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Old
04-14-2010, 02:28 PM
  #76
jas
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
Kovalchuk would replace Prospal. Prospal had 20 goals. The net is.....20g.

20 more goals this past season would have put the Rangers at 6th in the league in scoring. The five teams ahead of them would be WAS, PIT, VAN, SJ and CHI.

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Old
04-14-2010, 02:31 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by jas View Post
20 more goals this past season would have put the Rangers at 6th in the league in scoring. The five teams ahead of them would be WAS, PIT, VAN, SJ and CHI.
That really puts it in perspective to how good the Rangers would be if the two unnamed elite salaries weren't playing like utility players.

Utterly depressing, however. Day ruiner.

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Old
04-14-2010, 02:46 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Sykora? An ancient and declining Nylander/Jagr?? Betts?? Shelley??? Youre seriously suggesting that letting these players go is a reason why we're not contenders??? One is more inconsiquential than the next.

Acquiring the wrong players is this teams problem, not letting the right ones go.
They were the best players in the playoffs when they were let go.
Sykora was the only non Hank I liked in the 05-06 sweep.
Nylander was great 06-07, good sidekick for Jagr.
You're going to tell me Jagr wasn't the best player you've seen just before we let him go????? Him in that Pens series we lost...he was so commanding!

You're gonna bring up age? Why? What's that matter? How old was our only cup team in 70 years?

I have NEVER felt that giving away the standout players meant letting the right guys go.

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Old
04-14-2010, 02:55 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by msg View Post
Volchenkov would be a great signing if he replaced Redden. Rangers would have a very good blueline next year if that happened. I am not sure if Torts would want Volchenkov though. He seems to want only offensive minded defensemen.
if we replaced redden with volchenkov id shiit my pants

and i'd be so happy i wouldnt even change them

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04-14-2010, 02:56 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
So they would shoot up to 70 goal scorers with Brad Richards on their line. cmon.
I'm not saying that getting Brad Richards would make us a cup contender. I'm saying that getting Kovy won't.

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Team doesnt need an overpaid center this offseason. You look at marleau, Plekanec and you have potential disasters.
I agree. I'm not advocating that we trade for Richards, or that we sign Marleau or Plekanec. I'm saying we should be patient this offseason. We need to fix our cap situation. If we are smart this year, we can have enough money to re-sign our RFAs and get a Richards or Thorton as a UFA next year.

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04-14-2010, 02:56 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by CHGoalie27 View Post
They were the best players in the playoffs when they were let go.
Sykora was the only non Hank I liked in the 05-06 sweep.
Nylander was great 06-07, good sidekick for Jagr.
You're going to tell me Jagr wasn't the best player you've seen just before we let him go????? Him in that Pens series we lost...he was so commanding!

You're gonna bring up age? Why? What's that matter? How old was our only cup team in 70 years?

I have NEVER felt that giving away the standout players meant letting the right guys go.
so you felt that jagr should have been the highest paid player on the team for the next 2 seasons after that?

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04-14-2010, 02:58 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by jas View Post
20 more goals this past season would have put the Rangers at 6th in the league in scoring. The five teams ahead of them would be WAS, PIT, VAN, SJ and CHI.
That wasn't my point. I was saying that adding Kovy will help us no more than adding an elite center would. Whether or not either move would make us a good team is an entirely different argument.

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Old
04-14-2010, 03:17 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
I'm not saying that getting Brad Richards would make us a cup contender. I'm saying that getting Kovy won't.



I agree. I'm not advocating that we trade for Richards, or that we sign Marleau or Plekanec. I'm saying we should be patient this offseason. We need to fix our cap situation. If we are smart this year, we can have enough money to re-sign our RFAs and get a Richards or Thorton as a UFA next year.
How will our cap situation suddenly be better next offseason? Rozi and Drury will still have a year left on their deals (and Redden would still be in Hartford). You'd have the same exact situation next offseason.

Kovalchuk > Thornton > Richards... he's also several years younger, and there's no guarantee that Thornton or Richards will hit UFA a year from now or ever (yes, I know the Devils could re-sign or trade Kovalchuk, but I'm operating on the assumption that he's there on July 1st).

Passing on Kovalchuk because you think the grass will be greener next offseason is foolish. It's the same type of arguments being made last offseason about not signing Gaborik because Kovalchuk would be an UFA. Gabby worked out pretty good, eh? Get the bird in hand while you can.

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Old
04-14-2010, 03:20 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
That wasn't my point. I was saying that adding Kovy will help us no more than adding an elite center would. Whether or not either move would make us a good team is an entirely different argument.
I was comparing Kovalchuk + Gaborik to a hypothetical Thornton (protypical #1 playmaking center) + Gaborik.

Kovalchuk + Gaborik wins, imho. Both carry their own lines and gives you two offensive threats. The playmaking center might make Gaborik even better, but when you're a 40g+ scorer with Erik Christensen, there's not much room or need for improvement.

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Old
04-14-2010, 03:23 PM
  #85
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Sigh. We aren't signing Kovalchuk... We should be focused on continuing the strides we've made with developing our system, and signing a few complementary players, like Frolov, Volchenkov, or Seidenberg.

