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Rangers sign Lee Baldwin

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Old
03-20-2010, 10:19 PM
  #26
NYR Viper
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaromir Jagr View Post
And all of our depth should be valued around the league, and somewhat is.

So you're telling me Sather couldn't package some of this excess D along with roster players for a decent player or 1st round picks? (Not asking or attacking you personally, more of a rhetorical q).
I am sure he could, and he has. The Tyutin trade was made possible because of the defensive depth. People are talking about moving Girardi or Rozsival to save cap space to sign a player like Kovalchuk. That is possible because of that depth.

The hard part is, most prospects dont have very much value when they are in the minors unless they are true A-level can't miss prospects. They gain a TON of value once they make it to the NHL because the team getting them knows they have a good young NHL roster player for now and the future. That is why a player like Girardi is so valuable.

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Old
03-20-2010, 10:20 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
I think its a little unfair to assess him only on this season. It was a very large jump for him to go from college where he had to take classes straight to the NHL where he played a lot more games.

I am sure he has gotten worn down and to me it makes no sense why Sather and Torts didn't make a 7th defenseman more of a priority considering his lack of games played/season prior to this year.
I usually try to assess it as I see it. I don't let bias's like him "being a rookie should require time" get in the way.

There are rookies(even if they need work like Del Zotto) coming into the pro's where you know they will turn into legit NHL players. You see it in their offensive & most importantly defensive play. These guys are the Tyutins, Girardis, and the Del Zotto's of the game.

I think Gilroy's defensive game is at a such low in SOME aspects that he will struggle being a legit full time NHL player. IMO he'll eventually be like a Hutchinson. He'll get some seasons in on teams w/ limited depth. His development is too late too little. Having a legit powerforward go 1 on 1 against gilroy(rookie or not)-- I'd be extremely worried. Very weak on players, weak on the puck.

His offensive game is really his speed, somewhat patience(but was a much more posied and patient player in college). He cannot shoot off a pass(one-timer) if his life depended on it. I'm not sure if you guys noticed this. This is just how I see it. Everyone see's things differently.

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Old
03-20-2010, 10:25 PM
  #28
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Originally Posted by hpNYR View Post
I usually try to assess it as I see it. I don't let bias's like him "being a rookie should require time" get in the way.

There are rookies(even if they need work like Del Zotto) coming into the pro's where you know they will turn into legit NHL players. You see it in their offensive & most importantly defensive play. These guys are the Tyutins, Girardis, and the Del Zotto's of the game.

I think Gilroy's defensive game is at a such low in SOME aspects that he will struggle being a legit full time NHL player. IMO he'll eventually be like a Hutchinson. He'll get some seasons in on teams w/ limited depth. His development is too late too little. Having a legit powerforward go 1 on 1 against gilroy(rookie or not)-- I'd be extremely worried. Very weak on players, weak on the puck.

His offensive game is really his speed, somewhat patience(but was a much more posied and patient player in college). He cannot shoot off a pass(one-timer) if his life depended on it. I'm not sure if you guys noticed this. This is just how I see it. Everyone see's things differently.
Can't say I ever recall him being in a position to even attempt to one-time a puck, so that subject is moot with my opinion...

However, I don't see a strong wrist OR slap shot, very infrequent, though, to tell, but I don't see bursts of speed combined with offensive AWARENESS that COULD help our forwards in most games if they adapted to it correctly and he used it correctly. Could end up being a strong 3rd pairing defenseman with defensive struggles, who knows.

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Old
03-20-2010, 10:43 PM
  #29
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Worth a shot. Keep making these moves and one is bound to make it, no?

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Old
03-20-2010, 10:49 PM
  #30
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Originally Posted by hockeyviper87 View Post
I am sure he could, and he has. The Tyutin trade was made possible because of the defensive depth. People are talking about moving Girardi or Rozsival to save cap space to sign a player like Kovalchuk. That is possible because of that depth.

The hard part is, most prospects dont have very much value when they are in the minors unless they are true A-level can't miss prospects. They gain a TON of value once they make it to the NHL because the team getting them knows they have a good young NHL roster player for now and the future. That is why a player like Girardi is so valuable.
What defensive "depth" does the organization have that is ready to step in and replace a veteran defenseman who regularly plays 20+ minutes a night? While I can imagine either Roszival or (especially) Girardi being moved, I seriously doubt it would be to open up spot on the blueline for another rookie.

