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Habs-Plekanec Dialogue today, Deal will Likely be reached after deadline

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03-02-2010, 10:21 AM
  #76
MathMan
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
it is hard when you have limited cap space...
The instances of GMs actually getting screwed completely by the cap are actually vanishingly rare. You'll occasionally see one let a secondary player go that they would rather keep, but that's pretty much it. Star players don't get squeezed out by the cap.

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03-02-2010, 10:26 AM
  #77
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Exactly. They were turned down. AKA management ****ed up by not negotiating a deal before the deadline.

If Plekanec isn't signed before the deadline, the sensible thing to do would be to trade him now and (maybe) try to sign him in the offseason if he's not signed before then. That is good asset management for a team that is nowhere close to a contender. The reason we don't progress at all is precisely because we keep losing good players for nothing and we have no good young guys to replace them (a combination of mediocre drafting and not getting assets in return for the players we lose).
It takes 2 parties to negotiate a deal. A sign now or we'll trade you policy is a very tough stance to take. I'm not opposed to trading Pleks, but there had better be a fool proof plan in place to replace him come next October. Not sure that's even possible.

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03-02-2010, 10:30 AM
  #78
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You're making an exteme example. Usually games in hand are 1 and 2 so it's not out of the realm of possibility that they will lose those...plus our injury ravaged team is getting healthy and had a chance to rest a lot of guys which can only help us.
If a team is averaging over 1 point per game ( ex: Tampa - 61 games, 63 points) than to assume that will not get any points in 2 games is just being overly optimistic.

They "should" get 2 points in their next 2 games in hand, so if we did not play another till they catch-up, they would have 65 and us 64 points.

BUT, they're playing Philly at home, and Washington on the road...that can hurt their average.

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03-02-2010, 10:32 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Koseegin View Post
If Plekanec is not going to be traded, it's pretty clear that Gauthier is confident that he will be signed.
I disagree. I think its pretty clear that Gauthier is only concerned with one thing. Worrying about his short term reputation and trying to make a splash by making the playoffs in his first year.

However this is short sighted thinking. He could have easily blamed it all on Gainey and more importantly all of the injuries we've had this year. But no, instead he decided to empty the cupboard to fill our bottom 6 and he's going to end up letting our top 6 get away.


I honestly don't care if we pay Pleks $5.5m, its a slight overpayment, but come June 25th, his value is going to be in the $6m range whether he is worth it or not. Chris Drury is making $8m next year, he's not worth it but it was what the market was willing to pay.

Besides Marleau, Pleks is the only PPG centre on the market this summer, that = BIG BUCKS.

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03-02-2010, 10:47 AM
  #80
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First I want to say pleks might not get the money that he wants. Cap might go down and most teams are already up to the cap. Some have internal caps which impead them from adding more contracts. So his list of teams to go too is very short.

2nd Last year we could have traded are players for prospects and draft picks. What are the chances that we make the playoffs? They would definitely be lower. How ever we still have a chance and it would be win win. What happens if we don't make the playofffs? We just lost assets for nothing. Gainey treated his players like real people. Gave them what they wanted.

You need to treat your players as assets and do what is best for the future of the team. Sometimes you can think about the present. But the future is the most important part. Teams like the penguins can add players at the deadline becase they have young players as their core. Montreal how ever is old. If gainey tried to get as many picks as possible we might have had a 2nd PK subban? Or a claude Giroux.

I know some of you have the mentality of *win right now* which I agree with. But you have to do so without sacrficing the future. ESPECIALLY when your team is mediocre at best.

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03-02-2010, 10:57 AM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Ubercron9000 View Post
You do know we can get a young prospect for plekanecs right? Or a good deal that will still make us playoff performers. Losing pleks will just make this organization a joke, If we don't resign him. So I HOPE that we do sign him. If we go through the season and lose him for nothing whats the point? We lose, worst what happens if we don't make the playoffs and he goes? Thats worst case scenario... oi vey
Again, the point is to make the playoffs. I still believe this is the administration's goal for the current season, and neither I nor they seemingly see us getting there without Plekanec. Like i said, this is a gamble but one they are willing to take.

It could end up being that we make the playoffs and lose Pleky in the summer. We could end up seeing us miss the playoffs and losing Pleky in the summer for nothing in return. We could also see us making the playoffs and getting Pleky resigned before the end of the season. This is why it's called a gamble.

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Old
03-02-2010, 12:22 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
Nobody in their right mind "restocks their prospect pool" by trading players like that with 6 weeks left in the season when in a playoff spot.

What's the point of dumping every UFA on the roster and adding to the prospect pool if you have no job after the season as GM.

You are not living in the real world...more like the HF world, where you can dump all your brest players, get an early pick and be a contender in 3 years...but not lose your GM job.
So he didn't restock the prospect pool so he could save his own ass and then quits halfway through the following season. Great foresight on his behalf then, wasn't it? The GMs are suppose to look out for the best interest of the team, not themselves.

Gainey could of missed the playoffs and still been safe.

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03-02-2010, 12:31 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
The instances of GMs actually getting screwed completely by the cap are actually vanishingly rare. You'll occasionally see one let a secondary player go that they would rather keep, but that's pretty much it. Star players don't get squeezed out by the cap.
Exactly. That's the whole basis of cap management. Assets get moved for new pieces all the time. Salary dumps are a common occurrence. This whole panic over being up against the cap is quite overblown.

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03-02-2010, 01:32 PM
  #84
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Habs-Plekanec Dialogue today, Deal will Likely be reached after deadline

From Andy Strictland who is not that bad and has gotten some rumors right before, which is something many can't say.

