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Rinne's deal sets the bar for Halak?

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Old
02-25-2010, 11:03 AM
  #51
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
The past few seasons are certainly weighty arguments against the likelihood of offer sheets. If anything, they are probably likely to become entirely extinct altogether after the bad PR that some of them generated. I think the GMs who tried those moves have largely learned from the angst they generated.

But there hasn't been one for a goalie ever (has there?), and I think that even if you saw 1 or 2 per year on other players, it's far less likely to see one on a goalie. Because there are so many goalies available and the demarcation between them is so slim, it's really hard for a team justify making an "overpayment" to get one. That's precisely why the trade market for goalies has always been so stagnant. Teams always have other options. Cheaper options.

I don't see how any of the teams in your list justify the choice of Halak, plus giving him a salary high enough that we wouldn't match, plus giving up at minimum a 1st+3rd round pick. For that matter, some of those teams won't even have the picks to be able to make an offer. Watch which picks go at the deadline. If there are only 3 or 4 teams in the league who arguably could stand for a goalie upgrade, and you knock a couple down for lacking the compensation wherewithal, and then you consider their cap situations, and then you consider the history and political incorrectness of offer sheets... no, its exceedingly unlikely that we have to worry about one.

Of course, if we were worried, we could just go with club-elected arbitration on Halak anyway, and put the final nail in the coffin of that pseudo-threat. We could make it 100% certain that no offer sheets were forthcoming if we really wanted to.

No, I couldn't see Burke doing that. Look at how he handled Kessel. He went through the Penner thing. GMs aren't playing those games. He knows we won't let him go for a 2nd round pick, so why bother?

I think that time is over. People talked about it for a few years, it never happened, and now if anything GMs have probably moved closer to the collusion status of past years, they've seen the acrimony generated by the few offer sheets that did take place, and I'll be shocked if we see very many more, ever. Of course, who really knows. But that's what I'd be betting on if I was handling our goalie situation.
convincing enough...

I definitely hope you're right.

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02-25-2010, 11:28 AM
  #52
Andy
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This thread is hilarious.

Halak hasn't proven anything yet. He's never played more than 40 games in one nhl season and people want to give him money as though he's a veteren goaltender....wake up people, honestly.

Halak has nothing on Rinne who's been nothing but stellar in Nashville for more than just 26 games.

If someone is going send Halak an offer sheet of 3.8 million, I would take the first and 3rd round picks and run.

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02-25-2010, 11:49 AM
  #53
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
This thread is hilarious.

Halak hasn't proven anything yet. He's never played more than 40 games in one nhl season and people want to give him money as though he's a veteren goaltender....wake up people, honestly.

Halak has nothing on Rinne who's been nothing but stellar in Nashville for more than just 26 games.

If someone is going send Halak an offer sheet of 3.8 million, I would take the first and 3rd round picks and run.
Rinne - 95 games, 50-28-8 (10SO) , 2.56GAA , 0.911%

Halak - 86 games, 47-31-4 (7SO) , 2.72GAA, 0.917%

Price - 129 games, 59-46-17 (4SO), 2.74GAA, 0.912%

If somebody offers Price or Halak $3 million, would you take the 2nd round pick and run?

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Old
02-25-2010, 12:30 PM
  #54
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Originally Posted by Yarfangor View Post
I still think Halak will ask for 3-4 million. He could probably get 4-5 on other teams
There's no way Halak gets 4-5.

I'm guessing around 3 max, maybe 3.5, but that'd be pushing it.

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02-25-2010, 12:35 PM
  #55
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Originally Posted by NHLcrazy View Post
Well depends, a 1st, 2nd and 3rd from what team? And also have to consider they are picks from 2011 not 2010.

Would you do it?
No, I wouldn't.

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02-25-2010, 12:46 PM
  #56
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
This thread is hilarious.

Halak hasn't proven anything yet. He's never played more than 40 games in one nhl season and people want to give him money as though he's a veteren goaltender....wake up people, honestly.

Halak has nothing on Rinne who's been nothing but stellar in Nashville for more than just 26 games.

If someone is going send Halak an offer sheet of 3.8 million, I would take the first and 3rd round picks and run.
I second the motion.