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Old
03-20-2010, 10:50 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Jaromir Jagr View Post
That's nonsense... age doesn't factor into development... experience does.

It's not like Gilroy's stride is completely done, and how he is now is how he'll be forever...

He's adapting. He went from HS to College and switched to ENTIRELY DIFFERENT POSITIONS. Now he's changed from playing very few games to playing 82 games, a struggle every night against NHL players, playing with one of the worst defensemen in the league night in and night out in Redden.

I mean, I'm not pro-Gilroy, but hinting at the fact that he can't get better is absurd.
I never said his stride is completely done or that he won't develop anymore.

I was saying that next season when he's had some experience and hopefully? wont have Redden as a d-partner will be more telling of what we're gonna get from him. His age does matter though-- at 26 you aren't going to get that much better at skating compared to, say a 22 year old who can skate just as fast and has more years left before reaching prime. That goes for other skills as well besides skating.

Regardless of how many years someone has been in the NHL, their body is in its prime at ~26-30 and isn't going to get much better.

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Old
03-20-2010, 10:59 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by hpNYR View Post
I know he's a rookie. I went to highschool with him and he was in my Gym class. In fact, he's the one that told me higgins was traded and packed his bags. Gilroy was a forward at St Mary's in his highschool career. He switched to defense in College. That should say a little something too.

I just want to assess his game as it is. People were complaining about Poti? Gil's is very similar in style. He's a very soft player. He has an extremely tough time containing the puck off of bigger players. He's also easily rattled along the boards. His speed makes up for his poor positioning at times.

I would love for him to improve. I just don't see any meaningful improvement from him.
You sound like you are friends with Gilroy or something being that he told you about the Higgins trade...then you call him a joke?

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03-20-2010, 11:02 PM
  #33
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Worth a shot. Keep making these moves and one is bound to make it, no?
One would think so. All we can do is hope it happens.

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Old
03-20-2010, 11:04 PM
  #34
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One would think so. All we can do is hope it happens.
So who's out? Girardi? Sangs?

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Old
03-20-2010, 11:09 PM
  #35
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
So who's out? Girardi? Sangs?
How about some of the fans?

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Old
03-20-2010, 11:10 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
So who's out? Girardi? Sangs?
heikkinen

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Old
03-20-2010, 11:41 PM
  #37
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Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
You sound like you are friends with Gilroy or something being that he told you about the Higgins trade...then you call him a joke?
I guess you can call it "friends" if you want.

I was in the same gym class. He's ocassionally been at some of the pick-up games at ice works. That's where most of the interaction and exhange of numbers has been. In efforts to have pickup games. I send him the occasional text, he usually responds. It's not like we're very close buddies or something.

I have to judge things as how I see it. That's just what I see. Would I go in person and say that to him? No, def. not out of respect to him. But this is a message board and we assess players, talk about them, and opiniate. That's all I'm doing.

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Old
03-20-2010, 11:45 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by hpNYR View Post
I know he's a rookie. I went to highschool with him and he was in my Gym class. In fact, he's the one that told me higgins was traded and packed his bags. Gilroy was a forward at St Mary's in his highschool career. He switched to defense in College. That should say a little something too.

I just want to assess his game as it is. People were complaining about Poti? Gil's is very similar in style. He's a very soft player. He has an extremely tough time containing the puck off of bigger players. He's also easily rattled along the boards. His speed makes up for his poor positioning at times.

I would love for him to improve. I just don't see any meaningful improvement from him.
If true, way to talk about your friend like that, calling him a joke. But I doubt he's told you any inside info the way you talk about him.

edit - ok just saw your response from above.

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Old
03-20-2010, 11:56 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by Brooklyn Ranger View Post
What defensive "depth" does the organization have that is ready to step in and replace a veteran defenseman who regularly plays 20+ minutes a night? While I can imagine either Roszival or (especially) Girardi being moved, I seriously doubt it would be to open up spot on the blueline for another rookie.
Staal already plays 20+ minutes a night. If there is a way to move Redden then just replace him with a rookie and move on from there. There are nights where he only gets about 14 minutes anyways. Sanguinetti or McDonagh can handle that I am sure.