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Old
04-14-2010, 03:27 PM
  #86
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Originally Posted by NYR Fan in PGH View Post
Sigh. We aren't signing Kovalchuk... We should be focused on continuing the strides we've made with developing our system, and signing a few complementary players, like Frolov, Volchenkov, or Seidenberg.
Signing Kovalchuk and continuing to develop our system aren't mutually exclusive. In fact, signing Kovalchuk puts more emphasis on developing our system.

Signing a few complementary players, on the other hand, will hinder our development system. When you start giving multiple roster spots to second tier UFA talent, that's where you have problems. People advocating for Frolov and Volchenkov have learned nothing from Drury, Gomez, Holik, and Redden.

It's the Gaboriks you should be looking for in UFA, not the Drurys. The Drurys we can develop through our system.

My ideal Rangers team would have Gaborik and Kovalchuk as the only UFAs. The rest of the team gets built through our own development.

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Old
04-14-2010, 03:33 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by azrok22 View Post
Signing Kovalchuk and continuing to develop our system aren't mutually exclusive. In fact, signing Kovalchuk puts more emphasis on developing our system.

Signing a few complementary players, on the other hand, will hinder our development system. When you start giving multiple roster spots to second tier UFA talent, that's where you have problems. People advocating for Frolov and Volchenkov have learned nothing from Drury, Gomez, Holik, and Redden.

It's the Gaboriks you should be looking for in UFA, not the Drurys. The Drurys we can develop through our system.

My ideal Rangers team would have Gaborik and Kovalchuk as the only UFAs. The rest of the team gets built through our own development.
And you intend on signing Kovalchuk while resigning Staal, Girardi, Prospal, and Prust this year and Callahan and Dubisnky next season with what cap space?

Sorry, simply burying Redden won't cut it.

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Old
04-14-2010, 03:56 PM
  #88
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Look at Pitt... they have two 90-100 point players + role players around them, with a severely OVERRATED goalie.

Kovy gives us another 80-90 point player WITH Hank

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Old
04-14-2010, 03:59 PM
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Fan in PGH View Post
And you intend on signing Kovalchuk while resigning Staal, Girardi, Prospal, and Prust this year and Callahan and Dubisnky next season with what cap space?

Sorry, simply burying Redden won't cut it.
i agree it will be hard to but will be close letting jokinen and prospal go will free up another 6 with 6.5 redden in hartford will give you 12.5 mil to resign those rfa and sign kovy but prospal will be replaced by kovy staal and girardi and prust increase will equal jokinens' 5 mil...im sure there is a way to do it and sather if he wants kovy he will figure out a way and he should...thats why i would only target kovy and thats it...

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04-14-2010, 04:04 PM
  #90
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A couple of years ago, I would have been thrilled with the idea of going after Ilya Kovalchuk. But with the numbers (even if we were able to shed the Redden contract by whatver means), I still am frightened by the contract the Rangers could potentially hand Kovalchuk.

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:06 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by NYR Fan in PGH View Post
Sigh. We aren't signing Kovalchuk... We should be focused on continuing the strides we've made with developing our system, and signing a few complementary players, like Frolov, Volchenkov, or Seidenberg.
the more i think about it, he should be priority #1

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:07 PM
  #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Fan in PGH View Post
And you intend on signing Kovalchuk while resigning Staal, Girardi, Prospal, and Prust this year and Callahan and Dubisnky next season with what cap space?

Sorry, simply burying Redden won't cut it.
Let's do this year.

Let's assume the lineup is something along the lines of....

Dubinsky Christensen Gaborik
Kovalchuk Drury Callahan
Prospal Anisimov Avery
Shelley Boyle Prust

Staal Girardi
Rozsival Sanguinetti
MDZ Gilroy

or something similar.

Lundqvist
Auld


* Ilya Kovalchuk ($9.500m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m) / Chris Drury ($7.050m)
Ryan Callahan ($2.300m) / Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)
* Vaclav Prospal ($1.750m) / Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / * Erik Christensen ($0.800m)
* Brandon Prust ($0.750m) / * Jody Shelley ($0.750m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)
DEFENSEMEN
Michal Rozsival ($5.000m) / * Marc Staal ($2.900m)
* Daniel Girardi ($2.250m) / Matt Gilroy ($1.750m)
Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m) / Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m)
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) / * Alex Auld ($1.000m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER: 20; PAYROLL: $57.252m; CAP ROOM: $0.661m BONUSES: $0.212m

You can have 1 spare forward, like Enver Lisin, and youll have to run 6 D.

Next season, you can trade Michal Rozsival, and incorporate Ryan McDonagh. The salary difference is about 4 million and change. the 4 million and change can be used to pay Anisimov, Cally and Dubi, with plenty of space for extra players. 2 years from now, Drury is off the books, which gives us 7 mil to go and get another true elite player, possibly by trade.

i dont know how many times ive had to explain this, but yes, you can EASILY incorporate Kovalchuk into the lineup, and have money to pay the kids.

