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International Tournaments Discuss international tournaments such as the World Juniors, Olympic hockey, and Ice Hockey World Championships, as they take place; or discuss past tournaments.

Al Michaels: Hockey played at its best is THE best.

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Old
03-01-2010, 02:46 PM
  #26
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What Hockey brings that American sports do not are those several minutes of non stop action and unpredictability all at the same time. It's like a strange high, almost like you're in your own world when watching.

Football and baseball stop every 5 to 10 seconds. Basketball is never non stop at the most important part of the game (last 2 minutes), plus it's way too predictable.

That's a major void I miss when watching American sports. It always leaves me feeling unsatisfied.

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Old
03-01-2010, 02:51 PM
  #27
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Yep, the WHL is seeing the first wave of Stars, Sharks, Ducks and Gretzky-era Kings influenced kids now. In 10 years, the OHL might see players from other transplant heavy areas with new NHL teams like Atlanta, Nashville and Carolina.

Look out, Canada.
Few fans actually understand whats the probably inevitable. Closer than ever is USA Hockey.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:01 PM
  #28
DungeonK
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Agreed.

Never caught the first Brokaw piece from the Opening Ceremonies but saw this one. Thought it was wonderful.

Wow, that is absolutely beautiful. Almost brought a tear to my eye.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:06 PM
  #29
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I also love that there is no "loser's ball" in hockey. Every possession is earned. No freebies.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:13 PM
  #30
Brodie
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USA Hockey is improving, no doubt, but I don't think any of you north of the border have anything to worry about. You're always going to be there, just now you're getting a little more competition. It's good, makes things interesting and makes rivalries legit. The one thing NHL expansion/relocation did do for the better was increase interest in the game at the youth and grassroots levels, as another poster pointed out here. A lot of "Gretzky Kings-Era" kids are coming to the surface. Canada's got nothing to worry about, though, just a little competition.
I disagree. Look at Michigan... one of only 8 states with over 10 million people... once youth hockey took a serious hold here, the number of Michiganders making the CHL and NHL skyrocketed to the point where they're now close to Minnesota in number of players in the NHL and had the most players of any single state on the Olympic team. New York has undergone a similar boom on a smaller scale.

Now imagine something like that happening with states the size of California and Texas.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:21 PM
  #31
John Torturella
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Originally Posted by Brodie View Post
I disagree. Look at Michigan... one of only 8 states with over 10 million people... once youth hockey took a serious hold here, the number of Michiganders making the CHL and NHL skyrocketed to the point where they're now close to Minnesota in number of players in the NHL and had the most players of any single state on the Olympic team. New York has undergone a similar boom on a smaller scale.

Now imagine something like that happening with states the size of California and Texas.
New Jersey as well.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:26 PM
  #32
WhipNash27
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I remember there was a site that had NHL players by location. I don't remember what it was though.

According to another site I see
http://www.hockeywidgets.com/newblog...geography.html
Back in 2007, Minnesota (25), Michigan (24), New York (21), Massachusetts (20) had the most NHL players. Now I know that today there are definitely quite a few players from NJ that I'm seeing popping up, although this only says 3.

I know in NY you're also starting to see a much higher amount of NHL players coming out of the southern part of NY than in the past. In the past I think a larger percentage of NY players who made the NHL were from upstate.

Either way, as hockey grows more in these metropolitan areas, you should see a much larger and hopefully more skilled group of American players coming up. I mean look at Canada and how many players come out of the Toronto & Montreal areas.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:38 PM
  #33
massivegoonery
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Originally Posted by Minister of Offence View Post
Few fans actually understand whats the probably inevitable. Closer than ever is USA Hockey.
Are you speaking for the entire Jedi Council here?

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:40 PM
  #34
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Now imagine something like that happening with states the size of California and Texas.
Soon

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:49 PM
  #35
rye&ginger
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Are you speaking for the entire Jedi Council here?


