiness, because I didn't mean it that way when I wrote it but it sounded that way when I read it.

I do agree, though, that it's risky to be close to the cap especially when relying on unproven rookies in your lineup, though I really meant any old rookie would do in those spots. If you put Johnson or whoever impresses in camp in at LW, Letestu or whoever impresses at camp at C, and maybe a cheap free agent on the final pairing, you could save most of that $5m I allocated for the trade deadline and have the space to pull off a big deal.

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Old
02-04-2010, 03:51 PM
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnniewalker View Post
I explained badly in my example, but the 56.422 is already allocating $5 million to split between the 3 positions with X salary. I also edited my post to undo what appeared to be snarkiness, because I didn't mean it that way when I wrote it but it sounded that way when I read it.

I do agree, though, that it's risky to be close to the cap especially when relying on unproven rookies in your lineup, though I really meant any old rookie would do in those spots. If you put Johnson or whoever impresses in camp in at LW, Letestu or whoever impresses at camp at C, and maybe a cheap free agent on the final pairing, you could save most of that $5m I allocated for the trade deadline and have the space to pull off a big deal.
True, the only thing is if Letestu isn't the real thing we're a two line team which I'll go on record saying I would be fine with but a lot of people around here disagree.

Like I said the second LW spot is the only big thorn in my side, but I guess you can't have everything. It would be nice if the light bulb went off for Tangradi. I don't think anyone else has the potential to be more than a stop gap at that position.

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Old
02-04-2010, 03:55 PM
  #84
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I have to chuckle at all the 2010-11 projected lineups popping up with Malkin playing RW next to Staal. Two games and suddenly the last two playoff runs don't mean a thing anymore, I guess.

Amazing.

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Old
02-04-2010, 03:57 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
I have to chuckle at all the 2010-11 projected lineups popping up with Malkin playing RW next to Staal. Two games and suddenly the last two playoff runs don't mean a thing anymore, I guess.

Amazing.
I think it's perfectly fine for Staal to play with Malkin sometimes and then other times be thrown on the third line so we can roll three lines, depending on the situation. People here get too worked about coaches mixing lines - it happens all of the time. I think if it were done properly (I have total confidence in Bylsma) then it would be a very good thing for the Penguins.

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Old
02-04-2010, 04:00 PM
  #86
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Well no Malkin should definitely be the center I just let it pass if people have him at wing because I figure people just might mean they want Staal to take faceoffs therefore he's the center when the play starts.

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02-04-2010, 04:05 PM
  #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jag68Sid87 View Post
I have to chuckle at all the 2010-11 projected lineups popping up with Malkin playing RW next to Staal. Two games and suddenly the last two playoff runs don't mean a thing anymore, I guess.

Amazing.
You can chuckle about it if you want, but honestly it's just a way of looking at the information. Whoever we plug in at 3rd line center in lineups will likely be interchangeable with 2nd line winger, as they will probably be a random AHLer. It's not like Mark Letestu couldn't go on 2nd line RW if you move Malkin back to center, and in fact he would probably be better at draws than Malkin would.

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02-04-2010, 04:05 PM
  #88
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My point being they'll each center their own line again. And possibly as early as Saturday afternoon if Kunitz and Talbot are really ready to come back.

And even if they're not, maybe Shero and co. will continue the AHL carousel and recall someone new. We all thought Caputi deserved to stick around but he was sent down. Johnson has been up and down a ton. Conner deserved another game but he was sent down. It wouldn't surprise me if Letestu stays down this time.

Crosby, Malkin, Staal, Adams. That's our center strength. That's what wins for us. Everything else is temporary.

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Old
02-04-2010, 04:06 PM
  #89
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If Neal is an RFA, and we did trade for him and he left, what kind of compensation would we be looking at getting back?

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Old
02-04-2010, 04:11 PM
  #90
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Doesnt matter where Staal / Malkin play on the line. The two of them understand the following.

-Staal takes faceoffs
-Staal should play the down low d zone coverage
-Malkin would primarily be the guy taking the puck through the neutral zone.

As long as those things generally happen, they can both patrol and cover so much ice due to speed size and instincts that the results (thus far) have been impressive.

And again. It should be opponent or game situation based. The fact that both options seem to work so well is far from a problem. And IMO, speaks volumes about J.staals hockey sense and ability positively impact so many situations.

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Old
02-04-2010, 04:19 PM
  #91
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I think the thing that everyone is forgetting about trading Goligoski is that it all but requires that we must keep Gonchar. Gonchar would then have all the leverage in contract negotiations, and force us into something like 3 years/$16 million.

If we could get another puckmover somehow, I wouldn't be inherently opposed to this trade, though. Something structured around Goligoski and Benn could work.

With that said, it has about a .1% chance of happening.

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Old
02-04-2010, 04:24 PM
  #92
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Fistric and Benn or a decent pick for Gogo is very reasonable

Gogo may have the potential to put up 50pts a season but he doesn't have the potential to ever weigh 200lbs. To put up 50+pts he'll need to stay healthy and noone knows how his body is going to handle playing 82+ games a year. So far he hasn't been able to and hes only been hit solid once or twice. Fistric is young (23)and physical, what our D lacks other than Brooks. Plus his cap hit is only 1mil for the next 2 seasons then hes restricted.

