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Old
04-15-2010, 11:58 AM
  #201
Fitzy
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Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
volchenkov! with room to spare
Or Lidstrom for 1 season as another poster recommended.

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04-15-2010, 12:00 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Or Lidstrom for 1 season as another poster recommended.
i just dont see the benefit or any remote possibility it happens

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04-15-2010, 12:07 PM
  #203
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I wouldn't mind if they signed Matthew Lombardi. He isn't a number 1 center but he is an upgrade over Christensen to play with Gaborik and Dubinsky. And then you can move Christensen down to 2nd or 3rd line center. Lombardi wont be too expensive. He can fly he would be perfect for Tort's system.
Lombardi could be a good option, depending on the cost, but I could see him re-signing in Phoenix.

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04-15-2010, 12:18 PM
  #204
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This summer does not need heavy involvement in the free agency pool to succeed. Perhaps Volchenkov, maybe Frolov. Nobody else fills a dire need. Go young and go with the same. Consistency is key for success. Juggling lines all season long is what people complain about. Juggling teams doesn't help.

Simply resign the following:

Staal - long term preferably
Prust (won't be much $)
Shelley (won't be much $)
Christensen (won't be much $)

Maybe resign:

Prospal (at the right price)
Girardi (if Volchenkov doesn't work out, they can't trade Rozsival, etc)
Auld (if no other veteran backup is available at the right cost)
PAP

Erikkson, Jokinen, Lisin, Newbury aren't needed for renewals.

At this time. . . . there are possibly young'ns that could make the lineup.

Byers, Sangs, Grachev, Potter, McDonagh... some players might make the jump. There are also surprise players. You need room for these players.

And definitely, definitely, definitely rid yourselves of Redden in the minors and attempt to find a decent offer for Rozsival. Not that Rozsivals bad, and I'm not advocating you trade him for the sake of trading, but if the right deal is in place, do it.

Also: draft well. We have a decent pick for the first time in a while. Let's make it last.

All of these things don't involve free agency really.

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Old
04-15-2010, 12:41 PM
  #205
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
The cap is projected to be 57.7 million. 10% of that is 5.77 million. Redden's cap hit is 6.5 million. So we can sign other players as long as the total doesn't exceed 63.47 million. We have 14 players under contract for next season, counting Brashear and Redden. We have 12.1 mil in cap space + the 10% overage for a total of 17.87 million.

Assume Shelley is re-signed and Brashear is in Hartford. So now we've got about 17 million to spend on 4 more forwards, 4 more dmen (1 to replace Redden) and a backup goalie.

If the dmen are Staal, Girardi, Sangs/McD and Eriksson, we can expect them to cost between 6-8 million combined. Lets say 7 million.

A backup goalie will cost about 750K, leaving us at about 9.25 million for 4 forwards. Bring back Prust and Christensen. Bring up Weise. That's about 2.25 million, leaving us 7 million to sign....who? Not Kovy, if he wants in excess of 8 mil per season.
Thanks, GAGline. It seems you frequently have answers to my questions.

It looks like Kovalchuk will not be on the menu, fortuitously. If he's making 7.5 this year, he may very well be looking for 8.5-10.

I think you've underestimated the cost to resign the goalie - Auld was making 1 mil this year - Nittymaki, for example if we go for him, would deserve a raise. Prust and Christensen both probably get a mil or a bit more. Weise would make minimum, which makes the three of them 3-4 mil, depending. I mean, I might give EC 2-2.5 all by himself, depending on Gabby's take on him and the fact that he is the de facto no.1 center. Your number for the D sounds about right.

If after all numbers are accounted for and crunched there's that much money left lying on the table, maybe they hit some unsuspecting RFA with an offer sheet?

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Old
04-15-2010, 12:43 PM
  #206
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All: Let's not forget what market pressures do to UFA salaries. They push them up. During years where there are few desirable, slam-dunk style UFA's, those prices go up much more.

That is all.

