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Old
04-12-2010, 01:38 PM
  #76
buddahsmoka1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LowBallFern View Post
and I think he is making a well thought plan based on experience first.
Experience is paramount in the playoffs, which is what posters here have a hard time grasping.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:40 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
It wouldn't be O'Byrnes or MABs job to shut down Ovechkin, so what difference does it make?
the difference being that they have like what five 30 goal scorers, physical, gritty fowards. Washington isnt just Ovy you know.... Id rather have OB using his physical play against a physical, explosive team like the Caps.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:41 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by buddahsmoka1 View Post
I don't think our PP is going to be much of a factor, it has stunk for a month now, even if the Caps PK is brutal.

They have to play smart, disciplined and great team defense. Everyone thinks the Caps are going to bury the Habs with goals, I don't think that's going to be the case. A smart and patient game by the Habs will frustrate the Caps, I have seen it before with the Rangers. Goaltending will be huge, but it will come down to how well this team plays together defensively, and breakouts on transition that win this series, not all the frills and gimmicks people seem to think.
Right!
If Halak is madder (at his last performance) than frustrated, he will be OK.
Every time he's had bad sorties, he has bounced back to bring us where we are. Price has also done his share, but not at the same level of results.

Under pressure, Jaro has been underachieving (last olympic game (tired) and lately. He will learn big in theese palyoff, if he continues to battles like he's done all year and accept that pressure is not on him but on Washington, who are the favorites......

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:43 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Ginu View Post
Here's a question: didn't Markov play right D against the Capitals this season to shadow Ovy?

Another comment: do we really want MAB on D in this series? Any giveaways will kill us. I know he's been playing better on defense but the Caps can seriously murder us.
We played Spacek and Hammer against OV.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:44 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Quarantesix View Post
this is the line at practice today, good lineup imo

Michael Cammalleri - Tomas Plekanec - Andrei Kostitsyn
Benoît Pouliot - Scott Gomez - Brian Gionta
Travis Moen - Dominic Moore - Sergei Kostitsyn
Mathieu Darche - Maxim Lapierre - Tom Pyatt

Défenseurs :

Roman Hamrlik - Jaroslav Spacek
Andrei Markov - Marc-André Bergeron
Hal Gill - Josh Gorges

http://www.ckac.com/hockey/nouvelles...ide-10361.html
As much as i dislike MAB's defense, this is the lineup we have the best chance with against the Caps. If we're going to win, it won't be 2-1; we'll need at least 3-4 goals a game to win, and Bergeron gives us a much better chance to do that than with O'byrne in the lineup. I'm also glad both Pyatt and Darche are in the lineup; their work ethic is first class and having Bergeron as a 4th liner trying to fore-check would have been an epic waste. We need our bottom lines to tire out the D, and i'm confident they''ll do just that.

Right now my only worry is if Halak can keep it together. He looks like he's had the Price yipes out there; or maybe the Price "luck". The only way we win this if he plays like he had been before the losing streak. Only time will tell..

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04-12-2010, 01:46 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze View Post
Happy to see Sergei back. But, O'Byrne out? Bergeron on defense?
I imagine we'll be matching Spacek/Hamrlik against Ovie where possible, but I think the tales of Bergeron's defensive issues are greatly exaggerated. He's not a shut down guy, but he's more than adequate back there and generates more offense than he allows.

I am a big fan of Ryan O'Byrne, but the team is clearly better with four forward lines and he's the only one you can sit of the top six to let Bergeron play, which we clearly need in our transition game.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:48 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by PyrettaBlaze View Post
Happy to see Sergei back. But, O'Byrne out? Bergeron on defense?
Dude he hasn't been that bad defensively since his 2nd week with the team, give the guy a break.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:49 PM
  #83
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YES, trying to match Washington in fire power is the way to go.

Jacques Martin for Adams!

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Originally Posted by neofury View Post
Dude he hasn't been that bad defensively since his 2nd week with the team, give the guy a break.
Pyrettablaze = female. So, dudette.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:49 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Pierre Jr View Post
As much as i dislike MAB's defense, this is the lineup we have the best chance with against the Caps. If we're going to win, it won't be 2-1; we'll need at least 3-4 goals a game to win, and Bergeron gives us a much better chance to do that than with O'byrne in the lineup. I'm also glad both Pyatt and Darche are in the lineup; their work ethic is first class and having Bergeron as a 4th liner trying to fore-check would have been an epic waste. We need our bottom lines to tire out the D, and i'm confident they''ll do just that.