Also, if Rozsival and Redden are moved than Girardi stays leaving a defensive corps of something like this:

Staal-Gilroy
Girardi-MDZ(MDZ has played 20+ minutes already this season on multiple occasions)
Sanguinetti-McDonagh

Or move the pairings around. Or, a bettr option would be to go out and sign a cheap, veteran #6/7 and allow the bottom 3 to play in a rotation their 1st season due to the fact that their will be injuries and McDonagh is not used to playing 82 games anyways. Someone like Bouillon would be a good signing to help solidify the defense.

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Old
03-20-2010, 11:57 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by Jumbo View Post
If true, way to talk about your friend like that, calling him a joke. But I doubt he's told you any inside info the way you talk about him.

edit - ok just saw your response from above.
Don't get me wrong. I'm a respectful person. It doesn't matter who is across me I always approach w/ a level of respect. I probably shouldn't have used the word "joke". It was more emotionally driven than anything considering the last couple games this team has had. However, on messageboards; I feel the best approach to have is one without bias. That's what I try to do. I can certainly call him the next Leetch, or someone who will pot 50 points a season once he gets in the groove. However, IMO I think id' be not only lying to myself but the many others on these forums.

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Old
03-21-2010, 06:18 AM
  #41
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UA...

I should've said why didn't anyone notice him from ages 17-20 when most others are being drafted. Instead people strart drooling over an overrage freshman in college who's played more hockey than most freshman and who is obviously older.

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Old
03-21-2010, 06:35 AM
  #42
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I should've said why didn't anyone notice him from ages 17-20 when most others are being drafted. Instead people strart drooling over an overrage freshman in college who's played more hockey than most freshman and who is obviously older.
At least partially because he was something like 5'6 or 5'7 at the end of the dead puck error. A hockey player at that size had more chance of being struck by lightning, on multiple occasions, than get serious consideration as a prospect.

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Old
03-21-2010, 07:12 AM
  #43
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In regard to Gilroy I think he can get better--the question is how much better? I don't know if there is that much higher a ceiling for him to reach. His partner though completely sucks.

Too much emphasis on two way puck moving defensemen. Almost no emphasis on physical stay at home, make the safe play types. IMO we need a much better mix--Tort's credo of 'Safe is death' flies in the face of logic considering that NJ, Pitt and Wash, Ott all have physical stay at home types and are currently the top teams in the east.

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Old
03-21-2010, 01:15 PM
  #44
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so has this signing been confirmed?

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Old
03-22-2010, 09:36 AM
  #45
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Signing confirmed by Zip and Gross on Twitter.

http://twitter.com/stevezipay

http://twitter.com/AGrossRecord

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03-22-2010, 09:39 AM
  #46
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I guess they're not drafting a d-man in June.

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Old
03-22-2010, 09:41 AM
  #47
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Up on the teams website as well

http://rangers.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=522240

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Old
03-22-2010, 09:41 AM
  #48
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Another Baldwin brother? Is there no end to it?

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Old
03-22-2010, 09:43 AM
  #49
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imo the rangers HAVE to get kovalchuk and that's got to be at the expense of redden rozsival and gilroy.

sanguinetti can do gilroy's job just do it for about 1 mil cheaper.

the rangers though should bring in a cheap gritty veteran guy like eaton or mara or mckee that type to play on the third pair.

imo you replace those three with sanguinetti mcdonagh and that cheap veteran. the reason is that staal mdz and girardi are the guys getting the big minutes and will probably get even more next year, so really we're looking to fill in the bottom half. if we can do that with talented cheap rookies and a cheap gritty vet, we can def make some moves to fix the forward group.

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Old
03-22-2010, 09:45 AM
  #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by donpaulo View Post
Dobber hockey is reporting that University of Alaska-Anchorage Defenseman Lee Baldwin has signed with the Rangers

There is a serious backlog of players on the blueline for NY going forward
fixed it for you..

I'm so disenchanted with the whole franchise right now... I have no confidence that they will do anything right.

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