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Old
02-25-2010, 01:00 PM
  #57
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Originally Posted by Teufelsdreck View Post
I second the motion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyReb View Post
Rinne - 95 games, 50-28-8 (10SO) , 2.56GAA , 0.911%

Halak - 86 games, 47-31-4 (7SO) , 2.72GAA, 0.917%

Price - 129 games, 59-46-17 (4SO), 2.74GAA, 0.912%

If somebody offers Price or Halak $3 million, would you take the 2nd round pick and run?
So you would also take the 2nd round pick for Halak?

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02-25-2010, 01:04 PM
  #58
Blind Gardien
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http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=87893

Nice extension there on an RFA-aged guy who is playing more than our guys.

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02-25-2010, 01:08 PM
  #59
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
realistic ?

1. Habs have a season because of him
2. Slovaks have a chance of a medal because of him
3. he's only 24 and can still improve his game
4. he WILL have a better offer from KHL guaranteed
5. he's better than at least two or three goalies in the list
6. he improved every single year since he's in NA
7. he's a pro, works had, never complain, always give credit to his teammates, etc

this
he will make upwards to 3 million, but anymore than that will be a major overpayment

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02-25-2010, 01:10 PM
  #60
BigTime
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
This thread is hilarious.

Halak hasn't proven anything yet. He's never played more than 40 games in one nhl season and people want to give him money as though he's a veteren goaltender....wake up people, honestly.

Halak has nothing on Rinne who's been nothing but stellar in Nashville for more than just 26 games.

If someone is going send Halak an offer sheet of 3.8 million, I would take the first and 3rd round picks and run.
i agree here, someone may want to pay him this high but theres no way he should make well over 3 million yet

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02-25-2010, 01:14 PM
  #61
Ohashi_Jouzu
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I imagine someone in here has already pointed out that Rinne is 27 and heading for UFA, and Halak is still 24 heading to RFA, and thus Rinne's contract tells you next to nothing about Halak's "market value".

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02-25-2010, 01:49 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/p....php?pid=87893

Nice extension there on an RFA-aged guy who is playing more than our guys.
Exactly, Quick is more comparable than UFA to be, Rinne.

1.5 to 1.8 for Halak... MAX.

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02-25-2010, 02:11 PM
  #63
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Originally Posted by Agalloch View Post
Exactly, Quick is more comparable than UFA to be, Rinne.

1.5 to 1.8 for Halak... MAX.
I'm not sure Quick is a good comparison at all... he signed that extension at the beginning of this year, after having only played one full season in the NHL, and with only 47 NHL games under his belt. And even then his numbers were rather mediocre, with a .914 save percentage that season (.910 this year). And despite all THAT he's still getting $1,8 million per year, which would suggest to me at least, that $1.8 million is the STARTING point for negotiations, which would then only go up.

To compare, when Quick signed his $1.8 million extension:

* Quick was 24, Halak is 24
* Quick had played 47 NHL games, Halak has played 86 (and counting of course)
* Quick had a .914 save percentage (career), Halak had a .917 save percentage (career) and currently has a .923 save percentage

If you think Halak is going to sign for LESS than what Quick signed for, I would love to hear your logic...

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02-25-2010, 02:20 PM
  #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyReb View Post
I'm not sure Quick is a good comparison at all...

...To compare, when Quick signed his $1.8 million extension:

* Quick was 24, Halak is 24
* Quick had played 47 NHL games, Halak has played 86 (and counting of course)
* Quick had a .914 save percentage (career), Halak has a .917 save percentage (career)
Yeah, pretty much night and day... And you say Quick had played 47 games at that point. I know Halak has played 86 games, but how many did HE have at the time? That makes it even closer.

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02-25-2010, 02:30 PM
  #65
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Originally Posted by Agalloch View Post
Exactly, Quick is more comparable than UFA to be, Rinne.

1.5 to 1.8 for Halak... MAX.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ohashi_Jouzu View Post
Yeah, pretty much night and day... And you say Quick had played 47 games at that point. I know Halak has played 86 games, but how many did HE have at the time? That makes it even closer.
How is that relevent? If anything it merely strengthens Halak's case; "At the same age I have played twice as many games as Quick, look what he signed for..."

Even if you look at that, the 23 year old Halak had still played more games than the 24 year old Quick, who signed for $1.8 million...

