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Souray+ for Roszival+

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Old
04-22-2010, 10:41 AM
  #26
Gardner McKay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yukoner88 View Post
To NYR

D Souray
F Cogliano
conditional draft pick

To EDM

D Roszival
D Girardi
G Johnson

would something like this sound like it could be worked around to u?
Here is what I love about Rangers fans on these boards.

Two months ago your all clammoring to trade Girardi away, or not re-sign him, or trade his rights or whatever.

Now you have a chance to fill a viable need with a shot from the point and get rid of two players in the process and you say no?

Granted I think a little bit more from EDM's side is necessary considering they are both top 4 defenseman but the hypocrisy is astounding.

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Old
04-22-2010, 10:48 AM
  #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabborik View Post
Here is what I love about Rangers fans on these boards.

Two months ago your all clammoring to trade Girardi away, or not re-sign him, or trade his rights or whatever.

Now you have a chance to fill a viable need with a shot from the point and get rid of two players in the process and you say no?

Granted I think a little bit more from EDM's side is necessary considering they are both top 4 defenseman but the hypocrisy is astounding.
May be because Roszival and Girardi actually have value where as Souray has double negative value right now, being injured for two of the last three seasons, and the fact that he called out Oiler's management.

If a trade presents itself where the Rangers can deal one or both of Girardi/Roszival and actually get something that helps this team out on the blueline or upfront (Just a big shot from the point that might be healthy and might not be a headcase is not worth it at this point in time), i'm sure Sather and Ranger fans would more then likely pull the trigger.

This isn't one of those deals.

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04-22-2010, 10:49 AM
  #28
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awful awful awful deal.

our defense gets much much much worse... our offense doesn't improve by all that much... we actually get more injury prone and softer in the process, and pick up a worse contract all while losing a very promising goalie prospect.

you might as well have said Souray + conditional for Gaborik b/c it will save us cap space in the long run.

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Old
04-22-2010, 10:51 AM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabborik View Post
Here is what I love about Rangers fans on these boards.

Two months ago your all clammoring to trade Girardi away, or not re-sign him, or trade his rights or whatever.

Now you have a chance to fill a viable need with a shot from the point and get rid of two players in the process and you say no?
Granted I think a little bit more from EDM's side is necessary considering they are both top 4 defenseman but the hypocrisy is astounding.

who is this person who is going to shoot from the point? all I see is a waste of a contract that will be sitting in a suit b/c of injuries and when healthy I see other teams skaters skating around him b/c he is horrible defensively.


and yes I want to trade Girardi. But to make the trade I would want to get better ( or get a decent/good pick). Not to get worse defensively, older, and injury prone.

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04-22-2010, 11:12 AM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabborik View Post
Here is what I love about Rangers fans on these boards.

Two months ago your all clammoring to trade Girardi away, or not re-sign him, or trade his rights or whatever.

Now you have a chance to fill a viable need with a shot from the point and get rid of two players in the process and you say no?

Granted I think a little bit more from EDM's side is necessary considering they are both top 4 defenseman but the hypocrisy is astounding.
I haven't checked the rule book, but I'm pretty sure the league would have a problem with Souray shooting pucks from the stands on the PP.

Rosen: "Del Zotto flicks the puck over the glass to Souray. Souray drops his crutches and fires a shot on net! Dubinsky with the rebound!!! RANGERS SCORE!!! It's a power play goal!!"

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Old
04-22-2010, 11:19 AM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I haven't checked the rule book, but I'm pretty sure the league would have a problem with Souray shooting pucks from the stands on the PP.

Rosen: "Del Zotto flicks the puck over the glass to Souray. Souray drops his crutches and fires a shot on net! Dubinsky with the rebound!!! RANGERS SCORE!!! It's a power play goal!!"
I like it... the other team will never see it coming.

If this doesn't work, we can teach Gaborik the knuckle puck, dress him up like Lundqvist, and send him out there.

I tell you, if Gordon Bombay was our coach, we'd be on our way to the Stanley Cup finals this year.

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Old
04-22-2010, 11:29 AM
  #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I haven't checked the rule book, but I'm pretty sure the league would have a problem with Souray shooting pucks from the stands on the PP.

Rosen: "Del Zotto flicks the puck over the glass to Souray. Souray drops his crutches and fires a shot on net! Dubinsky with the rebound!!! RANGERS SCORE!!! It's a power play goal!!"


amazing post.

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Old
04-22-2010, 11:36 AM
  #33
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Sutter really shouldn't allow himself to answer the phone when Sather calls.

