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Preds vs. Kings ~~ March 04, 2010 7:00 PM

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Old
03-05-2010, 05:03 PM
  #76
Seth Lake
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Originally Posted by glenngineer View Post
Someone else other than us saving us the very few brain cells we have left?
TPCR will take care of those...


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Old
03-05-2010, 05:21 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
So the accepted standard now is throw a clean, hard hit ... get punched? Got it. Bye-bye Hamhuis hip check unless he's ready for a few more roughing calls. Weber should expect to get in a fight after every check.

Wilson took his hit, got up, looked at Greene, got his butt back in the play. Tootoo skated around for ten - fifteen seconds, then didn't even get in a real fight over it. In the end, the Kings didn't pay for it ... we did ... taking a penalty on the resulting 4 on 4 that led to their goal.
I'm just saying you make guys pay for going after your top talent. Let'em know that it will not go overlooked. When opposing teams get that message, you give your top guys room to skate and create.

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03-05-2010, 05:43 PM
  #78
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from a kings perspective, on the Tootoo-Greene incident, I think it should have been 2 minutes roughing for Tootoo and nothing for Greene. At least Tootoo did us a favour in the 3rd taking our worst player, Randy ***ing Jones, off the ice for a while, shame he didnt beat the holy hell into him to get him off the ice for a major

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03-05-2010, 05:53 PM
  #79
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[QUOTE=101st_fan;24321529]Wilson's three fights as an Admiral demonstrate that he is capable of sticking up for himself if the thinks it was a borderline or dirty hit.



Wilson had 3 fights in the AHL. I had heard about 1, but 3? Not really what I would expect, coming out of college hockey where no one fights! Maybe he has been waiting all these years?
Honestly, I think Tootoo jumping in sends a message. Yes, it looked like a clean hit but Tootoo must have felt differently. Nice to see him stand up for a team mate.

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03-05-2010, 06:01 PM
  #80
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Greene fought back, so to speak, therefore he gets the roughing as well.

I'm not sure why there's a discussion about what Tootoo did. Whether it took him 1 second or 1 hour he did exactly the right thing. The game was getting chippy, there were a couple of shots taken and it was time to make a statement about the situation. It's part of the game and something that this team has been accused of not doing near enough. He stood up for a team mate, took the guy to the penalty box with him and let the Kings know that things weren't going to go unanswered.

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03-05-2010, 08:42 PM
  #81
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Funny how nobody here is claiming Bouillon should have gotten a little encounter for standing up Franson just now. Oh, wait, I forgot it's saintly if we do it and the embodiment of evil if it happens to us (no matter how clean the play really was).

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03-05-2010, 09:19 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Funny how nobody here is claiming Bouillon should have gotten a little encounter for standing up Franson just now. Oh, wait, I forgot it's saintly if we do it and the embodiment of evil if it happens to us (no matter how clean the play really was).
Nobody's saying remotely that.

It was just a hockey fight. Tootoo decided to throw down. We don't know why. All we know is he used Wilson getting rocked as the reason. Players did say afterward it was rugged out there. I didn't know if the hit was dirty but I was nearly certain Tootoo was going to go there. And he did.

Since when is one fight a big deal? Toots felt it was time to show we weren't going to get pushed around. Some here are acting as if every hockey fight has some high and mighty reason behind it. Sometimes someone decides to see if someone else will go. Tootoo found a taker. Big whoops. I happen to be glad he did it when Wilson went down to show teams he's a guy we won't let be lined up. I've seen dozens of fights when the reason to go was a clean hit.


Last edited by OpenWheel: 03-05-2010 at 09:26 PM.
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03-05-2010, 09:48 PM
  #83
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Nobody's saying remotely that.

It was just a hockey fight. Tootoo decided to throw down. We don't know why. All we know is he used Wilson getting rocked as the reason. Players did say afterward it was rugged out there. I didn't know if the hit was dirty but I was nearly certain Tootoo was going to go there. And he did.

Since when is one fight a big deal? Toots felt it was time to show we weren't going to get pushed around. Some here are acting as if every hockey fight has some high and mighty reason behind it. Sometimes someone decides to see if someone else will go. Tootoo found a taker. Big whoops. I happen to be glad he did it when Wilson went down to show teams he's a guy we won't let be lined up. I've seen dozens of fights when the reason to go was a clean hit.
For me one fight isn't a big deal but claiming a clean hit is a reason to fight is. That hit was clean. If Toots wants to justify his contract using the things that don't necessarily show on a scoresheet because he can't net as many goals as the recently waived Jones .. then let's not try to pretend it was because of the hit on Wilson.

