HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The Rink
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The Rink For the not so ready for prime-time players, coaches, referees, and the people that have to live with them. Discuss experiences in local leagues, coaching tips, equipment, and training.

Has anybody had to negotiate a contract before?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
02-19-2010, 06:11 PM
  #1
koh19
Registered User
 
koh19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Fribourg
Country: Switzerland
Posts: 1,164
vCash: 500
Has anybody had to negotiate a contract before?

I'm soon gonna be 20 years old and it means that I'm no longer gonna be a junior player.

I currently play in the 3rd league in my country (which is the highest amateur level before the pros) and although we're not pros (not even half pro), players have to sign contracts.

Now this is new to me, I've never had a contract before and I certainly don't know what I'm entitled to or not. I didn't ask my teammates what it involves because it really seems a little private IMO. I don't even know what my teammates got this year, because they do get a little something , that, I know, but I haven't got a clue of how much we're talking about here. I've heard rumors that some guys can get as much as 10'000 swiss francs per year. I also heard a guy talking about the fact that he got some money for all the travelling he does to go to practices and games. I also think that some players get money for their equipment.

I don't even know what players get in the entire league in general.

The "contract" guy of my club said that we had to prepare a list of things we wanted for next season, what we didn't like this season and what changes we'd like to see. I don't know what I'm supposed to say. We're gonna meet on Monday.

For example, can I like ask for a free gym membership of my choice to train this offseason? stuff like that

I know that I'm the one who should know about this stuff and that most of you guys don't even live in the same country as me but I really haven't got a clue.

Thanks for the help guys

koh19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 06:17 PM
  #2
CanadaBacon
 
CanadaBacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,570
vCash: 500
This os where agents/managers come into play. I would not take advice about something like this from an online forum. Especially in a section where a lot of guys who are new to the game are. Get some professional advice

CanadaBacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 07:16 PM
  #3
BadHammy*
MSL For Hart!
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Right Behind Me!
Posts: 10,444
vCash: 500
Like CB said, ask a professional.

BadHammy* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 07:46 PM
  #4
gojacketsgo61
Fire the Refs!
 
gojacketsgo61's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Country: Canada
Posts: 1,707
vCash: 555
demand millions or holdout

gojacketsgo61 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 07:47 PM
  #5
sjmay*
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by koh19 View Post
I'm soon gonna be 20 years old and it means that I'm no longer gonna be a junior player.

I currently play in the 3rd league in my country (which is the highest amateur level before the pros) and although we're not pros (not even half pro), players have to sign contracts.

Now this is new to me, I've never had a contract before and I certainly don't know what I'm entitled to or not. I didn't ask my teammates what it involves because it really seems a little private IMO. I don't even know what my teammates got this year, because they do get a little something , that, I know, but I haven't got a clue of how much we're talking about here. I've heard rumors that some guys can get as much as 10'000 swiss francs per year. I also heard a guy talking about the fact that he got some money for all the travelling he does to go to practices and games. I also think that some players get money for their equipment.

I don't even know what players get in the entire league in general.

The "contract" guy of my club said that we had to prepare a list of things we wanted for next season, what we didn't like this season and what changes we'd like to see. I don't know what I'm supposed to say. We're gonna meet on Monday.

For example, can I like ask for a free gym membership of my choice to train this offseason? stuff like that

I know that I'm the one who should know about this stuff and that most of you guys don't even live in the same country as me but I really haven't got a clue.

Thanks for the help guys
Definitely talk to a professional, even talk to a veteran on your team, it will help you out.

But keep in mind, you can always ask for anything, it's up to them if they want to give it, it all depends on how much you think they value you in comparison to how much they actually do.

If you ask for something unreasonable, say, 20,000 swiss francs when you have only heard rumours of 10,000, and say a new car, chances are you will be turned down.

Right now, make a list of things you like playing for the team, and a list of things you don't like, be brutally honest on both sides, and then take a look at the list of things you don't like, see what you have control over, if one of the things is travel, not too much control over there, but maybe there is something else you can affect.

sjmay* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 09:28 PM
  #6
koh19
Registered User
 
koh19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Fribourg
Country: Switzerland
Posts: 1,164
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by sjmay View Post
Definitely talk to a professional, even talk to a veteran on your team, it will help you out.

But keep in mind, you can always ask for anything, it's up to them if they want to give it, it all depends on how much you think they value you in comparison to how much they actually do.

If you ask for something unreasonable, say, 20,000 swiss francs when you have only heard rumours of 10,000, and say a new car, chances are you will be turned down.

Right now, make a list of things you like playing for the team, and a list of things you don't like, be brutally honest on both sides, and then take a look at the list of things you don't like, see what you have control over, if one of the things is travel, not too much control over there, but maybe there is something else you can affect.
Thanks.

There's one thing though, I've never heard of somebody that had an agent at this level. I think most of the guys do it themselves.

koh19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 09:35 PM
  #7
sjmay*
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,732
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by koh19 View Post
Thanks.

There's one thing though, I've never heard of somebody that had an agent at this level. I think most of the guys do it themselves.
Yea, at this level agents won't do much good to be honest, it sounds like a local competitive league, that's not really on the national scene.