Quote:
Montreal and Tomas Plekanec have good dialogue today on extension. Deal will likely get done after the deadline
http://twitter.com/andystrickland

So for the other thread....shut up

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Old
03-02-2010, 01:32 PM
  #85
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andystrickland Montreal and Tomas Plekanec have good dialogue today on extension. Deal will likely get done after the deadline

Andy strickland via twitter

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03-02-2010, 01:33 PM
  #86
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http://twitter.com/AndyStrickland

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03-02-2010, 01:34 PM
  #87
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Same thing RDS reported yesterday... how is this news

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Old
03-02-2010, 01:37 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by Next Best Thing View Post
Same thing RDS reported yesterday... how is this news
because apparently theyve had a good dialogue today, which by all logic cannot be yesterdays news... unless Dr. Emmit Brown and his Delorean are involved

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03-02-2010, 01:37 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by MathMan View Post
The instances of GMs actually getting screwed completely by the cap are actually vanishingly rare. You'll occasionally see one let a secondary player go that they would rather keep, but that's pretty much it. Star players don't get squeezed out by the cap.
flames screwed themselves by not carefully managing the cap last season...

hurt them badly down the stretch and contributed to their early playoff exit.

I would bet that most teams took that "lesson" to heart, and will be that much more vigilant moving forward.

speaking of the flames, if you don't think that moving Phaneuf had everything to do with his cap hit, then I don't know what to tell you.

not too mention Gomez... Star maybe a huge overstatement, but as so many love to point out, he's a much better player than Higgins/Mcdonnaugh, and yet that's what he was traded for... why? the cap.

Do you really think Komisarek walks if the cap hit wasn't a factor?


Sorry mathman, but ignoring the impact the cap has on how rosters are made up and managed ignores the reality of the current NHL.

and with out current cap situation heading into next season, being able to re-sign Plekanec, along with re-signing all our RFA's, will not be an easy task... let alone trying to actually improve the roster from this season.

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03-02-2010, 01:39 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by Next Best Thing View Post
Same thing RDS reported yesterday... how is this news
Because it goes back to what I said in the first page.

Gauthier knows the amount Plekanec wants and knows he will sign and knows it will fit under the cap.

Like I said, everyone is complaining for no reason.

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03-02-2010, 01:39 PM
  #91
Miller Time
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Originally Posted by m00ks View Post
Exactly. That's the whole basis of cap management. Assets get moved for new pieces all the time. Salary dumps are a common occurrence. This whole panic over being up against the cap is quite overblown.
this is the part we're missing...

moving assets for new pieces as opposed to losing assets and trying to replace them with new pieces.

unfortunately, we seen to be the destination for salary dumps (gomez, moore, schneider) as opposed to the team dumping their bad salaries for young assets/picks from other teams.

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03-02-2010, 01:40 PM
  #92
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because apparently theyve had a good dialogue today, which by all logic cannot be yesterdays news... unless Dr. Emmit Brown and his Delorean are involved
Ha ha....Nice.


This is great news. I have a feeling they will reach a deal.

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Old
03-02-2010, 01:44 PM
  #93
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Ha ha....Nice.


This is great news. I have a feeling they will reach a deal.
Same.
And it would be a good thing for the organisation...

My prediction is 5.25M-5.5M$ for 5 years...

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Old
03-02-2010, 01:44 PM
  #94
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Some people here would like to have their cake and eat it.

But a lot of people here would like to be in an infinite warehouse of cake and never stop eating.

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03-02-2010, 01:48 PM
  #95
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Originally Posted by HabuseMoi View Post
Some people here would like to have their cake and eat it.

But a lot of people here would like to be in an infinite warehouse of cake and never stop eating.
My suggestion to some people would be to join an Economics forum if they want to talk about money, assets and cap hits all day.

I know you have to include it in the discussion somewhat but when you start seriously talking about trading away your #1 centerman away for nothing something is wrong.

Used to be we had folks on here who knew hockey. Now I'm not so sure some posters even know what a good hockey player looks like because they are so concerned about the cap.

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03-02-2010, 01:50 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by Booky View Post
Same.
And it would be a good thing for the organisation...

My prediction is 5.25M-5.5M$ for 5 years...
I think it might be less money, 2-3 years. Just my guess though.

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03-02-2010, 01:50 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by Booky View Post
Same.
And it would be a good thing for the organisation...

My prediction is 5.25M-5.5M$ for 5 years...
Just curious, if they give Pleks that much does that mean we can expect Hamrlik gone at the deadline? Will this kind of salary fit with our current cap issues?

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03-02-2010, 01:53 PM
  #98
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Just curious, if they give Pleks that much does that mean we can expect Hamrlik gone at the deadline? Will this kind of salary fit with our current cap issues?
Not imperatively...
We can round out our roster with cheap UFA signings (500K$-700k$) and qualifiying offers to our RFAs (which means not much of a raise)
Except we'd be pretty tight against the salary cap...
This discussion was pretty much exhausted in the other thread and I dont wanna get into details but its feasible...

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Old
03-02-2010, 01:55 PM
  #99
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Originally Posted by Miller Time View Post
flames screwed themselves by not carefully managing the cap last season...

hurt them badly down the stretch and contributed to their early playoff exit.
Yes maybe if you want to say it was the cap's fault that all the Flames Dmen were injured.

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03-02-2010, 01:56 PM
  #100
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The sooner the better so it doesn't become a distraction for Pleks or the team.

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