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Old
03-11-2010, 06:08 AM
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Coach's methods fall flat

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For his next trick, Rangers' head coach and travel director John Tortorella will have his players take rickshaws to Atlanta for tomorrow night's match with the Thrashers.

It's always about something else with Tortorella, always about establishing turf and about those meaningless catch phrases the coach likes to toss out there to distract attention from the issue at large, which happens to be that his team is largely unresponsive to him and his methods.

The particular catch phrase for yesterday was, "Limos flying in all over the place," because Tortorella had taken it upon himself to become offended that prior regimes had permitted Rangers players to travel by car service to games in New Jersey.


http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...avxToMvldC9O5H

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Olli Jokinen opened last night between Gaborik and Vinny Prospal marking the first time that line had been intact since Jokinen's first game with the Rangers, Feb. 2, in Los Angeles. By the time the game had concluded, Jokinen, who was not especially engaged in his own end, had moved all over, as had essentially every forward. Combinations changed by the shift.

Yet coach John Tortorella talked as if mystified that the team had lost its, "structure."
Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/range...#ixzz0hrvMTu2P



See ya John

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03-11-2010, 06:11 AM
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yeah...because Larry Brooks of all people...has written this. Shocking...just SHOCKING.

oh please.

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03-11-2010, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
yeah...because Larry Brooks of all people...has written this. Shocking...just SHOCKING.

oh please.
You think John has done a good job coaching this team?

The players are playing like they want to get the coach fired.

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03-11-2010, 06:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
yeah...because Larry Brooks of all people...has written this. Shocking...just SHOCKING.

oh please.
Who cares WHO wrote it, isn't it true?

Don't you regret all the posts you made about Torts last year? You do agree the guy has bombed here right?

Torts tactics have no logic behind them.
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03-11-2010, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
Who cares WHO wrote it, isn't it true?

Don't you regret all the posts you made about Torts last year? You do agree the guy has bombed here right?

Torts tactics have no logic behind them.
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I have to admit that I am starting to come around to this line of thinking but isn't anyone else disturbed by this group of players quitting on their second coach in a year?

More than anything, I am bothered by the lack of 'team' for this group of individuals. That are all employees, not friends, not teammates and certainly not NHL hockey players on the Rangers. I think any other team besides the Bruins, from first to last, would stick up for each other and fight if their Captain was elbowed and concussed by a dirty elbow, if their goalie was run night in and night out, if their marquee forward was challenged to fight by a sideshow goon. That is not Tortorella's fault. It's a symptom of a larger issue. If they can't get passionate about those things they won't get passionate for anything. They are disengaged, be it games, practice, or anything hockey related.

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03-11-2010, 06:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Son of Steinbrenner View Post
Who cares WHO wrote it, isn't it true?

Don't you regret all the posts you made about Torts last year? You do agree the guy has bombed here right?

Torts tactics have no logic behind them.
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He changes the system every game and the lines every shift...

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Old
03-11-2010, 06:45 AM
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look at our roster. I'd LOVE to find out the coach evrybody has in mind to lead this bunch to greatness.

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03-11-2010, 07:06 AM
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Originally Posted by allstar3970 View Post
look at our roster. I'd LOVE to find out the coach evrybody has in mind to lead this bunch to greatness.
Yeah, while I do have some issues with Torts...namely his line changing, I have yet to hear any alternatives that dont make my stomach turn.

Torts has won a Silver medal as a coach, a stanley cup, and I believe a memorial cup if im not mistaken (its 8am, and ive been cleaning a virus off my website for the past 6 hours now, im too tired to freaking look)...is he perfect? no. could he do better? probably.

but the team he has leaves a lot to be desired. When Christensen is your best center, youve got some problems.

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Old
03-11-2010, 07:19 AM
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Lost with Wade Redden,wilderness of pain...

And all the coaches are insane...

Sather? Yes Torts? I want to **** you.

Come on baby take a chance with us...

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03-11-2010, 07:25 AM
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Still with the Limo ridin, Jet Flyin, Wheelin Dealin, Kiss stealin, Whooooooo

Ooops, that's someone else.

sad.

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Old
03-11-2010, 07:27 AM
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It starts with the defense and then moves outwards to the forwards.