Clean hits are not reasons for fights ... unless you're a wimp like #99 who needed thugs on his wings to survive.

If we're going to skate Wilson on the 4th line, we need to expect for him to get treated like a fourth liner.

Funny how we support our guys for dropping the gloves after a clean hit or facewashing a guy for poking at our goalie after the whistle, but we whine like hell when it happens to our guys in identical situations. A tad hypocritical.

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03-05-2010, 09:50 PM
  #84
Seth Lake
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Funny how nobody here is claiming Bouillon should have gotten a little encounter for standing up Franson just now. Oh, wait, I forgot it's saintly if we do it and the embodiment of evil if it happens to us (no matter how clean the play really was).
If the circumstances were different and the game was actually out of reach at the time...I had an issue with Kronwall taking a 15' run at Hornqvist around the blueline trying to kill him from the blindside. That is a lack of respect in the game today and I'd have had no problem with someone dropping the gloves right then...

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03-05-2010, 09:53 PM
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Funny how nobody here is claiming Bouillon should have gotten a little encounter for standing up Franson just now. Oh, wait, I forgot it's saintly if we do it and the embodiment of evil if it happens to us (no matter how clean the play really was).
Bouillon also didn't take a run at Franzen though. He caught him with the puck in his feet and stood him up. Bouillon didn't do anything wrong there.

Greene took a run at Wilson coming in from the point and skated through his hit. There is a major difference between the two...

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03-05-2010, 10:03 PM
  #86
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The puck was at Wilsons feet .. just as with Franson.

Thanks for illustrating my point that if our guy gets hit cleanly we find reasons to justify a fight, but if it's our guy delivering the hit we excuse it.

The hit on Hornqvist was a lot closer to a reason to drop the gloves than the hit on Wilson. Late in a game ... no real chance to come back .... big run ... much more of a blindside hit. Notice no outcry for him getting pummeled.

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03-05-2010, 10:27 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
The puck was at Wilsons feet .. just as with Franson.

Thanks for illustrating my point that if our guy gets hit cleanly we find reasons to justify a fight, but if it's our guy delivering the hit we excuse it.

The hit on Hornqvist was a lot closer to a reason to drop the gloves than the hit on Wilson. Late in a game ... no real chance to come back .... big run ... much more of a blindside hit. Notice no outcry for him getting pummeled.
Couple things, first...this is carrying this thread way off-topic and extending the life of a GDT unnecessarily...

Second, I never excused Bouillon's hit, nor do I feel I vilified Greene's. Regardless, it doesn't matter what we think because it was Tootoo that decided to take offense and ultimately Trotz who will judge whether or not he had a problem with Tootoo's decision.

I said it earlier, you're damned if you do and damned if you don't. If Tootoo doesn't stand up for Wilson, you have people griping about a lack of team toughness and when he does you have people questioning the entire league.

Honestly, I didn't have an immediate reaction to Greene's hit except to cringe a little and hope Wilson got up. It didn't immediately have me calling for his head and my first thought when I heard Tootoo went after Greene was about how stupid this will be if Toots was giving the Kings a PP and a big momentum swing here. In the end, I appreciated that Tootoo stood up for his teammate, but that was totally after the fact and didn't really cross my mind till we had secured a victory.

As I said, Tootoo was the one with a gripe about Greene's hit, not anyone else. Maybe the bench was up in arms yelling about it and that lead to Tootoo taking offense or maybe he just saw a teammate get laid out and wanted to stop it right there. I don't know, but judging by the fact that Trotz was prepared to scratch Tootoo tonight for Boyd, I don't think that this "team toughness" moment was enough in his eyes to keep Tootoo in the lineup...

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03-05-2010, 10:42 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
For me one fight isn't a big deal but claiming a clean hit is a reason to fight is. That hit was clean. If Toots wants to justify his contract using the things that don't necessarily show on a scoresheet because he can't net as many goals as the recently waived Jones .. then let's not try to pretend it was because of the hit on Wilson.

Clean hits are not reasons for fights ... unless you're a wimp like #99 who needed thugs on his wings to survive.
I'm not sure what to answer, as you're all over the map. Still trying to get over Jones getting fired and for some reason blaming Tootoo?. It's not Tootoo's fault.