Shero is going to sign Gonchar for 3-4yrs prob btw 4-5mil/yr. So why do we need a replacement for him now? What if Gogo proves he can't produce up to his potential or handle the physicality of the NHL in the next few years before Gonch leaves? We would have missed out on a great deal when his value is at its possible peak...

...but I know in NHL10 hes an 89-OVR in 3yrs

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02-04-2010, 04:27 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pens5887 View Post
Fistric and Benn or a decent pick for Gogo is very reasonable

Gogo may have the potential to put up 50pts a season but he doesn't have the potential to ever weigh 200lbs. To put up 50+pts he'll need to stay healthy and noone knows how his body is going to handle playing 82+ games a year. So far he hasn't been able to and hes only been hit solid once or twice. Fistric is young (23)and physical, what our D lacks other than Brooks. Plus his cap hit is only 1mil for the next 2 seasons then hes restricted.

Shero is going to sign Gonchar for 3-4yrs prob btw 4-5mil/yr. So why do we need a replacement for him now? What if Gogo proves he can't produce up to his potential or handle the physicality of the NHL in the next few years before Gonch leaves? We would have missed out on a great deal when his value is at its possible peak...

...but I know in NHL10 hes an 89-OVR in 3yrs
No. Why would the team want to be on the hook in case he gets injured or his play falls off drastically? He is too old to take that large of a risk I think.

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02-04-2010, 04:54 PM
  #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pens5887 View Post
Fistric and Benn or a decent pick for Gogo is very reasonable

Gogo may have the potential to put up 50pts a season but he doesn't have the potential to ever weigh 200lbs. To put up 50+pts he'll need to stay healthy and noone knows how his body is going to handle playing 82+ games a year. So far he hasn't been able to and hes only been hit solid once or twice. Fistric is young (23)and physical, what our D lacks other than Brooks. Plus his cap hit is only 1mil for the next 2 seasons then hes restricted.

Shero is going to sign Gonchar for 3-4yrs prob btw 4-5mil/yr. So why do we need a replacement for him now? What if Gogo proves he can't produce up to his potential or handle the physicality of the NHL in the next few years before Gonch leaves? We would have missed out on a great deal when his value is at its possible peak...

...but I know in NHL10 hes an 89-OVR in 3yrs
It's not a reasonable return.. It's an awesome return, Benn is a promising goal scoring rookie pwf with two more years on his entry level deal.

Fistric is a great defensive defenseman who actually is not bad at playing the puck, decent skater and good hitter. Signed at a 1 million cap hit for two more years after this one.

The Stars wont give these guys away...

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02-04-2010, 05:14 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by pens5887 View Post
Fistric and Benn or a decent pick for Gogo is very reasonable

Gogo may have the potential to put up 50pts a season but he doesn't have the potential to ever weigh 200lbs. To put up 50+pts he'll need to stay healthy and noone knows how his body is going to handle playing 82+ games a year. So far he hasn't been able to and hes only been hit solid once or twice. Fistric is young (23)and physical, what our D lacks other than Brooks. Plus his cap hit is only 1mil for the next 2 seasons then hes restricted.

Shero is going to sign Gonchar for 3-4yrs prob btw 4-5mil/yr. So why do we need a replacement for him now? What if Gogo proves he can't produce up to his potential or handle the physicality of the NHL in the next few years before Gonch leaves? We would have missed out on a great deal when his value is at its possible peak...

...but I know in NHL10 hes an 89-OVR in 3yrs
Why are people replying to this post?

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Old
02-04-2010, 05:20 PM
  #96
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Never trade for a guy with two first names. Guys like that are soff.
See: Ryan Whitney

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02-04-2010, 05:29 PM
  #97
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It's not a reasonable return.. It's an awesome return, Benn is a promising goal scoring rookie pwf with two more years on his entry level deal.

Fistric is a great defensive defenseman who actually is not bad at playing the puck, decent skater and good hitter. Signed at a 1 million cap hit for two more years after this one.

The Stars wont give these guys away...
I agree completely. I don't know if you guys don't watch Dallas or what but we would be extremely lucky to get this fictional return. I don't see any way that Nieuwendyk makes this deal even though I would absolutely love to see Benn in our top 6.

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02-04-2010, 05:48 PM
  #98
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Where there's smoke, there's fire. pens are scouting the Jackets/Stars game tonight. I see the Pens being interested in players on both teams.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Brian...ening/54/26039

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Old
02-04-2010, 05:51 PM
  #99
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That is the trade suggested on insidepittsburghsports.com

I would even add a decent pick from PITT if Dallas would trade Benn and Fistric for Gogo. I was unable to find a decent sight for Dallas and their "potential trades/rumors" to see how much thruth could be behind this.

Also, I know Gonch is a libility due to his age, but there are guys out their that are older log the same minutes and get paid still. Gonch is in good enough shape to last that long but Shero isn't going to let him go. Gonch won't sign short term and if they were going to possibly let him go Letang would be top priority not Gonch, but thats not the case. Gonch will stay, for the same $$$

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02-04-2010, 06:09 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by SprootsMasterFlex View Post
Where there's smoke, there's fire. pens are scouting the Jackets/Stars game tonight. I see the Pens being interested in players on both teams.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Brian...ening/54/26039
People actually read Eklund?

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