On the backend you have:
  • Henrik Lundqvist- an elite goalie who has the potential to take the next step into becoming THE best goalie in the league. It seems that playing in New York is taking a toll on him. Needs to develop better consistency, but probably struggling due to workload (quality of shots faced nightly, not games played). It seems he stands on his head every night and gets no offense, and then finally the games he gets offense, he seems to let in soft goals. I think he'll come back refreshed next season but needs much better defense in front of him to give support. If he was on Chicago or Washington, oh boy.....
  • Wade Redden aka The Black Hole- taking up a huge chunk of money and not doing anything
  • Michal Rozsival has actually been playing great defense, but again, getting payed as an offensive defenseman and he's not providing any
  • Marc Staal- seemed to have taken a slight step back defensively this season, doesnt seem as engaged or physical
  • Dan Girardi- while technically our #2 shutdown defender, he has made more brutal turnovers leading to goals than I can remember
  • Michael Del Zotto- one of the few bright spots this season was the emergence of our future powerplay ace quarterback, however at a -21 its obvious he has developing to do in his own end
  • Gilroy- hasn't been the offensive presence we hoped he would be signed him, but has been a sready defensemen, although prone to rookie mistakes along the way

And for the ragtag group of forwards:
  • Gaborik-the lone offensive threat, has been dynamite all year except for a stretch of 10 games where he was kept largely off the scoresheet. A freak injury in practice has caused him to miss key games down the stretch, and be somewhat ineffective as of late. That being said, still the only threat this team has, and next season should be a man on a mission.
  • Prospal- the bargain of the league, showed instant chemistry with Gaborik and will surely deserve a raise
  • Christensen- waiver wire pickup has been excellent, but its a telling sign when you have a first liner who was picked up on waivers
  • Callahan- future captain, all around solid game, one of the few untouchables on this team in my opinion. Would be great if he developed some better offensive touch, because he generates a lot of scoring chances for himself. I see him as a Zach Parise minus the scoring touch. But you cant fault him if he never becomes a 30 goal scorer because he does everything else.
  • Dubinsky- shows flashes of potential first line ability, but pretty inconsistent. As of now, he is definitely a solid 2nd line player, but you can't help but hope he develops consistency and becomes a first liner because he has the tools. Maybe a better supporting cast will do him wonders.
  • Jokinen- has provided a boost to an anemic offense, however takes a lot of penalties and hasnt been too good in his own zone. However he provides an element this team is missing, and at the right price deserves to be a Ranger next season.
  • Anisimov- another bright spot on this team, will only get better as he notches more seasons under his belt.
  • Avery- a sparkplug who seems to have been 'tamed' a bit under Torts. Needs to provide a bit more offense because he has the skill, and needs to bring it night in and night out. When on his game, this team wins, plain and simple.
  • Drury- while he takes a lot of heat for his contract, he has actually according to my statistics been our best defensive player, even moreso than all our defenseman. He is absolutely necessary to this team, but his contract is awful. His offense seems to have dried up, but I am not convinced in the slightest that his ability has deteriorated. Watching him in the Olympics has confirmed to me that given the right system and supporting cast, he can still be a major presence. Problem is New York is not that team.
  • Boyle- a waste of a huge frame. At 6-7 he doesnt through the body which is a huge disappointment, but if your not gonna be physical than your only option is to be finesse. Problem is, his whopping 6 points indicate he isnt that either.


While Torts hasn't done a heckuva job, his roster is a far cry from an actual team. That being said, there have been coaches who have turned crap into playoff teams, so the hype he had coming into New York has been a letdown. I say he deserves another shot, and with a better team that gives a consistent effort before we can right him off. If next season goes the same way, both Torts and Sather must go.

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03-11-2010, 08:30 AM
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This is what 'Brooksy' took out of last night's game? A story about how the players arrived to Newark?

His bias against Tortorella makes his writing complete drivel. It's obvious that he just sits on these kind of stories months in advance and waits for an opportunity to put them out there. There's no analysis or original points made whatsoever...just a sad excuse for journalism.

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03-11-2010, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
yeah...because Larry Brooks of all people...has written this. Shocking...just SHOCKING.

oh please.
Who cares who wrote it? The article is pretty much spot on.

Tortorella has done a terrible, terrible job this season.

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03-11-2010, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Yeah, while I do have some issues with Torts...namely his line changing, I have yet to hear any alternatives that dont make my stomach turn.
You know, people always say this, but almost every fan base with a team like ours (I.E. a bad one) has this exact same complaint. Methinks it's just something most coaches do when dealing with a lousy lineup. Throw a bunch of **** at the wall and see what sticks.