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02-25-2010, 02:32 PM
  #66
Kjell Dahlin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnnyReb View Post
I'm not sure Quick is a good comparison at all... he signed that extension at the beginning of this year, after having only played one full season in the NHL, and with only 47 NHL games under his belt. And even then his numbers were rather mediocre, with a .914 save percentage that season (.910 this year). And despite all THAT he's still getting $1,8 million per year, which would suggest to me at least, that $1.8 million is the STARTING point for negotiations, which would then only go up.

To compare, when Quick signed his $1.8 million extension:

* Quick was 24, Halak is 24
* Quick had played 47 NHL games, Halak has played 86 (and counting of course)
* Quick had a .914 save percentage (career), Halak had a .917 save percentage (career) and currently has a .923 save percentage

If you think Halak is going to sign for LESS than what Quick signed for, I would love to hear your logic...
I agree: Quick’s contract is the low benchmark for the upcoming negotiation with Halak.

I see a 2,5M$ cap hit until he reaches UFA status; maybe 3,5M$ if he is willing to "sacrifice" one year of free agency.

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Old
02-25-2010, 02:33 PM
  #67
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Originally Posted by RE-HABS View Post
With the Pred's re-signing Rinne to a two year 6.8 million deal, 2.8 million year one and 4 million year two...does that mean we are looking at Halak demanding 3 - 4 million per in a deal?

http://tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=311320

No way Habs can afford two goalies in the 3 million range and both wanting to play.
That's it. I said it in the past: you can Have for at least 2 years Halak for around 3.0M$, and Price for 2M$. 5M$ while other teams have over 6M$ on one goaltender: that's not bad at all.

Stop talking about trading our best assets (Halak, Price, Plekanec). Usually, teams KEEP the best players. And those three guys can only help us on a short term scale (Halak, Plekanec), and on a long term scale (Halak, Plekanec, Price).

We don't have the cap space? Well I am sure that Hamrlik or Spacek will make an other team happy.

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02-25-2010, 02:35 PM
  #68
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Only in Montreal would you rather trade a young stud goalie who is excelling at the top level of hockey (Olympics) in favour of keeping a young unproven and inconsistent goaltender.

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02-25-2010, 02:38 PM
  #69
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Only in Montreal would you rather trade a young stud goalie who is excelling at the top level of hockey (Olympics) in favour of keeping a young unproven and inconsistent goaltender.
Halak is having a great year, but to call him a stud goalie is a huge stretch. Plus, Price is as proven or more than he is. Sometimes you have to look past NOW and look at the big picture.

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02-25-2010, 02:45 PM
  #70
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Halak is having a great year, but to call him a stud goalie is a huge stretch. Plus, Price is as proven or more than he is. Sometimes you have to look past NOW and look at the big picture.
To see what a goalie has proven?

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02-25-2010, 02:47 PM
  #71
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Halak is having a great year, but to call him a stud goalie is a huge stretch. Plus, Price is as proven or more than he is. Sometimes you have to look past NOW and look at the big picture.
How is Carey Price more proven? I'd love to know. Was it when he choked against Philly or was it Boston last year? When he threw his arms up like Patrick Roy?

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02-25-2010, 02:58 PM
  #72
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How is Carey Price more proven? I'd love to know. Was it when he choked against Philly or was it Boston last year? When he threw his arms up like Patrick Roy?
what does have to do with his actual goaltending?? All that situation proved is that mtl fans are ridiculous, that is all.

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02-25-2010, 03:00 PM
  #73
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How is Carey Price more proven? I'd love to know. Was it when he choked against Philly or was it Boston last year? When he threw his arms up like Patrick Roy?
Halak was the back up for all those supposed chokes, Price has outplayed them for most of the time they have been on the same team. Price has won a Calder Cup and WJHC, what has Halak won?

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02-25-2010, 03:02 PM
  #74
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IMO I think a deal can be work where Halak is paid 2,1 to 2,4 by year and price something like 1,8-2,0 by year and that would be fair considering Rinne and Quick as example. I would be also possible to gave a little less to Price considering he as be paid well with his bonus and he has regressed in term of performance.

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02-25-2010, 03:03 PM
  #75
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Sorry, but that Calder Cup was not won on Carey Prices shoulders, Halak was the goalie for that team, and could have taken us the whole way, but Gainey sent him to the world championships. Carey looked Shakey even at the AHL level, and when he was in Hamilton the next season, he looked like ****. Don't question it because I was there for every home game and a few road games too.

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