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Confirmed w/ link: Ehrhoff/Lukowich to VAN for P. White/D. Rahimi

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Old
03-16-2010, 12:36 PM
  #601
Canucks5551
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
It's a loss regardless of the results. The Sharks got what will amount to be a late 2nd round pick for what was a top four d-man. We've seen guys who are worse than what you deem Ehrhoff as then go for better selections.

Besides that, he's actually not at all any better than he was in San Jose. He's just been given more time at even strength with the offensively talented players so his production has gone up there. Don't understand what you dislike about him last year. He was a very solid player for most of the regular season and the 2nd best d-man at the very least in the playoffs.

It probably doesn't help that Remenda tended to single out Ehrhoff on the blue line all the time when everyone else was just as prone to the same errors that Christian did. That bias is not a surprise though. He's been doing it for years against the Euros.
I watched a reasonable amount of Ehrhoff last season and his game has definitely improved in the defensive end. Last year whenever I watched the Sharks he was good for a blatant screwup or two a game, but that's changed big time in Vancouver. I was still happy about the trade in the summer because we gave up next to nothing to get him, but I was still nervous about his defensive game. He's been as solid as can be on the back end for the Canucks though, and his smooth skating and offensive game is very valuable.

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Old
03-16-2010, 12:57 PM
  #602
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Originally Posted by hockeyball View Post

The Ehrhoff trade is the biggest mistake DW has made as GM. I'm sure he realizes it now, he's not a fool. He gambled on Blake having one year left in him, and he was so, so wrong.

If I had the off-season to do over again:
- Make the Heatley deal
- Don't re-sign Blake
- Keep Ehrhoff
- Try and move Luko, or keep him as a #7
- Give Boyle the captaincy
- Let Huskins go

Also, if possible I would also rather have moved Clowe+Mitchell instead of Michalek, but that may not have been an option. I think a line up of:
totally agree. and I'm sure DW would too. But putting the off season agenda in that order distorts the facts...of course if we could have made the heatley deal first we can then decide how to handle everything else. But unfortunately we signed husksins and blake in July, and made the trade in September.

everyone seems to pretend you get to sit down and make every single trade all at once and make sure every other GM is cool with it. Of course DW would have liked to do things differently in hindsight. But he had the balls to make the moves he thought would help the team at the time. Sure we can second guess him, but don't act as if he'd rather have huskins than error or clowe was a better keep than milan.

Hell, when he signed huskins and blake of course he thought they would perform better, he likely anticipated that erhoff or another one of your young Dmen was our best trade bait, or maybe not. Instead the heatley deal falls in his lap and he decides he has to go for it. Now nobody wants huskins or blake and he needs to lose salary.

It's not like he sat around in the off season and was like, "Ok! I am going to dump erhoff for nothing and then overpay huskins!". (well, apparently he did like the overpaying husksins part).

If he had not signed blake or huskins and kept luko and error and the heatley trade doesn't come along, then he has done nothing and we complain about that. We say, "look the oilers got heatley for x, y, and z and we could have taken him and traded erhoff (who we still hate because he is shooting wide on the PP constantly). Oh and we also end up keeping cheech and complaining about that wasted salary. If we could have traded for heatley July 9th and then sorted out our D situation of course that would have been the best of both worlds, and DW would agree...

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Old
03-16-2010, 02:01 PM
  #603
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Hindsight is very powerful. Last time I checked, nobody is clairvoyant...

Besides, lots of posters on here were lambasting Ehrhoff last season. It seems that with some people, Wilson is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't...

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Old
03-16-2010, 02:26 PM
  #604
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Originally Posted by SharkyMcWoo View Post
Hindsight is very powerful. Last time I checked, nobody is clairvoyant...

Besides, lots of posters on here were lambasting Ehrhoff last season. It seems that with some people, Wilson is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't...
Ya of course, I'm just saying, if I had it to do over again. I'm not specifically saying I expect DW to have done that, but it gives a good contrast to how the off-season could have gone in a perfect situation.

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Old
03-16-2010, 02:39 PM
  #605
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Originally Posted by SharkyMcWoo View Post
Hindsight is very powerful. Last time I checked, nobody is clairvoyant...

Besides, lots of posters on here were lambasting Ehrhoff last season. It seems that with some people, Wilson is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't...
lambasting error doesnt mean he wasnt a solid dman. It just means he went brain dead about once or twice a game.

It also doesnt mean that his value was zero, which is what DW traded him for.

None of this is hindsight, hes playing the same game in Vancouver as he played here, his talent level just wasnt replaced on the Sharks roster. He was better than Blake last year and is better than Blake this year.