Right now my only worry is if Halak can keep it together. He looks like he's had the Price yipes out there; or maybe the Price "luck". The only way we win this if he plays like he had been before the losing streak. Only time will tell..
heh...strange. I think that'll be our exact gameplan. I'm not saying it'll be successful, but I'm betting that is what JM wants.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:49 PM
  #85
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Martin is a man that clearly favors his veterans. He's done it all season long. MAB comes in with the experience of a Cup run. Even if he wasn't a big part of that run, he still went through it.

As weak MAB can be, he did step up his game and performed better down the stretch of the year.

We'll see what Martin decides but the good thing is he has options.
Not too long ago, we were in daze with Sheldon Souray (same as MAB) shot....but weaker than MAB on D.... We all know that Souray was wayyyyyy more physical than MAB ....

All of a sudden MAB's is worthless and those who criticize him wouldn't say booh if Souray was in our line-up instead of Obyrnes.....

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:51 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by shutehinside View Post
For everyone in favour of OB in instead of MAB, are you freakin' kidding me!?

OB has been HORRIBLE down the stretch and he's purely one dimensional player. If that dimension isn't working then how the hack can he be effect? If you think Ovy will make MAB his b1tch just imagine what he would do to OB, probably make him score on his own net.

This will not be a physical, ground and pound series. It will be a much more fast paced, offensive tilt then grinding hockey. That being said, you need to be able to quickly transition from defense to offence and MAB and Markov give you the best option to do just that. Just look at how they've dominated Washington on the PP this year. If they can work their magic 5 on 5 during a game, all the better.

OB could be a good player for us one day, but as of today he doesn't have the confidence, experience or where with all to be effect. MAB has all of the above and besides his size is an upgrade on OB in every other category as of late including on defence.

A red hot MAB makes so much more sense then a fragile OB.
That makes sense to me too.....

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:52 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by Kriss E View Post
Martin is a man that clearly favors his veterans. He's done it all season long. MAB comes in with the experience of a Cup run. Even if he wasn't a big part of that run, he still went through it.

As weak MAB can be, he did step up his game and performed better down the stretch of the year.

We'll see what Martin decides but the good thing is he has options.
good points, however Martin's ideology has always been defense first and O'byrne is much better defensively than MAB. The only logic I see to putting MAB on the first pair is to try to match Washington's offense, which isn't possible.

IMO, MAB costs us more goals than he scores for us.

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:52 PM
  #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjell Dahlin View Post
Bergeron is not expected to provide a stay-at-home contribution but we always blame him for his lack of defensive awareness.

Guys like Markov, Cammalleri, the Kostitsyn brothers, Bergeron, Gomez, Gionta... need some breathing room.
First of all, I'd like to say that it's nice to see some systems/strategy analysis. Posters like you are the exception to the multitudes of posters whose analysis consists of debating line-up changes, and nothing deeper.

We're on the same side here. I agree with your ideas, just not the use statistic you used in support. MAB should be fine. His offensive contribution should outweigh the odd defensive mistake he makes. I think that people are overlooking his lateral mobility against the rush. The Caps' best players can kill defensemen to the outside with their speed, skill and quick puck movement on the rush. MAB should be able to match them most of the time while backing up (as long as his decision making is decent).

I hold firm in believing that Montreal's success or failure in this series (from a defensive standpoint) hinges on the second pairing. Markov will do his job and cancel out most mistakes that are made by his partner. Gorges and Gill should be able to play a simple "off the glass and out" game and contribute on the PK. It's Hamr and Spacek that worries me a bit. They will have to play well in both transition games and carry a heavy workload. The forwards will really have to support this pairing on the backcheck and also the breakout. The backcheck will be important to negate the third man into the zone if Hamr and Spacek get backed up against the rush. On the breakout, the forwards will need to give this pairing a shorter breakout pass and an easier target. Markov can hit guys with 50 foot passes in and through traffic, but Hamr and Spacek aren't going to succeed doing this. I think they can pull it off, but they will have to improve on their recent play.

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04-12-2010, 01:55 PM
  #89
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Hi, I'm an idiot

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Old
04-12-2010, 01:56 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by saints96 View Post
and i am sure OB would do a much better job shutting down Ovy than MAB would.
and you know this how???

Faster skater than MAB?
Faster transition than MAB?
Better puck control than MAB?
Better footwork than MAB?
Bettre backward skating than MAB?

I'll stop here....
But keep beleiving...lol

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:02 PM
  #91
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If either O'Byrne or Bergeron are playing big minutes against Ovechkin, we're in trouble.

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:02 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by LowBallFern View Post
and you know this how???

Faster skater than MAB?
Faster transition than MAB?
Better puck control than MAB?
Better footwork than MAB?
Bettre backward skating than MAB?

I'll stop here....
But keep beleiving...lol
You could give MAB a GPS and a spotter and he'd still be ****in' lost in the defensive zone.

