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WCQF | Game 4 |Canucks @ Kings | 04/21/10 | Series tied 2-2

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04-22-2010, 03:52 PM
  #201
hauspaint
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
Man, how about those horrible refs? I hate the fact that the guys in Toronto want the Canadian teams to win. They've screwed the Kings all series. It's all their fault!

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04-22-2010, 03:58 PM
  #202
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Originally Posted by Sydor25 View Post
First, it is not just one bad game by Quick. He has only had 1 great game since the Olympics and that was game 1 of this series.

Second, I do not want to see Bernier in a Kings uniform until training camp/rookie camp.

Third, I don't think everyone thinks that Bernier is a "savior", they just wanted him to get a chance to play more games when Quick was struggling so much in March and April, before the playoffs. The reason we only have 3 NHL games to look at is because Murray wouldn't give Quick a needed break.

Fourth, once Murray decided not to play Ersberg anymore, Bernier should have been used in 10-15 games with the Kings to get a better read on his NHL ability this season. He earned that right with his attitude adjustment and stellar play in the AHL.

And finally, Bernier makes the difficult saves look routine with his technical abilities. He is so sound in his movements and position, he makes it look almost effortless when he is out there and I believe that builds the confidence of his teammates. Quick can make some of the routine saves look acrobatic because of his poor positioning and rebound control. I lost count of how many times Quick kicked the rebound right up the middle of the slot last night. It was frightening.

Again, I do not want Bernier to play for the Kings this season, this is Quick’s team. That ship has already sailed when Murray didn’t play him enough to get a good read on his ability in the NHL. He is the Monarchs goalie for this season.

I also firmly believe that the Kings can still win this series with Quick in net. Quick showed in game 1 how good he can be, even with poor defensive play. Game 2 and 3 were obviously good enough for the Kings to win, but game 4 needed that big save in the third period. Last night’s game turned on that breakaway save by Luongo. From that moment, you could see the confidence in the Canucks and their belief that they were not going to be denied. The Kings didn’t get that save from Quick.

Quick had to stop Sedin and he didn’t. If Quick made that difficult save, I believe that the Kings would have won that game. The momentum would have shifted.
For once, I can agree with you on all of this. EXCEPT the very last part...there were MANY other points where the Kings could have sealed victory. To BLAME it on Quick is shortsighted. The TEAM made mental mistakes last night that sealed their fate.

Could Quick have stolen this game for us? Certainly. And the Kings would have won. But you can't BLAME him for the NHL's leading scorer coming down on essentially a breakaway with a pass option AFTER a huge miscue by the forwards getting caught in deep and the D losing it. It was a team loss, and Quick was absolutely a part of it, but there's much more to discuss than goaltending.

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04-22-2010, 04:08 PM
  #203
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Originally Posted by MN14 View Post
For once, I can agree with you on all of this. EXCEPT the very last part...there were MANY other points where the Kings could have sealed victory. To BLAME it on Quick is shortsighted. The TEAM made mental mistakes last night that sealed their fate.

Could Quick have stolen this game for us? Certainly. And the Kings would have won. But you can't BLAME him for the NHL's leading scorer coming down on essentially a breakaway with a pass option AFTER a huge miscue by the forwards getting caught in deep and the D losing it. It was a team loss, and Quick was absolutely a part of it, but there's much more to discuss than goaltending.
In a game where both goalies were bad, you have to look at the big saves that were made. Both teams had bad turnovers and defensive coverage mistakes. Both teams gave up odd man rushes.

The difference in the game was the save on the 3rd Kings PP on Johnson alone in front that allowed the Canucks to kill their first penalty in 7 tries, then the Frolov breakaway chance and finally the Brown chance on the clear 2-on-1.

Those three saves could easily haev been 3 goals for the Kings. Which save(s) by Quick last night stands out to you? I can't think of any.

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04-22-2010, 04:12 PM
  #204
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Randy Jones > Sean O'Donnell

If anyone on the Kings deserves the lion's share of the blame it's Sean O'Donnell. He was flat out AWFUL. A liability every time he was on the ice.

Sean, I know you've spent a lot of time with this organization, but do us all a favor and retire. You are no longer capable of playing at the NHL level.

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04-22-2010, 04:14 PM
  #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MN14 View Post
If he has a bad game, I'm sure this board will eat him alive like they have to Quick...right? Hmmm

I'm not even trying to fire up the goalie debate again...but I think it's funny that we can tell that "Quick is an average goalie at best" based on one full season, but that Bernier is the savior based on several NHL games and a body of AHL work. As if Quick certainly isn't going to get better and Bernier is a sure thing.

I just wish people would temper their expectations of our goalies and not just see what they want to see.
I've been watching Bernier since he was drafted on the Kings. Watched a lot of Lewiston Maineiacs games, 2008 World Juniors with Canada, a couple Monarch games, and of course Bernier with the Los Angeles Kings.

Lets look at Bernier's resume...

2006 11th overall Draft pick
Guy Lafleur trophy winner (MVP of the QMJHL playoffs)
At 18, beat out everyone in Kings camp and started for the LA Kings in London.
Won gold in 2008 World Juniors
2009-10 AHL All-Star (Team Canada)
2009-10 AHL Goalie of the year.

And it's still being written.

So yeah, I have a pretty good idea what kind of goalie Bernier is going to be in the NHL. He should have been starting with the Kings this season, but do to Lombardi's plan. He wasn't given the chance to, simply because Quick was named starter before camp. Essentially handed the job. Bernier has been a premier goalie at just about every level of hockey. He's going to be on in the NHL. There's one consistent thing with Bernier, is that he ALWAYS shows up in big games. The more pressure, the better he does.

