HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > Philadelphia Flyers
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Trade With Toronto

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
03-22-2010, 06:43 AM
  #1
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Trade With Toronto

Hi, Leafs fan here. Got something to run by you guys.

Kaberle for Carter. Straight up.

You guys are in a world of pain vis-a-vis the cap. I'm sure you've noticed. Carter makes way too much money for a #2C and he's going to get a raise next year when he's RFA. If you get Kaberle then you can trade Timonen. Obviously Kaberle isn't as good defensively as Timonen but he is, IMO, vastly superior offensively. With Carter gone you also have the #2C spot for Giroux. Stay with me. You can also trade Briere, IMO for not much return with that hideous contract, and free up even more cap. With Carter, Timonen and Briere out and Kaberle in you have ca. $15m cap-space to address your goaltending (Nabokov?) and go after a big-name UFA forward (Kovalchuk/Marleau) to replace Briere.

Marleau/Kovalchuk - Richards - Gagne
Kaberle - Pronger

Nabokov

Flame on...

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 06:51 AM
  #2
BringBackStevens
Registered User
 
BringBackStevens's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 12,305
vCash: 500
lol.

BringBackStevens is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 06:53 AM
  #3
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
Kaberle for Briere. Straight up.
I don't know. I'd have to think about it.

CS is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:03 AM
  #4
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
I don't know. I'd have to think about it.
Mhmm. If you're lucky and you catch a GM first thing in the morning while he's still hungover then you might get a third round pick for that monstrous contract.

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:13 AM
  #5
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
Mhmm. If you're lucky and you catch a GM first thing in the morning while he's still hungover then you might get a third round pick for that monstrous contract.
Well, if you want Carter, you better start with Kessel if you don't have a couple lottery picks just gathering dust in the back.

CS is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:24 AM
  #6
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
Well, if you want Carter, you better start with Kessel if you don't have a couple lottery picks just gathering dust in the back.
Awesome idea, add more cap to your team, just what the Flyers need.

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:41 AM
  #7
Juicy Couturier*
CannonGoBoom
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Philly Area
Posts: 4,910
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Juicy Couturier*
Lol you canadians smoke too much weed. The Carter for Kaberle windown closed 2 years ago, you know back when Kaberle was young and before Carter put up 80+ goals in 2 years.
Posted via Mobile Device

Juicy Couturier* is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:46 AM
  #8
dawkins121
Registered User
 
dawkins121's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Philadelphia
Country: United States
Posts: 2,415
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
Awesome idea, add more cap to your team, just what the Flyers need.
When you're trying to free up cap space you don't start with young, 40 goal scorers.

dawkins121 is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:46 AM
  #9
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
Lol you canadians smoke too much weed. The Carter for Kaberle windown closed 2 years ago, you know back when Kaberle was young and before Carter put up 80+ goals in 2 years.
Posted via Mobile Device
I'm not Canadian. Note the Union Flag in my user details.

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:47 AM
  #10
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by dawkins121 View Post
When you're trying to free up cap space you don't start with young, 40 goal scorers.
No, because other teams are dying to do you a huge favour and take Hartnell or Briere off your hands.

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:55 AM
  #11
Giroux tha Damaja
Registered User
 
Giroux tha Damaja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mount Holly, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,231
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Giroux tha Damaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
Hi, Leafs fan here. Got something to run by you guys.

Kaberle for Carter. Straight up.
You guys are in a world of pain vis-a-vis the cap. I'm sure you've noticed.
Carter makes way too much money for a #2C and he's going to get a raise next year when he's RFA.

If you get Kaberle then you can trade Timonen. Obviously Kaberle isn't as good defensively as Timonen but he is, IMO, vastly superior offensively.

With Carter gone you also have the #2C spot for Giroux. Stay with me.

You can also trade Briere, IMO for not much return with that hideous contract, and free up even more cap.

With Carter, Timonen and Briere out and Kaberle in you have ca. $15m cap-space to address your goaltending (Nabokov?) and go after a big-name UFA forward (Kovalchuk/Marleau) to replace Briere.

Marleau/Kovalchuk - Richards - Gagne
Kaberle - Pronger

Nabokov

Flame on...
Carter scored 46 goals last year, may touch 40 again this year, can kill penalties and plays good D at even strength. You're right though, he is a ****ing albatross with that five million dollar contract. You totally sold me the idea of trading him for Kaberle. We need more all star defensemen in the twilight of their careers.

What's nice here is that trading Briere is just as easy as wanting to do it (never mind other team's cap implications or NMC's). The fifteen million dollar estimate is nice too. Apparently Kaberle as well as Briere and Kimmo's replacements are going to play for league minimum, so his idea has that going for it.