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04-15-2010, 01:33 PM
  #207
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Originally Posted by BobSantos View Post
Thanks, GAGline. It seems you frequently have answers to my questions.

It looks like Kovalchuk will not be on the menu, fortuitously. If he's making 7.5 this year, he may very well be looking for 8.5-10.

I think you've underestimated the cost to resign the goalie - Auld was making 1 mil this year - Nittymaki, for example if we go for him, would deserve a raise. Prust and Christensen both probably get a mil or a bit more. Weise would make minimum, which makes the three of them 3-4 mil, depending. I mean, I might give EC 2-2.5 all by himself, depending on Gabby's take on him and the fact that he is the de facto no.1 center. Your number for the D sounds about right.

If after all numbers are accounted for and crunched there's that much money left lying on the table, maybe they hit some unsuspecting RFA with an offer sheet?
Prust is a 26 year old 4th line player who scored 14 points in 69 games this season. He's coming off a 2 year contract in which he was making the league minimum. He's an arbitration eligible RFA, but he won't go to arbitration. His qualifying offer will be 550k. At most he'll get 600k per year if he signs for 2 years.

Christensen won't get anywhere near 2 million. His salary this year was 750k. He's also a 26 yo arbitration eligible RFA. But he won't go to arbitration either. Anaheim waived him twice this year. He cleared waivers the first time and we picked him up the 2nd time. He did well with us, but that's not enough to earn him a huge raise. His qualifying offer will be $787,500. If he signs for 2 years, he'll probably get 800-850 per year.

As far as the backup goalie goes, Sather won't pay that much. Vally was only making 725K per year. Sather will sign someone who understands that he is the backup, is ok with getting paid as a backup, and has no aspirations of being a starter. Maybe Sather will go as high as 1 million, but only if he has no other choice.

Weise's cap hit for next year (assuming he makes the team) is 700k (+80k in bonuses).

There are ways we can squeeze Kovy under the cap, but I don't like any of them. We could lowball Staal and only offer him a 1 or 2 year deal, in which case he'd probably get at most 2 mil per year. That's what Sather did to Dubinsky. We could trade Girardi, but we won't find a better dman for cheaper. We could trade Rozy for a cheaper dman, but that's likely to be a downgrade too. We could replace Gilroy with a rookie, but then that would probably be 2 rookies on defense (1 to replace Redden). I'm not sure we want to go down that road again so soon.

Of course, if we don't send Redden down, this is all moot. Come July 1st, we'll know their intentions with him based on how much money they spend.

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04-15-2010, 02:23 PM
  #208
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There doesn't seem to be any thought in this thread to making an addition or two by trade. The Rangers have some flexibility with assets and there are probably a couple of good players who will be available at a moderate asset price. I'm not talking Richards (unless of course he's ready to sign a team friendly extension) but a Sharp might be on the radar. There are probably others. Several teams are up against the cap. The prudent approach to me would be to wait out the UFA market (I can't see the Rangers squeezing in Kovalchuk) make a few modest price additions (i.e Corvo, Lombardi) and look to trade for 1-2 players. And the Rangers need to get off the pot with Sauer and Byers.

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04-15-2010, 02:47 PM
  #209
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Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
There doesn't seem to be any thought in this thread to making an addition or two by trade. The Rangers have some flexibility with assets and there are probably a couple of good players who will be available at a moderate asset price. I'm not talking Richards (unless of course he's ready to sign a team friendly extension) but a Sharp might be on the radar. There are probably others. Several teams are up against the cap. The prudent approach to me would be to wait out the UFA market (I can't see the Rangers squeezing in Kovalchuk) make a few modest price additions (i.e Corvo, Lombardi) and look to trade for 1-2 players. And the Rangers need to get off the pot with Sauer and Byers.
I'm much more inclined to go the trade route. I think acquiring a Sharp or Versteeg is a much better play than targeting a big name UFA.