I would talk to the Vets, and if you have a good relationship with the staff, talk to a coach or manager with your concerns.

I would definitely still make out a list of things you like/dislike about the club. Also make a list of the things you truly want from them, in regards to professional life, your career, etc etc, that will help distinguish what is important to you.

sjmay* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 10:22 PM
  #8
Frankie Spankie
Registered User
 
Frankie Spankie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Dorchester, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 10,316
vCash: 500
Obviously talk to veterans in the league to see what you should be looking for. I think a gym membership would be very reasonable since they really don't cost that much. My suggestion though would be for at least the first season or two, to take what you can get just so you can get your name out there in the rest of the league. I used to work with a guy that was drafted very late by Colorado (like 9th round) and was offered a contract. His agent told him that he could earn more and to hold out. He was never offered another contract again. I don't mean to tell you to go in for free but just take what you can get until you become more known so you have a bit of job security and have a good chance finding a new team if your current team releases you.

Frankie Spankie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-19-2010, 10:38 PM
  #9
CanadaBacon
 
CanadaBacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,570
vCash: 500
If you are accepting payment (cash, material whatever) it is a "pro" league. Doesnt matter how little the income is. When you start getting into contracts you need somebody who has experience with this aspect of the game. One of the biggest mistakes guys do in the lower levels is try and do all the administration work themselves and find out the guys on the other end of deal are smarter then you.

CanadaBacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2010, 08:22 AM
  #10
Bruwinz37
Registered User
 
Bruwinz37's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Country: United States
Posts: 26,878
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by koh19 View Post
I'm soon gonna be 20 years old and it means that I'm no longer gonna be a junior player.

I currently play in the 3rd league in my country (which is the highest amateur level before the pros) and although we're not pros (not even half pro), players have to sign contracts.

Now this is new to me, I've never had a contract before and I certainly don't know what I'm entitled to or not. I didn't ask my teammates what it involves because it really seems a little private IMO. I don't even know what my teammates got this year, because they do get a little something , that, I know, but I haven't got a clue of how much we're talking about here. I've heard rumors that some guys can get as much as 10'000 swiss francs per year. I also heard a guy talking about the fact that he got some money for all the travelling he does to go to practices and games. I also think that some players get money for their equipment.

I don't even know what players get in the entire league in general.

The "contract" guy of my club said that we had to prepare a list of things we wanted for next season, what we didn't like this season and what changes we'd like to see. I don't know what I'm supposed to say. We're gonna meet on Monday.

For example, can I like ask for a free gym membership of my choice to train this offseason? stuff like that

I know that I'm the one who should know about this stuff and that most of you guys don't even live in the same country as me but I really haven't got a clue.

Thanks for the help guys
As it relates to the league you are playing in are you good or do you suck?

Seriously....everything is usually negotiable and it never hurts to ask....all they can do is say no. Start high.

Bruwinz37 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2010, 09:02 AM
  #11
koh19
Registered User
 
koh19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Fribourg
Country: Switzerland
Posts: 1,164
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruwinz37 View Post
As it relates to the league you are playing in are you good or do you suck?

Seriously....everything is usually negotiable and it never hurts to ask....all they can do is say no. Start high.
Compared to the league, I'm pretty good I'd say. It's gonna be my first year 100% "pro". This year (already last year, we got eliminated from the playoffs), I played with the pros and the junior team. I think I have great potential. I'm one of the only ones that has been 100% trained in the club, most of the other players come from outside. Dunno if that has an influence.


Last edited by koh19: 02-20-2010 at 09:10 AM.
koh19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2010, 09:07 AM
  #12
koh19
Registered User
 
koh19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Fribourg
Country: Switzerland
Posts: 1,164
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Krejci46 View Post
Obviously talk to veterans in the league to see what you should be looking for. I think a gym membership would be very reasonable since they really don't cost that much. My suggestion though would be for at least the first season or two, to take what you can get just so you can get your name out there in the rest of the league. I used to work with a guy that was drafted very late by Colorado (like 9th round) and was offered a contract. His agent told him that he could earn more and to hold out. He was never offered another contract again. I don't mean to tell you to go in for free but just take what you can get until you become more known so you have a bit of job security and have a good chance finding a new team if your current team releases you.
thanks!

Yeah, I'm already almost sure I'm gonna stay with the team anyway. They gave me the opportunity to play at this level so I should be grateful.

There also another thing. I want to get somewhere in hockey, I want to go further. I know I'm already quite "old" but my dream is to play professionally. Injuries are the main cause I'm late in my development (serious injuries at 16 and 18 years old). The other players in my team have no desire to play at a higher level, they're just content with what they have (most of them already have a family). Can this be a big factor? What will it change?

koh19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-20-2010, 09:25 AM
  #13
Salzig
I am laudable.
 