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:11 PM
  #93
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Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Let's do this year.

Let's assume the lineup is something along the lines of....

Dubinsky Christensen Gaborik
Kovalchuk Drury Callahan
Prospal Anisimov Avery
Shelley Boyle Prust

Staal Girardi
Rozsival Sanguinetti
MDZ Gilroy

or something similar.

Lundqvist
Auld


* Ilya Kovalchuk ($9.500m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m) / Chris Drury ($7.050m)
Ryan Callahan ($2.300m) / Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)
* Vaclav Prospal ($1.750m) / Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / * Erik Christensen ($0.800m)
* Brandon Prust ($0.750m) / * Jody Shelley ($0.750m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)
DEFENSEMEN
Michal Rozsival ($5.000m) / * Marc Staal ($2.900m)
* Daniel Girardi ($2.250m) / Matt Gilroy ($1.750m)
Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m) / Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m)
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) / * Alex Auld ($1.000m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER: 20; PAYROLL: $57.252m; CAP ROOM: $0.661m BONUSES: $0.212m

You can have 1 spare forward, like Enver Lisin, and youll have to run 6 D.

Next season, you can trade Michal Rozsival, and incorporate Ryan McDonagh. The salary difference is about 4 million and change. the 4 million and change can be used to pay Anisimov, Cally and Dubi, with plenty of space for extra players. 2 years from now, Drury is off the books, which gives us 7 mil to go and get another true elite player, possibly by trade.

i dont know how many times ive had to explain this, but yes, you can EASILY incorporate Kovalchuk into the lineup, and have money to pay the kids.
Forgot Brashears contract and that D is horrible.

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:12 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by pwoz View Post
Look at Pitt... they have two 90-100 point players + role players around them, with a severely OVERRATED goalie.

Kovy gives us another 80-90 point player WITH Hank
Fleury is not overrated, for one. He steps up his game when it counts.

You're talking about Malkin and Crosby here. They make the players around them better with their vision and creativity. Gaborik can do that, but Kovalchuk isn't that kind of player.

Two franchise wingers is not the same as two franchise centers. Not even close.

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:12 PM
  #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Inferno272 View Post
Let's do this year.

Let's assume the lineup is something along the lines of....

Dubinsky Christensen Gaborik
Kovalchuk Drury Callahan
Prospal Anisimov Avery
Shelley Boyle Prust

Staal Girardi
Rozsival Sanguinetti
MDZ Gilroy

or something similar.

Lundqvist
Auld


* Ilya Kovalchuk ($9.500m) / Marian Gaborik ($7.500m) / Chris Drury ($7.050m)
Ryan Callahan ($2.300m) / Sean Avery ($1.938m) / Brandon Dubinsky ($1.850m)
* Vaclav Prospal ($1.750m) / Artem Anisimov ($0.822m) / * Erik Christensen ($0.800m)
* Brandon Prust ($0.750m) / * Jody Shelley ($0.750m) / Brian Boyle ($0.525m)
DEFENSEMEN
Michal Rozsival ($5.000m) / * Marc Staal ($2.900m)
* Daniel Girardi ($2.250m) / Matt Gilroy ($1.750m)
Michael Del Zotto ($1.087m) / Bobby Sanguinetti ($0.855m)
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($6.875m) / * Alex Auld ($1.000m)
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS
ROSTER: 20; PAYROLL: $57.252m; CAP ROOM: $0.661m BONUSES: $0.212m

You can have 1 spare forward, like Enver Lisin, and youll have to run 6 D.

Next season, you can trade Michal Rozsival, and incorporate Ryan McDonagh. The salary difference is about 4 million and change. the 4 million and change can be used to pay Anisimov, Cally and Dubi, with plenty of space for extra players. 2 years from now, Drury is off the books, which gives us 7 mil to go and get another true elite player, possibly by trade.

i dont know how many times ive had to explain this, but yes, you can EASILY incorporate Kovalchuk into the lineup, and have money to pay the kids.
looks right and even if staal gets more than 2.9 then you dont resign prospal

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:12 PM
  #96
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Originally Posted by SI Ranger View Post
Forgot Brashears contract and that D is horrible.
not to mention there is an absurd amount of asumptions going on there

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:15 PM
  #97
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Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
if we replaced redden with volchenkov id shiit my pants

and i'd be so happy i wouldnt even change them


Oh man. I laughed out loud at work over that one.

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:20 PM
  #98
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Originally Posted by Puckface Avery View Post
Langenbrunner has three cups
He also had a world class center playing in front of him in Modano.

In NJ he had Arnott. I like Langenbrunner, but he is a 2nd line center & a fill in first. Don't get me wrong, we could get by with him.

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:33 PM
  #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SI Ranger View Post
Forgot Brashears contract and that D is horrible.
im assuming brashear is traded. we might have to add to make it work.

brashear +4th for 7th or something.

that D is this years D, with Sanguinetti instead of Redden.

its not going to be worse than this year, thats for sure.

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Old
04-14-2010, 04:34 PM
  #100
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Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
not to mention there is an absurd amount of asumptions going on there
which assumptions?

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