Ovechkin WAY stronger than Bergeron, so along the boards, Bergy is done for. O'bryne is cautious and doesn't pinch nearly as often as Bergy does. The game gets nasty do you really want Bergy to be out there with Markov to be his defender ?

Besides, Spacek and Hamrlik will be giving the main duty against Ov I suspect.

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:06 PM
  #93
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you blaming gainey makes you know more about hockey right? ..where was MTL before the gainey era? Nowhere, not even a play off contender, pittyful display of hockey, they weren't even on the map. Spare with me with the gainey suck BS.
Are they better than last year with 88 points???
How will his overpaid pygmie team will perform in four years compared to what we had last year?How will our aging, overpaid defense do in the next 2 years?

Gainey did very well with revamping our farmteam but friged it all up for five years with is dumb moves last summer!

He should have resigned last april...But hey, that's just me not knowing hockey.
Have a nice day anyway....

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:07 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by Capitano View Post
heh...strange. I think that'll be our exact gameplan. I'm not saying it'll be successful, but I'm betting that is what JM wants.
Well if it is, we're doomed; the Habs were at their best this year when they played an up-tempo, back-and-forth game. They've played their worst when they went into a defensive shell and backed up all the time. If we play like that, it will be like the 3rd period of the Philly game for the entire series...

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:08 PM
  #95
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Guys, it's simple, we need more goals... considering that, MAB is a lot better than O'Byrne. We already have 4 other D with almost 0 offense. I think we need a little more punch on offense. Let MAB use is canon and cross your fingers

go habs go

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:08 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by saints96 View Post
i hope JM isn't that stupid, with JM you never know.
He might get caught in Washington, but that would be unforgiveable in Mtl on defensive face offs when Ovy is on....

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:11 PM
  #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjell Dahlin View Post
"... It's not really fair compare the PP triggerman against the 5th and 6th defencemen based solely on shots..."

You are right: it is not fair but I was trying to underline (quickly and in a concise way) the fact that when Gill – Gorges are on the ice, on ES, we should expect a lot of time spent in our zone, near zero pressure on the opponent's net, and a poor transition game - puck shot on the boards to clear the zone.

We can’t expect to win against WAS (it’s true against any team but especially against a high octane team like WAS) if we spend most of the time in our zone and/or continuously give them back the puck when we are trying to break out of our zone. And once we gain WAS’ blue line, we will need support from our Ds.

People (fans and analysts) are quick to underline Bergeron’s defensive errors but rarely will we read/hear people complain about Gill and Gorges offensive errors.

"... Gorges and Gill aren't expected to provide offense..." and we almost never blame them for their lack of offensive skill.

Bergeron is not expected to provide a stay-at-home contribution but we always blame him for his lack of defensive awareness.

Guys like Markov, Cammalleri, the Kostitsyn brothers, Bergeron, Gomez, Gionta... need some breathing room.


PS you are also right about Hamrlik and Spacek: they need to step their game up a notch... or two!
So refreshing to read you instead of those so call experts in bashing.....

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:14 PM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LowBallFern View Post
Are they better than last year with 88 points???
How will his overpaid pygmie team will perform in four years compared to what we had last year?How will our aging, overpaid defense do in the next 2 years?

Gainey did very well with revamping our farmteam but friged it all up for five years with is dumb moves last summer!

He should have resigned last april...But hey, that's just me not knowing hockey.
Have a nice day anyway....
YAWN.. same old story with habs fan, blame the GM when every key player was injured for an extensive period of time. New team, new core, new coach, new system yet everyone wanted results from day 1. Anways im not getting into a gainey debate with you, it's not worth it my time. Have a good one.

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:17 PM
  #99
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Not the least bit surprising, since Martin doesn't believe the team needs toughness. Guess we'll be enjoying more softness over the next few years.

Not that I'm a pro scout or a GM or a coach, but Washington is a team that plays on the edge and loves to buzz around the net. HOW does he expect Bergeron to keep guys like Knuble, Chimera, Laich, Gordon, Steckel, Bradley, Fehr or Ovechkin away from the crease or from owning the boards?

Sometimes I wonder if there's some secret handbook for coaches that clarifies headscratchers like those.

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Old
04-12-2010, 02:17 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by Pierre Jr View Post
Well if it is, we're doomed; the Habs were at their best this year when they played an up-tempo, back-and-forth game. They've played their worst when they went into a defensive shell and backed up all the time. If we play like that, it will be like the 3rd period of the Philly game for the entire series...
I won't disagree with you, you're probably right.

But I can't see JM deserting his 'system' for a balls-out offensive style. We're going to play it close to the vest and rely on our goaltending to save us - like this whole year pretty much.

We're going to trap, trap, and then trap some more, pray a little bit for some timely goals, hope our PP comes to play, and our goalie stands on his head.

That's pretty much it, lol.

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