Salzig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bonn, Germany
Country: Germany
Posts: 1,002
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by koh19 View Post
There also another thing. I want to get somewhere in hockey, I want to go further. I know I'm already quite "old" but my dream is to play professionally. Injuries are the main cause I'm late in my development (serious injuries at 16 and 18 years old). The other players in my team have no desire to play at a higher level, they're just content with what they have (most of them already have a family). Can this be a big factor? What will it change?
Well I think I can guess what the 3rd league in the Swiss is like. It shouldn't be very different from the German 3rd (semi-pro) league. I think you can make yourself a name with a good effort and some good stats. But I wonder if your dream is really to become a pro? I mean you won't make that much money and you'll probably become a journeyman and you will play for a different team nearly every year. But then again getting paid for playing hockey sounds good, though. (I think it depends on what your regular job is)

I guess the rumors you've heared are right. The best players can make some money even in the 3rd league. The regular players should get the equipment for free. Since it's your first contract I would agree on what they offer you. (one-year contract) It's a chance to play in such a league and you can show other teams your talent, too. In the 2nd year you can resign with your team for a price you think you're worth or go to another team if a team is interested. I think your team will offer you only a one-year contract, I've never heared of a rookie signing a contract for more than one year. If I were you I'd talk to a veteran and ask him for advices.

Salzig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-21-2010, 04:49 PM
  #14
koh19
Registered User
 
koh19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Fribourg
Country: Switzerland
Posts: 1,164
vCash: 500
I asked one of my teammates and he said that I could easily ask for 1000 bucks for the equipement.

koh19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-21-2010, 04:54 PM
  #15
Gino 14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 812
vCash: 500
As stated right off, get yourself an agent or a lawyer. If you take advise from anybody else, you could be throwing money and maybe your career away.

Gino 14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 08:32 AM
  #16
Salzig
I am laudable.
 
Salzig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bonn, Germany
Country: Germany
Posts: 1,002
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gino 14 View Post
As stated right off, get yourself an agent or a lawyer. If you take advise from anybody else, you could be throwing money and maybe your career away.
I don't think that you need an angent for the 3rd league. In addition I also don't think that there is any agent who works for 3rd league players except the really good players...

Salzig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:03 AM
  #17
CanadaBacon
 
CanadaBacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,570
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salzig View Post
I don't think that you need an angent for the 3rd league. In addition I also don't think that there is any agent who works for 3rd league players except the really good players...
If you are receiving payments you need an agent/manager and of course there are agents/managers who work with minor pros.

CanadaBacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:18 AM
  #18
Gino 14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 812
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salzig View Post
I don't think that you need an angent for the 3rd league. In addition I also don't think that there is any agent who works for 3rd league players except the really good players...
Thus my suggestion not to heed the advise of others........

Gino 14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:25 AM
  #19
koh19
Registered User
 
koh19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Fribourg
Country: Switzerland
Posts: 1,164
vCash: 500
Yeah, I don't think anybody in this league has an agent. They do it themselves.

koh19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:28 AM
  #20
hockeymaneeak*
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: United States
Country: United States
Posts: 297
vCash: 500
I'll have to do this in a few years.

hockeymaneeak* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:36 AM
  #21
Salzig
I am laudable.
 
Salzig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Bonn, Germany
Country: Germany
Posts: 1,002
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CanadaBacon View Post
If you are receiving payments you need an agent/manager and of course there are agents/managers who work with minor pros.
I don't know any player who has an agent in the 3rd league over here in Europe. I know there are some players in this league who have an agent (but I don't know them personally) but these players are full pro players who earn their money with hockey. Most of the players in such a low leaggue are semi-pros, thoguh. Maybe it's different in Canada...

Salzig is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:39 AM
  #22
CanadaBacon
 
CanadaBacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,570
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by koh19 View Post
Yeah, I don't think anybody in this league has an agent. They do it themselves.
I know a guy that played for St. Moritz (i think) in some Liga or some such, he was pro and needed an agent. He said he was in a league right under National A and B, so i would assume that is the third highest.

CanadaBacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:41 AM
  #23
CanadaBacon
 
CanadaBacon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: Canada
Posts: 3,570
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salzig View Post
I don't know any player who has an agent in the 3rd league over here in Europe. I know there are some players in this league who have an agent (but I don't know them personally) but these players are full pro players who earn their money with hockey. Most of the players in such a low leaggue are semi-pros, thoguh. Maybe it's different in Canada...
semi pro and minor pro is the same thing, you still receive payment hence you are pro.

Whether you get an agent or not, makes no difference to me, you are the one who will be in the position of being screwed over.

CanadaBacon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:46 AM
  #24
Gino 14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 812
vCash: 500
Because the OP asked, he's not in a position that he knows enough to feel comfortable doing his own negotiations or even what to ask for. It's a whole lot easier to hire an agent and pay him while you learn the ropes than it is to go in blindly and get taken advantage of by an owner's lawyer that can smell a sucker coming. But, it's your money, your career.

Gino 14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
02-22-2010, 11:47 AM
  #25
Gino 14
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Country: United States
Posts: 812
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Salzig View Post
I don't know any player who has an agent in the 3rd league over here in Europe. I know there are some players in this league who have an agent (but I don't know them personally) but these players are full pro players who earn their money with hockey. Most of the players in such a low leaggue are semi-pros, thoguh. Maybe it's different in Canada...
What league do you play for and who negotiates your contracts?

Gino 14 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:52 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.