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Old
03-16-2010, 03:25 PM
  #606
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SharkyMcWoo View Post
Hindsight is very powerful. Last time I checked, nobody is clairvoyant...

Besides, lots of posters on here were lambasting Ehrhoff last season. It seems that with some people, Wilson is damned if he does and damned if he doesn't...
No one needed hindsight to know that Ehrhoff lead the team in ice time in the playoffs and Blake (and Vlasic for that matter) was terrible in them, or that Ehrhoff had been trending up for his whole career and showed noticeable improvements from year to year. There was a decent number of folks here who thought this was a terrible idea in the offseason. The hindsight just makes us angrier and proved us right.

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Old
03-16-2010, 04:07 PM
  #607
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Originally Posted by WineShark View Post

Like you - if you could foresee Blake's drop in mobility and offense and Ehrhoff's rise, sure --- you keep Ehrhoff. But during the summer, there were plenty of people wanting Blake's leadership over Marleau, JT, etc. But bottom line - I didn't like the trade then and nothing has changed.

Blake hasn't been mobile for about 5 years now!!!!!

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Old
03-16-2010, 06:30 PM
  #608
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Is...
Boyle - Murray
Blake - Vlasic
Wallin - Huskins
Demers = $19.027

Could have been...
Boyle - Vlasic
Rivet - Ehrhoff
Demers - Murray
Leach = $19.252

More mobility, more offense, same price.

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Old
03-16-2010, 06:45 PM
  #609
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Brody View Post
Is...
Boyle - Murray
Blake - Vlasic
Wallin - Huskins
Demers = $19.027

Could have been...
Boyle - Vlasic
Rivet - Ehrhoff
Demers - Murray
Leach = $19.252

More mobility, more offense, same price.
That hurts to read. Hurts.

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Old
03-16-2010, 07:01 PM
  #610
Led Zappa
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Brody View Post
Is...
Boyle - Murray
Blake - Vlasic
Wallin - Huskins
Demers = $19.027

Could have been...
Boyle - Vlasic
Rivet - Ehrhoff
Demers - Murray
Leach = $19.252

More mobility, more offense, same price.
Wasn't Rivet a casualty of Boyle? And Demers was not replacing Huskins this year. Not gonna happen. Hell, he hasn't lasted a whole season and looks worse as the year goes on. Huskins on the other hand looks better.

Would I rather have Ehrhoff over Blake. From the outside looking in, of course. Did we get as much as we could have. Doesn't look like it, but as we saw at the deadline, mgrs were not throwing around draft picks like in the past and we needed to dump salary. Ehrhoff was the man for whatever reason. Reasons we'll probably never know.

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Old
03-16-2010, 07:15 PM
  #611
one2gamble
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chief Brody View Post
Is...
Boyle - Murray
Blake - Vlasic
Wallin - Huskins
Demers = $19.027
Could have been...
Boyle - Vlasic
Huskins - Ehrhoff
Joslin(.5) or Moore(1) - Murray
Leach

More mobility, more offense, cheaper price.

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Old
03-16-2010, 07:31 PM
  #612
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If the Sharks did it right it could of been:

Pronger - Niedermayer
Boyle - Vlasic
Murray - Ehrhoff

/sarcasm

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Old
03-16-2010, 07:44 PM
  #613
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Originally Posted by Canucks5551 View Post
I watched a reasonable amount of Ehrhoff last season and his game has definitely improved in the defensive end. Last year whenever I watched the Sharks he was good for a blatant screwup or two a game, but that's changed big time in Vancouver. I was still happy about the trade in the summer because we gave up next to nothing to get him, but I was still nervous about his defensive game. He's been as solid as can be on the back end for the Canucks though, and his smooth skating and offensive game is very valuable.
He's also playing with much better teammates in Vancouver than he was in San Jose. He wasn't nearly as bad as people claim he was and he's not nearly as good as people think he is since he's been to Vancouver. He's improved certain things but he hasn't taken off and made improvements in leaps and bounds. He's just been given an opportunity and ran with it that he would've done if given the opportunities they hand-feed Vlasic.

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Old
03-16-2010, 10:22 PM
  #614
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ender View Post
If the Sharks did it right it could of been:

Pronger - Niedermayer
Boyle - Vlasic
Murray - Ehrhoff

/sarcasm
Boyle - Murray
Rivet - Ehrhoff
Vlasic - Semenov

Much better.