Giroux tha Damaja is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 07:56 AM
  #12
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
No, because other teams are dying to do you a huge favour and take Hartnell or Briere off your hands.


I thought this was dead. You want to pry a player off a team with no cap space, go to Chicago. The Flyers' cap situation is manageable. I'd take the time to explain why, but it probably wouldn't do me any good. So just stop.

CS is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 08:23 AM
  #13
Juicy Couturier*
CannonGoBoom
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Philly Area
Posts: 4,910
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Juicy Couturier*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
I'm not Canadian. Note the Union Flag in my user details.
My post was from a phone, cant see the details.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
No, because other teams are dying to do you a huge favour and take Hartnell or Briere off your hands.
Hartnell, Carle and Gagne are all tradeable players and would all be moved before dumping Carters salary.

Juicy Couturier* is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 08:31 AM
  #14
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Any player is tradeable, all depends on what return you expect for them. IMO, none of those players will get you anything like a decent return with those contracts.

The crux of what I'm thinking is that trading for Kaberle gives you a good return (Kaberle is 7th in dman scoring before some wit makes reference to him not being any good any more) and allows you to move a big contract off your D as well. IMO it means your team retains its current threat and gives you some much needed cap-flexibilty and potentially allows you to do something about your woeful goaltending because let's face it, the Flyers are a true #1G away from being solid cup-contenders.

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 08:43 AM
  #15
Juicy Couturier*
CannonGoBoom
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Philly Area
Posts: 4,910
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Juicy Couturier*
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
Any player is tradeable, all depends on what return you expect for them. IMO, none of those players will get you anything like a decent return with those contracts.

The crux of what I'm thinking is that trading for Kaberle gives you a good return (Kaberle is 7th in dman scoring before some wit makes reference to him not being any good any more) and allows you to move a big contract off your D as well. IMO it means your team retains its current threat and gives you some much needed cap-flexibilty and potentially allows you to do something about your woeful goaltending because let's face it, the Flyers are a true #1G away from being solid cup-contenders.
I understand what you are saying but trading away one of the only good contracts we have is not going to help us. The guy is going to have around 85 goals in 2 seasons before even turning 25, thats not what you move for a guy like Kaberle who is 32 and making 750k less than him. Kaberle's contract is up after next season, thats all well and good but he isnt going to sign next year for anything less than 4 million again on a 3 year deal and if we dont resign him then its essentially a salary dump by moving our best offensive threat on a good contract. If Carter is going to demand too much money next year then we move him before the end of next season or after this one but the return for him will be much better than Kaberle.

If you guys sent the bruins two top 10 overall picks plus a 2nd rounder for Kessel why would Carter who is CLEARLY the better player get less of a return?

Juicy Couturier* is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 08:53 AM
  #16
JSTAFF
Registered User
 
JSTAFF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Philadelphia, PA
Country: Italy
Posts: 4,386
vCash: 500
turn off the xbox pal

JSTAFF is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 08:58 AM
  #17
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
I understand what you are saying but trading away one of the only good contracts we have is not going to help us. The guy is going to have around 85 goals in 2 seasons before even turning 25, thats not what you move for a guy like Kaberle who is 32 and making 750k less than him. Kaberle's contract is up after next season, thats all well and good but he isnt going to sign next year for anything less than 4 million again on a 3 year deal and if we dont resign him then its essentially a salary dump by moving our best offensive threat on a good contract. If Carter is going to demand too much money next year then we move him before the end of next season or after this one but the return for him will be much better than Kaberle.
And then when Carter is due his RFA raise, what then? The best case scenario I've seen mentioned around here is he signs a Richards-esque, ridiculously long contract for $5.75m. Having well over $10m on two centres, for the next ten years, is not a good way to build a team and will affect your team balance. You guys have been a #1G away from being solid cup-contenders for years and you haven't had one because you can't afford one. You can't afford one because you have too much money tied up in your top-six.

Kaberle is 7th in D scoring. Imagine where he'd be on a good team like PHI. No, he doesn't make up for the offense you lose from Carter and I won't pretend he does. Hopefully giving Giroux top-six minutes helps him develop and his offensive output will help fill the hole left by Carter too. Plus you can still move Briere or Gagne, or hope that their production bounces back.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CannonGoBoom View Post
If you guys sent the bruins two top 10 overall picks plus a 2nd rounder for Kessel why would Carter who is CLEARLY the better player get less of a return?
Because the situations aren't comparable, apples to oranges and all that.

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 08:59 AM
  #18
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by JSTAFF View Post
turn off the xbox pal
Don't have an Xbox, thanks for coming out and being constructive though.