Of course "clean" hits can be reason to go. We just saw an example. There's different levels of "clean" as SLake alluded to. And many times the players police these things themselves. They don't need an official to tell them when things are getting too rough. It doesn't even matter if this hit deserved it or not. Some of us were glad to see Tootoo let people know he wasn't going to let it go too far. He prevented a next time. If it's hypocritical to root for our guys to protect our guys even when a hit is technically ok, so be it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post

If we're going to skate Wilson on the 4th line, we need to expect for him to get treated like a fourth liner.
Or, we can have someone out there on the ice to kick some rear if he gets rocked too hard. Like Tootoo did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
Funny how we support our guys for dropping the gloves after a clean hit or facewashing a guy for poking at our goalie after the whistle, but we whine like hell when it happens to our guys in identical situations. A tad hypocritical.
Funny how "we" do what? I haven't noticed this board whine any more than any other. Maybe you can show some examples? I don't even see anybody making that big a deal of Tootoo dropping the gloves. A few have said it would not have been smart if he got a penalty. So I don't know where this vast support you see is. I only said I knew Tootoo was going to go. I doubt he even was sure if it was clean, or a charge, or what. Maybe he went "just in case" and maybe as payback for some elbows or something. And, in hindsight, that's cool with me. We don't want Wilson being treated like a fourth liner do we? But I guess some people get bent when players fight for their own reasons and others don't. I don't.

If kings fans want to come here and demand an apology, or the player who fought Tootoo wants to demand all of us hypocrites apologize, than we can bring it up again. So far I don't see a whole lot of angst over a short hockey fight.


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Old
03-05-2010, 11:03 PM
  #89
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Gordie Howe, Bobby Hull, Mark Messier .... none of them would fit in today's NHL. Oh no, a clean hit, we must have somebody else fight over it .... bovine excrement. Either stand up for yourself or realize that a clean hit shouldn't result in somebody else fighting for you.

The simple fact that when our guy laid a hit and nobody said he should have been confronted about it shows the hypocrisy here. Clean hits are part of the game ... always have been ... always should be. This isn't the IIHF women's game where checking is illegal. Keep your head up ... remain situationally aware ... be prepared for clean hits and realize they are part of the game that shouldn't result in a pathetic excuse of a fight.

If you can't score but get a 1.25mil per year contract, resort to the only thing you contribute to the team and use a clean hit as an excuse. The fan base will make all excuses to justify it. See Tootoo, Jordin.

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03-05-2010, 11:31 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by 101st_fan View Post
The simple fact that when our guy laid a hit and nobody said he should have been confronted about it shows the hypocrisy here.
Sure, we're supposed to keep tabs of which hits and which players another team feels they should defend with a fight.

Maybe next time Tootoo will rewind the DVD player and take a closer look at the hit a few times before he decides to throw down. His video replay of what happened must not have been as up to it as yours.

OK, so you think Tootoo is an overpaid hack and Jones hung the moon. That's your right. Out...

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03-06-2010, 08:50 AM
  #91
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Tootoo 13 points
Jones 11 points

just saying...

Should a Detroit player stood up for Cube, maybe. Different hit and situation. At the time the game was all but over and Detroit isn't known for being a physical team with the exception of Kronwall. Different set of circumstances but I'm sure you'll find a similiar one somewhere that proves your point.
As with openwheel. Out

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03-06-2010, 10:24 AM
  #92
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Tootoo 13 points
Jones 11 points

just saying...

Should a Detroit player stood up for Cube, maybe. Different hit and situation. At the time the game was all but over and Detroit isn't known for being a physical team with the exception of Kronwall. Different set of circumstances but I'm sure you'll find a similiar one somewhere that proves your point.
As with openwheel. Out
Jones 14 goals in 87 games as a Pred
Tootoo 9 goals in 106 games over the past two seasons ... 7 goals or more just once in his career.... turns the puck over .... misses assignments ..... doesn't kill penalties ..... niche player .... just saying.



Openwheel... even live I thought it was an overreaction by Toots. The replay simply confirmed it and led to more questioning after watching exactly what Tootoo did following the hit.

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03-06-2010, 01:56 PM
  #93
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"The most important play you can make on the ice is not scoring a goal, it's making the pass to the guy that scores the goal."

I've been told that by just about every coach I ever played for and I say that to every team I coach. Focus too much on goals and only goals and you lose sight of the rest of the game.

Quote:
turns the puck over .... misses assignments ..... doesn't kill penalties ..... niche player
You just described Jones.

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