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Old
03-16-2010, 10:23 PM
  #615
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Originally Posted by Davidhye View Post
Boyle - Murray
Rivet - Ehrhoff
Vlasic - Semenov

Much better.
mines better!

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Old
03-16-2010, 10:23 PM
  #616
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mines better!
Mine's bigger.

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Old
03-16-2010, 10:36 PM
  #617
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Originally Posted by Davidhye View Post
Boyle - Murray
Rivet - Ehrhoff
Vlasic - Semenov

Much better.
Semenov is an auto fail, David. That and Rivet sucks just as bad as Blake does.

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Old
03-17-2010, 01:29 AM
  #618
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Originally Posted by CBJenga View Post
Repeating a lie does not make it true, the Heatley trade left us needing to sing any one of the third/fourth liners we did (let's just say Malhotra) it was the contracts that were unearned and shouldn't have been made:
Who is lying? Ehrhoff was dumped for cap space for the Heatley trade. Were the previous siginings bad? (Huskins, blake, mitchell) Hell yes! DW did what he had to do to get Heatley at THAT time.

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Old
03-17-2010, 09:15 AM
  #619
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Who is lying? Ehrhoff was dumped for cap space for the Heatley trade. .

No he wasnt

The Heatley trade was basically even in even out and didnt necessitate any other moves.

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Old
03-17-2010, 09:15 AM
  #620
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Semenov is an auto fail, David. That and Rivet sucks just as bad as Blake does.
Rivet is WAY BETTER than Blake. You weren't serious, right?

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Old
03-17-2010, 01:25 PM
  #621
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Originally Posted by one2gamble View Post
No he wasnt

The Heatley trade was basically even in even out and didnt necessitate any other moves.
To be fair, I will admit that we lost 200k capspace in that trade (7.3 v. 7.5), but that still means we only needed to clear another 700k to get a third/fourth liner to replace to 2 players that went out for 1. But either way, the meme that it was the heatley trade's fault needs to stop.

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Old
03-17-2010, 01:34 PM
  #622
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Led Zappa View Post
Wasn't Rivet a casualty of Boyle? And Demers was not replacing Huskins this year. Not gonna happen. Hell, he hasn't lasted a whole season and looks worse as the year goes on. Huskins on the other hand looks better.
I thought at the time Rivet deal was actually a casualty of needing to resign Murray, Vlasic, and Ehrhoff, although that turned out not to be the case when Blake was resigned. I had always assumed that Rivet was traded, and Blake signed for 1 year, because the assumption was that Blake would retire after one year, while Rivet had two years left. We needed the space in the 2nd year (this year) to be sure we could retain all of Ehrhoff Murray and Vlasic. Then this summer Blake didn't retire, and he was signed in place of Ehrhoff (at least, that's how I view it). So both Rivet and Ehrhoff were casualties of our penalty-box loving Captain. At least, that's my guess.

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Old
03-17-2010, 01:47 PM
  #623
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Originally Posted by CrazedZooChimp View Post
I thought at the time Rivet deal was actually a casualty of needing to resign Murray, Vlasic, and Ehrhoff, although that turned out not to be the case when Blake was resigned. I had always assumed that Rivet was traded, and Blake signed for 1 year, because the assumption was that Blake would retire after one year, while Rivet had two years left. We needed the space in the 2nd year (this year) to be sure we could retain all of Ehrhoff Murray and Vlasic. Then this summer Blake didn't retire, and he was signed in place of Ehrhoff (at least, that's how I view it). So both Rivet and Ehrhoff were casualties of our penalty-box loving Captain. At least, that's my guess.
Well Blake was signed shortly before Boyle and I thought that was a precautionary gamble in case Boyle fell through. So in a way it was Blake, but the main effort was to attain Boyle. I don't understand Blake over Ehrhoff this year unless there's a lot more to the story, like locker room stuff or a shrift with management.

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Old
03-17-2010, 01:48 PM
  #624
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I think it was Heatley that demanded that Goc and Ehrhoff be removed and Greiss be repeatedly benched, so Dany could have all the German glory to himself.

that's what i heard from this one dude at least...

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Old
03-17-2010, 01:50 PM
  #625
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Originally Posted by SactoShark View Post
I think it was Heatley that demanded that Goc and Ehrhoff be removed and Greiss be repeatedly benched, so Dany could have all the German glory to himself.

that's what i heard from this one dude at least...
I can't be the only one that's happy Goc is gone. Absolutely no disrespect meant to him, but he just wasn't... helpful? useful? (neither get quite at what I mean) but I think that getting Nichol instead of Goc was one of the single best offseason moves we made.

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