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Old
04-22-2010, 11:41 AM
  #34
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Rozsival is a better defenseman than Souray.

Girardi is equal to or better than Cogliano.

CJ is a good goalie prospect.

If you want to swap Souray for Rozsival you have to send something legitimate extra back our way. I still dont think its a good idea.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:07 PM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fitzy Duke of NY View Post
Rozsival is a better defenseman than Souray.

Girardi is equal to or better than Cogliano.

CJ is a good goalie prospect.

If you want to swap Souray for Rozsival you have to send something legitimate extra back our way. I still dont think its a good idea.
That doesn't say much for Souray since Rozsival is not even an adequate one.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:09 PM
  #36
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Originally Posted by GAGLine View Post
I wouldn't do Rozy for Souray. I wouldn't do Girardi for Cogliano. And I wouldn't do Johnson for a conditional draft pick. No way I'm doing all 3 for all 3.
This about sums it up.
No, No, and No way.

Only way this gets done is if the conditional pick is a 1st rd pick in '11 which becomes 2 1st rd picks, '11 and '12, if Souray plays fewer than 82 games next year.

So again NO.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:11 PM
  #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjolnir13 View Post
That doesn't say much for Souray since Rozsival is not even an adequate one.
Where is this coming from? He had a bad first month or so of the season and then turned it on, becoming one of the Rangers top 2 D-men. Granted on a Stanley Cup team, he is a top 4 D-man, but he played great for the rest of the season after those first two months. He may be $500K to $1 million over-paid, that's it.

Roszival is more then adequate, he is just a bit overpaid, but the way he played after those first two months (And all the other seasons as a Ranger post-lockout, just about) was very good.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:12 PM
  #38
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Terrible deal. Ranger fans need to stop bashing Rozsival so much. Yeah, he's faded a little bit, but recently he's come back to play like I'd say a #2 or #3 defenseman. He's been doing good. No need to trade him for Souray, who has a terrible contract and extreme injury proneness. His value is at an all-time low, it wouldn't take as much as that to get him. IF I even really wanted to go for Souray, which, I'm extremely nervous about acquiring him, it'd be an offer like this:

To NYR
Souray
Cogliano

To EDM
Girardi
Brashear
Voros


I see this as a great opportunity to get rid of useless cap hitters like Brashear and Voros. Brash, who's an AHLer now, and Voros, who gets scratched 60+ games a year.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:19 PM
  #39
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To NYR
D Souray
F Cogliano

To EDM
D Redden
F Brashear
F Voros


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Old
04-22-2010, 12:20 PM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panfork View Post
Terrible deal. Ranger fans need to stop bashing Rozsival so much. Yeah, he's faded a little bit, but recently he's come back to play like I'd say a #2 or #3 defenseman. He's been doing good. No need to trade him for Souray, who has a terrible contract and extreme injury proneness. His value is at an all-time low, it wouldn't take as much as that to get him. IF I even really wanted to go for Souray, which, I'm extremely nervous about acquiring him, it'd be an offer like this:

To NYR
Souray
Cogliano

To EDM
Girardi
Brashear
Voros


I see this as a great opportunity to get rid of useless cap hitters like Brashear and Voros. Brash, who's an AHLer now, and Voros, who gets scratched 60+ games a year.
I'm not against dealing Girardi (If the deal is right) and I would love to get rid of Brashear/Voros, but the Rangers are taking back too much cap here. Souray's $5.4 million and Cogliano, who is an RFA, will more then likely get something around $1.5 to $1.75 million (Almost an offset to what Girardi will get, which is somewhere around $2.0 to $2.25 million). The Rangers would be dealing $1.4, $1.0, and an estimated $2.25 million (For a total of $3.65) and getting back $5.4 and an estimated $1.5 million (For a total of almost $7 million).

Too much salary coming back.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:23 PM
  #41
Gardner McKay
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
I haven't checked the rule book, but I'm pretty sure the league would have a problem with Souray shooting pucks from the stands on the PP.

Rosen: "Del Zotto flicks the puck over the glass to Souray. Souray drops his crutches and fires a shot on net! Dubinsky with the rebound!!! RANGERS SCORE!!! It's a power play goal!!"
You guys make it sound like he would be playing for us tomorrow... but oh wait trade deadline is over, we didnt make the playoffs so he wouldnt play till October and in that case would healed and ready to go.