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03-11-2010, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by CaptainCallahan View Post
It starts with the defense and then moves outwards to the forwards. ...If next season goes the same way, both Torts and Sather must go.
Excellent analysis of what has transpired during the season - but figuring a way out is going to be tough.

Basically it comes down to: the kids have to step it up. Callahan, Dubinsky, et al have to show that they really belong where they are playing or it will be another long season, irrespective of the other vet contracts malingering.

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03-11-2010, 08:45 AM
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It's time for Torts to start making some hard choices and the time is now. Del Zotto was terrible last night and I mean terrible. His long homerun passes are not working at a hi percentage and is out of position A LOT. The kid looks lost out there at times. Scratch him, send him to HDF for conditioning or something. I think Potter can bring more at this point. Not bashing MDZ, he's 19 for gods sake and being asked to be the premier offensive defenseman, a role he isn't ready for obviously. I don't wanna see his development get retarded for a whole year because of this experience.

Wade Redden should not dress another game as a Ranger. I don't care if he sits and cries, to me that puts more pressure on Sather for having a total of 10 mil in the pressbox and in the minors. He needs to put the best players on a line and keep them there for the whole run. Prospal, Joker, Gabby should not be split up unless a major rash of injury happens.

61GP 11G 12A 23TPS -13

And the press wants to know why the team can't score. That right there are the stats of our highest paid foward Chris Drury who makes almost as much as Sidney Crosby. Yeah Jokinen and Prospal why aren't you scoring for the captain? Why is this guy not expected to lead by example? Drury is getting a free pass here for what reason?


Last edited by Radek27: 03-11-2010 at 08:51 AM.
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Old
03-11-2010, 08:45 AM
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It's a wonder that Torts managed to win a Stanley Cup...

The same people who blamed Renney and were proven wrong have now moved towards blaming Torts.

There just isn't enough talent on this freaking team... Drop your favorites for a moment and look at the team with the most critical eye.

- Del Zotto shows a ton of promise but right now he is a huge liability position wise. I'm willing to live with it, but it's going to hurt the team right now. He shows number 1 defenseman upside between his strength and his offensive abilities.

- Anisimov is doing very little... Brings nothing physically and isn't exactly creating goals either. His few goals have come on plays where he's been given room and he can get off that good wrist shot. He doesn't create the room himself.

- Staal... As good as he is defensively, and I think he's nearly great, he has hands of stone with the puck. Occasionally (very seldom) he can put together a good rush where he looks competent with the puck but he's just not.

- Dubinsky - Although he's scored a couple lately, he just hasn't been good in the other areas. He has decided that he doesn't want to play physical and has passed up on more chances to really hit someone than I can remember. He's been very bad with the puck at times and has either made a very good play, or just flat out turned it over

- Callahan - as good as the guy is with effort and off the rush, he's horrible on the boards, has NO ability to make a tape to tape pass. If he's not doing something off the rush, he's very rarely doing something offensively.


These are just a few guys, and that are all guys I am fans of. But the team doesn't have serious talent outside of Henrik and Gabby. When each of these young guys improve over the next couple years, the team will start winning more games. It won't be because Torts is becoming a better coach, he's already a good coach.

The only thing thing that truly bugs me right now is the lack of physicality... Fights I don't care about, give me some consistent physical play though. Teams must love playing against us because there is zero threat of injury.

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03-11-2010, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
And the press wants to know why the team can't score. That right there are the stats of our highest paid foward Chris Drury who makes more than Sidney Crosby. Yeah Jokinen and Prospal why aren't you scoring for the captain? Why is this guy not expected to lead by example? Drury is getting a free pass here for what reason?
Just a point of clarification: Crosby makes 9 million this year, with an 8.7 cap hit on the contract as a whole.

9 million > 8 million

8.7 million > 7.05 million

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03-11-2010, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Yeah, while I do have some issues with Torts...namely his line changing, I have yet to hear any alternatives that dont make my stomach turn.

Torts has won a Silver medal as a coach, a stanley cup, and I believe a memorial cup if im not mistaken (its 8am, and ive been cleaning a virus off my website for the past 6 hours now, im too tired to freaking look)...is he perfect? no. could he do better? probably.

but the team he has leaves a lot to be desired. When Christensen is your best center, youve got some problems.
We should have hired Lavs when we had the chance. or better yet Renney should have been fired before the start of last year after the Pitt debacle and Quennville should have been hired then. I wanted both of those to happen but, unfortunately they didn't.

but yeah, I don't really see much out there... but maybe we need to get a complete unknown, a young coach or one on his first gig. Sort of like Sacco is doing out there in Colorado. But I don't really think that its the coach as much as it is a bunch of the players' doing. Redden, Drury, Girardi, Rosy all just look completely indifferent out there. This "core" is killing the team more than just capwise. These are players the coach plays alot and counts on and they have ALWAYS just looked indifferent from when they played w/ Renney to Torts.