I'll say it again, and I have no problem saying it. Quick is overrated and is not the type of goalie to get you to the promised land. He just doesn't have sound positioning, focus, rebound control.

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04-22-2010, 04:22 PM
  #206
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To try and isolate any one moment of that 3rd period by the Kings is truly to lose sight of the team getting taken away from their game and letting the Canucks get to them.

You can't stop playing hard and heavy along the boards in the 3rd and expect to win, ever. Anytime you do win a game like that you are lucky that either your goalie bailed you out or that the other team sucked. Neither happened last night, which is fine, because you can't expect either to happen in the first place when the team stops playing their game.

We didn't win faceoffs and more importantly, we stopped winning board battles in the third. We got beat to lose pucks. That will lose you a lot of games in the playoffs.
You can say 'well lLuongo made key saves in the 3rd'. Fine, he did, but he did so ALONG WITH his team playing great hockey in front of me, despite a few mistakes getting caught while they tried to tied it up and take the lead. Luongo didn't make those saves in the first two periods while his team looked off. The inverse was true of Quick, he made the saves in the first 2 while the Kings played well and didn't make the saves in the 3rd while the team played crappy.

Coicidence? Absolutely not.

Everyone on the team, from the goalie to D6 to F12 to D1 to F1, feeds of eachother. Like I said, nothing happens in a vaccuum. And everyone deserves equal responsibility on this one. Everyone.

I hope the team doesn't point fingers, because as soon as you start looking for a scapegoat after a game like that, is the moment your team and your locker room starts to unravel.

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04-22-2010, 04:24 PM
  #207
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Look, this will be my last post on the matter, because nothing stops the Quick bashers from coming out of the woodwork at every opportunity.

I believe that Bernier is the goalie of the future. I also believe that Quick will be a good-to-great goalie for a long, long time.

I agree that had Quick made a big save last night in the third period, maybe the result is different. But I disagree that the game was his 'fault' because the team's mental lapses are what led to the downfall. But the goaltender is the easy scapegoat, especially for those who are seeing only what they want to see.

Edit: What JDM said ^^^^^^

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04-22-2010, 04:24 PM
  #208
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Originally Posted by 24frolov View Post
I've been watching Bernier since he was drafted on the Kings. Watched a lot of Lewiston Maineiacs games, 2008 World Juniors with Canada, a couple Monarch games, and of course Bernier with the Los Angeles Kings.

Lets look at Bernier's resume...

2006 11th overall Draft pick
Guy Lafleur trophy winner (MVP of the QMJHL playoffs)
At 18, beat out everyone in Kings camp and started for the LA Kings in London.
Won gold in 2008 World Juniors
2009-10 AHL All-Star (Team Canada)
2009-10 AHL Goalie of the year.

And it's still being written.

So yeah, I have a pretty good idea what kind of goalie Bernier is going to be in the NHL. He should have been starting with the Kings this season, but do to Lombardi's plan. He wasn't given the chance to, simply because Quick was named starter before camp. Essentially handed the job. Bernier has been a premier goalie at just about every level of hockey. He's going to be on in the NHL. There's one consistent thing with Bernier, is that he ALWAYS shows up in big games. The more pressure, the better he does.

I'll say it again, and I have no problem saying it. Quick is overrated and is not the type of goalie to get you to the promised land. He just doesn't have sound positioning, focus, rebound control.
I must have forgotten that only butterfly goalies can win cups.

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04-22-2010, 04:26 PM
  #209
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-I am not a Jones fan but he played ok! Made a huge save on what would of been a goal.
- O'D not his best game but as a team to many break downs and happened at the worst time.
-Frolov has to go unless he will resign at a bottom six price. We went to both games at staples and if he played with a ounce of heart that clune, parse, simmonds, etc. play with then he would fit into the kings system. He does not appear to be a DL type player and had the playoffs to prove otherwise.
-Keep fighting boys and GO KINGS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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04-22-2010, 04:28 PM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
If anyone on the Kings deserves the lion's share of the blame it's Sean O'Donnell. He was flat out AWFUL. A liability every time he was on the ice.

Sean, I know you've spent a lot of time with this organization, but do us all a favor and retire. You are no longer capable of playing at the NHL level.
Oh come on, he had a rough game, but so did Greene. Overall OD has been VERY good this series. His veteran-'ness' has come through more than his oldness. He ****ed up big time last night, twice. But again, as soon as I saw the way the Kings played the first 5 minutes of that period, I knew it was only a matter of time until someone got exposed. It just so happened to be OD.

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04-22-2010, 04:39 PM
  #211
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Baumer is hurt so Alberts will replace him.

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04-22-2010, 04:45 PM
  #212
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This animated .gif demonstrates how the game went last night.

The Bikers = Us fans

Pee-Wee = The entire Kings roster


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04-22-2010, 04:46 PM
  #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnjm22 View Post
If anyone on the Kings deserves the lion's share of the blame it's Sean O'Donnell. He was flat out AWFUL. A liability every time he was on the ice.

Sean, I know you've spent a lot of time with this organization, but do us all a favor and retire. You are no longer capable of playing at the NHL level.
I agree....OD was brutal. On Ehrhoff's goal, I was really pissed at OD because he didn't even try to move the Canuck forward (or himself for that matter) out of the way So Quick could see the shot.

To quote Don Cherry - "Either block the shot or get out of the way!"

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04-22-2010, 04:55 PM
  #214
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Its time to see what the kings are made of. Im expecting a huge effort from the kings in game 5. Lets not let the "gloom and doom" attitude take root, the series is still tied. Plain and simple: I BELIEVE.

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04-22-2010, 05:11 PM
  #215
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Hi All:

Please continue the series discussion here: http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=761970

Gracias.

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