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04-15-2010, 03:07 PM
  #210
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Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I'm much more inclined to go the trade route. I think acquiring a Sharp or Versteeg is a much better play than targeting a big name UFA.
My only concern there would be what are we giving up? I'm not interested in trading Dubinsky for either of them. I don't think either would represent a significant upgrade offensively. A trade like that isn't going to do much to improve this team. We need to add a Sharp or Versteeg to what we already have, but I don't know how we can manage that, unless we are trading picks. Would our 2011 1st get it done for Sharp?

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04-15-2010, 03:11 PM
  #211
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I mentioned trades in the draft thread.

I see the writing on the wall. I have a feeling Slats will try to trade into a Centerman and maybe another Dman.

How much salary would we be taking back by getting Souray AND Dustin Penner from the Oil if they took Redden or Rosy in a deal?

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04-15-2010, 03:15 PM
  #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bobbop View Post
There doesn't seem to be any thought in this thread to making an addition or two by trade. The Rangers have some flexibility with assets and there are probably a couple of good players who will be available at a moderate asset price. I'm not talking Richards (unless of course he's ready to sign a team friendly extension) but a Sharp might be on the radar. There are probably others. Several teams are up against the cap. The prudent approach to me would be to wait out the UFA market (I can't see the Rangers squeezing in Kovalchuk) make a few modest price additions (i.e Corvo, Lombardi) and look to trade for 1-2 players. And the Rangers need to get off the pot with Sauer and Byers.
im all for going the trade route

however, we would need a little bit of luck for it to work out right

the problem is we need 1st liners....i think it would pretty tough to get one via trae without getting compeltely *****

so we need to trade for someone who can become a 1st liner...then we need to be lucky enough that they actually do

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04-15-2010, 03:30 PM
  #213
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
My only concern there would be what are we giving up? I'm not interested in trading Dubinsky for either of them. I don't think either would represent a significant upgrade offensively. A trade like that isn't going to do much to improve this team. We need to add a Sharp or Versteeg to what we already have, but I don't know how we can manage that, unless we are trading picks. Would our 2011 1st get it done for Sharp?
I would give Dubinsky up for Sharp in a heartbeat. He and Versteeg are basically equal though.

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04-15-2010, 03:59 PM
  #214
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Originally Posted by NYR Fan in PGH View Post
I would give Dubinsky up for Sharp in a heartbeat. He and Versteeg are basically equal though.
Sharp is overrated. Giving up a 23 year old, 50 point player for a 28 year old, 60 point player would be foolish.

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04-15-2010, 04:01 PM
  #215
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Its odd considering a fanbase that tens to overvalue our system players undervalues Dubisnky so much.

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04-15-2010, 04:02 PM
  #216
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Originally Posted by NYR Fan in PGH View Post
I would give Dubinsky up for Sharp in a heartbeat. He and Versteeg are basically equal though.
Never in a million years. Dubinsky is untouchable HERE. Anywhere else probably not, but this franchise has lacked a player like Dubi since Graves left. Sather is on board with this thinking, one of the few things he's not ****ing up.

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04-15-2010, 04:03 PM
  #217
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Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Its odd considering a fanbase that tens to overvalue our system players undervalues Dubisnky so much.
i think there's generally 2 camps (well...2 highly vocal camps)

those who love him and think he does no wrong

and those who think he'll never be anything and we should trade him

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04-15-2010, 04:05 PM
  #218
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Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Its odd considering a fanbase that tens to overvalue our system players undervalues Dubisnky so much.
Overvaluing our system guys is completely justified considering the bull **** we saw come up the last I don't know 12 years+. We finally have some heart and sould guys, OUR guys, and people want to ship em off for who???

Half of this fanbase thinks just like mgmt. I think it's a NY thing.

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04-15-2010, 04:07 PM
  #219
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Originally Posted by mullichicken25 View Post
i think there's generally 2 camps (well...2 highly vocal camps)

those who love him and think he does no wrong

and those who think he'll never be anything and we should trade him
There is a middle ground, and thats that he is a good, young, cheap successful 2nd liner.