Always in motion is the future.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:52 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by NeelyWasAWarrior View Post
Why do people say USA hockey is on the rise, if anything i see a decrease in talent compared to our previous olympic squads. Yea we have a good team, a young team but overrall our team doesn't compare to:

Roenick
Tkachuk
Hull
Modano
Leetch
Leclair
Guerin
Lafontaine
Chelios
etc.
You have a point. For now. Don't forget that a lot of this team is under 25. They are going to get a lot better and some of those guy's (maybe most of them) WILL be passed on the list of best US players ever. The only guy that for sure won't be passed is Hull, the rest of them IMO are fair game.

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:59 PM
  #37
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Hope the TV ratings aren't too big in the US. They have a large minor hockey program in even Dallas now. Dallas of all places. SoCal is even cranking out good players; a team from there PWND at the midget tournament.

I don't like this.
The best coaches down here are Cdn; they toss out the USA Hockey 'manuals' and teach "the Canadian way".

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Old
03-01-2010, 03:59 PM
  #38
mrzeigler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NeelyWasAWarrior View Post
Why do people say USA hockey is on the rise, if anything i see a decrease in talent compared to our previous olympic squads. Yea we have a good team, a young team but overrall our team doesn't compare to:

Roenick
Tkachuk
Hull
Modano
Leetch
Leclair
Guerin
Lafontaine
Chelios
etc.
Once a nation has become relatively mature in its consumption of/participation in a sport, it's easy to pick the 10 best players from any era and make a case that they're roughly as good as the 10 best from another era.

But when multiple metropolitan areas as has been the case with hockey over the past couple decades add a new sport to the landscape and that sport grabs attention of children there, then as a nation, the quality of those top 10 players inches upward a bit. But more importantly, the quality of the next dozen players (the ones who round out an Olympic roster) increases significantly.

It can take a couple of decades as those metro areas add ice rinks and mature as hockey cities, but it happens. Pittsburgh went from a market that produced no NHL players to producing Ryan Malone and R.J Umberger and a few depth players to a region that produced several players on the World Juniors and U-17 Challenge teams that beat Canada this year.

I'm not claiming Pittsburgh is a powerhouse in terms of producing NHL talent, but I am saying it has developed into a region that will turn out players on a regular basis. The same can be expected in coming years of Dallas, the California markets and perhaps even some of the troubled expansion cities if the NHL sticks it out there (I'm not advocating one way or another on that issue).

This story on the Penguins website expands on what I'm saying: http://penguins.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=518754

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Old
03-01-2010, 04:11 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Minister of Offence View Post
Few fans actually understand whats the probably inevitable. Closer than ever is USA Hockey.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rye&ginger View Post


Always in motion is the future.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brodie View Post
I love that piece. It really sums up what those of us in places like Southeast Michigan, Western New York and Washington State have known forever... Canada and it's people are the best the world has to offer.
The force is strong in this one.

They have the best hockey bloggers in the world too, Tom Benjamin being my personal favorite.

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Old
03-01-2010, 04:12 PM
  #40
NyQuil
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Originally Posted by rye&ginger View Post


Always in motion is the future.
Rest on their laurels, Canada will not.

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Old
03-01-2010, 04:31 PM
  #41
mrzeigler
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Rest on their laurels, Canada will not.
Canada might as well be frozen in carbonite. It doesn't have any nonhockeyplaying population. Practically all of the US is nonhockeyplaying ...

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Old
03-01-2010, 04:34 PM
  #42
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Love Al Michaels.

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Old
03-01-2010, 04:43 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by mrzeigler View Post
Once a nation has become relatively mature in its consumption of/participation in a sport, it's easy to pick the 10 best players from any era and make a case that they're roughly as good as the 10 best from another era.

But when multiple metropolitan areas as has been the case with hockey over the past couple decades add a new sport to the landscape and that sport grabs attention of children there, then as a nation, the quality of those top 10 players inches upward a bit. But more importantly, the quality of the next dozen players (the ones who round out an Olympic roster) increases significantly.