Drury while he does try hard he has the same emotionless expression win, lose, succeed or fail. It just looks like he has lost his passion out there. He isn't the same Person let alone player that he was in past years. I really think the pressure of NY and his contract has broken him. he was even a completely different player and person in the Olympics.

Redden can't play decent anymore, and always has the indifferent smug on his face.

Girardi is always chewing on that grimy mouthpiece while coffing up the puck, and then doesn't seem to care much. again an emotionless and turning into a pretty useless player.

Rosy competes and plays, but he seems to be listless as well. But at least his play is improving.

How many different players and coaches do we have to go through before our GM realizes that these are the constants and causes for the indifference on the team.

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03-11-2010, 08:50 AM
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We should have hired Lavs when we had the chance. or better yet Renney should have been fired before the start of last year after the Pitt debacle and Quennville should have been hired then. I wanted both of those to happen but, unfortunately they didn't.
Yeah, I was dying to see Laviolette coach this team. I loved what he did in Carolina.

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03-11-2010, 08:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vito Andolini View Post
This is what 'Brooksy' took out of last night's game? A story about how the players arrived to Newark?

His bias against Tortorella makes his writing complete drivel. It's obvious that he just sits on these kind of stories months in advance and waits for an opportunity to put them out there. There's no analysis or original points made whatsoever...just a sad excuse for journalism.
His story is about how the coach found that to complain about during this stretch and for the 2nd time this season. There are many more problems than how they get to the game, Larry hates Torts BS answers and so do I. He might still need to watch the tape though to figure out what happened lastnight. He just won't give an honest answer to the media which makes his PC's really pointless except for the soap opera drama that happens every week or so. When I tune into a Torts post game interview i'm not tuning in to listen to hockey analysis of my team, i'm tuning in to see some drama. Most here would admit the same. What has anyone learned about this team this season from watching 60+ of these so far? NOTHING.

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03-11-2010, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by we want cup View Post
Just a point of clarification: Crosby makes 9 million this year, with an 8.7 cap hit on the contract as a whole.

9 million > 8 million

8.7 million > 7.05 million
Thank you

I have edited it. Still sad though.

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Old
03-11-2010, 08:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Radek27 View Post
His story is about how the coach found that to complain about during this stretch and for the 2nd time this season. There are many more problems than how they get to the game, Larry hates Torts BS answers and so do I. He might still need to watch the tape though to figure out what happened lastnight. He just won't give an honest answer to the media which makes his PC's really pointless except for the soap opera drama that happens every week or so. When I tune into a Torts post game interview i'm not tuning in to listen to hockey analysis of my team, i'm tuning in to see some drama. Most here would admit the same. What has anyone learned about this team this season from watching 60+ of these so far? NOTHING.
Spot on and, sadly, I think this is what a lot of fans wanted to see when they spouted off crap about "being more exciting" and "playing not to lose."

It was nearsighted and ignorant. Those fans that were so excited to see Tortorella come aboard are just as inept and trigger happy as our General Manager.

But hey, at least they realized we have a real personnel problem around here. 18 months too late, but better late than never, I suppose.

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03-11-2010, 08:59 AM
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Torts makes me long for the days of Ted Sator. He is the worst coach this team has had in a LONG time, Ron Low included. I think the team needed to see Renney go (he had run his course), but I think we'd be better off today if he was still behind our bench and not the Oilers bench.

Torts seems clueless. He reminds me of Tom Coughlin before Coughlin was reborn as a players coach (the rebirth before the G-Men won the SB).

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03-11-2010, 09:01 AM
  #25
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Originally Posted by rangerfan2 View Post
Torts makes me long for the days of Ted Sator. He is the worst coach this team has had in a LONG time, Ron Low included. I think the team needed to see Renney go (he had run his course), but I think we'd be better off today if he was still behind our bench and not the Oilers bench.

Torts seems clueless. He reminds me of Tom Coughlin before Coughlin was reborn as a players coach (the rebirth before the G-Men won the SB).
Agreed.

I think Renney would have guided this team into the playoffs, and I dont even really think its up for debate.

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