Hes not gonna be a superstar, and after 3 seasons of 40+ points its pretty certain hes not a bust either.

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04-15-2010, 04:13 PM
  #220
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Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
There is a middle ground, and thats that he is a good, young, cheap successful 2nd liner.

Hes not gonna be a superstar, and after 3 seasons of 40+ points its pretty certain hes not a bust either.
and those are my thoughts as well..i just think our group is usually over shaddowed by the other two

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04-15-2010, 05:58 PM
  #221
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
Sharp is overrated. Giving up a 23 year old, 50 point player for a 28 year old, 60 point player would be foolish.
I find it odd that Dubinsky's point totals are rounded up, while Sharp's are rounded down. Dubinsky has never cracked 50 points, while Sharp almost notched 70 this year and has a 36 goal season to his credit.

If we're doing the "projected over 82 games" thing, then Sharp has 2 30+ goal seasons to his credit.

I'm not signing off on a Dubinsky for Sharp trade, but Sharp certainly is not overrated.

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04-15-2010, 07:37 PM
  #222
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I find it odd that Dubinsky's point totals are rounded up, while Sharp's are rounded down. Dubinsky has never cracked 50 points, while Sharp almost notched 70 this year and has a 36 goal season to his credit.

If we're doing the "projected over 82 games" thing, then Sharp has 2 30+ goal seasons to his credit.

I'm not signing off on a Dubinsky for Sharp trade, but Sharp certainly is not overrated.
Sharp didn't start scoring until Toews and Kane showed up. Prior to that, his career high was 35 points at the age of 25. I'm not saying that they are entirely to do with his success, but they definitely have inflated his numbers.

And yes, I'm prorating Dubinsky's numbers over 82 games. Dubinsky put up those numbers on a far worse offensive team and he's 5 years younger. In two years Dubi will be putting up the same numbers Sharp is now and Sharp will be on the wrong side of 30.

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04-15-2010, 07:54 PM
  #223
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Sharp didn't start scoring until Toews and Kane showed up. Prior to that, his career high was 35 points at the age of 25. I'm not saying that they are entirely to do with his success, but they definitely have inflated his numbers.

And yes, I'm prorating Dubinsky's numbers over 82 games. Dubinsky put up those numbers on a far worse offensive team and he's 5 years younger. In two years Dubi will be putting up the same numbers Sharp is now and Sharp will be on the wrong side of 30.
Ehh sharp for Dubinsky isnt that much of an improvement

Its not that i wouldnt trade dubinsky for the right price he is definitely movable.

I still am a little upset at the fact that he was what held up the Heatley trade.

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04-15-2010, 08:05 PM
  #224
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Sharp didn't start scoring until Toews and Kane showed up. Prior to that, his career high was 35 points at the age of 25. I'm not saying that they are entirely to do with his success, but they definitely have inflated his numbers.

And yes, I'm prorating Dubinsky's numbers over 82 games. Dubinsky put up those numbers on a far worse offensive team and he's 5 years younger. In two years Dubi will be putting up the same numbers Sharp is now and Sharp will be on the wrong side of 30.
And Dubinsky's numbers were not inflated by playing with Gaborik? Or with Jagr? Also, why ignore the fact that with Philly, Sharp was used almost exclusively as a 4th liner?

Seems like a pretty obvious double standard to me, but to each their own.

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04-15-2010, 08:31 PM
  #225
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Dubinsky for Sharp is a sideways move. I want to add to the core, not change pieces. And it's probably not where the Hawks need to go. They are so far over the projected cap it is not funny. Maybe Sangs (or another VG prospect) and a 2nd for Sharp gets you there. Yes he's got some question marks and yes, Towes and Kane certainly haven't hurt but he's played most of this year on another line and has done well. He's an awfully good hockey player. True #1 center? No. Playing with Gaborik? Maybe.

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