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 09:07 AM
  #19
DrinkFightFlyers
Grave Before Shave
 
DrinkFightFlyers's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 12,862
vCash: 50
Send a message via AIM to DrinkFightFlyers
What is with people thinking Carter is going to get traded. Trading your best offensive player for anyone, let alone a guy nearing the end of a career at a position where he really isn't needed, is not a good way to turn a team around. If the Flyers were a basement team and Carter's contract was running out, then I could see trading him. But (when there is a goalie in net) the Flyers are a contender and JC is a pretty big reason for that. But yeah, let's trade a burgeoning superstar that is the best offensive player on our team for a washed up D-man (or at least soon to be washed up D-man) straight up. That is brilliant.

DrinkFightFlyers is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 09:07 AM
  #20
Giroux tha Damaja
Registered User
 
Giroux tha Damaja's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Mount Holly, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,231
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to Giroux tha Damaja
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
And then when Carter is due his RFA raise, what then? The best case scenario I've seen mentioned around here is he signs a Richards-esque, ridiculously long contract for $5.75m. Having well over $10m on two centres, for the next ten years, is not a good way to build a team and will affect your team balance. You guys have been a #1G away from being solid cup-contenders for years and you haven't had one because you can't afford one. You can't afford one because you have too much money tied up in your top-six.

Kaberle is 7th in D scoring. Imagine where he'd be on a good team like PHI. No, he doesn't make up for the offense you lose from Carter and I won't pretend he does. Hopefully giving Giroux top-six minutes helps him develop and his offensive output will help fill the hole left by Carter too. Plus you can still move Briere or Gagne, or hope that their production bounces back.



Because the situations aren't comparable, apples to oranges and all that.
When you first came on and made that joke of a proposal it was a little funny. Now you're attempting to diagnose our team's issues for us.

A: You don't know our team as well as we do.
B: Stick to figuring out how to fix the Leafs...should keep you busy for a while.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DrinkFightFlyers View Post
What is with people thinking Carter is going to get traded. Trading your best offensive player for anyone, let alone a guy nearing the end of a career at a position where he really isn't needed, is not a good way to turn a team around. If the Flyers were a basement team and Carter's contract was running out, then I could see trading him. But (when there is a goalie in net) the Flyers are a contender and JC is a pretty big reason for that. But yeah, let's trade a burgeoning superstar that is the best offensive player on our team for a washed up D-man (or at least soon to be washed up D-man) straight up. That is brilliant.

Be fair. Kaberle is a good player, but he has turned down multiple trades from Toronto. He apparently doesn't mind losing that much. That makes him a loser in my book. Don't want em'.

I don't want my team trading one of their four best players and two best assets for a guy who is in the twilight of his years (not really gonna say his careers almost over, he's only 32).

Giroux tha Damaja is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 09:10 AM
  #21
DUHockey9
Registered User
 
DUHockey9's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Hogwarts
Country: United States
Posts: 4,472
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
Don't have an Xbox, thanks for coming out and being constructive though.
When attempting to create cap space, you do not start with 25 year old, 40 goal scoring, 2 way centers with size. You end with them actually.

DUHockey9 is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 09:47 AM
  #22
sa cyred
Yea....the Flyers...
 
sa cyred's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Traveling...
Country: Cuba
Posts: 15,708
vCash: 500
Thanks man. Needed a good laugh. Its not like we haven't heard this proposal, hmm, maybe about 100 times in the past 2-3 years.

You know we have Timonen and Pronger...right? Those are 2 top defenders in the league. Why do we need another? Especially since at the moment, our superstar offense cant even score goals. So yea, thats smart to get rid of the guy who actually does score goals.

sa cyred is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 09:55 AM
  #23
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Ok cool, you guys aren't fans. I'll get out of your hair then.

BTW, you shouldn't assume that simply because I'm not a strict PHI that I know nothing about your team. I certainly know enough to get a chuckle from fans of a team that traded two Firsts, a Third, a decent prospect and an ok top-six player talking about trading for washed up defensemen. Often 'ein auslander' can provide an objectivity lacking on team-focused boards, I see it all the time on the Leafs forums, people get sucked in and believe that their team can't possibly be changed, everything is always peachy, other teams are just begging to take their teams trash players and contracts and that every hometown player is the next #99.

Ta ta. Good luck next year with whatever goaltending you manage to sign for $1.5m

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 09:56 AM
  #24
Jodiju
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Hamilton
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 31
vCash: 500
Yeah, Timonen and Pronger, 2004's top dmen...

Jodiju is offline  
Old
03-22-2010, 09:58 AM
  #25
CS
Bryzgalov's Blueline
 
CS's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lumberton, NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 14,005
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jodiju View Post
Yeah, Timonen and Pronger, 2004's top dmen...
You need to cut yourself off.

CS is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:27 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.