It can take a couple of decades as those metro areas add ice rinks and mature as hockey cities, but it happens. Pittsburgh went from a market that produced no NHL players to producing Ryan Malone and R.J Umberger and a few depth players to a region that produced several players on the World Juniors and U-17 Challenge teams that beat Canada this year.

I'm not claiming Pittsburgh is a powerhouse in terms of producing NHL talent, but I am saying it has developed into a region that will turn out players on a regular basis. The same can be expected in coming years of Dallas, the California markets and perhaps even some of the troubled expansion cities if the NHL sticks it out there (I'm not advocating one way or another on that issue).

This story on the Penguins website expands on what I'm saying: http://penguins.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=518754
All great points, but in response to the poster you were responding to I will spin off the bolded section. Look no further than what the U-17, U-18, and WJC teams have done in the past six or seven years. They are competing on a regular basis more than ever before, let alone taking Golds more often in these events. Add to that the higher number of American-born players being drafted (and in higher rounds) and the number of other geographical areas of the country starting to produce talent and overall you have a much-improved overall national product in the sport of hockey. They are not overtaking anything or any nation by any means, but with regard to this particular conversation USA Hockey is improving and doing so fairly rapidly and are competing and winning on a more regular basis than ever before. The proof is in everyone's aforementioned points.

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Old
03-01-2010, 04:48 PM
  #44
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The problem with this is that this style of Hockey isn't played(or, at least maintained) in the NHL.

Also, it's funny how Hockey can become great without fighting.

However, you need generally all-star teams to accomplish this.

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Old
03-01-2010, 04:49 PM
  #45
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Agreed.

Never caught the first Brokaw piece from the Opening Ceremonies but saw this one. Thought it was wonderful.

Wow, that was really touching.

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Old
03-01-2010, 05:05 PM
  #46
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Originally Posted by Brodie View Post
I disagree. Look at Michigan... one of only 8 states with over 10 million people... once youth hockey took a serious hold here, the number of Michiganders making the CHL and NHL skyrocketed to the point where they're now close to Minnesota in number of players in the NHL and had the most players of any single state on the Olympic team. New York has undergone a similar boom on a smaller scale.

Now imagine something like that happening with states the size of California and Texas
.
You mean, in the desert?

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Old
03-01-2010, 05:18 PM
  #47
mrzeigler
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You mean, in the desert?
There are at least a couple of indoor ski slopes in the Middle East, so perhaps indoor hockey rinks aren't such a far-fetched idea. Perchance someone even could dream up a queer little vehicle that would smooth the ice on a regular basis.

If only Jules Verne were still alive!

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Old
03-01-2010, 05:18 PM
  #48
Brodie
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You mean, in the desert?
Well, sometime after your avatar becomes a reality and Prime Minster Obama orders ice rinks built on every block to catch the rest of the country up.

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Old
03-01-2010, 05:22 PM
  #49
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I doubt they were setting the bar low... knowing the British press, they'll complain about the London games, too. It's how they sell papers.
cynicism is easy

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Old
03-01-2010, 05:30 PM
  #50
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Canada might as well be frozen in carbonite. It doesn't have any nonhockeyplaying population. Practically all of the US is nonhockeyplaying ...
You're dead wrong on this one.
Tons of kids play soccer in Canada. Also, as far as rec games go, Basketball is also quite popular. Kids grow up playing all kinds of sports, it's just we don't have the proper developmental avenues for them to parlay their childhood passion into something fruitful.

A good percentage of my friends don't play pick up hockey on a regular basis(the occasional shinny game not-withstanding). Most can't skate too well either.

I say this living in a metropolitan place like Toronto (and earlier in the 'burbs of Vancouver). People love their hockey but as far as churning out world class players, smaller communities where hockey is everything tend to dominate.

If we had good developmental soccer leagues or basketball leagues or whatever, we should see a steady increase in world class athletes in those categories as well.

Canada has a substantial nonhockey playing community, especially in the bigger cities.
I'd be curious to see some stats on this, actually.

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