Rozsival got his contract of 5 million by actually using his offensive skills. Considering his defensive game is far from stellar and doesnt use his shot... EVER... were trading one bad defenseman for another. Rozsival is slightly better on defense, Souray is better on offense, what the Rangers need.

And the sarcasm is far from needed.


Last edited by Gardner McKay: 04-22-2010 at 12:28 PM.
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Old
04-22-2010, 12:23 PM
  #42
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I'm going to quote someone on this board

"Souray's as fragile as a snowflake in june"

So no thanks

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04-22-2010, 12:28 PM
  #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabborik View Post
You guys make it sound like he would be playing for us tomorrow... but oh wait trade deadline is over, we didnt make the playoffs so he wouldnt play till October and in that case would healed and ready to go.
He is talking about his recent history. Two of the last three season's Souray has played less then 40 games. Roszival has played just about every game since becoming a Ranger. Roszival has also consistantly put up over 30 points (aside from last season) while playing well in his own end. Souray is a defensive liability.

The risk doesn't outweigh the reward here, not to mention the player(s) the Rangers would have to give up.

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04-22-2010, 12:31 PM
  #44
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That 20+ goals from Souray does sound oh-so juicy, though. Such a risky thing, in one case you could get an injury prone, washed up defenseman with a big cap hit, or you could get Sheldon Souray, 26 goal scorer extraordinaire.

I don't knowwww. If Rozsival is going to EDM for Souray, Cogliano and a pick better be coming back, and Rozsival is going alone.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:35 PM
  #45
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To EDM: Redden, 3rd round pick 2011, Grachev

To: NYR: Souray

I mean at least they'd consider. I really cannot see anybody taking redden

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04-22-2010, 12:37 PM
  #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyko1827 View Post
To EDM: Redden, 3rd round pick 2011, Grachev

To: NYR: Souray

I mean at least they'd consider. I really cannot see anybody taking redden
Really? Really? Really?

Bad Contract for a Bad Contract + 3rd Round Pick + Our #1 Prospect.

Bravo.

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04-22-2010, 12:43 PM
  #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyko1827 View Post
To EDM: Redden, 3rd round pick 2011, Grachev

To: NYR: Souray

I mean at least they'd consider. I really cannot see anybody taking redden
Sather will waive Redden before he trades the Rangers top prospect just to rid himself and this team of that contract.

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04-22-2010, 12:45 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Panfork View Post
Really? Really? Really?

Bad Contract for a Bad Contract + 3rd Round Pick + Our #1 Prospect.

Bravo.
4 year remaining bad contract at 6.5 for a 2 year remaining bad contract at 5.

You shed two years, and 1.5 mil salary per year.

Its not ideal, and im not advocating it either, but I can at least understand where the guy is coming from.

In two years you have 12 mil coming off the books for two players vs, only 7 and keeping 6.5 million of deadend weight around.

Just a rough estimate but you have about 1/6th of your cap relieved from 2 players. Giving up Grachev isnt worth that but the overall basis isnt terrible.

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Old
04-22-2010, 12:48 PM
  #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panfork View Post
That 20+ goals from Souray does sound oh-so juicy, though. Such a risky thing, in one case you could get an injury prone, washed up defenseman with a big cap hit, or you could get Sheldon Souray, 26 goal scorer extraordinaire.

I don't knowwww. If Rozsival is going to EDM for Souray, Cogliano and a pick better be coming back, and Rozsival is going alone.
The last 3 years is a good sample size to get a good idea how things will go with Souray next season:

37 games 4 goals
81 games 23 goals
26 games 3 goals

That and he turns 34 in July. Could he bouce back and score 20+ goals? Sure. The odds are stacked up against him though, because of his age. That combined with his attitude problem, make me want to stay far, far away from him.

Then there is the question is if and how Souray and Torts get a long. Could the same thing happen with the Rangers as it did with the Oilers if Torts sits him?

Too many questions, not enough answers.

EDIT: Not to mention he was a -19 in those 37 games last season. I know this stat doesn't mean everything, and the Oilers were a bad team last season, but that is pretty bad. That was 4th or 5th worst on the team, and tied for 9th worst in the entire NHL. And yes MDZ was a -20, but he is a rookie.


Last edited by UAGoalieGuy: 04-22-2010 at 12:54 PM.
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Old
04-22-2010, 12:52 PM
  #50
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The Rangers should not be trading for ANY bad contacts... certainly not for a guy like Souray. Keep Rozy or deal him for a pick, and use the money elsewhere. Souray is not our guy...

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